Apple Closes As The Most Valuable Company In the World

[samcraig]

Only the most ardent of Apple fans would be cheering this "win" over exxon. You want to celebrate Apple increasing its value, etc. Fine.

But in this economy - we should be cheering and rooting for MANY companies to succeed, increase profits, hire more employees, etc.

and PS - you don't need to put down one company to extol another. Same crap happens with Apple vs Anyone on here. Gets old, boring and redundant.

 

[jacobj]

I am not sure that I agree with the term "much bigger". The implication there is that Apple is some way off. However if I use the same quarter as an example and go back 5 years, assume average growth in either Revenue or Margin, then Apple will be bigger than Exxon by this time next year. This is a very simple analysis and I actually expect Apple to beat it by some margin.

I would happily buy Apple stock if I had the cash and not a mortgage. Look at the cash they hold and the P/E ration is better than it has been for years.

 

[jacobj]

I am not sure that I agree with the term "much bigger". The implication there is that Apple is some way off. However if I use the same quarter as an example and go back 5 years, assume average growth in either Revenue or Margin, then Apple will be bigger than Exxon by this time next year. This is a very simple analysis and I actually expect Apple to beat it by some margin.

I would happily buy Apple stock if I had the cash and not a mortgage. Look at the cash they hold and the P/E ration is better than it has been for years.

 

[Themaeds]

If you don't like the way Apple distributes the profits made from your stock investments in them, sell, sell, sell and invest it in a company that does it your way! It's your decision to be a part of it or not.

Dell obviously is very jellous of Jobs, and wishes he had a bundle of cash on hand instead of giving it all away to his stockholders. He probably thinks that if he could get Jobs to do the same, it would make Dell look less poorly.

Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

 

[DeathChill]

Only the most ardent of Apple fans would be cheering this "win" over exxon. You want to celebrate Apple increasing its value, etc. Fine.

But in this economy - we should be cheering and rooting for MANY companies to succeed, increase profits, hire more employees, etc.

and PS - you don't need to put down one company to extol another. Same crap happens with Apple vs Anyone on here. Gets old, boring and redundant.

It is probably one of the greatest business comeback stories ever, so I think it is interesting news, especially for Apple fans.

I am not really sure I understand your point though. Of course nobody here wants any company to fail, but this is an Apple focused site so why would anyone come here to cheer Home Depot on?

 

[samcraig]

It is probably one of the greatest business comeback stories ever, so I think it is interesting news, especially for Apple fans.

I am not really sure I understand your point though. Of course nobody here wants any company to fail, but this is an Apple focused site so why would anyone come here to cheer Home Depot on?

For someone who's been "around" since 2005, I'm surprised you don't understand my point or haven't noticed how people on here love to extol Apple at the EXPENSE of other companies.

Apple vs Google
Apple vs Microsoft
Apple vs Amazon

to name just three

My point - is that you can love Apple products. You can get excited with good news. But you don't HAVE to put down other companies to enjoy another's success

Celebrate Apple's #1 position, for example in this thread. But that's no need to bring in derogatory comments about Exxon, Microsoft, Bill Gates, etc.

 

[nylonsteel]

re aapl stock split

dear mr. jobs - great job
split the stock 4 to 1 please

i know in my dreams

"street of dreams..." - rainbow

 

[Moopy Sac]

Only the most ardent of Apple fans would be cheering this "win" over exxon. You want to celebrate Apple increasing its value, etc. Fine.

But in this economy - we should be cheering and rooting for MANY companies to succeed, increase profits, hire more employees, etc.

and PS - you don't need to put down one company to extol another. Same crap happens with Apple vs Anyone on here. Gets old, boring and redundant.

I have been cheering increased profits (the most profitable time in American history + highest profit margins in 20 years) for the past 6 quarters or so. Until those profits translate into job growth, they only benefit equity holders. Hopefully that is the case soon.

 

[Moopy Sac]

re aapl stock split

dear mr. jobs - great job
split the stock 4 to 1 please

i know in my dreams

"street of dreams..." - rainbow

Why?

