Apple Faces German Antitrust Probe Into App Tracking Transparency

[AppliedMicro]

Might want to have a look at the details of fintech sector data handling if you really want to be scared

...which, again, the UK is one of the leading and most "innovative" places in the world.

At least the UK rid itself of the pretence that the worst privacy-hostile legislation has been instituted and "required by Brussels ...so there isn't much we can do about it". Well... sort of, I guess, given the economic integration with the EEA still in place that makes it keep similar legislation.

Many German privacy activists would agree that one of the worst offending legislators isn't (and aren't in) their domestic parliament - but the EU.

 

[I7guy]

App developers can go to iOS. Or Android.

Almost no one else uses anything else as a smartphone OS.
That's why developer can't just "go there".

I guess we’ll agree to disagree. it depends, how one views the marketplace. Operating systems or vendors. Like cars, there are multiple manufacturers but only one Honda.

 

[AppliedMicro]

Like cars, there are multiple manufacturers but only one Honda.

To keep up with the analogy, 98% of the market for automotive engines is divided between Mercedes and Toyota.
Mercedes uses their engines exclusively in their own cars. And regardless which brand, 95% of all non-Mercedes cars use Toyota engines. Except in China and Korea, where they have a couple local competitors.

And you’re saying: if you don‘t like how a Mercedes drives, there’s so many other brands to choose from 😉

 

[CarlJ]

I'm a huge fan of Apple's app tracking transparency but Apple has to abide by the same transparency rules they're imposing on third-parties, otherwise Germany is right about it being anti-competitive in favor of Apple.

Indications are that Apple is abiding by the rules - they're asking the user about all the tracking that they're doing, which is none - they aren't doing that kind of tracking, so there's nothing to ask.

 

[webkit]

It can occur

It can occur and that it what I said. Well, at least you agree.

A company that mass produces consumer discretionary products this successful does in fact prove something, especially since the competition has less expensive cell phones.

Again, it doesn't necessarily prove anything. In fact, given the nature and purpose of antitrust laws, it's the "successful" companies with notable market share are the ones that end up getting charged with anticompetitive behavior.

Yes, how is apple or google preventing competitors from entering the market. It's similar to saying Ford is preventing me from entering into the auto manufacturing business.

As far as Apple goes, by dominating the mobile OS market (in various regions) and restricting other browser engines, app stores, etc. it could discourage businesses from going into those market areas and/or prevent existing businesses from achieving the level of success they might otherwise be able to achieve.

Also, using Ford as a comparison is not similar since Ford doesn't have the market share that Apple has in mobile OS. There are many automakers with varying degrees of market share but very few mobile OS makers and two of them (iOS and Android) have nearly 100% of that market.

If you were AT&T in 1983, go somewhere else was meaningless and required two tin cans and a string.

But in 2022, go somewhere else:
- Samsung
- OPPO
- Lirbrem, pine phone
- etc, etc.

In the case of mobile OS, go somewhere else pretty much only means Android. Since we've already established/agreed that anticompetitive behavior can occur even when there are other choices I will say again, "go somewhere else" is a poor way to react to or deal with potential antitrust/anticompetitive activities used by a company.

 

[I7guy]

It can occur and that it what I said. Well, at least you agree.





Again, it doesn't necessarily prove anything. In fact, given the nature and purpose of antitrust laws, it's the "successful" companies with notable market share are the ones that end up getting charged with anticompetitive behavior.





As far as Apple goes, by dominating the mobile OS market (in various regions) and restricting other browser engines, app stores, etc. it could discourage businesses from going into those market areas and/or prevent existing businesses from achieving the level of success they might otherwise be able to achieve.

Also, using Ford as a comparison is not similar since Ford doesn't have the market share that Apple has in mobile OS. There are many automakers with varying degrees of market share but very few mobile OS makers and two of them (iOS and Android) have nearly 100% of that market.





In the case of mobile OS, go somewhere else pretty much only means Android. Since we've already established/agreed that anticompetitive behavior can occur even when there are other choices I will say again, "go somewhere else" is a poor way to react to or deal with potential antitrust/anticompetitive activities used by a company.

Again, apple has been found to be a legal
Monopoly on its products. And because anti-competitive behavior can occur doesn’t mean that it actually has.

 

[I7guy]

To keep up with the analogy, 98% of the market for automotive engines is divided between Mercedes and Toyota.
Mercedes uses their engines exclusively in their own cars. And regardless which brand, 95% of all non-Mercedes cars use Toyota engines. Except in China and Korea, where they have a couple local competitors.

And you’re saying: if you don‘t like how a Mercedes drives, there’s so many other brands to choose from 😉

If the primary purpose of a car is to get you from point a to b you can pick one of you choosing even if they all have Takata airbags.

 

[visualseed]

How do you know what the majority of iPhone users think? Did you ask them personally?

Apple did. Every last one of them were asked "do you like that state of our products and services enough to give us money for them?"

 

[webkit]

Again, apple has been found to be a legal
Monopoly on its products. And because anti-competitive behavior can occur doesn’t mean that it actually has.

This part of the discussion was about anticompetitive behavior and that it CAN occur when there are multiple players/choices in a market. Obviously, regulators, courts, etc. have to investigate and decide if it has. The proceedings in Germany were only recently announced and nothing has been determined yet. Apple can be found "guilty" of illegal anticompetitive behavior in this case and/or other cases in the future.

If Apple followed its own rules, was less restrictive, more open to letting the market "speak", etc. maybe they wouldn't be in these situations as much. Similar can be said about Google and others.

 

[ian87w]

It’s funny how the scrutiny is on Apple who is providing better privacy for consumers, and not to the app developers who keep trying their best to circumvent any privacy tools.

 

[svish]

Another legal trouble has started for Apple. Never ending troubles!

 

[webkit]

It’s funny how the scrutiny is on Apple who is providing better privacy for consumers, and not to the app developers who keep trying their best to circumvent any privacy tools.

In this case, the scrutiny appears to be on Apple for NOT applying the new and additional rules when it comes to their own activities.

From the article:
However, the Bundeskartellamt's preliminary findings indicate that while users can also restrict Apple from using their data for personalized advertising, Apple "is not subject to the new and additional rules of the App Tracking Transparency Framework."

 

[Apple Fan 2008]

Data Analysis Engineering Intern - Careers at Apple

Apply for a Data Analysis Engineering Intern job at Apple. Read about the role and find out if it’s right for you.

jobs.apple.com

This says it all.

Did you read it your self. Intern will join our GC channel sales team to develop and implement business and sales strategies. - Track, analyze, and report sales KPI - Analyze consumer electronics market size and consumer demand trends, including but not limited to smartphone, tablet, personal computer, wearables, etc. - Analyze retail channel changes and support development of related route-to market strategy, including both offline and online retail. - Review effectiveness of existing retail programs - Analyze program performance both qualitatively and quantitively, highlighting risks and opportunities - Support development of new retail programs or performance improvement programs - Help launch and track the implementation of pilot programs. IT'S FOR ANYALYZING SALES DATA NOT APP DATA!

 

[Apple Fan 2008]

There is a reason why Apple does not allow Firewalls on iOS, so its users can block any App communication. Or alternative Browser Engines with decent Adblockers, etc.

These things would kill Apples own tracking mechanisms.

On macOS Apple got caught trying to circumvent it.

Apple removes feature that allowed its apps to bypass MacOS firewalls and VPNs

The ContentFilterExclusionList has been removed in macOS 11.2 beta 2.

www.zdnet.com

They removed it!