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Two things:

1. Bugs are not a day-to-day reality. I've worked with Oracle technology for almost 20 years and I will encounter, on average, 2-3 database bugs per project. They are certainly not "day-to-day" activities. And certainly none that involve a client's data loss. Oracle would go out of business very quickly if 100G of financial data was randomly "oopsed" for several customers.

2. If you're actually comparing Apple to the likes of IBM and Microsoft, then I would argue the entire purpose of Apple has been upended. Apple was the first on a lot of things.. first to put ECC ram in consumer laptops, first to have SSD drives standard, first to remove ports, etc. etc. If we're throwing our hands up now and saying "Oh, well Apple is just like everyone else", then Apple has lost.


As to #1) Anyone in the software business knows that you are never bug free. Never.

Also, read my response in full and you will see that I think this bug in monumental.

#2) You are reading my response incorrectly. I was responding to your flippant post "bug, bugs, bugs..." which you meant 100% to communicate that you believed Apple is a company in decline because of some many "bugs. bugs, bugs". I argue all tech companies are dealing with bugs EVERY DAY. If you honestly believe that data loss has not occurred at Microsoft, IBM and Oracle - due solely to a bug - well, what can I say, we'll just have to agree to disagree.
 
If I go to UK with my US Samsung device, do you think they will help me?

Samsung USA denied service of my Samsung device, claiming that they do not support unlocked devices, period.
Sony Asia denied to even check my Xperia Z1 because it's not a local SKU.
Meanwhile, my Verizon iPhone got serviced in Singapore and Japan, no questions asked.
From my experience, Apple's support is superior than any other companies.

Who knows? All I know was I was able to get my parents tablet replaced 1.5 years after it was bought because the battery stopped holding a charge.

You seem to be moving the goal posts a little bit here. If we're now talking about companies going beyond, rather than what they're supposed to provide according to EU law, then I'd have to hand it to Dell. I accidentally damaged an old 2007FPW (I think it was) display. Completely my own fault, I just emailed them asking how fixable it would be, and they offered to replace it 4 years after I originally bought it. Do you think Apple would do that? Heh.
 
It wasn't so much the video. It was the time and effort Caldwell put into trying to determine a potential root cause. And this from someone who was a sceptic at best. Bug? Looks like Apple maybe thinking that way.

The funny thing about that article is that the "support document" from Apple that they link to is just the standard procedure for replacing a corrupted .itl file. Like I've said earlier in the thread, an .itl file corruption can look like you've lost music to people that haven't experienced it before, but it doesn't actually remove files. It's just a problem with the database that iTunes is accessing.
 
I can confirm that some of my personal music has been deleted. It seems to be music Apple doesn't have on their servers like Tool. Also, now Tool won't play on my music app on my iPhone or iPad so it isn't just an iTunes glitch. I'm glad I backed up my music to Google's free music manager. Really Apple? Btw I turned Apple Music back on last week to give it a try, it is still horrible with bad UI, poor playlists (max of 18 songs if you're lucky) and now this crap! I'm back on Spotify and will use Google Music to manage my own music now.
 
122 GB of music all gone, flying away into thin air EEK! wow Apple what's going on
 
Additionally, they ought to release a tool that will scan your current library, then scan a backup of your data on TimeMachine and list for you the songs that are no longer in your library but are in your backup and then easily restore them. Hunting around for songs you know have been deleting is one thing... but what about the things that have been deleted and I'm not even aware of it yet due to the size of my library?
Unfortunately they won't do that. Too smart idea for current Apple.
 
Additionally, they ought to release a tool that will scan your current library, then scan a backup of your data on TimeMachine and list for you the songs that are no longer in your library but are in your backup and then easily restore them. Hunting around for songs you know have been deleting is one thing... but what about the things that have been deleted and I'm not even aware of it yet due to the size of my library?

I think this is actually much closer to what some people have experienced: they have missing files BEFORE they start the matching process, then make the incorrect assumption that it must have happened AFTER the matching process.

I have missing files in my library and it has nothing to do with iTunes or Apple Music. It's just losing track of the location of some of the files over the years and not really having everything available locally anymore. Drives used to be smaller in capacity and more expensive than they are now, so moving files around on a regular basis or having your collection spread out among multiple drives wasn't that unusual.
 
