Hasn’t stopped my Netflix subscription from getting more and more expensive. I’m now paying $18 a month
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Apple Discussed 'Punitive Measures' Against Netflix for Dropping In-App Purchases
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Dude, Thats one business manager asking a question! When you say "they" you do realise that there a thousands of employees that work at a company. And you also do realise there is a process that goes into all decisions that produce a unified company response. Thats ALL businesses.
By the way, it is good for businesses to explore as many responses as possible to an issue to get to the right decision. No one person has the right answer all the time. At the end of the day what Apple did as a company is what matters, not how they got that decision.
You used to be able to buy an iPhone for $450...
Inflation... cost of content... infrastructure costs... nothing is static.
They discussed "punitive measures" because a service that exists on a ton of platforms outside of iOS didn't want to give 30% of all subscription costs through iOS directly to Apple. If Netflix was just something that existed on iOS that'd be one thing, but a Netflix subscription is something people use on their TVs, laptops, etc. So a user who signs up through iOS, but primarily watches Netflix on their TV, which is probably pretty common among subscribers, is still only letting Netflix get a little over 2/3rds of the sub cost. Doesn't matter if they only used the iOS app once.
If Apple was actively promoting the Netflix app, have Netflix pay directly for those ads if they wish to. If not, remove the promotions and Netflix would have no business complaining about it. But taking just shy of 1/3 of their money, even for subscribers who don't primarily use the iOS app, isn't the way to get that promoting paid for.
I'm an apple fanboy and I find these appalling. I chose apple becuase they were better then the bs out there but they slipping into some bad **** now.
I moved to IOS from Android due to privacy and security concerns. It certainly wasn't because IOS is better than Android - the opposite is true, IOS frustrates all the time with being so restricted. I am thinking of going back - at least google is upfront about not being trustworthy, rather than Apple with its holier-than-thou attitude belied by its actions.
Thank you. Geez I wonder why everyone is having a hard time comprehending this?
The “Why does Netflix get away with it while Epic can’t” question always boggles my mind.
Apple has already told Epic they can charge people on their company’s website and Apple will be ok with it; you just can’t charge through the app without the tax.
exactly most developers have to Pay to be in the store and make money. $100 upfront with the idea you may recoup your costs.
As a develper thats ok when your just starting out and getting your Idea strait but the option to self host and administrat is a good idea for non novice developers.
It's clear that many commenters here don't appreciate how a business works.
The AppStore is a business model. If Apple is going to promote an App, it stands to reason they want to make money off that app in exchange for that promotion--promoted apps consume time and resources. If they're not going to make money, then it's perfectly reasonable to discuss discontinuing any feature promotion of that app. The fact that Apple discussed this internally isn't at all surprising.
What Epic wants is something different. They want the ability to collect payments through their app without going through the AppStore infrastructure to process those payments. If that comes to pass, then any app can have its own payment channel. That means no one knows who's processing that payment. Let that happen and the fraud will run rampant.
Epic also wants the ability to load apps on iOS outside of the AppStore (as do many others). Let that happen, and the malware/spyware/adware on iOS will run rampant, just as it does on Android. Anyone that's looking for that experience can just switch to Android. Leave iOS alone. Nothing is perfect, but the "walled garden" is better than most.
The AppStore is a business model. If Apple is going to promote an App, it stands to reason they want to make money off that app in exchange for that promotion--promoted apps consume time and resources. If they're not going to make money, then it's perfectly reasonable to discuss discontinuing any feature promotion of that app. The fact that Apple discussed this internally isn't at all surprising.
What Epic wants is something different. They want the ability to collect payments through their app without going through the AppStore infrastructure to process those payments. If that comes to pass, then any app can have its own payment channel. That means no one knows who's processing that payment. Let that happen and the fraud will run rampant.
Epic also wants the ability to load apps on iOS outside of the AppStore (as do many others). Let that happen, and the malware/spyware/adware on iOS will run rampant, just as it does on Android. Anyone that's looking for that experience can just switch to Android. Leave iOS alone. Nothing is perfect, but the "walled garden" is better than most.
It's like you don't know that MacOS exists. Or do you just believe that it's riddled with malware and fraud? Not to mention the countless scam apps that already exist on the App Store which Apple is slow to remove because they generate a lot of revenue.
Apple already sells devices that allow you to install software from outside of its App Store. This is a solved problem.
I agree. I actually don’t do subscription outside of the App store for that very reason. Figuring out how to end those web subscriptions when the trail ends is next to impossible. I actually signup to things on Apple and then immediately cancel so I don’t forget.
Netflix is big enough to resist Apple's pressure. Smaller companies are not so lucky ...
www.theverge.com
Apple made ProtonMail add in-app purchases, even though it had been free for years
Apple strongarmed another independent email app
www.theverge.com
This stuff always reminds me of Godfather 2, when the Deniro's character bumps off the boss that causing everyone misery. And now he collects tax off them because, guess what... he did the hard work!
