Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

webkit

macrumors 68030
Jan 14, 2021
2,893
2,508
United States
Looks like Apple did not want the iPhone 12 mini to go down to $500 and start to encroach on the price points established by the iPhone SE.

Perhaps but it's also been common for Apple to only offer one version of the two year old model. Given the reportedly low sales of minis, it would make sense that the 12 they offered would be the "regular" size.
 

jamesmcinerney

macrumors newbie
Jul 9, 2014
8
5
Here in Europe, iPhone 13 and 13 mini continue to be sold under the same exact prices as last year: 809€ for the mini, 909€ for the regular iPhone 13.

Then, iPhone 14 is a thousand euros.
Who says it won't be designated to become the new SE? I mean, they can't give people and emerging economies a low-cost big-screen iPhone, can they? (due to the danger of cannibalising sales of other me expensive models)


USA:
999 USD / 998 € plus local taxes.

Ireland:
1089 USD / 1088 € plus local VAT.
And up to 6 years of statutory warranty rights in addition to Apple's warranty.

Apple's products have always been a little more expensive overseas.
Yeah I get your point - but even with VAT accounted for the price has still jumped significantly in Europe while staying the same in the US. The price gap has never been that big and the manufacturing cost per device is the same so why is the profit margin higher in Europe for the same product.

I’ve checked the price on Apples Singapore website, Australian site etc and the EU price is the highest with no real reason for it.
 

AppliedMicro

macrumors 68020
Aug 17, 2008
2,204
2,529
Yeah I get your point - but even with VAT accounted for the price has still jumped significantly in Europe while staying the same in the US. The price gap has never been that big and the manufacturing cost per device is the same so why is the profit margin higher in Europe for the same product.

I’ve checked the price on Apples Singapore website, Australian site etc and the EU price is the highest with no real reason for it.
Apple has always primarily priced their devices in USD. And that (USD) is most probably their cost base, what they’re paying suppliers for manufacturing (certainly not EUR to any great degree).

Their products in Europe have long been priced at a premium of slightly less than 10% across different product ranges, if you compare net prices. Upon release. Apple have been rather reluctant to adjust pricing in overseas markets unless they‘ll release a new model, absorbing some exchange rate fluctuations.

I also don‘t think that the margin is much higher in Europe than in the US. Their financial figures, in fact, suggest that their European hardware margins are on the low end among geographical regions.
 

AppliedMicro

macrumors 68020
Aug 17, 2008
2,204
2,529
I’ve checked the price on Apples Singapore website, Australian site etc and the EU price is the highest with no real reason for it
You checked wrong:

Australia:
1590 AUD (net of 10% goods and services tax) for the base 14 Pro = 1073 USD

Singapore:
1571 SGD (net of 7% goods and services tax) = 1096 USD

Ireland:
1088€ EUR (net of 23% value added tax) = 1088 USD

👉 Basically the same net prices in all three countries.

Apple doesn’t pocket the VAT/sales taxes that got added on top of these net prices, mind you.
These taxes are (supposed to be) borne by consumers - not retailers or manufacturers. Apple or third-party retailers are just obliged to collect them on behalf of the government on domestic sales. They’ll just pass them through to the taxman, so Apple will only pocket the net price.

with no real reason for it.
There is:

EU buyers just pay (much) higher sales/VAT taxes than other countries.
And their currency has very much tanked against the USD lately (by about 18% over the last year).

Honestly, I can understand how it sucks for EU customers.
Their wages and income certainly haven’t kept up with that and/or inflation.

But it’s not as if Apple had „suddenly begun“ to gouge EU customers on pricing.
It’s very much the same pricing as every year and every new generation of products.
 
Last edited:

JippaLippa

macrumors 65816
Jan 14, 2013
1,419
1,520
Yeah it's really quite something. I'm glad my 13 Mini will last a few years but it's really getting to a point (again) where I'm not sure I'm willing to spend that kind of money on a phone.
I don't want to spend it either, but I mostly use my iPhone for filming, and there have been countless times I missed having a telephoto lens, also the ultra-wide angle (while super cool as a lens) was borderline unusable with anything but complete sunlight.
As an editor, I'd also love to be able to shoot prores!

One of the things that got me excited the most were the improvements to the camera system which, to be fair, seemed pretty substantial this year.

I really liked what I saw with the iPhone 14...I only find the price to be preposterous, but in the end still worth the investment.
I will more than probably skip the 15 gen
 

dampfnudel

macrumors 601
Aug 14, 2010
4,526
2,565
Brooklyn, NY
Apple will probably continue selling the 13 mini until they clear out stock and then next year, the mini is reborn as the next SE, with all of the new features the 14 got. You could call it a “delayed” 14 mini.
 

