Apple Faces User Backlash After Dropping Support for iPhone 7 From iOS 16

[MasterMike]

The people mad could always just swap to android. Might get longer coverage over there…🥱

There are multitudes of reasons to be upset about this, including (but not limited to):

• It starts a ticking time bomb for App/Website support
• It pushes (and eventually, given enough time, forces) people to upgrade to be able to reasonably use their device
• The iPhone 7 Plus (an A10 device with 3GB of RAM) did not get 16 whereas the iPad 5 (an A9 device with 2GB of RAM) got 16
  • For the record, iOS and iPadOS, while not exactly the same, are very similar code-wise, so it really isn't because of the lockscreen.
  • Arguably, the iPad 5 is actually using a more intensive OS even on 15 since it has full on multitasking functionalities compared to the iPhone's

 

[Abazigal]

There are multitudes of reasons to be upset about this, including (but not limited to):

• It starts a ticking time bomb for App/Website support
• It pushes (and eventually, given enough time, forces) people to upgrade to be able to reasonably use their device
• The iPhone 7 Plus (an A10 device with 3GB of RAM) did not get 16 whereas the iPad 5 (an A9 device with 2GB of RAM) got 16
  • For the record, iOS and iPadOS, while not exactly the same, are very similar code-wise, so it really isn't because of the lockscreen.
  • Arguably, the iPad 5 is actually using a more intensive OS even on 15 since it has full on multitasking functionalities compared to the iPhone's

Points 1 and 2 apply regardless of how long or short a device is supported, and it’s worth noting that Apple’s support is still longer than android. Do you expect Apple to keep supporting their devices indefinitely?

If not, then how long and why?

 

[TimmuJapan]

Points 1 and 2 apply regardless of how long or short a device is supported, and it’s worth noting that Apple’s support is still longer than android. Do you expect Apple to keep supporting their devices indefinitely?

If not, then how long and why?

There is no reason to stop supporting devices except for money and their business model, which encourages a fast upgrade cycle, which means more money for them.

In a perfect world, legacy devices would be able to receive OS support indefinitely. In a perfect world, Apple would strive to keep legacy devices secure for as long as possible, but offer less features than the newest hardware and software. This would be good for the world, but less money for them.

Basically, organizations and people like @dosdude1 and the OCLP people are striving to implement this vision for macOS on legacy devices, instead of Apple.

Wouldn’t it be great if Apple offered a simple but secure iOS, which has less features / app compatibility than the latest and the greatest, but could be used on old hardware securely? Just for making telephone calls and basic web browsing, etc?

 

[I7guy]

Yes. Jailbreaking is one great example. (For the uninformed, jailbreaks exploit security vulnerabilities to be able to do what they are able to do).

To start, when unc0ver updated to 5.3.0, it gained support for 12.4.1-12.4.8 on these old devices... thing was, they used an exploit of a vulnerability that was patched in 13.3.1 (time_waste)

When Apple released 12.4.9, it did break the tool... only because the kernel version was incremented (the exploit/vulnerability was still there and worked fine without any modifications). Soon after, Chimera 1.5.0 (utilizing a different exploit of the exact same vulnerability for unrelated reasons) and later on unc0ver 6.0.0 would add support for 12.4.9

When Apple released 12.5.5, it also broke all of those tools... for the exact same reason as 12.4.9, tools would eventually be updated and 12.5.5 became a non-issue very quickly.

Mind you, if anyone wanted to, the exploits utilized in these jailbreaks could very easily be used for malicious intent if somebody desired to go that route.

But there is no example of a zero day vulnerability using jailbreaking methods, which require physical access to the device.

That's a fair point - the extent people can be affected by app compatibility being dropped can vary wildly for many people, ranging from not being an issue to being a massive issue. And yes, if an app wants to use brand new functionality, it likely has to either implement a pathway for the older OS to ignore the functionality or drop the old OS entirely.

That being said, regarding the devices actually being dropped it does in effect start a time bomb that will keep ticking down with regards to app support, both on an app support scale and on a (where applicable) server support scale

(And for the people who just browse the web, website support can start to degrade over time as well, as can be seen by the various examples of the modern web breaking on older browsers).

Dropping App support is not unique to iOS. Can one run an msdos binary on windows? Apple dropped support for 32 bit along the line. At least windows supports 32 bits.

From my own observation the average useful age of an iPhone is about 8 years. That shouldn’t be a surprise to anyone. Old hardware just a gets well old.

I agree about browsing the web. Try browsing the web on windows xp(let’s say in a virtual machine with modern hardware) or browsing the web on iOS 6. It’s just the way things go.

 

[I7guy]

There is no reason to stop supporting devices except for money and their business model, which encourages a fast upgrade cycle, which means more money for them.

Old hardware gets old. Trying running modern day games like Msft fs 2020 on a core i7 920. Desktop class pentium chips do have better staying power than mobile chips. Imo, a recent iPhone lasts 8years, that’s the opposite of a money grab.

In a perfect world, legacy devices would be able to receive OS support indefinitely. In a perfect world, Apple would strive to keep legacy devices secure for as long as possible, but offer less features than the newest hardware and software. This would be good for the world, but less money for them.