 

[GfPQqmcRKUvP]

Apple simply needs to do something with their cash. It's a waste of money to have that large of a stockpile and not invest in business or distribute back to shareholders. That's becoming more of a concern every quarter for shareholders. And by the way, Exxon as a company is still worth more. Market cap simply denotes the value of the common equity outstanding.

Secondly, the financial knowledge of people on this board is downright embarrassing. I'm not saying that to insult people, but understanding the basic tenants of the stock market and some of the valuation principles behind it is useful for everyone. I suggest every person on here brushes up on some of this knowledge whether that means going to a library and checking out a finance book or simply increasing knowledge by researching topics online. It's important, even if you don't think finance is your thing.

 

[mijail]

Our company is one of the few that were bold enough to start implementing ...

As military, DoD contractor, I qualify for....

Man, you have been registered here for 1 month and a half and you have already managed to drop in the conversations (usually without any real relationship to the matter at hand) that you have worked for Apple, Google, Microsoft, Oracle... And now the military.

You really must have a fascinating job.

Apple is not a "giving" company in any charitable measure and Steve Jobs has made it very clear that he has no intention on "giving back" even though earlier he did state when the company was in a better position to do so "back when Apple was in a dire mess financially". He even said that people assume too much that just because a company is successful that there's some requirement to give back to the people, and said that was false.

Also, it's unfortunate that you so rarely give any source for what you usually present as facts.
What I remember is that Jobs said in an interview (still in the 90's, when talking about being father and about Education in USA) that Apple had already tried helping schools by giving them computers, and at the end they saw it was changing nothing; that charity doesn't fuel change, doesn't help in the long run, and so they were trying other approaches (no idea which). (...or was it that technology wasn't really what schools were needing most?)
Interestingly, Gates said recently in other interview something very similar about a big part of the money spent up to now by the Gates Foundation.
See, I'd look for those interviews, but since you gave no sources, why should I?

 

[AppleScruff1]

Apple simply needs to do something with their cash. It's a waste of money to have that large of a stockpile and not invest in business or distribute back to shareholders. That's becoming more of a concern every quarter for shareholders. And by the way, Exxon as a company is still worth more. Market cap simply denotes the value of the common equity outstanding.

Secondly, the financial knowledge of people on this board is downright embarrassing. I'm not saying that to insult people, but understanding the basic tenants of the stock market and some of the valuation principles behind it is useful for everyone. I suggest every person on here brushes up on some of this knowledge whether that means going to a library and checking out a finance book or simply increasing knowledge by researching topics online. It's important, even if you don't think finance is your thing.

Most here don't understand that. They actually think Apple is a bigger company than Exxon.

 

[DeathChill]

For someone who's been "around" since 2005, I'm surprised you don't understand my point or haven't noticed how people on here love to extol Apple at the EXPENSE of other companies.

Apple vs Google
Apple vs Microsoft
Apple vs Amazon

to name just three

My point - is that you can love Apple products. You can get excited with good news. But you don't HAVE to put down other companies to enjoy another's success

Celebrate Apple's #1 position, for example in this thread. But that's no need to bring in derogatory comments about Exxon, Microsoft, Bill Gates, etc.

I understand people like to do that; it's human nature. There has to be an enemy. I don't necessarily agree with it, but it's true.

Hell, even companies do it with Google making thinly veiled insults at Apple at their I/O events.

 

[MacNewsFix]

While not looking to become embroiled in the debate among the immediately prior post authors, I do wish to post something in regards to this historic accomplishment.

It seems like only yesterday that some in the industry were suggesting Apple close up shop and give back the money to the shareholders (Boy, those shareholders would be pissed if they did pull their money then!). Truly an amazing turnaround over the last 14 years.

Well done, Steve & Team. Well done.

 

[Hyper-X]

Man, you have been registered here for 1 month and a half and you have already managed to drop in the conversations (usually without any real relationship to the matter at hand) that you have worked for Apple, Google, Microsoft, Oracle... And now the military.

You really must have a fascinating job.

It's one of the many advantages of being a contractor for over 17 years, a Reservist for 22 years amongst other things.

Also, it's unfortunate that you so rarely give any source for what you usually present as facts.

