Apple Faces Patent Lawsuit Over Siri in China

[Dave.UK]

Indeed the mind boggles, as I really cannot find any reference to the polish grocery store case in this thread.

Really? Heres a link to the Polish grocery store I mentioned above
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2409669,00.asp

What about this one as well. Apple suing a German cafe over their logo

http://gawker.com/5853402/apple-threatens-to-sue-tiny-german-cafe-whose-logo-is-an-apple

Or this other Polish grocery store Apple is suing

http://www.webpronews.com/apple-sues-online-grocery-store-over-its-logo-2012-09

People seem to think Apple can do no wrong and always complain when other companies sue when it appears Apple has infringed their patents.

 

[iLLUMI]

Pretty sure Siri wasn't around in 2006.

Well I'm pretty sure it was and I'm pretty sure the Chinese didnt event the technology! Unless of course it was stolen from the Chinese by DARPA back in 2003. Hmm...

But either way, Apple bought Siri they didn't create and develop it themselves, therefore they cannot be sued.

SIRI was born out of the CALOS project: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CALO
It was abandoned or rather taken over by a bunch of guys known as SIRI Inc. in 2007. They developed it further and released it as an App on the App store. Apple then bought it and integrated into iOS.

So if Zhi Zhen wanted to sue anyone it should be DARPA and good luck with that. DARPA would crush them in any court.

So yeh it is a case of "more gold digging".

 

[usbp456]

While I was reading this, a strange thought came to my head.

What if for some greedy reason.

This company got together with the Chinese government and produced fake documents stating that they in fact applied for a patent when they said they did and it being approved a year or 2 later. That way they get Apple to stop selling their stuff in China. Which Im guessing is China's number one goal.

I dont know why I though that but Im weird like that.

It might have been because I was reading that one article where China is trying to ruin/smear Apple.

 

[TallManNY]

What, 14 posts and no...
-"Die Shanghai Zhi Zhen Internet Technology. Die" or
-"Apple should just buy Shanghai Zhi Zhen Internet Technology" or
-someone making some conspiracy connection that Samsung is probably behind this.

Of course, there is already the usual pro-Apple posts making this company out to be another idea thief ignoring that they had a patent on this technology BEFORE there was an iPhone gen 1. I know that many of us think that only Apple can innovate anything and that the time something is actually patented only matters when Apple is the one who actually patented something first but other companies can innovate and time to the patent office benefits whichever company gets there first. Apple "innovating" something later doesn't automatically make something created years ago some theft of Apple innovation (they would have needed to time travel into the future to see the Siri "innovation" to do that).

Get over yourselves. Sometimes other companies invent good things before Apple. If they build a Siri-like thing first, they deserve their rewards just as if Apple built some feature first and someone copies them later. Why is the patent system stupid & outdated when it works against Apple but celebrated when it works for Apple?

A patent on what "technology"? Is there an allegation that Apple stole code? Is Apple using similar algorithms? Because if the technology is "some day humans might want to talk to a computer", I think Alan Turing, 1950, and his Turing Test idea pretty much had that concept on the table. I'm really curious what the technology at issue really is.

If this is a case of stealing the design (i.e., putting a microphone on the screen), then it should be easy enough to show when each design was released. And Apple can buy these folks off (like they did for the latest clock program) or program in a new design in an update.

 

[olowott]

Wait, China recognizes patent/copyright laws? Since when?

you are so on point, i cant stop laughing


Those guys are legendary for copying

 

[dec.]

Really? Heres a link to the Polish grocery store I mentioned above
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2409669,00.asp

What about this one as well. Apple suing a German cafe over their logo
Image
http://gawker.com/5853402/apple-threatens-to-sue-tiny-german-cafe-whose-logo-is-an-apple

Or this other Polish grocery store Apple is suing
Image
http://www.webpronews.com/apple-sues-online-grocery-store-over-its-logo-2012-09

People seem to think Apple can do no wrong and always complain when other companies sue when it appears Apple has infringed their patents.

