Come on now let's be serious. I doubt they would hold a special event for a Madonna partnership. You don't invite the media for something as lame as a Madonna partnership.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Apple Event: September 5th, 2007
- Thread starter stevehp
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Come on now let's be serious. I doubt they would hold a special event for a Madonna partnership. You don't invite the media for something as lame as a Madonna partnership.
how do you know that?
I have never heard anything about having or not having wi-fi. I think you are wishing.
I really think scrolling using a circle is better than cover flow. It's one handed, whereas coverflow would require one hand to hold the iPod and another to touch.
Then again, the closest experience I've had in coverflow scrolling is my Mac's two-finger scrolling through iTunes. So maybe I'm just making uneducated assumptions.
-=|Mgkwho
Then again, the closest experience I've had in coverflow scrolling is my Mac's two-finger scrolling through iTunes. So maybe I'm just making uneducated assumptions.
-=|Mgkwho
Madonna was also the only non-Apple employee in the world that got an iPhone before it was released.
Not for testing, but for keeps.
I think it's kind of creepy. Can you imagine el Jobso all fawning and giggly over that over-hyped, talentless man-woman? It has about the same "ick-factor" as Balmer's monkey-dance IMO.
A summary and (hopefully) logical analysis of the earlier debates about Sept. 5
Finally: NEWS!!! A number of us have been hovering around these boards for the past week (for some, probably much longer, sigh…), and a good debate sort of fleshed out the thinking on the new ipods. Now that we know that there will be new ipods, and that they will almost certainly include a widescreen ipod, I though I would post the fruits of our debate for the many whom have not seen them. What follows below are not really my ideas, but just me reorganizing them all together (so thanks to everyone who posted on the earlier threads in the past week). I APPOLOGIZE for those who have already read this, I just wanted to keep it updated (I'm not trying to spam or anything, i guess I just don't know when to shut u...)
I just want to build on these ideas and go through a quick logical analysis on the product line as it might stand, so bear with me.
(sorry for the length, but there’s a lot to cover)
Assumptions
First, there are some important assumptions that can be helpful in narrowing down the options:
a) Ipod have always gotten unequivocally better than their previous versions. In every new generation, there has Always been models that loose nothing (really significant) from previous models. The only possible exception would be the mini diehards, but the nano proved to be a positive upgrade in all respects, with a smaller size, eventually greater capacity, and better battery life with flash memory. What Apple wants to avoid is making someone want to buy (other than for sentimentality) a previous version, and they have been successful.
b) Because of the above point, they are unlikely to do the following
i. Not include a HDD ipod. The highest conceivable flash-memory based ipod would have 32 gigs, and could pay a premium for that. Many people use up all of their 60 and 80 gig ipods, so not including one of the same or larger size would make a previous generation (and 5.0) superior in a significant way.
ii.Get rid of the small form factor of the nano. Unless the pictures have the scale wrong (maybe the click wheel isn’t the part that stays the same size, but the width, and its just a shorter nano but not wider???), they would be getting rid of the best selling Ipod ever, and not with a compatible version. The nano fills a huge niche: people who want to listen to some (not dozens of gigs) of music. Its cheap, small, and easy, and would remain popular even after it was discontinued. The nano, or some small and cheap heir, must remain.
c) Ignore the niche of the shuffle. It’s cheap, there are some people who love its size and functions, so why get rid of it? I don’t think than anyone is suspecting that, so we have another model.
Models
Let’s regroup. We have, at this point, two models that seem stupid to kill because there is nothing more to add (i.e. a larger screen, or a screen period) that wouldn’t come at the cost of what defines the Nano or shuffle (size, randomness). So we have:
1) SHUFFLE. While they may want to keep from having too many versions (like sandisk or creative, that make things complicated), there is no reason not to add a 4gb version, keep the 2gb version, and maybe have a 1gb version, with a subsequent price shift. Other devices are catching up and are cheaper, so apple may have to pull some muscle here.
2) NANO. While its hard to see them discontinuing it, it is also difficult to predict what they will do to differentiate it. Video (on the current sized pod) seems pointless (especially if the stubby comes to pass), and while a 16 gb version may be in the works, one would expect something more. Shorter pod? Longer screen? It’s impossible to tell without knowing the other models (or having a source).
