Apple Developing 'Mac Studio,' Described as a Mac Mini and Mac Pro Hybrid

[DeepIn2U]

The Cube is back ?

2nd and first real attempt indeed. The first attempt was in a cylinder called the Mac Pro ‘Trash Can’.

I think the Mac Studio is great for:
large programming teams that have NDAs where online macOS hosting machines is not suitable, where most team members don’t need the full Mac Pro power, and can have savings to have Mac Studio which would be more powerful than iMac Pro.
Scientific division teams same sort of use case.

 

[sudo-sandwich]

I was discussing this rumor just yesterday in the what’s not coming to Peek Performance event. Apple needs a product that is more capable then a Mac Mini, but yet not so high end like the Mac Pro. This has been this requested for a long time, as a alternative to the all-in-one large IMac.

Pretty sure they intentionally avoided making this so people would spend $$$ maxing out an iMac. In the Intel days, they always stuck weak CPUs and GPUs in the Mac mini and then neglected to update them for a while. It could've competed with the iMacs without a huge redesign.

For some users like me, used 2009-2012 Mac Pros with cheap used CPU/RAM upgrades filled that missing product line in a jank way. Apple surprisingly backported firmware updates to it, giving it official support for a crazy long time, and afterwards I had it working with the latest macOS with some hacks all the way until I bought an M1 mini to replace it.

 

[Marshall73]

no way they call it studio, Microsoft already uses that name on their Surface desktops and laptops

 

[Boil]

My guess is that it will be made to replace the lowest-end configurations of the traditional Mac Pro, which are generally not a very good value. So, it's likely that the alleged 'Mac Studio' will contain the same type of chip as the future Apple-Silicon-based Mac Pro — just with fewer CPU/GPU cores and less unified memory, as well as featuring additional forms of cost cutting (such as limited expansion, etc.). A less likely scenario is that this will be the new Mac Pro, and that the Mac Pro in its current form will maybe be updated one more time before being left to die on the vine.

With discrete GPUs out of the picture, and more TB4/USB4 ports on a multi-SoC model (so one can dedicate a TB4 controller to a PCIe expansion chassis), third time may just be a charm for a No Slots Mac...!

I don’t think there will be a macmini pro now if we get the studio.

9to5Mac now believes that the smaller Mac Pro will in fact be the new “Mac Studio,” coming to replace the high-end Intel-powered version of the Mac mini that is still on the market.​

Ohhhhh sorry. I meant the 16 inch model. Specifically that it costs a minimum of $1,000 to go from 16 GB to 64.

Back at the Apple Store again; $400 to go from 16GB to 32GB, another $400 bucks to go from 32GB to 64GB (with the need for a $200 upgrade to the M1 Max SoC, because the 16" MBP base lines with the full-die M1 Pro SoC); there is no difference in RAM pricing between the 14" & 16" MBP models...

Oh let's go.
Wonder if they're going for dedicated GPUs or off-chip RAM in this.

Apple silicon SoC(s) mean integrated GPUs and RAM on the package (so not on the SoC, but still soldered)...

 

[lverg]

Anyone else thinking that the new entry-level MBP might be rebranded to MacBook Studio then?

 

[mjtomlin71]

Anyone else thinking that the new entry-level MBP might be rebranded to MacBook Studio then?

No. I think the ”Pro” in the Mac line will be dedicated to the larger tower Macs (currently Intel only). The “Studio” will be an extremely powerful, albeit, non expandable system specifically designed for ”studio” professionals; image, audio, and video processing… and more specifically, optimized for Apple’s own professional workflows. And I wouldn’t be surprised if both Final Cut Pro and Logic Pro come bundled with them (maybe even a new Aperture-like production image application).

 

[mjtomlin71]

no way they call it studio, Microsoft already uses that name on their Surface desktops and laptops

Makes more sense for Apple to use this name as the target market for these systems will probably be actual production studios.

 

[throAU]

Mac cube confirmed

 

[Boil]

The “Studio” will be an extremely powerful, albeit, non expandable system specifically designed for ”studio” professionals; image, audio, and video processing… and more specifically, optimized for Apple’s own professional workflows. And I wouldn’t be surprised if both Final Cut Pro and Logic Pro come bundled with them (maybe even a new Aperture-like production image application).

