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Apr 12, 2001
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As the Epic Games v. Apple trial progresses into its third day, Apple's internal documents and communications with various companies are continuing to surface, giving us some insight into the dealings that Apple has had around the App Store.

netflix-sign-up.jpg

Back in December 2018, Netflix stopped offering in-app subscription options for new or resubscribing members and instead began requiring them to sign up for Netflix outside of the App Store in order to avoid paying Apple's 30 percent cut. As it turns out, Apple executives were unhappy with Netflix's decision, and made attempts to persuade Netflix to keep in-app purchases available.

The subject hasn't yet been broached in the live in-person trial that's going on right now, but 9to5Mac highlighted emails between Apple executives discussing Netflix's decision. When Apple learned that Netflix was A/B testing the removal of in-app purchases in certain countries, Apple started scrambling to put a stop to it.

Apple's App Store Business Management Director Carson Oliver sent out an email in February 2018 outlining Netflix's testing plans and asked his fellow App Store executives whether Apple should take "punitive measures" against Netflix.
Do we want to take any punitive measures in response to the test (for examples, pulling all global featuring during the test period)? If so, how should those punitive measures be communicated to Netflix? (sic)
The emails do not make it clear if Apple did indeed take any steps to limit featuring during Netflix's testing, but Netflix did proceed with the A/B test and found it fruitful. Ahead of when Netflix pulled in-app purchase options, Apple designed an entire presentation to persuade Netflix to continue to offer in-app subscription sign ups.

Netflix was concerned about voluntary churn levels on iOS because it was higher than those who signed up via the web. In a nutshell, iOS users who subscribed to Netflix through in-app purchases were cancelling their Netflix accounts at a greater rate, an issue that Apple worked to solve for Netflix.

Other Netflix concerns included free trial abuse (which Apple addressed), un-grandfathering (raising prices on users locked in to a select price), and offering promotions (wasn't possible to offer discounts on iOS). Apple internally discussed ways to fix these problems for Netflix to encourage the company to stick with in-app purchases.

Apple also incentivized Netflix by describing how much dedicated featuring Netflix was getting. Apple said that Netflix was featured more than any other partner, something that Apple was willing to continue doing.

Apple proposed continued coordinated featuring across iOS and Apple TV, ads promoting Netflix, App Store email campaigns, featuring performance data, an "Apple TV bundle" and select video partner program benefits such as the option to up-sell non-IAP customers and billing flexibility to un-grandfather and cancel subscription charges.

Apple also discussed bundle offers for Netflix and an Apple service along with carrier and payment partners for co-funded subscription offers, as well as in-store marketing for Netflix, but none of these measures ultimately convinced Netflix to stick with in-app purchases.

Today, there is no in-app purchase option for Netflix, and those who want to watch Netflix on an iPhone or an iPad must first sign up on the web, with Apple collecting no money. Netflix is also not allowed to direct customers where to sign up, though, and the splash screen just says "You can't sign up for Netflix in the app."

The Epic Games v. Apple trial is expected to last for approximately three weeks in total, with Apple CEO Tim Cook and other executives set to testify in the coming weeks.



Article Link: Apple Discussed 'Punitive Measures' Against Netflix for Dropping In-App Purchases
 

threesixty360

macrumors 6502
May 2, 2007
416
743
I dont see anything here. A business manager asked a question about what the company should do. Thats not "apple" doing anything here.

Then they discussed working with Netflix to improve the experience etc.. Again what is the deal here? Apple works with companies that add significant benefit to their products.. is that news?

Finally, Netflix seem to have decided that the churn rate for sign ups via the app were even more of a problem than the 30% cut ( which would drop to a lot lower after 1yr right?).

What am I missing here?
 
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edgonzalez32

Suspended
Jul 21, 2011
653
1,189
I dont see anything here. A business manager asked a question about what the company should do. Thats not "apple" doing anything here.

Then they discussed working with Netflix to improve the experience etc.. Again what is the deal here? Apple works with companies that add significant benefit to their products.. is that news?

Finally, Netflix seem to have decided that the churn rate for sign ups via the app were even more of a problem than the 30% cut ( which would drop to a lot lower after 1yr right?).

What am I missing here?
Just because they didn’t do it doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be opened up for discussion. Regardless of your view, it’s messed up that they were even considering punishing them. That’s going too far.
 
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drumpat01

macrumors 6502
Jul 31, 2004
431
32
Denton, TX
The biggest issue I've always had with Apple's in-app purchasing is that you can't even LINK to your own website to sign up. That is not OK! Yes, people know what Netflix is and can get to Netflix a million ways...but what about everyone else? What about some other small app maker that isn't already a household name? So they can list their website for support but not list it in the app itself when registering? That's terrible and anti-competitive.
 
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CthuluLemon

macrumors regular
Aug 14, 2020
166
156
I dont see anything here. A business manager asked a question about what the company should do. Thats not "apple" doing anything here.

Then they discussed working with Netflix to improve the experience etc.. Again what is the deal here? Apple works with companies that add significant benefit to their products.. is that news?

Finally, Netflix seem to have decided that the churn rate for sign ups via the app were even more of a problem than the 30% cut ( which would drop to a lot lower after 1yr right?).

What am I missing here?

It implies Apple is willing to retaliate against developers who don't do what Apple wants, even if they are still in compliance with Apple's own rules. Being so casually mentioned in an email also implies it may be the norm at Apple. I doubt the Judge will buy into the implication without stronger evidence, though; it seems to just suggest wrongdoing as a possibility rather than prove it occurs.
 
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DeepWebinar

macrumors member
Aug 9, 2020
61
80
Even though they didn’t do it, this speaks to Apple’s greed and overreach in how they view their control of the App Store. Why would hosting the app on the App Store entitle them to 30% of subscriptions Netflix makes through the app? Absurd. I hope they get crushed in this case.
 
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Jakuta

macrumors newbie
Aug 26, 2003
22
62
New York, NY
Just because they didn’t do it doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be opened up for discussion. Regardless of your view, it’s messed up that they were even considering punishing them. That’s going too far.
A corporation considering a business decision is not going too far. IMO, it would have been going to far if they had followed through on the punitive action.
 
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Blkant

macrumors member
Jul 27, 2012
95
138
A single executive asking others if they wanted to do something indicates nothing.
Apple is the greediest company in the world. They take extracting money out of others to ridiculous levels in every product they sell.
If this isn’t sarcasm you clearly know nothing of the corporate world to think Apple is even in the top 1000.

They aren’t even in the right category of business to be among the worst. (pharmaceuticals, insurance, banks, defense contractors etc…)
 
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