I have read plenty about those cases. I simply couldn't find any evidence of people stating that it's ok for Apple to sue the polish store in this thread before you brought it up. It just seemed like quite a lot of implications that you were making based on that what you would like to think "people" (a very vague term) are thinking. It might sound like nitpicking but as you can point down the amount of people who have posted their opinion in this thread, I think it's pretty measurable as opposed to the generalized "people" you were talking about at the end of your post.

People also hate Apple for sueing other companies.

 

[Dave.UK]

I have read plenty about those cases. I simply couldn't find any evidence of people stating that it's ok for Apple to sue the polish store in this thread before you brought it up. It just seemed like quite a lot of implications that you were making based on that what you would like to think "people" (a very vague term) are thinking. It might sound like nitpicking but as you can point down the amount of people who have posted their opinion in this thread, I think it's pretty measurable as opposed to the generalized "people" you were talking about at the end of your post.

People also hate Apple for sueing other companies.

The point I was getting at is people seem to think its of for Apple to sue for any reason, however as soon as a company sues Apple for patent infringement its the other company that gets complained about and not Apple.

As for people comparing a Chinese company to the whole of China - words fail me!

 

[ElRojito]

Here's a timeline for the Siri:

http://www.sri.com/work/timeline/siri

As you can see, the research for this project actually began in 2003 or prior to 2003. I'm not saying who may be at fault but I would like to apply the following general rule for awarding software patents or patents in general:

One can be granted a patent if and only if they are the first to publish the work or research for an idea. For example, if person A publishes a research paper and person B reads an attempts to file a patent based on the paper of person A, then the patent will not be granted to person B and can be only granted to person A. Furthermore, this rule should be observed world wide; when you file for a patent, it will be recognized by all.

Next, I would like to state that personal assistants have been around for as long as 1966. Please think back to 'Star Trek' where crew members would initiate commands like 'Computer: locate Captain Kirk' and the computer would respond with something like 'Captain Kirk is not on the Enterprise'. This is just another implementation of a personal assistant which uses a different deployment platform (i.e. space ship computer) instead of a cell phone. Furthermore, this work for the TV series has been researched and published back in 1966 or prior to 1966.

Finally, I would like to consider patents are truly original ideas instead of people and/or companies today trying to steal from the past.

Turing - circa 1950.

it seems like we're doing all the work here for Apple's Lawyers. Maybe they'll just get their info here. *sarcasm*

 

[chagla]

it's just amusing when other companies sue apple, they are all greedy, have no creativity and what not. when apple sues other companies for whatever reason, no one questions.

what gives?

 

[lwapps]

This is amazing! The Chinese tend to be the most blatant copyright breakers themselves and yet they have the guts to sue others. I wish all the automotive companies sued them for copying designs. That would've been an interesting day.

Oh don't be so prejudice. One company is suing Apple, not the Chinese people. Not everyone in China is a knock off merchant.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

If Xiaoi had the same interface and functionality Siri had from the get go, why didn't they try to settle months ago? It just doesn't make sense to try to dispute this after almost 2 years of Siri being released. Siri hasn't really changed and was widely publicized, they should have taken action when it was first released if this was the case.

Sure it makes sense to wait. You stand by, let tons of money be made, then sue. The big prize makes it worth the cost & risk of working through the legal system. Had Siri killed iPhone sales so that there was no money in this, this legal action probably wouldn't have happened. This is how it works all the time. Watch those legal commercials on TV for all kinds of medical treatments that happened years ago. Mesothelioma. Hip replacement. Drugs that have long-since been removed from the market. It always works this way: wait until the prize is pretty large, then make the move.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

A patent on what "technology"? Is there an allegation that Apple stole code? Is Apple using similar algorithms? Because if the technology is "some day humans might want to talk to a computer", I think Alan Turing, 1950, and his Turing Test idea pretty much had that concept on the table. I'm really curious what the technology at issue really is.

If this is a case of stealing the design (i.e., putting a microphone on the screen), then it should be easy enough to show when each design was released. And Apple can buy these folks off (like they did for the latest clock program) or program in a new design in an update.