I do understand how updates work. I worked for Apple for 14 years so I am well versed at the spin and what they know and how they react... or dont react or dont admit....
I worked at Apple for 15 years. Your turn.
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That's not necessarily true. Apples has literally, and not the urban dictionary meaning of literally either, taken years to acknowledge certain problems before offering a remedy. MBP GPU ring any bells? Anti-reflective coating delamination? Some things they handled quicky, others they haven't. No need to rewrite history.
Your examples are terrible. They're all isolated hardware defects that might require recalls, a lot of money and tons of lawyers to avoid class action lawsuits. Apple might know the solution and have a fix for those but their lawyers wouldn't have let them admit anything until they figured out the best approach and where they are in the product cycle. That could take years while a software patch could take minutes. Like i said, it's all about the amount of people affected and if it's worth it when you're dealing with fixing software that everyone has on their devices.
 
Your examples are terrible. They're all isolated hardware defects that might require recalls, a lot of money and tons of lawyers to avoid class action lawsuits. Apple might know the solution and have a fix for those but their lawyers wouldn't have let them admit anything until they figured out the best approach and where they are in the product cycle. That could take years while a software patch could take minutes. Like i said, it's all about the amount of people affected and if it's worth it when you're dealing with fixing software that everyone has on their devices.
Might. A word commonly used when someone's hedging their bet while playing fast and loose with actual facts. Nothing you wrote can even be remotely supported by evidence, anecdotal or otherwise. You could have saved the fiction. Fact remains, what I stated is still true. Apple handles some issues quickly and other issues not so much. Like every other company out there. To be clear, my comment wasn't a criticism of Apple. It was a criticism of your revisionist history.
 
I worked at Apple for 15 years. Your turn.
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Your examples are terrible. They're all isolated hardware defects that might require recalls, a lot of money and tons of lawyers to avoid class action lawsuits. Apple might know the solution and have a fix for those but their lawyers wouldn't have let them admit anything until they figured out the best approach and where they are in the product cycle. That could take years while a software patch could take minutes. Like i said, it's all about the amount of people affected and if it's worth it when you're dealing with fixing software that everyone has on their devices.
Then you're well aware of the spin on blaming user error until it hits mainstream media. And you know how many times theyve known of issues and denied them until forced to admit it was a glitch. Examples include water damage sensors, home buttons, duck head issues, fraying cables, calibrating machines bricking phones, defective logic boards, known battery issues, display issues on laptops, display issues on iMacs, bend gate, antenna gate.... the list goes on. Well known internally and denied publicly.
 
The only kind of customers Apple has more of now are people coming from Android who have dealt with worse or people who got an iPhone for the first time and don't use it enough to care. The people who are vocal about software issues are the people who have been using iPhones already for 5+ years and have reasonable standards for quality.

I'd also like to mention that 2016 is the year that an Apple software engineer went to work and committed suicide.
But we know that there isn't something going on with the software and the people who make it. It's just the increase in customers. /s

Wow.

So the suicide is tragic, but we don't know anything about its circumstances.

Second, what the hell? New customers coming from Android don't know any better? That's such a condescending point of view. I use both devices and I can say neither is perfect and there are plenty of things that an Android user could argue they're stepping down in quality when they move to an iPhone, with cloud software and storage being one.

Hardware had been previously unmatched but in the last two generations Android manufacturers have significantly closed the gap.

So no, it's not just veteran iPhone / Apple users who can tell when Apple isn't making their best.
 
So no, it's not just veteran iPhone / Apple users who can tell when Apple isn't making their best.
If you read the post I replied to, the person is saying that there are more complaints only because there are more people, and that there is no difference in Apple's performance or quality than there was in the past.

You seem to acknowledge that more people complain because there is actually more to complain about. That's the point I'm making.

Android historically never out-polished iOS until after iOS 7 when Apple started getting lazy, and then they equalized. Most people switched from Android to iOS at the iPhone 6 launch, when that difference in perceived quality and refinement wasn't as great as it was before. Android users would complain that Apple can be worse than companies dealing with Android, but they're not the ones saying that Apple's quality has gone downhill in the past three years. That may be because they didn't have an iPhone over three years ago.