3) TOUCH/WIDESCREEN. OK, now we KNOW there will be a widescreen. The current ipod video is primarily 2 years old. While a stubby (get to that later) could be in the works, that would be a pathetic upgrade to span 3 years of ipods, and by next fall, Apple would be significantly behind other companies. WI-FI would be nearly pointless (read Zune) on a click-wheel/small screen ipod, and so (baring Apple coming up with a new technology completely, like mind reading) widescreen is the first step (unless Steve thinks everyone loves coverflow enough to make it the only 6g advance, after which there would be a revolt). At this point, if they have OS X, then why not include multi-touch? While the click-wheel is sentimental (maybe have it as a virtual option), its in the past.
---Also, this is likely where a HDD would come in. While a “stubby” could have a hard drive, the primary use for the larger hard drives would be to include some video, which would go perfectly with a widescreen. Maybe they’ll have flash for frequently played songs (or loading current playlists before turning off the hard drive temporarily), and maybe they’ll have a flash-only version (although that could be too many models for Apple), but you can bet on a Widescreen, hard drive ipod with multi-touch.
---Wi-FI? I would love it, as my home and work all have WI-FI, so I could always be connected. THIS IS THE CENTRAL QUESTION. This has been a hotly debated topic, and it is hard to predict with the Iphone in the mix. That said, it was ApplePi at Appleinsider that made the most compelling argument. If the video has a Hard Drive (or at least 16 or 32 gigs of Flash) as it must for a video niche device, than it would far surpass the iphone in that regard. While some people would likely buy both, it is hard to see the iphone taking second place to an ipod at this time, as the ipod would only be lacking phone capability. Remember the January Keynote when Steve said there were three devices, for now, I think we can expect the Ipod (although we can still hope) to stay in its niche and let the iphone take all three. In a year or so, things may be different. Hopefully, even without internet and mail, the ipod will have calendar and pda capabilities (and why not?, its only software), as it will certainly have photos. It would, however, be interesting to see with AppleTV.
---If we’re lucky, though, it could have Bluetooth for synching to computers, each other, and most of all, headphones. This could open hacking for browsing the internet through ones Bluetooth enabled computer (many PDAs do this). The downside: its slow (although they DO use EDGE).
---Screen and size. Without the need for a microphone or earpiece built in, it could retain a 320:480 screen with a shorter form factor, or, if we’re really lucky, go wider (for true 16:9, although that seems like a longshot (I must admit, I checked the resolution on the picture that was posted with the announcement).
4) NEW NANO/STUBBY/MINI?. Here is where it gets a bit tricky. Without knowing prices for the new Nano and Touch, it is hard to know if there is room for something inbetween. What IS promising, however, is that while the 3 above models have logic behind them, the newest device is the one that has been getting the most rumors (and fake pictures), surpassing even the touch. While it doesn’t fit a random/small/video nitch of the other three models, Apple could add it between a $200 8gb Nano and $350/$400 Touch. If the top Nano is $250 and the Touch is $299, then there is much less room for another device. Shrinking the video ipod, however, could be easy, cheap, and compete against devices in that niche (while the Touch has the premium slot all to its own). If it IS flash, it could be much thinner (there have been pictures), which wouldn’t make it seem so obese but more like a thin but wide card.
Caveats
While these above products seem logical, there are a few important caveats:
i) Apple may work on the best technologies it can and see how they come together, rather than pre-planning everything.
ii) Apple’s AT&T agreement could throw a wrench into everything, but don’t bet on apple being that stupid.
iii) Apple has, in the past, kept down the number of specific models. There are, at the moment, 2 video ipods, 3 nanos, and a shuffle. We could see 2 touch ipods, 2 video ipods, 2/3 nanos, and 2 shuffles. On the other hand, the market and technology has only grown, and as apple can outcompete others directly, they may opt for more models.
iv) Apple has shown itself to have many tricks up its sleeve. We could still be in for a WOW display (but seriously, don’t expect the iphone nano). Expect SOMETHING that no one has mentioned on this board.
v) Apple may not be too hesitant to steal market share from itself. While its contract with AT&T may bind it somewhat, the real bottom line is profit, not units sold. It has been calculated that the iphone costs less to build than 50% of its sales price, plus the money in a 2-year cellular data contract. If it comes up with a stubby ipod, than it could make a more expensive ($400?) ipod touch with WI-FI, cover the entire spectrum of the market, and only bring in more money. It seems more likely, however, that they will leave out the WI-FI, lower the price and profit margin per unit but selling many more units ($299 is much easier to sell than $399) and leave the iphone for those willing to give Apple really sick profits (thats what you get when you have a monopoly of that power.
vi) The Beatles? I’m not a fan more than your average person (which, I guess, means that I am a fan), but it seems like a good time, if they have finally worked out the negotiations, to release their albums. A special version (perhaps with all of the beatles music preloaded, although one would have to expect that any fan that would buy this would already have most if not all of the music) could be in the works (like the product/red version of the nano). Plus, wouldn’t it be cool to coordinate this with an update of the UK store?