Pick a side and be consistent. If we can find fault with others who might have a patent over Apple because of historically-similar stuff, we should be able to find the same fault with Apple with historically-similar stuff. We can't fault this company because Alan Turing had something similar in the past but then not find fault with Apple vs.- say- Samsung in iPhone & Tablet claims (when we can watch 1960's episodes of Star Trek and see similar ideas).

We sling every possible negative at the patent holder that is not Apple but we will then defend every possible positive when it's Apple holding a patent. Pick a stand and be consistent. Either Apple is just as wrong when historically-similar ideas can be found or all other companies are just as right as Apple if we want to ignore history. Or, if Apple patents winning cases against others is wonderful, so it goes with other company patents winning cases against Apple. We shouldn't whine for patent reform when patents work against Apple but praise patents when they work for Apple. It's not a patent system for only Apple's benefit.

 

[lucas107]

wow Apple fans are racist

 

[bmt134]

Apple stealing from other companies? Like that never happened before...

 

[dec.]

The point I was getting at is people seem to think its of for Apple to sue for any reason, however as soon as a company sues Apple for patent infringement its the other company that gets complained about and not Apple.

There may well be people out there who think so, I just wasn't really getting that impression from any of the posts in this thread.

As for people comparing a Chinese company to the whole of China - words fail me!

Maybe that's because plenty of inspired products like the "hiPhone5" or the "MaiPad" (or automobiles, aircrafts, watches, electric guitars (chibanez!)...) originate in China, which makes one wonder about the laws and regulations and design culture there in general.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

deleted

 

[Trius]

I'm suing

I had an idea about a cell phone that would be just a giant touch screen back in 2001.. I would be a zillionaire right now with my idea that I did nothing with if it wasn't for Apple!!

 

[Mike MA]

One month without patent lawsuits please. Oh, and no analyst's predictions.

 

[Tknull]

wow Apple fans are racist

This is the second such comment in this thread. i find it confusing. I think you are confusing people's skepticism of Chinese lawsuits (as Chinese companies have long histories of copyright infringement) with racism (treating someone differently solely on basis of race).

I guess you interpret the comments as saying "This company is Chinese. Thus, it is owned by Chinese people. Therefore, how dare they sue."

 

[macchiato2009]

LOL since when Chinese invest stuff instead of copying ?

it's funny because when they violate intellectual property, they just don't care

when they can make money on people's back, there you are, there is the law...

 

[lucas107]

This is the second such comment in this thread. i find it confusing. I think you are confusing people's skepticism of Chinese lawsuits (as Chinese companies have long histories of copyright infringement) with racism (treating someone differently solely on basis of race).

I guess you interpret the comments as saying "This company is Chinese. Thus, it is owned by Chinese people. Therefore, how dare they sue."

if this company does not have a history of ip theft then the comments are racist by your definition

 

[Solomani]

I ate an apple once. I think it was in the 8th grade. I know some lawyer can inform me that I have a valid case against Apple. I can win millions!

 

[haravikk]

But I don't believe that Mac feature is available in China or in Chinese.

But does chinese patent law not have a requirement that a concept be novel like other patent systems? I don't know as I barely know what the law is where I am, but any patent office should be able to verify that the technology has existed for a long time.

Even if the addition of chinese support is new, is that really novel enough to be patentable in its own right? It's still the same fundamental technology, just adapted to recognise a different language.

Not that China hasn't surprised us all before with its weird and wonderful peculiarities, but I just don't see how the patent could restrict something like Siri, and normally what you patent is more the technique than the concept. I mean, maybe they have a patent that describes chinese language parsing in suitably generic terms?

But from the article all they seem to be going for is similarity in appearance and function, but then Apple's been using message-bubble style lists since it added iChat to OS X, and the button bars are pretty typical of the OS, it's not as if Apple have gone out of their way to use a unique UI that bears little resemblance to the rest of iOS, or even older Mac apps.

 

[Glideslope]

China

You'll see more of this Chinese BS as their bubble gets ready to burst.

 

[Dave.UK]

You'll see more of this Chinese BS as their bubble gets ready to burst.

Whose Apples?