SantaFeNM

macrumors regular
Oct 13, 2012
150
210
Santa Fe, NM
Going to definitely think about picking up an iphone 13 mini from an iphone 12 mini now. The 12 mini has much weaker side by side 5G performance with the 13 mini, to the point of being almost unusable on T-Mobile in San Francisco. While T-mo's rollout hasn't blanketed the city yet, the upgrade still might be worth it.
Yeah, 5G reception was documented to be improved on the 13 mini due to some internal redesign and the battery life is better. I think it's worth the upgrade.
 

Konrad

macrumors 6502
Aug 26, 2009
456
107
Bi-continental
The sim-less US version of the 14 better be a joke. An anti pro joke for that. I rushed to buy a 13 pro today, but with this most boring Cuppertino show, the 13 pro was swiftly remove from the system. Europe, probably among other markets still will get the tray. And for very good reasons. Embarrassing.
 

Woochifer

macrumors 6502a
Apr 22, 2007
772
56
Apple will probably continue selling the 13 mini until they clear out stock and then next year, the mini is reborn as the next SE, with all of the new features the 14 got. You could call it a “delayed” 14 mini.
What new features? The differences between the iPhone 13 and iPhone 14 are minimal, aside from an upgraded camera and a deleted SIM card slot. And the current SE already has the A15 processor that the 13 AND 14 currently use.

I think the iPhone 13 mini will slog along until the current SE ages out, at which time we will see a new SE with an A16 processor with the mini body. I don't see the SE getting an update until spring 2024. By that time the SE 2022 will have been on the market for 2 years and the iPhone 13 mini will have been around for 2 1/2 years.

It sucks that Apple is trying to artificially create value for the iPhone 14 Pro models by gimping the base iPhone 14 models. With the base models, the only thing that's new is swapping out the mini for the plus size. Otherwise, it's nothing more than an iPhone 13 with a different camera and no SIM slot.
 

EnigmaticZee

macrumors regular
May 31, 2022
113
132
Lalaland
Normal in the iPhone world. In the Android world 6.1 is considered compact / mini... The Samsung S22 is 6.1, there is basically no current smaller flagship available (none, including the Zenfone 9, which is exactly the same size, just with more bezels).
That's crazy, I still have 5.8in phone and that's the perfect size for me... I'd rather go a little smaller (read: shorter) than bigger.

Yeah, I use both Android and iOS. I am still using S10e from Android world and not moving to any freaking device over 5.8"
 

LukeHarrison

macrumors 6502
May 11, 2007
276
111
Just ordered my 13 mini in the UK. Price drop not as extreme over here, £30 or so, and the trade in for my 8 Plus has dropped £30 to £100.

So I could've actually had the mini a year ago and paid the same price. Ah well. Just glad it's still here. All I want is a smaller phone, can't wait for it to arrive.
I've just checked. It's come down £20, yet my trade in offer has come down £30. It's actually cost me more to wait for the price drop than it would've if I'd just have bought it on launch last year. Come on Apple, play the game. Not really fair that is it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sorgo †

Stormz

macrumors regular
Aug 21, 2007
115
152
I've just checked. It's come down £20, yet my trade in offer has come down £30. It's actually cost me more to wait for the price drop than it would've if I'd just have bought it on launch last year. Come on Apple, play the game. Not really fair that is it.
If you don't need to order direct from Apple, you might be better off buying it from Argos or John Lewis. In fact their current discounted prices from before might well see another drop in light of yesterday, though I've no idea how quickly that's likely to happen.
 
  • Like
Reactions: snipr125

LukeHarrison

macrumors 6502
May 11, 2007
276
111
If you don't need to order direct from Apple, you might be better off buying it from Argos or John Lewis. In fact their current discounted prices from before might well see another drop in light of yesterday, though I've no idea how quickly that's likely to happen.
It’s done now to be fair. Not going to miss an extra tenner over two years. More the principal of it. Waited a year for a lower price that never happened. 😅
 

sorgo †

Cancelled
Feb 16, 2016
2,871
7,046
Canceled my 14 Pro pre-order; sticking with my trusty green 13 mini. And I’m happy. I just adore this little wonder of a phone.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Populus

CarAnalogy

macrumors 601
Jun 9, 2021
4,185
7,712
At last iPhone, Mini is saved for now. It will be a heartbreaking day when it is discontinued.

Now I’m thinking they probably won’t discontinue the Mini line. There really was not any point to making a 14 mini this year, the 14 itself was such a small upgrade and the headline feature of satellite connectivity probably would not have worked well with even smaller antenna and less battery to draw from.

They might start doing it like the SE and just releasing one every few years as actual upgrades become noticeable.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sorgo †

DeepIn2U

macrumors G5
May 30, 2002
12,821
6,876
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Long live the iPhone Mini!
:LOVE:
Now I'm going to upgrade from 12 mini to a 13 mini. I would have spent Pro money, for an iPhone 14 Mini Pro.
Indeed, fully agree - give me A16 APU + Dynamic Island on an iPhone 14 Mini with Macro and Wide Lens with portrait capbility and that would ROCK!
I was really confused with the pricing slide:

View attachment 2052666

iPhone 12 from $599
iPhone 13 from $599
iPhone 14 from $799
iPhone 14 Pro from $999

Not to mention looking at the comparison of all 3 phone there is very little difference between the three.