Well, I guess I ranted for a while, but It helped me make sense of all of the rumors that I’ve been hearing, so score one for sanity. I’ve been waiting for an ipod forever (I’ve used a PDA, which was OK, but not refined), and haven’t wanted to get something (i.e. 5.5g) that will soon be out of date (although if they release ipod Wi-FI next year, I’ll be annoyed). I’d love it to be Sept. 5, and while the store stocking reports hint towards that, Apple has yet to mention anything other than the Paris expo, and we are all probably a little biased (and very impatient) for an earlier release dade.
At the same time, as many of people became impatient on the earlier boards, talk turned to a device I hadn’t looked at: the archos 605. A widescreen (with 800x480 resolution!) with touch capabilities and WI-FI for $279 for 30gigs (plus flash/80/and160 gig versions) that isn’t much larger than the current ipod and kicks it butt in the current niche. I hope this makes Apple do WI-FI with internet, because if not, then I’ll probably get an Archos 605 or a refurbished iphone with an unlock hack (and hope the cell hack becomes availible).
I’d just like to thank everyone on this (and a few other boards), because most of what I’ve written above (and all of the good stuff) came from many others debating this. I just like lists, and I’d like nothing better than being able to scroll through my music lists with muti-touch and coverflow within a couple of weeks while being able to check my email.
Finally: NEWS!!! A number of us have been hovering around these boards for the past week (for some, probably much longer, sigh…), and a good debate sort of fleshed out the thinking on the new ipods. Now that we know that there will be new ipods, and that they will almost certainly include a widescreen ipod, I though I would post the fruits of our debate for the many whom have not seen them. What follows below are not really my ideas, but just me reorganizing them all together (so thanks to everyone who posted on the earlier threads in the past week). I APPOLOGIZE for those who have already read this, I just wanted to keep it updated (I'm not trying to spam or anything, i guess I just don't know when to shut u...)
I just want to build on these ideas and go through a quick logical analysis on the product line as it might stand, so bear with me.
(sorry for the length, but there’s a lot to cover)
Assumptions
First, there are some important assumptions that can be helpful in narrowing down the options:
a) Ipod have always gotten unequivocally better than their previous versions. In every new generation, there has Always been models that loose nothing (really significant) from previous models. The only possible exception would be the mini diehards, but the nano proved to be a positive upgrade in all respects, with a smaller size, eventually greater capacity, and better battery life with flash memory. What Apple wants to avoid is making someone want to buy (other than for sentimentality) a previous version, and they have been successful.
b) Because of the above point, they are unlikely to do the following
i. Not include a HDD ipod. The highest conceivable flash-memory based ipod would have 32 gigs, and could pay a premium for that. Many people use up all of their 60 and 80 gig ipods, so not including one of the same or larger size would make a previous generation (and 5.0) superior in a significant way.
ii.Get rid of the small form factor of the nano. Unless the pictures have the scale wrong (maybe the click wheel isn’t the part that stays the same size, but the width, and its just a shorter nano but not wider???), they would be getting rid of the best selling Ipod ever, and not with a compatible version. The nano fills a huge niche: people who want to listen to some (not dozens of gigs) of music. Its cheap, small, and easy, and would remain popular even after it was discontinued. The nano, or some small and cheap heir, must remain.
c) Ignore the niche of the shuffle. It’s cheap, there are some people who love its size and functions, so why get rid of it? I don’t think than anyone is suspecting that, so we have another model.
Models
Let’s regroup. We have, at this point, two models that seem stupid to kill because there is nothing more to add (i.e. a larger screen, or a screen period) that wouldn’t come at the cost of what defines the Nano or shuffle (size, randomness). So we have:
1) SHUFFLE. While they may want to keep from having too many versions (like sandisk or creative, that make things complicated), there is no reason not to add a 4gb version, keep the 2gb version, and maybe have a 1gb version, with a subsequent price shift. Other devices are catching up and are cheaper, so apple may have to pull some muscle here.