Usually pointless since if you're genuinely interested in my comments, you can search for references on your own. However since you asked...

http://mkcreative.net/blog/2011/01/10/apples-lack-of-charity-still-squeezed-in-blogosphere/ - "That’s certainly true of [Bill] Gates, who not only gives vast sums away, but also speaks up in support of the organizations and institutions he believes in.
This is not the case for Jobs. To the best of my knowledge, in the last decade or more, Jobs has not spoken up on any social or political issue he believes in — with the exception of admitting he’s a big Bob Dylan fan. Rather, he uses social issues to support his own selfish business goals."

http://www.businessinsider.com/10-unusual-things-i-didnt-know-about-steve-jobs-2011-2 <-- read #6

http://www.change.org/petitions/did-you-know-apple-doesnt-have-a-charitable-foundation <- Top Fortune company Apple, no charitable foundation

http://news.brothersoft.com/apples-charity-false-charity-true-marketing-6948.html <-- Microsoft founder Bill Gates just took the second place on Forbes billionaires list last week for his continuingly devotes $30 billion to charity...; " Apple released RED Special Edition iPod models in 2006, for every iPod Nano Red Special Edition sold, Apple donates $10 to the Global Fund to Fight AIDS, Tuberculosis and Malaria. 4GB red nano sold for $199. Apple’s Charity is always False Charity and be connected with Marketing."

 

[diogenis]

Apple simply needs to do something with their cash. It's a waste of money to have that large of a stockpile and not invest in business or distribute back to shareholders. That's becoming more of a concern every quarter for shareholders. And by the way, Exxon as a company is still worth more. Market cap simply denotes the value of the common equity outstanding.

Secondly, the financial knowledge of people on this board is downright embarrassing. I'm not saying that to insult people, but understanding the basic tenants of the stock market and some of the valuation principles behind it is useful for everyone. I suggest every person on here brushes up on some of this knowledge whether that means going to a library and checking out a finance book or simply increasing knowledge by researching topics online. It's important, even if you don't think finance is your thing.

Before advising mr. Jobs about how to run his company, I would suggest you take a look at recent news about the company planning to build something big...
Secondly, if you add all XOMs dividents for say .. a decade and include difference in stock prices then and now, will that give you back your money 40x? What concerns shareholders more again???
Oh and I am not saying these to insult you, but before getting in that library, first take a look at numbers that dont lie.

 

[divinox]

re aapl stock split

dear mr. jobs - great job
split the stock 4 to 1 please

i know in my dreams

"street of dreams..." - rainbow

Courtages arent that expensive, so why dream? You save like what? A burger at McDonalds?

 

[GfPQqmcRKUvP]

Before advising mr. Jobs about how to run his company, I would suggest you take a look at recent news about the company planning to build something big...

Yeah, because you need 70 billion of cash on hand to do that...

Secondly, if you add all XOMs dividents for say .. a decade and include difference in stock prices then and now, will that give you back your money 40x? What concerns shareholders more again???

Where did I ever say that Exxon's returns trumped Apple's? Never. Now imagine if AAPL's share price reflected not only its phenomenal growth (so the current price as a baseline) but also dividends that should be paid out.

Oh and I am not saying these to insult you, but before getting in that library, first take a look at numbers that dont lie.

Save it. Your numbers are irrelevant.

 

[diogenis]

And you are missing the BIG picture. No one can judge Apple for it's business decisions, especially after such tremendous success. Maybe Apple can be used as a navigator for other companies and not the other way around.
Anyway as it is, you are barking at the wrong door here.

 

[mijail]

It's one of the many advantages of being a contractor for over 17 years, a Reservist for 22 years amongst other things.

Great for you. But my point was: if you are right, or if you present some (documented) fact, it doesn't matter who you work or worked for.
But if you are wrong, or if you have nothing to back an opinion, saying "I worked in blahblah" adds nothing... but a chance for others to smirk.

Usually pointless since if you're genuinely interested in my comments, you can search for references on your own. However since you asked...

