Apple Exploring New Glass Panel MacBook Keyboards That Could End Sticky Key Problems

[Lone Deranger]

This sounds like an ergonomic nightmare.

It's the next step in the effort to downgrade Macs to be more like iPads. All part of the great master plan to wean us off of Macs and onto iToys, where the profits are. Sad, sad tidings, but it's Tim Cook's vision for Apple unfortunately.

 

[Skeith]

The easiest solution is to take a step back and return to the 2015 design - who would care other than a few people within Apple who would have to eat humble pie. Pushing on with glass keyboards is just going down the rabbit hole of excessive design for the sake of it - now at the expense of durability and therefore device longevity. This is leading to massive costs on a relatively simple but fundamental component of a laptop.

Yeah. just refresh 2015 model. add/replace USB-A to USB-C. and sell lotsa of 'em. Done. simple.

 

[leman]

If they can make it feel like a keyboard, sure. I/m worried though that it would be more like these silicone keyboard mats, which were terrible for typing.
[doublepost=1549281869][/doublepost]

The easiest solution is to take a step back and return to the 2015 design

Why would you want to regress to a worse keyboard? Butterfly is superior in terms of key stability and typing experience.

 

[rols]

Do apple engineers actually type on laptops ever? It's hard to believe they do as the keyboards get progressively worse with no travel or tactile feedback to speak of. Add the godawful touch bar and the arrow keys designed to ensure you always hit the wrong one twice and I now find it a better experience typing on my iPad cover-keyboard than on the macbook pro.
If they remove all the feel and turn it into a lump of glass, they will have succeeded in making the worst keyboard, for actual people who use keyboards, possible.

 

[biffuz]

I still don't like my 2013's keyboard, and the current one is almost unuseable for me. I understand we can't have a mechanical keyboard in a notebook like in the '80s, but come on!
Several notebooks from 15-20 years ago had very good keyboards, and they don't take that much more thickness anyway (the keyboards, not the notebooks, obvioulsy).
BTW, when I can I use a full size mechanical keyboard. MX blue or clear. Just love 'em.

 

[Smeaton1724]

If they can make it feel like a keyboard, sure. I/m worried though that it would be more like these silicone keyboard mats, which were terrible for typing.
[doublepost=1549281869][/doublepost]

Why would you want to regress to a worse keyboard? Butterfly is superior in terms of key stability and typing experience.

For typing, you really prefer the 2016-2017 and the 2018 partial re-design over the 2015?!

Also the reliability of the keyboard keys on the 2016, 2017 and 2018 question the whole longevity of the device. Even if you don't mind the typing experience there's plenty of evidence to suggest the device won't last as long in terms of durability over the 2015 model. That alone for me is enough to return to a previous, apparently more reliable design.

 

[sunapple]

The 2012-2015 had less problems (wasn't problem-free), but I think the new keyboards are way nicer to type on. It looks like the move to this glass keyboard eliminates the durability issues, which sounds to me like the perfect keyboard.

 

[Starfia]

"Push."

 

[GrumpyCoder]

Not sure I like this... the current keyboard is by far the best keyboard I've ever used. I'd happily replace my external mechanical keyboards with those, if only they were available as stand alone keyboards. Changing those, not such a good idea unless of course they're on the same level as the current ones or better.

 

[Val-kyrie]

I still don't like my 2013's keyboard, and the current one is almost unuseable for me. I understand we can't have a mechanical keyboard in a notebook like in the '80s, but come on!
Several notebooks from 15-20 years ago had very good keyboards, and they don't take that much more thickness anyway (the keyboards, not the notebooks, obvioulsy).
BTW, when I can I use a full size mechanical keyboard. MX blue or clear. Just love 'em.

What is fascinating is how Lenovo can have the best keyboard in the industry in the same thinness as a MB/MBA/MBP. Even Dell’s keyboards aren’t terrible. They are very similar to the previous gen MBA and have a similar profile to Apple’s portable line. Yet Apple can’t seem to get this right.

 

[Abazigal]

Called it.

 

[kyykesko]

It's not April's fool day yet! The keyboard on current macs is horrible and apparently they want to be even more courageous and see how bad a keyboard they can actually make before everyone moves away from Macs. I write a lot and I truly hate coding with Mac these days. I even hate writing anything more than a short facebook post on it. Dragging an external keyboard around with me is not an option, so I'll just have to find the courage to move away from Macs finally. *sigh*

 

[neuropsychguy]

What about the fact that the new keyboards are terrible to type on for longer periods of time? Apple went from the best keyboard design in the industry to the worst in a single year.

You haven't used a lot of Windows-based laptop keyboards recently. I just bought a new Dell XPS in November. Let's just say that Dell's keyboard makes Apple's look phenomenal. I like Apple's butterfly keyboard. It's not the best I've used (I have a nice mechanical keyboard with a desktop PC) but I prefer it to most other laptops I've used in the past 8 years.