Final Cut Pro	$299
Logic Pro	$199
Aperture Pro	$199

Seven hundred bucks of software for free...? Or would this drive up the base line price of the Mac Studio...? Maybe Apple offers the software bundle for $299, but only available with a Mac Studio purchase...?

 

[mjtomlin71]

Oh let's go.
Wonder if they're going for dedicated GPUs or off-chip RAM in this.

Neither, at least with the M1. They could add support for PCI expansion options in future generations, but I don’t think Apple believes they’ll need it.

 

[sublunar]

This is interesting. So there may not be an Apple Silicon Mac Pro then. Mac Pro will remain Intel and Mac Studio will be Apple Silicon. I think this is a smart move to name them differently.

I like that thinking, certainly allows Apple to continue selling an Intel Mac Pro beyond this year if the rumour about a further Mac Pro refresh to reassure professionals is accurate.

I’d also point out concerns over the stability of the 24” iMac on the desk.

Could Apple be considering a strategic change to a future iMac Pro instead of Just producing a stylistically identical but potentially unstable 27” version?

Could this Mac studio product actually be replacing the bigger iMac? And the display have VESA mount option?

 

[mjtomlin71]

Final Cut Pro	$299
Logic Pro	$199
Aperture Pro	$199

Seven hundred bucks of software for free...? Or would this drive up the base line price of the Mac Studio...? Maybe Apple offers the software bundle for $299, but only available with a Mac Studio purchase...?

To me “studio” implies a solution, not just a product name… so, yeah, software as part of a solution would be bundled. And what better way to incentivize professionals to move away from non-Apple workflows?

 

[Mity]

I would love to see a return of the 2013 "Trash Can" Mac Pro.

 

[Boil]

To me “studio” implies a solution, not just a product name… so, yeah, software as part of a solution would be bundled. And what better way to incentivize professionals to move away from non-Apple workflows?

If Apple bundled the software without any hidden upcharge, that would be sweet...

 

[mjtomlin71]

If Apple bundled the software without any hidden upcharge, that would be sweet...

Well of course there’s an up charge somewhere. That’s why I don’t think there will be a low-end single M1 Max option… base system will start with a Max Duo and probably start at $4k-5k.

 

[EntropyQ3]

The vast majority of Apple’s customers aren’t interested in a desktop of ANY kind, though… 80%+ of Mac buyers are buying mobile systems. And, of those that want desktop systems, the vast majority actually prefer the iMac line. There’s probably a single digit percentage of anything that’s not mobile and not an iMac being sold.

Arguably the reason why Apples desktops sell like canned dog **** compared to their laptops is because they just aren’t that desireable relatively. At this point there is the completely unupgradeable M1 mini, (that no longer supports even external GPUs, and has questionable monitor compatibility) and the Mac Pro with Very Exclusive Wheels.

Some desktop customers may buy Apple laptops, but actually and in my personal experience, they buy Windows (Linux) boxes instead. This of course is an opportunity for Apple to gain market share. Unfortunately it also seems like a market that their design oriented strategy has a hard time understanding/adressing. Or maybe it’s just that their profit maximizing product matrix can’t fit a decent desktop computer offering.

Regardless of cause, I think they have been making a mistake by leaving a gaping hole in their line-up. It would be interesting if they attempted to plug it, and if they managed to not kill it by artificially hamstringing it or overpricing it. The current cryptocoin driven GPU pricing levels could help Apples perceived value proposition.

 

[polyphenol]

The current cryptocoin driven GPU pricing levels could help Apples perceived value proposition.

Perhaps Apple should launch a device expressly designed to mine cryptocoin?


[ This was meant to be mildly amusing. Not a serious comment. I really didn't think anyone would take it literally. ]

 

[Pezimak]

I wish it were true but it's not. There was a really ugly four-year stretch from 2014 to 2018 where all they offered was the same dual-core model.

But did Apple not offer any model in the Mac Mini range with upgraded specs or options during that time? If not I can see the point of it not being updated.

It’s not a matter of “If that was the case”, it IS the case. Apple has communicated as much (and analysts have confirmed what Apple says here).