Yes, and seeing the quality of your sources, I am glad that I asked. Your sources seem to be a mish mash of dubious blog posts or petitions or whatnot which sometimes even contradict you.
Giving sources is, IMHO, giving a backing fact; it is NOT saying "hey, I will demonstrate that Jobs is an alien", and half-assedly type "Steve Jobs alien" in Google and present the results as "sources".

http://mkcreative.net/blog/2011/01/10/apples-lack-of-charity-still-squeezed-in-blogosphere/ - "That’s certainly true of [Bill] Gates, who not only gives vast sums away, but also speaks up in support of the organizations and institutions he believes in.
This is not the case for Jobs. To the best of my knowledge, in the last decade or more, Jobs has not spoken up on any social or political issue he believes in — with the exception of admitting he’s a big Bob Dylan fan. Rather, he uses social issues to support his own selfish business goals."

This blog post only sums up other blog posts: one from Wired from 2006, and the other by Sarah Schacht. You have to still follow that thread to find something really interesting:
"In early 2009, I attended the Google Inaugural Ball, a guy asked me to dance. The guy happened to be the government relations and charitable affairs director for Apple (see? that's what I would call a source!). I took the opportunity, over several dances, to ask him why Apple didn’t give charitably. He remarked that it wasn’t in the organization’s culture and that Steve Jobs had been burned by charitable giving in the past."

http://www.businessinsider.com/10-unusual-things-i-didnt-know-about-steve-jobs-2011-2 <-- read #6

In #6, that blogger says "As far as I know, Jobs has never even commented about his thoughts on charity.". Yeah, that's a really high standard for a source. Why do you want me to read someone who admits he doesn't know?

But even better, that blogger is in fact contradicting you. Did you even read before linking? In #6 he says, I actually think Jobs is probably the most charitable guy on the planet. Rather than focus on which mosquitoes to kill in Africa (Bill Gates is already focusing on that), Jobs has put his energy into massively improving quality of life with all of his inventions. People think that entrepreneurs have to some day “give back”. This is not true. They already gave at the office.

http://www.change.org/petitions/did-you-know-apple-doesnt-have-a-charitable-foundation <- Top Fortune company Apple, no charitable foundation

That's a petition, man. It's someone wishing something. And even then, it has only 128 signatures as of now, so you can't even claim that a lot of people agree with it.

http://news.brothersoft.com/apples-charity-false-charity-true-marketing-6948.html <-- Microsoft founder Bill Gates just took the second place on Forbes billionaires list last week for his continuingly devotes $30 billion to charity...; " Apple released RED Special Edition iPod models in 2006, for every iPod Nano Red Special Edition sold, Apple donates $10 to the Global Fund to Fight AIDS, Tuberculosis and Malaria. 4GB red nano sold for $199. Apple’s Charity is always False Charity and be connected with Marketing."

An opinion blog post in brothersoft.com. That's even less reliable than Macrumors, man. It's not even grammatically correct.


At the end of the day, we can only know/suspect that Apple is not doing a lot, charity-wise. But we just don't know what Jobs does with his money. In fact, do we have any right to know?

You are free to like/love/idolize Bill Gates for what he does. Kudos to him, obviously. But saying/thinking that some third person should do something with whatever he has is not right. Who are you to decide for someone else?

 

[Hyper-X]

Yes, and seeing the quality of your sources, I am glad that I asked. Your sources seem to be a mish mash of dubious blog posts or petitions or whatnot which sometimes even contradict you.
Giving sources is, IMHO, giving a backing fact; it is NOT saying "hey, I will demonstrate that Jobs is an alien", and half-assedly type "Steve Jobs alien" in Google and present the results as "sources".

So what you're saying is that unless you stick your hand into the red hot Sun and see it burn, there's no concrete evidence that it's true that the Sun is indeed hot.

This blog post only sums up other blog posts: one from Wired from 2006, and the other by Sarah Schacht. You have to still follow that thread to find something really interesting

You asked for sources, I only pointed you in the direction to find information. I'm not going to carry you to your exact destination just because you ask for directions, that's up to you to do for yourself. If you want to know where to buy gas I'll point you to where you need to go but don't expect me to pump the gas into your tank for you.

In #6, that blogger says "As far as I know, Jobs has never even commented about his thoughts on charity.". Yeah, that's a really high standard for a source. Why do you want me to read someone who admits he doesn't know?