2) NANO. While its hard to see them discontinuing it, it is also difficult to predict what they will do to differentiate it. Video (on the current sized pod) seems pointless (especially if the stubby comes to pass), and while a 16 gb version may be in the works, one would expect something more. Shorter pod? Longer screen? It’s impossible to tell without knowing the other models (or having a source).
3) TOUCH/WIDESCREEN. OK, now we KNOW there will be a widescreen. The current ipod video is primarily 2 years old. While a stubby (get to that later) could be in the works, that would be a pathetic upgrade to span 3 years of ipods, and by next fall, Apple would be significantly behind other companies. WI-FI would be nearly pointless (read Zune) on a click-wheel/small screen ipod, and so (baring Apple coming up with a new technology completely, like mind reading) widescreen is the first step (unless Steve thinks everyone loves coverflow enough to make it the only 6g advance, after which there would be a revolt). At this point, if they have OS X, then why not include multi-touch? While the click-wheel is sentimental (maybe have it as a virtual option), its in the past.
---Also, this is likely where a HDD would come in. While a “stubby” could have a hard drive, the primary use for the larger hard drives would be to include some video, which would go perfectly with a widescreen. Maybe they’ll have flash for frequently played songs (or loading current playlists before turning off the hard drive temporarily), and maybe they’ll have a flash-only version (although that could be too many models for Apple), but you can bet on a Widescreen, hard drive ipod with multi-touch.
---Wi-FI? I would love it, as my home and work all have WI-FI, so I could always be connected. THIS IS THE CENTRAL QUESTION. This has been a hotly debated topic, and it is hard to predict with the Iphone in the mix. That said, it was ApplePi at Appleinsider that made the most compelling argument. If the video has a Hard Drive (or at least 16 or 32 gigs of Flash) as it must for a video niche device, than it would far surpass the iphone in that regard. While some people would likely buy both, it is hard to see the iphone taking second place to an ipod at this time, as the ipod would only be lacking phone capability. Remember the January Keynote when Steve said there were three devices, for now, I think we can expect the Ipod (although we can still hope) to stay in its niche and let the iphone take all three. In a year or so, things may be different. Hopefully, even without internet and mail, the ipod will have calendar and pda capabilities (and why not?, its only software), as it will certainly have photos. It would, however, be interesting to see with AppleTV.
---If we’re lucky, though, it could have Bluetooth for synching to computers, each other, and most of all, headphones. This could open hacking for browsing the internet through ones Bluetooth enabled computer (many PDAs do this). The downside: its slow (although they DO use EDGE).
---Screen and size. Without the need for a microphone or earpiece built in, it could retain a 320:480 screen with a shorter form factor, or, if we’re really lucky, go wider (for true 16:9, although that seems like a longshot (I must admit, I checked the resolution on the picture that was posted with the announcement).
4) NEW NANO/STUBBY/MINI?. Here is where it gets a bit tricky. Without knowing prices for the new Nano and Touch, it is hard to know if there is room for something inbetween. What IS promising, however, is that while the 3 above models have logic behind them, the newest device is the one that has been getting the most rumors (and fake pictures), surpassing even the touch. While it doesn’t fit a random/small/video nitch of the other three models, Apple could add it between a $200 8gb Nano and $350/$400 Touch. If the top Nano is $250 and the Touch is $299, then there is much less room for another device. Shrinking the video ipod, however, could be easy, cheap, and compete against devices in that niche (while the Touch has the premium slot all to its own). If it IS flash, it could be much thinner (there have been pictures), which wouldn’t make it seem so obese but more like a thin but wide card.