Apple has done the hard work. That's why Jobs had that attitude to this. Why if you do the hard work to create a situation that everyone can eat off should you then just give it away for free. What if you didn't do that work? Where would everyone be? NOWHERE.
People have short memories. I remember it what software development was like pre the App Store for indie dev's. It was practically impossible due to distribution costs, piracy etc.. not to mention malicious files. The big companies selling boxed software had everything on lock so it was extremely hard for devs to setup on their own and sell software. You were in a similar situation that indie artists were in vs major labels.
Then the web came and changed the distribution model for software which was big deal. Subsequently Apple came and provided a streamlined service for actual exe's.
Apple basically solved the "friction" just like they did with iTunes music. They fixed the distribution issues, the piracy issues and the malicious code problem. And most importantly they used the trust they'd built in iTunes to fix the payment trust issue. No-one had done that all in one go. No one.
The even solved the pricing issue because dev's needed to account for piracy and would sell 1 app for multiple times its cost to cover piracy. Now you had so many devices to sell to easily with no friction you could sell an app for $3 or whatever and still make lots of money. Thats why we now have software synths that would be $100 sell for $4.99. This a miraculous achivement considering what was happening before.Essentially they gave software dev's who would normally HAVE to work for some crappy big company the ability to work for themselves.
So now everyone has amnesia and has forgotten what it was like before. And they pretend that this current App Store model was always going to happen. lol.. yeah. right! sure it was!
As for apple needing dev's to make the App Store happen. How about dev's needing Apple to create the setup in the first place! No one else did. What makes everyone think google or MS / Oracle etc.. were ever going to create anything like what Apple did for devs? Previously these companies have only liked to work with big companies (i.e. how the console business works). Dev kits used to cost thousands not 99 dollars a year etc...
I tell you, people forget the history as quick as they can when they want to make a buck...
Apple has done the hard work. That's why Jobs had that attitude to this. Why if you do the hard work to create a situation that everyone can eat off should you then just give it away for free. What if you didn't do that work? Where would everyone be? NOWHERE.
People have short memories. I remember it what software development was like pre the App Store for indie dev's. It was practically impossible due to distribution costs, piracy etc.. not to mention malicious files. The big companies selling boxed software had everything on lock so it was extremely hard for devs to setup on their own and sell software. You were in a similar situation that indie artists were in vs major labels.
Then the web came and changed the distribution model for software which was big deal. Subsequently Apple came and provided a streamlined service for actual exe's.
Apple basically solved the "friction" just like they did with iTunes music. They fixed the distribution issues, the piracy issues and the malicious code problem. And most importantly they used the trust they'd built in iTunes to fix the payment trust issue. No-one had done that all in one go. No one.
The even solved the pricing issue because dev's needed to account for piracy and would sell 1 app for multiple times its cost to cover piracy. Now you had so many devices to sell to easily with no friction you could sell an app for $3 or whatever and still make lots of money. Thats why we now have software synths that would be $100 sell for $4.99. This a miraculous achivement considering what was happening before.Essentially they gave software dev's who would normally HAVE to work for some crappy big company the ability to work for themselves.
So now everyone has amnesia and has forgotten what it was like before. And they pretend that this current App Store model was always going to happen. lol.. yeah. right! sure it was!
As for apple needing dev's to make the App Store happen. How about dev's needing Apple to create the setup in the first place! No one else did. What makes everyone think google or MS / Oracle etc.. were ever going to create anything like what Apple did for devs? Previously these companies have only liked to work with big companies (i.e. how the console business works). Dev kits used to cost thousands not 99 dollars a year etc...
I tell you, people forget the history as quick as they can when they want to make a buck...
They have no right to ask what?
What did Apple do? You can’t sue someone for thinking about doing something bad to you.
That cuts both ways. Where would Apple be without the vibrant app developer community?
Besides, people forget that the original iPhone didn't have an app store when it came out. Jobs envisioned that everyone would use web applications at the time, which wouldn't allow Apple to play these games.
Netflix is big enough to resist Apple's pressure. Smaller companies are not so lucky ...
Apple made ProtonMail add in-app purchases, even though it had been free for years
Apple strongarmed another independent email app
When you say “Netflix is big enough” you mean “Netflix doesn’t have to rely on apple’s infrastructure to attract customers.” If you do need to rely on apple’s infrastructure, seems fair for apple to charge for that.
By that definition "Apple" never does anything - just people working for Apple.
FYI Apple isn't alive. Executives' decisions on company actions, often through the work of other employees, is what everyone else means when they say Apple is doing something.
No, you are missing the point. There is no evidence anything ever came from asking the question. Asking the question did not hurt Netflix. “Should we smack Scott in the head?” is only a problem if the answer is “yes“ and there is follow-through.
That's only one aspect. The other is that Netflix is popular enough that its absence on Apple products would probably hurt Apple's sales. You can see from the email exchange quoted in the article that the execs were spending a lot of effort not to lose them.
Besides, I don't think a company like Protonmail has to "rely on apple’s infrastructure to attract customers".