But even better, that blogger is in fact contradicting you. Did you even read before linking? In #6 he says, I actually think Jobs is probably the most charitable guy on the planet. Rather than focus on which mosquitoes to kill in Africa (Bill Gates is already focusing on that), Jobs has put his energy into massively improving quality of life with all of his inventions. People think that entrepreneurs have to some day “give back”. This is not true. They already gave at the office.

Reading comprehension isn't your strong point I see. Where does it show that it contradicts anything I said? Seems like you failed to read my earlier post... Refer back to post #150

...He (Steve Jobs) even said that people assume too much that just because a company is successful that there's some requirement to give back to the people, and said that was false.

While I hate to admit that he's right on that account, it's also correct that in comparison to Microsoft, more people have benefited from them than Apple.

I never said I agreed with Bill Gate's choices with who he gives money to but that's his choice and I like the idea that he's passionate about something he believes in and gives generously.

Regarding my experience, it matters, it just doesn't matter to you. It matters in such a way that through years of experience, I'm able to form a better opinion than someone who sits at their computer merely theorycrafting about what really happens in the professional world, but this goes for any professional in just about any line of work. If you'd rather take the word from a guy who claims to know better who makes french fries at a fast food joint than someone who makes a living doing it day to day, then that's your choice. I could care less if you disagree, but that's the freedom of posting in an open forum.

Just because the links point to a blog doesn't make the content false, although I will admit it's not exactly the best kind of source, the point is Jobs has openly stated that there's no requirement for him or his company to give back to anyone. I could counter your argument with a challenge to provide concrete proof that those entries at those blog sites are false. See what I did there?

I don't know what you expect from a source, like a signed affidavit from Mr. Jobs with a Certificate of Authenticity stating he doesn't give to charities or something along those lines? Do you need to actually swim out 500 miles out to sea to believe that the water there is just as wet as the water near shore?

You are free to like/love/idolize Bill Gates for what he does. Kudos to him, obviously. But saying/thinking that some third person should do something with whatever he has is not right. Who are you to decide for someone else?

Odd that you think in such narrow minded terms. Just because I'm a PC user, you assume that I must idolize Bill Gates... typical Apple fanboy mentality. I only pointed out that his philanthropism is very well known, Microsoft has and continues to offer many grants that benefits not only students but many other institutions, which is public knowledge.

It's my right to my opinion, that's who I am on that issue. I nor anyone else is a party here to make decisions on Apple or Mr. Job's behalf but again we have a right to express our thoughts on the matter nonetheless. Sorry if you're such a Apple-Nazi fanboy that anything other than positive comments for Apple and/or Mr. Jobs hurts your ego.

 

[SactoGuy18]

Apple simply needs to do something with their cash. It's a waste of money to have that large of a stockpile and not invest in business or distribute back to shareholders.

A couple of comments:

1. Only US$28 billion of the circa US$76 billion of liquid asset holdings belonging to Apple sits in the USA. The rest sits in banks around the world, used primarily to pay component suppliers.

2. Apple is wise NOT to squander this cash in things like dividend payments to stockholders. Given the poor state of the economy right now, Apple may need this huge cash reserve to protect itself in case the economy really tanks.

 

[mijail]

Odd that you think in such narrow minded terms. Just because I'm a PC user, you assume that I must idolize Bill Gates.

Odd that you tripped on that "idolize" word. I didn't know that you are a PC user, and I don't care. We are not (I was not) talking about computers here.

My experience matters, it just doesn't matter to you specifically.

If your experience matters, I am sure you will be able to reflect it in something more than hearsay and word-of-mouth.

If you'd rather take the word from a guy who claims to know better who makes french fries at a fast food joint than someone who makes a living doing it day to day, then that's your choice.

The point being, I can't know if you do work at Google or at McDonalds.
But the beautiful thing is: who cares? Say something interesting, back it up, and I can't see what additional weight your bright career (or not) adds.

You wanted sources, I gave them to you so don't complain.

Sorry, I value quality over quantity. You didn't give even ONE real source. Maybe because there are NO real sources?

Just because the links point to a blog doesn't make the content false, although I will admit it's not exactly the best kind of source, the point is Jobs has openly stated that there's no requirement for him or his company to give back to anyone.