Daring Fireball: The Mac Pro Lives

daringfireball.net

• Overall, the split between notebooks and desktops in Mac sales is roughly 80/20. (Personally, I’m a little surprised desktops account for even 20 percent of sales. I would have guessed 85/15, and wouldn’t have been surprised to hear 90/10.)
• Even among pro users, notebooks are by far the most popular Macs. In second place are iMacs. The Mac Pro is third. Apple declined to describe the Mac Pro’s share of all Mac sales any more specifically than “a single-digit percent”, but my gut feeling is that the single digit is a lot closer to 1 than it is to 9.
• In the same article the main thing Apple says about the Mini is “The Mac Mini remains a product in our lineup”

Firstly I ignore analysts, they do not now the hard facts as Apple won’t tell them. And 20% is not single digits either as was being implied, it’s double. And unless you’ve spoken to ever ‘Pro’ out there you do not know if they prefer laptops, it’s not just Pros buying laptopa so you cannot go by what analysts predict with that opinion either.
I’m not stating laptops don’t sell well, but as your comment proves it’s is incorrect to claim they only sell in single digit percentages, and it makes it very difficult for you to present opinion as fact like you have here.

Both of those exist to fill a niche.

Apple needs the Mac Pro to stay relevant in the professional A/V markets where they are still relatively successful (which is why there will be another Intel-based Pro - to support those who still need the expansion that ASi currently does not support).

And the Mac mini is Apple’s entry-level system, which was designed to allow people to enter the Mac platform with the minimum amount of cost.

The high volume of sales in the high margin laptop space, allows Apple to continue to develop and support these other niche systems.

And I wouldn’t get my hopes up on thinking this new ”Studio” Mac is going to be “affordable”. While it may not top out at $50k like the current Mac Pro (due to lack of options), it will probably start at $5k and approach $15-20k maxed out. It will be priced this high because it will probably out perform everything on the market for an A/V workflow.

A mini with an M1 Pro/Max will fill the hole you speak of, ranging in prices from $1,200 to $5k.

I never said the Mac Studio would be cheap? Cheaper then the Mac Pro but that’s not difficult and they won’t be paying for Intels Xeon chip prices. Personally I don’t think if they launch this Studio model they will also launch a Mac Mini with M1 pro or Max.
Also the sales of laptops really don’t effect the R&D costs of another product, that budget comes from all sales. They will spend money on developing devices that sell. That 20% pointed out by the poster I quoted above, even if it is made by analysts, is still millions of computer.
The A/V market is only one market too, from what I see of Apple that is not the only market they target, they are also big in the music market and photography market.

 

[Boil]

Well of course there’s an up charge somewhere. That’s why I don’t think there will be a low-end single M1 Max option… base system will start with a Max Duo and probably start at $4k-5k.

Dude over here (who "broke" this rumor before 9to5 Mac...?) indicates numerous things:

• System was hidden in a G4 Cube size black cardboard box
• System very quiet
• States system being looked at was "20/48 with 32GB RAM"
• States possible system configurations - 10/24, 10/32, 20/48, & 20/64
• States max RAM is 128GB

The 32GB RAM thing is a little odd, because the minimum RAM for a M1 Max SoC is 32GB, so a 20/48 system would have had 64GB RAM minimum; maybe Apple has sourced some 4GB LPDDR5 chips, so we could see RAM options of 16GB / 32GB / 64GB on the single SoC systems, and 32GB / 64GB / 128GB on the dual SoC systems...?

Starting at $4k to $5k is too close to the 2019 Intel Mac Pro at $6k, and too far from the 2018 Intel Mac mini at $1.1k; 9to5 Mac article indicates the Mac Studio is the replacement for the high-end 2018 Intel Mac mini, and intended to bridge the gap between the low-end Mn Mac mini & the high-end multi Mn Max SoC Mac Pro...?

I would put the base model Mac Studio (as I have outlined elsewhere in the thread) at $2.5k for a 10/24, 32/512, Dual Gigabit Ethernet configuration, maybe Apple goes $2,749 to cover their Pro apps bundle...?

At one point Gurman stated:

​

"...the new ‌Mac Pro‌ will feature a smaller design that "could invoke nostalgia for the Power Mac G4 Cube..."​

​

One would wonder if Apple would go with an entirely new design for the Mac Studio, or if some elements from the 2019 Intel Mac Pro might carry over...?