Caveats
While these above products seem logical, there are a few important caveats:
i) Apple may work on the best technologies it can and see how they come together, rather than pre-planning everything.
ii) Apple’s AT&T agreement could throw a wrench into everything, but don’t bet on apple being that stupid.
iii) Apple has, in the past, kept down the number of specific models. There are, at the moment, 2 video ipods, 3 nanos, and a shuffle. We could see 2 touch ipods, 2 video ipods, 2/3 nanos, and 2 shuffles. On the other hand, the market and technology has only grown, and as apple can outcompete others directly, they may opt for more models.
iv) Apple has shown itself to have many tricks up its sleeve. We could still be in for a WOW display (but seriously, don’t expect the iphone nano). Expect SOMETHING that no one has mentioned on this board.
v) Apple may not be too hesitant to steal market share from itself. While its contract with AT&T may bind it somewhat, the real bottom line is profit, not units sold. It has been calculated that the iphone costs less to build than 50% of its sales price, plus the money in a 2-year cellular data contract. If it comes up with a stubby ipod, than it could make a more expensive ($400?) ipod touch with WI-FI, cover the entire spectrum of the market, and only bring in more money. It seems more likely, however, that they will leave out the WI-FI, lower the price and profit margin per unit but selling many more units ($299 is much easier to sell than $399) and leave the iphone for those willing to give Apple really sick profits (thats what you get when you have a monopoly of that power.
vi) The Beatles? I’m not a fan more than your average person (which, I guess, means that I am a fan), but it seems like a good time, if they have finally worked out the negotiations, to release their albums. A special version (perhaps with all of the beatles music preloaded, although one would have to expect that any fan that would buy this would already have most if not all of the music) could be in the works (like the product/red version of the nano). Plus, wouldn’t it be cool to coordinate this with an update of the UK store?
Well, I guess I ranted for a while, but It helped me make sense of all of the rumors that I’ve been hearing, so score one for sanity. I’ve been waiting for an ipod forever (I’ve used a PDA, which was OK, but not refined), and haven’t wanted to get something (i.e. 5.5g) that will soon be out of date (although if they release ipod Wi-FI next year, I’ll be annoyed). I’d love it to be Sept. 5, and while the store stocking reports hint towards that, Apple has yet to mention anything other than the Paris expo, and we are all probably a little biased (and very impatient) for an earlier release dade.
At the same time, as many of people became impatient on the earlier boards, talk turned to a device I hadn’t looked at: the archos 605. A widescreen (with 800x480 resolution!) with touch capabilities and WI-FI for $279 for 30gigs (plus flash/80/and160 gig versions) that isn’t much larger than the current ipod and kicks it butt in the current niche. I hope this makes Apple do WI-FI with internet, because if not, then I’ll probably get an Archos 605 or a refurbished iphone with an unlock hack (and hope the cell hack becomes availible).
I’d just like to thank everyone on this (and a few other boards), because most of what I’ve written above (and all of the good stuff) came from many others debating this. I just like lists, and I’d like nothing better than being able to scroll through my music lists with muti-touch and coverflow within a couple of weeks while being able to check my email.
I would use it in itunes if it let me full screen on my second monitor. Right now, full screen blacks out the other monitor not being used. If I could somehow have itunes in full screen cover flow on one monitor while I did work on another, i would *always* be using it
Because if the new iPod is multi-touch with a larger HD, it may be more of what I would need right now.
Who am I kidding, I'd rather an iPhone any day of the week.
I guess I just don't get it? If ya need a phone, iPod and Internet via edge etc... then iPhone is the way to go! Of course you gotta be able to afford a 2 year commitment to AT&T's contract!
BUT, if ya want an iPOD with massive storage and hopefully some other great features then iPod is the way to go! Of course this option is much cheaper, considering there's no 2 year contract!
The choice is really clear for all of us!
Now let's see some real innovation!
If they don't update the damn Apple TV to support video playlists and offer HD content on the iTunes store, I'm selling mine.
While I won't get rid of the few in my house...I do agree...we need HD!
WOW. That is quite the Kool-Aid you're drinking there... Let's take transferring files to an iPod out of the equation for the moment:
If iMovie 06 takes forever and a day to render a movie on a G4 mini, and iMovie 08 won't even run on such a processor, what has you believe iMovie could possibly run on a handheld device in some decent fashion? Let's not even get in to screen size limitations...
I guarantee the OS will be closed, much like the iPhone. Great if there was a texteditor, and room for Quicktime plug-ins, but I'm not holding my breath.
I'm glad someone brought this up. I do NOT use Coverflow. It's one of those things that are cool for about the first 3 or 4 minutes, but after that you realize that there are just better and faster ways of getting to your music. Not to mention that most of my music doesn't even have album covers for it. So when I DO use Coverflow I get "Blank - blank - blank - Jimmy Eat World - Clarity - blank - blank - blank - Red House Painters - Songs for a Blue Guitar - blank - blank - blank". I think you get the picture. I honestly don't see the point of Coverflow. The new Leopoard OS uses Coverflow in Finder! That's just weird...and kind of sad....and dumb.