 

[pika2000]

Wow, so a full force-touch keyboard? That's intriguing. I just hope my 2013 Macbook Pro can last long enough to bypass all these butterfly and flexgate bruhaha.

 

[BornAgainMac]

I guess we can always throw in a USB keyboard into our bag with our laptop and other dongles and cables.

 

[GrumpyCoder]

Dragging an external keyboard around with me is not an option, so I'll just have to find the courage to move away from Macs finally. *sigh*

Different strokes for different folks. I code and write a lot, love the keyboard. 2015 version, Lenovo, Dell and even mechanical are all bad for me in comparison. If the keyboard doesn't work for you, do as you say and just buy something else.

 

[pika2000]

You haven't used a lot of Windows-based laptop keyboards recently. I just bought a new Dell XPS in November. Let's just say that Dell's keyboard makes Apple's look phenomenal. I like Apple's butterfly keyboard. It's not the best I've used (I have a nice mechanical keyboard with a desktop PC) but I prefer it to most other laptops I've used in the past 8 years.

That's the sad part. Even at what most think Apple's low point, the other OEMs don't even try. I mean I shared my amazement in another thread, how many PC laptops are still sporting slow spinning platter and 768p screens, even those in the $1k range. You would think the previous Macbook Air has eradicated these crappy spec, but there's a reason Apple could sell the previous Macbook Air for so long without much updates. The rest of the PC market are just not doing anything to completely outdo Apple in anything other than their most top end flagship model.

 

[andiwm2003]

funny that this article is just above the article from Gruber stating that Apple makes to expensive hardware, This is just another example of over-engineering. Just make the damn notebooks a bit thicker and use the keyboards from 3 years ago. Cheaper, better, more robust, problem solved.

 

[Marekul]

YMMV.

I wouldn't call that a 'fact' per se. For you and others it may be a problem, but for me, and others still, I really like this new design. I can type faster and for much longer periods of time on the new MacBook Air.

I can’t even tell because it’s so annoying with all the miss and double firings and loud noise I never wrote for extended periods of time. these keyboards are very sensitive and break a lot even in normal use. in stark contrast to predecessor model - everyone agreed apple had the best keyboards. That is a fact.

 

[Moonjumper]

The Sinclair ZX Spectrum had possibly the worst keyboard ever (know for it's "dead flesh" feel), but at least it was easy on the fingers because the buttons were soft. The less travel we get, the harder the buttons are on the fingers. This glass keyboard patent appears to have no travel, so is very unappealing.

 

[leman]

For typing, you really prefer the 2016-2017 and the 2018 partial re-design over the 2015?!

Yes, I do. and I am far from being the only one. The older keyboard feels wobbly and imprecise in comparison, I can't type on it it anymore after I got used to the new keyboard.

Also the reliability of the keyboard keys on the above question the whole longevity of the device, so even if you don't mind the typing experience there's plenty of evidence to suggest the device won't last as long in terms of durability over the 2015 model. That alone for me is enough to return to a previous, apparently more reliable design.

Sure, but at the same time, we had exactly one keyboard failure on over 20 machines in 2.5 years. It's a chance I gladly take, especially since I don't risk anything financially (extended keyboard warranty).

 

[DrJR]

This sounds like an ergonomic nightmare.

It's the next step in the effort to downgrade Macs to be more like iPads. All part of the great master plan to ween us off of Macs and onto iToys, where the profits are. Sad, sad tidings, but it's Tim Cook's vision for Apple unfortunately.

Yep. I was needing to drive an Oculus for dev purposes. Bud gave me old DK2. To get an iMac to drive it wth external GPU would be big $$$$. Built a great box for $1200, dual boot Linux and windows 10. I can sell my maxed out 2014 iMac for about $1500? The new box is 25% faster and I can upgrade away. I switched to Apple in 2004. It was a good run while it lasted. OSX is the finest version of Linux, no doubt. Don’t get me wrong, I’ll still keep the iOS ecosystem and services (until I can’t take the cost). As far as development though, Apple F’d Us over with the trash can. It was a sign from F’n Phil.

 

[kdarling]

Sometimes you really wonder if Apple execs use their own products, or if they've all got assistants for that now.

 

[leftofjuniper]

I am certain I’m in the minority here, but my favorite Apple keyboard at the moment (I have both a 2017 iMac and 12” MacBook) is the Smart Keyboard on my new 12” iPad Pro. I love the way it feels, the travel and the keys, and that it is covered entirely by the protective layer. I’m sure it wouldn’t work on a MacBook because of heat issues, but I sure do enjoy it on the iPad Pro.

 

[69Mustang]

Nope. Got a '15 MBP in 2017 partially because of the keyboard feel from newer macbooks. This new patent seems even worse. As others have stated, scissor switches were fine.

Housekeeping:

The concept differs from the featureless plain of a virtual onscreen keyboard because the...

That should be featureless plane instead of plain.