One thought would be a chassis with the G4 Cube dimensions (9.8" x 7.7" x 7.7" - H x W x D) and front venting like on the current Mac Pro, I would think a 200mm x 30mm fan would work well as front intake, with positive pressure rear exhaust...

No feet or handles on this one...!

Apple could also go with an all-new design, still a Cube in dimensions (including feet), but aluminum exterior shell, add discrete feet for bottom intake with 180mm fan / massive 2019 Mac Pro-style vertically-oriented heat sink / top exhaust with 180mm fan / thermal chimney done right style active air cooling...!

I think I might favor the second one, lower cost than the high CNC time 3D venting & higher cooling potential...?

 

[MajorFubar]

Mac Studio? Ah well, there goes all my money...

 

[Pezimak]

Dude over here (who "broke" this rumor before 9to5 Mac...?) indicates numerous things:

• System was hidden in a G4 Cube size black cardboard box
• System very quiet
• States system being looked at was "20/48 with 32GB RAM"
• States possible system configurations - 10/24, 10/32, 20/48, & 20/64
• States max RAM is 128GB

The 32GB RAM thing is a little odd, because the minimum RAM for a M1 Max SoC is 32GB, so a 20/48 system would have had 64GB RAM minimum; maybe Apple has sourced some 4GB LPDDR5 chips, so we could see RAM options of 16GB / 32GB / 64GB on the single SoC systems, and 32GB / 64GB / 128GB on the dual SoC systems...?

Starting at $4k to $5k is too close to the 2019 Intel Mac Pro at $6k, and too far from the 2018 Intel Mac mini at $1.1k; 9to5 Mac article indicates the Mac Studio is the replacement for the high-end 2018 Intel Mac mini, and intended to bridge the gap between the low-end Mn Mac mini & the high-end multi Mn Max SoC Mac Pro...?

I would put the base model Mac Studio (as I have outlined elsewhere in the thread) at $2.5k for a 10/24, 32/512, Dual Gigabit Ethernet configuration, maybe Apple goes $2,749 to cover their Pro apps bundle...?

At one point Gurman stated:

​

"...the new ‌Mac Pro‌ will feature a smaller design that "could invoke nostalgia for the Power Mac G4 Cube..."​

​

One would wonder if Apple would go with an entirely new design for the Mac Studio, or if some elements from the 2019 Intel Mac Pro might carry over...?

One thought would be a chassis with the G4 Cube dimensions (9.8" x 7.7" x 7.7" - H x W x D) and front venting like on the current Mac Pro, I would think a 200mm x 30mm fan would work well as front intake, with positive pressure rear exhaust...

No feet or handles on this one...!

Apple could also go with an all-new design, still a Cube in dimensions (including feet), but aluminum exterior shell, add discrete feet for bottom intake with 180mm fan / massive 2019 Mac Pro-style vertically-oriented heat sink / top exhaust with 180mm fan / thermal chimney done right style active air cooling...!

I think I might favor the second one, lower cost than the high CNC time 3D venting & higher cooling potential...?

If and it’s a big if the new machine had that sort of price point I’d be very tempted. It would suite my setup nicely.

 

[EntropyQ3]

Perhaps Apple should launch a device expressly designed to mine cryptocoin?

I sure as hell hope not. Cryptocoin mining exchanges resource consumption for tokens of value. It’s as if you were given money for every barrel of gasoline you bought and burned.

It’s an abomination.

 

[Velli]

Apple Silicon doesn’t actually need much space or cooling. 9to5Mac calls this “primarily Mac Mini based”. What if we get a new Mac Mini that is Apple TV-sized with M1, and the Studio is basically the existing Mac Mini size but with M1 Pro/Max/Ultra?

 

[polyphenol]

I sure as hell hope not. Cryptocoin mining exchanges resource consumption for tokens of value. It’s as if you were given money for every barrel of gasoline you bought and burned.

It’s an abomination.

I didn't think I had to add an emoji for it to be seen as a mildly amusing comment.

It would very likely be an instance of Jevons Paradox were they to do so using, for example, their M1 technology to reduce the energy usage somewhat.

 

[MacBH928]

the cube is back