This pricing shows Apple is REALLY confused.
The hope ...
At last iPhone, Mini is saved for now. It will be a heartbreaking day when it is discontinued.
Is that Apple recent news that the TouchID will not continue - may actually mean the SE 4 will BE the iPhone Mini in new kings clothes - aka naked iPhone Mini as we already know it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Malcy16

Populus

macrumors 601
Aug 24, 2012
4,583
6,609
Spain, Europe
Is that Apple recent news that the TouchID will not continue - may actually mean the SE 4 will BE the iPhone Mini in new kings clothes - aka naked iPhone Mini as we already know it.
Nope, actually next SE will probably have iPhone X or XR body. The iPhone 13 mini will still be sold next year as a mid-range smartphone, not as an entry iPhone (which is what it is the SE lineup).

And I’ve been a year or two reading people saying “the iPhone mini will keep living under the SE brand”, people repeating it over and over doesn’t mean those are Apple’s plans. The fact that the mini resembles the first gen SE, has nothing to do with it being the candidate for the next SE. SE doesn’t mean “small edition” but rather “special edition” of a good seller design, such as the iPhone 5S and the iPhone 6/7/8. The iPhone mini is far from being a big seller to be honest.

I like small smartphones, so I really hope Apple chooses the 5.7” format, similar to the iPhone X/XS if it had an LCD instad of an OLED. I really hope Ross Young was right on this, and we get a manageable size, because if the next SE is an XR sized phone, I am probably done with iPhone.
 
Last edited:

DeepIn2U

macrumors G5
May 30, 2002
12,821
6,876
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Nope, actually next SE will probably have iPhone X or XR body. The iPhone 13 mini will still be sold next year as a mid-range smartphone, not as an entry iPhone (which is what it is the SE lineup).

And I’ve been a year or two reading people saying “the iPhone mini will keep living under the SE brand”, people repeating it over and over doesn’t mean those are Apple’s plans. The fact that the mini resembles the first gen SE, has nothing to do with it being the candidate for the next SE. SE doesn’t mean “small edition” but rather “special edition” of a good seller design, such as the iPhone 5S and the iPhone 6/7/8. The iPhone mini is far from being a big seller to be honest.

I like small smartphones, so I really hope Apple chooses the 5.7” format, similar to the iPhone X/XS if it had an LCD instad of an OLED. I really hope Ross Young was right on this, and we get a manageable size, because if the next SE is an XR sized phone, I am probably done with iPhone.

The problem is … there is NOTHING special about the SE any longer. And the starting price of each is far too close to ignore. Scrub the TouchID with news that it’ll be gone next year, it’s likely to happen. Can’t get better LCD panels of the SE size any longer at cheaper prices and eith TSMC increasing apu price it’ll not be cheap any longer “SE”.

Yes I get some need the button but nothing price will help with.

Saying the mini will grow in screen size and dimensions to the X/XS/ is the best joke I’ve heard this week.

Please compare the dimensions via gsmarena.com.
 

Populus

macrumors 601
Aug 24, 2012
4,583
6,609
Spain, Europe
The problem is … there is NOTHING special about the SE any longer. And the starting price of each is far too close to ignore. Scrub the TouchID with news that it’ll be gone next year, it’s likely to happen. Can’t get better LCD panels of the SE size any longer at cheaper prices and eith TSMC increasing apu price it’ll not be cheap any longer “SE”.

Yes I get some need the button but nothing price will help with.

Saying the mini will grow in screen size and dimensions to the X/XS/ is the best joke I’ve heard this week.

Please compare the dimensions via gsmarena.com.
I haven‘t said anything about the mini growing to the dimensions of the X/XS. I was talking about the SE.

I haven’t said cheap, I‘ve said “entry price point”.

I haven’t said anything about the need of the button, because it will probably be gone with the next SE, if it gets the X, XS or XR design.

Please, don‘t put words I haven’t said in my mouth.

The joke I am actually reading for years, is that a premium device like the mini will be sold as an entry device. Nope, not at least during the next SE iterations, because the iPhone mini will still be sold at 800€, maybe they will lower the price or discontinue it entirely by 2024, I don’t know. As I’ve already said, SE doesn’t stand for small, and Apple chooses a big seller design as the new SE because they want a high volume of sales. The mini isn’t that device unfortunately.

The most reliable display analyst has already spoken, and yes, the SE is getting bigger, I just hope not much more, just to 5.7” like he predicted.

This is nothing personal, it is just I think everyone hoping for a mini-SE don’t know Apple well enough to see that it is very un-Apple to sell a premium device (developing such a small form factor has it’s associated costs) as an entry level device. And I wouldn’t like to see so many people disappointed.

So I’m bookmarking this comment, and once the next SE is released in march/April, I will quote you. If I was wrong, and the next SE is adopting the mini form factor, I will admit I was wrong. But I think this is not happening.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.