And here is the problem! You say Jobs has openly stated that? Well, what about looking for that quote instead of presenting it as fact but source-free? After all, Job's life has been pretty well documented, so that should be pretty easy to find, don't you think?

If you look up Microsoft or Gate's involvement with charities, institutions, grants, flat out hand outs, you'll find them very quickly. Do that with Steve Jobs or Apple, you'd have to dig through a lot just to find a small amount of hits on a search engine. Do I need to find a certified statement from Steve Jobs to tell me he doesn't give back to the community? No. Giving back is something to be proud of, is never bad for their image whether on a personal or corporate level, and is usually appreciated and posted somewhere online for some credit and/or recognition.

No, that is very wrong.

I don't follow specially any religion, but the Bible said this about this subject (and I concur, and think is a rather standard thing in other religions too):
"Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. " (Matthew 6:1-4)

Microsoft's involvement or any other company involved in charities don't have to tell people that "hey we gave ____ to ____ foundation, schools, etc.", the recipient(s) of their charitable offers/donations usually do that for them in recognition for their generosity and that is very easily searchable.

Given your extensive experience in corporate bussiness, maybe you have heard about tax cuts because of giving to charities and all of that?

Again, I am not dissing Bill Gates nor the Gates Foundation. But comparing what the Gates Foundation does to what Microsoft does is simply dangerous.

And my main point: we don't know what Jobs does with his money, nor should we know. To each his own. You'd like to see more charity from Apple? Let them know, or just buy from some other company more according to your liking. In that way you will be DOING something, instead of just complaining.

 

[Hyper-X]

Odd that you tripped on that "idolize" word. I didn't know that you are a PC user, and I don't care. We are not (I was not) talking about computers here.

Whether you realized it or not, you associated me as such and I disproved your comment.

If your experience matters, I am sure you will be able to reflect it in something more than hearsay and word-of-mouth.

Your real issue is not my experience, rather the content to what's posted in those links. You presume as if I wrote those blogs, petitions and such. Did I say that what you found in those links was going to satisfy your expectations? Your issue was I didn't provide links or sources, and I did. If you don't like what you saw then that's fine by me.

The point being, I can't know if you do work at Google or at McDonalds.
But the beautiful thing is: who cares? Say something interesting, back it up, and I can't see what additional weight your bright career (or not) adds.

So what's your point? I'm posting comments towards a thread for discussion. If you don't like what I post, I suggest that you move on to posts that do interest you. Does every post on Macrumors have to be interesting to you? Seems to me that you're such an Apple fanboy that you wanted to merely get into a pissing contest with me because I may have posted something that might've tarnished your perfect image of Apple and/or Mr. Steve Jobs.

Sorry, I value quality over quantity. You didn't give even ONE real source. Maybe because there are NO real sources?

Odd, I do too. You haven't disproved anything on the sites to which I linked. Hmm...

And here is the problem! You say Jobs has openly stated that? Well, what about looking for that quote instead of presenting it as fact but source-free? After all, Job's life has been pretty well documented, so that should be pretty easy to find, don't you think?

Seems you didn't get the memo, it's quite common and old information. When I read about it on the internet, it came to no surprise to me.

No, that is very wrong.

I don't follow specially any religion, but the Bible said this about this subject (and I concur, and think is a rather standard thing in other religions too):
"Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. " (Matthew 6:1-4)

You seriously brought in religion into this discussion to challenge my comment? Source verification authority, grammar police, Apple fanboy and now Bible Preacher? Interesting credentials indeed.

Here, let me rephrase what you just did.

"You sir are WRONG, WRONG, WRONG! I'm not a religious person but the Bible says you are and here's the proof!"

Given your extensive experience in corporate bussiness, maybe you have heard about tax cuts because of giving to charities and all of that?

Again, I am not dissing Bill Gates nor the Gates Foundation. But comparing what the Gates Foundation does to what Microsoft does is simply dangerous.

Not all charities are eligible for tax write offs. Not sure what you mean by "dangerous" as you make no sense in saying that. What Bill Gates does with his own personal money versus what happens with Microsoft's are 2 different things. For the latter it requires approval and most certainly involves a formal process, whereas Bill can give to whomever he feels is the next lucky recipient arbitrarily when it comes to his personal funds.