You're telling me a view that aligns with mine yet you're expressing disagreement.

Maybe it's because I mentioned that suicide, which should be alarming. It was a software engineer, and he joined Apple in 2013.
 
If you read the post I replied to, the person is saying that there are more complaints only because there are more people, and that there is no difference in Apple's performance or quality than there was in the past.

You seem to acknowledge that more people complain because there is actually more to complain about. That's the point I'm making.

Android historically never out-polished iOS until after iOS 7 when Apple started getting lazy, and then they equalized. Most people switched from Android to iOS at the iPhone 6 launch, when that difference in perceived quality and refinement wasn't as great as it was before. Android users would complain that Apple can be worse than companies dealing with Android, but they're not the ones saying that Apple's quality has gone downhill in the past three years. That may be because they didn't have an iPhone over three years ago.

You're telling me a view that aligns with mine yet you're expressing disagreement.

Maybe it's because I mentioned that suicide, which should be alarming. It was a software engineer, and he joined Apple in 2013.

I did not think I was giving you a view that completely aligned with what you had said, which is why I had replied. We both agree that there has been an actual decline in Apple quality.

I felt the point you were making was that long-time Apple users had a better understanding of the decline in Apple's quality. I am saying two things: 1) even non-Apple users are able to appreciate the decline in quality (without even switching, mind you) and 2) new users going from Android to iOS still feel they are stepping down in some ways (pre or post iOS 7) not due to design or hardware quality but because of certain software features (cloud services, namely, but also control and customization).

I think Android out did iOS in customization, control and cloud services and still does.

The decline post iOS 7 wasn't JUST that Apple's quality began to decline but that 2013 was also the year KitKat as released, and subsequently the summer after iOS 7 Google debuted Material Design, so arguably Google's software design improved rapidly after 2013. Finally, also, hardware manufacturers have begun making quality phones (not everyone, but many).

So my disagreement was only that it's not just long-time Apple users who were sensitive to the decline. An Android user who switched felt the weakness of certain software features right away and the fact that iOS had been catching up to Android in many other ways of the ensuing years.

Ultimately you're right, my post is probably completely unnecessary and what alarmed me more was connecting the suicide to Apple and its quality (or maybe corporate attitudes or morale?) and to that I just wanted to say how we don't know what exactly was going, suicide is complex and it's unfair to tie Apple and its potential in-house issues with an employee's suicide.
 
Software deleting private data without asking the user for permission first is a very very serious issue.

Downplaying it with quotes such as "in an extremely small number of cases" is also very insulting to me as a customer...

Ex. : "In an extremely small number of cases, uncareful iCar drivers may have been electrocuted by the charging electronics... apple is investigating... "

They definitely must step up in responsibility, if they want to sell cars some time..
 
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For some reason, I stand by Apple's side. Sure! If the bug consists of deleting 122 gigs worth of music, then shame on Apple. But, ever since I read the first sentence of the blog, all I heard was nagging and sensationalist writing. And to create lies saying that Apple willingly and purposely deleted those unrecoverable tracks makes my blood boil. Besides that, I hope Apple's music app redesign meets my expectations cause right now it's full of s***.
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This is what I keep telling everyone. And when I do, they keep asking: "What is iTunes Match?"

I am a long-time, loyal Apple user. I started with an Apple Lisa.

I think the issue is with iTunes Match. When I first signed up, my entire library was erased from my iPhone and I could only stream. This was problematic when in 3G coverage areas so I reloaded my entire library back onto my iPhone. Then, about a year later, it happened again. How ever one labels it -- "rare" or otherwise -- it happened to me twice.

The other thing that happened with iTunes Match relates to my Apple TVs. I have six of them, G2s and G3s. iTunes Match/My Music would simply not work. My software was up to date. What did the trick was resetting each one to factory settings. Of course, I had to set up each one as if new. But, it worked.

Again, how ever one labels -- "rare" or otherwise, it really happened to me a total of 8 times and it all seemed to be related to iTunes Match.

It is somewhat disheartening when this sort of thing happens and we also hear rumors that Apple is talking about turning off downloads and going streaming only.
 
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