So in short, I agree with you, it's just not very practical.
not to be cynical or anything...because I really hope the new iPods are multi-touch, with wifi, airport, mail, iChat, and are basically an iPod/PDA/iPhone minus the phone iPod, but just because coverflow is depicted in the invitation, doesn't mean at all that it will be an iPhone without the phone. Coverflow could easily be implemented in the current interface. Scrolling right would go to albums to the right, and same for the left...
I really hope I am wrong, maybe that just happens with the nano or that new square, rumored iPod. I have been using my 2G 10GB iPod for a long time now, and am ready to carry all of my music with me, on a device that is similar to the iPhone.
I really hope I am wrong, maybe that just happens with the nano or that new square, rumored iPod. I have been using my 2G 10GB iPod for a long time now, and am ready to carry all of my music with me, on a device that is similar to the iPhone.
If they don't update the damn Apple TV to support video playlists and offer HD content on the iTunes store, I'm selling mine.
I feel your pain, I like the Apple TV but my immediate wish list would be:
1) More codec, and file type support
2) Recode multichannel AAC to Dolby Surround or DTS on the fly
so we can get real surround sound out of the optical audio out (and HDMI)
3) Make some kind of use of the USB port:
3a) I'd like to be able to hookup my iPod Dock to it, & browse/play iPod/iPhone contents.
3b) Allow a USB Hub so I can do the above and still hook up additional external storage.
4) Let the Apple TV share/stream content
5) Direct iTunes Store Access
If the new nano video has a screen almost as big as the 5.5G iPod and offers 16 GB of flash memory storage for US$299, sold!
I'm really excited about the new iPods being full screen, touch, with Wi-fi...But i've got to help you all in not getting your hopes up. Trust me, I'd love to have an iPhone minus the phone probably more than anyone who has every posted that, but I'm telling you, I don't think there's anyway that Apple will release a new iPod with wifi internet on it. And it's NOT because it would "cannibalize iphone sales"...I really hate that term, it makes no sense. Who is cannablizing sales from? Doesn't all the money you spend on Apple products go to one place at the end of the day...Apple?
I can't wait to see what Apple has in store for us, just don't get your hopes up for a Wifi iPod...We probably WILL get a full screen touch iPod with photos, etc, though.
I guess we'll all know soon.
I can't wait to see what Apple has in store for us, just don't get your hopes up for a Wifi iPod...We probably WILL get a full screen touch iPod with photos, etc, though.
I guess we'll all know soon.
I'd simply be happy with DVD quality tv/movie downloads from iTunes and a full touchscreen iPod similar to what is available with the iPhone. I've been wondering why I pay for cable ($75-$80/month for relatively basic channels) yet I have a DVR filled with stuff since May 2007 because I never have time to sit down and watch tv. If the "ipod touch" comes out I will gladly buy the iPod touch, cancel cable and download tv shows to my iPod. At least then I'll be able to watch tv at the gym while doing cardio and with the few shows I watch it'll be a great $ savings over cable. I can't be the only one who would do this... Anyone else?
Some people think that if the two devices are radically different, many people will buy both, while if they are similar, a customer will only buy one device...
I love Coverflow. Well, for iTunes, and on my iPhone. But then, I have only entire albums in my library, and I painstakingly retrieved high-res art from http://www.rateyourmusic.com/ , so YMMV. I adore it, and wish it was in my AppleTV's system so I could use it there too.
nobody mentioned..
I do hope they are widescreen, etc... but more than that I hope they aren't so damn scratch-prone as my current 5.5 G ipod. Just once I'd like to take it out of its case and not worry about it being scratched.
While I don't want it armorized - the only really annoying thing about my ipod is that it gained bulk with a case - and if you don't have the case on it gets scratched all to he&&.
I do hope they are widescreen, etc... but more than that I hope they aren't so damn scratch-prone as my current 5.5 G ipod. Just once I'd like to take it out of its case and not worry about it being scratched.
While I don't want it armorized - the only really annoying thing about my ipod is that it gained bulk with a case - and if you don't have the case on it gets scratched all to he&&.