And my main point: we don't know what Jobs does with his money, nor should we know. To each his own. You'd like to see more charity from Apple? Let them know, or just buy from some other company more according to your liking. In that way you will be DOING something, instead of just complaining.

Why not? You can't expect to be the most valuable company at the #1 spot and not expect to have inquiries as to where some of that money goes to.

 

[mijail]

Your real issue is not my experience, rather the content to what's posted in those links. You presume as if I wrote those blogs, petitions and such. Did I say that what you found in those links was going to satisfy your expectations? Your issue was I didn't provide links or sources, and I did. If you don't like what you saw then that's fine by me.

Well, in fact, my real issue was that I was trying to take you seriously. You know, as if what you said could have some merit.
My expectation was backing information. Was that such an unreasonable expectation?

So what's your point? I'm posting comments towards a thread for discussion. If you don't like what I post, I suggest that you move on to posts that do interest you. Does every post on Macrumors have to be interesting to you? Seems to me that you're such an Apple fanboy that you wanted to merely get into a pissing contest with me because I may have posted something that might've tarnished your perfect image of Apple and/or Mr. Steve Jobs.

Since you seem to like rephrasing, I'll rephrase the "conversation" up to this point:
You: "Steve Jobs said blahblah"
Me: "When? I in fact remember something else"
You: "Can't remember. Here, look at this cereal box."
Me: "... this cereal box has nothing to do with the subject!"
You: "You fanboy!"

Odd, I do too. You haven't disproved anything on the sites to which I linked. Hmm...

Ever heard of the "black swan problem"? You can't PROVE that something does NOT exist (outside of mathematics, of course). You can only PROVE that it DOES exist, or SUSPECT that it does NOT. Do flying monkeys exist? No one can PROVE that they don't, we only know that nobody ever reported one.

So the same happens with Jobs' charity efforts (hell, I hate to sound like I am defending him). We only know that nobody has reported anything. That doesn't PROVE anything.

Corollary: the one saying that something EXISTS has the burden of proof. You say that Jobs' quote exists: the burden of proof is yours.

And as a sidenote: I never said that Jobs did anything about charity; I can only point, as I already did in my first post, to what he said in some interview about 15 years ago. Here you have the link: http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/4.02/jobs_pr.html . Look at the question "Could technology help by improving education?".

Steve Jobs> I used to think that technology could help education. I've probably spearheaded giving away more computer equipment to schools than anybody else on the planet. But I've had to come to the inevitable conclusion that the problem is not one that technology can hope to solve. What's wrong with education cannot be fixed with technology. No amount of technology will make a dent. ........

(look at that: it took me 1 minute and 4 words in Google to find that 15-year old interview. Makes me wonder why you can't find your quote...)

Seems you didn't get the memo, it's quite common and old information. When I read about it on the internet, it came to no surprise to me.

Well, you see, it was a surprise to me. That's why I asked for your sources. What a pity that you can't remember where you read that.

You seriously brought in religion into this discussion to challenge my comment? Source verification authority, grammar police, Apple fanboy and now Bible Preacher? Interesting credentials indeed.

Your only certain credential up to now seems to be Name Caller.

Here, let me rephrase what you just did.

"You sir are WRONG, WRONG, WRONG! I'm not a religious person but the Bible says you are and here's the proof!"

I'd prefer something like "what you said is so wrong that I can even retort by quoting the ****ing Bible, maaaan".

Heh, in fact it was SO wrong that you even edited your post to erase that quote...

Not all charities are eligible for tax write offs. Not sure what you mean by "dangerous" as you make no sense in saying that.

If you are trying to get to a valid conclusion, that kind of thinking is plainly dangerous.

If you are not trying to get to a valid conclusion, hey, by all means go wild. Sorry that I interrupted you. Please proceed.

Why not? You can't expect to be the most valuable company at the #1 spot and not expect to have inquiries as to where some of that money goes to.

I thought freedom and capitalism were about doing what you want with what you have?

(hey, look at me, now I am a rabid Capitalist!!)