Sure, in a perfect world. Exactly which vendor has stepped up to the plate for infinite support?

Basically, organizations and people like @dosdude1 and the OCLP people are striving to implement this vision for macOS on legacy devices, instead of Apple.

Wouldn’t it be great if Apple offered a simple but secure iOS, which has less features / app compatibility than the latest and the greatest, but could be used on old hardware securely? Just for making telephone calls and basic web browsing, etc?

There is no such thing as basic web browsing. JavaScript rendering, a staple of many modern websites, requires a lot of horsepower. Websites would have to have basic html versions, and my guess is not many web developers have the resources to do so.

 

[TimmuJapan]

Old hardware gets old. Trying running modern day games like Msft fs 2020 on a core i7 920. Desktop class pentium chips do have better staying power than mobile chips. Imo, a recent iPhone lasts 8years, that’s the opposite of a money grab.

Sure, in a perfect world. Exactly which vendor has stepped up to the plate for infinite support?

There is no such thing as basic web browsing. JavaScript rendering, a staple of many modern websites, requires a lot of horsepower. Websites would have to have basic html versions, and my guess is not many web developers have the resources to do so.

Sorry, dude…. None of what you write is a fair response to what I wrote.

1) I didn’t say support legacy devices to game on them. I said for basic tasks like web browsing, wordprocessing, just making a phone calls….

2) there are low end macs from 2006 that can run windows 10 and Linux. Some of them can even be patched up to run macOS El Capitan, which supports current Firefox browsers. I know this because I’ve owned them. These devices have processors that are less powerful than just about any iPhone, and basic web browsing, watching Netflix, etc. Is still entirely possible on these machines.

iPhones 4 and 5 have processors that are powerful enough to complete basic tasks still like web browsing and streaming media. Old hardware might not do things super well, but the power for very basic things is there.

 

[I7guy]

Sorry, dude…. None of what you write is a fair response to what I wrote.

1) I didn’t say support legacy devices to game on them. I said for basic tasks like web browsing, wordprocessing, just making a phone calls….

2) there are low end macs from 2006 that can run windows 10 and Linux. Some of them can even be patched up to run macOS El Capitan, which supports current Firefox browsers. I know this because I’ve owned them. These devices have processors that are less powerful than just about any iPhone, and basic web browsing, watching Netflix, etc. Is still entirely possible on these machines.

iPhones 4 and 5 have processors that are powerful enough to complete basic tasks still like web browsing and streaming media. Old hardware might not do things super well, but the power for very basic things is there.

It's a fair rebuttal to your post, pointing out the state of longevity in a world with billions of mobile phones and x86 processors.

My old i7 970 could run windows 10 and open websites also, but that is not this conversation. There is no such thing as basic web browsing. Desktop class processors with multiple cores and lots of TDP have a longer life span than mobile chips. I don't see why Apple (or similiar to Microsoft supporting Windows XP forever) would want to develop a specific version of IOS that could browse modern day websites and Netflix et al, with processors that are limited by today's standards. The iphone 4 does not have enough horsepower, imo, to browse modern day websites with a good user experience.

 

[Abazigal]

There is no reason to stop supporting devices except for money and their business model, which encourages a fast upgrade cycle, which means more money for them.

You have just described Apple’s business model. They use software to differentiate their hardware and justify higher prices. Just because iOS updates are free to the consumer doesn’t mean they are free to develop from Apple’s perspective. Services like Siri, iMessage and maps incur ongoing costs, which is all factored into the upfront cost that you pay for your hardware.

So in a sense, buying an apple product entitles the user to a certain number of years of software support and access to the Apple ecosystem. I don’t know what their internal numbers are, but it’s definitely finite. Apple is not a charity after all.

That said, I don’t think 4-5 years constitutes a fast upgrade cycle. Your apps also aren’t going to stop working right away; developers typically don’t deprecate their apps so quickly. There’s a difference between not having access to the latest software features, and not having a working device.

In the very least, I don’t see android users throwing out their devices every year when those invariably don’t get software updates.

In a perfect world, legacy devices would be able to receive OS support indefinitely. In a perfect world, Apple would strive to keep legacy devices secure for as long as possible, but offer less features than the newest hardware and software. This would be good for the world, but less money for them.

In a perfect world, I can think of bigger problems I want to solve than having my iPhone supported for more than 5 years.

Wouldn’t it be great if Apple offered a simple but secure iOS, which has less features / app compatibility than the latest and the greatest, but could be used on old hardware securely? Just for making telephone calls and basic web browsing, etc?

You may want to look at something like the light phone.

A Mindfulness Monday Review of The Light Phone – The Sweet Setup

An in-depth look at the Light Phone, a great smartphone alternative for those who want to reclaim their focus.

thesweetsetup.com

But otherwise, no, I do not see the point.

 

[webkit]

For my city, the retail shop FE 256gb price is around exactly the same as iPhone 11 128gb price.

Feel free to share a link to the always "big discount" prices you had previously mentioned but all I can speak to are the prices (new devices, in the U.S.) I've seen for the S21 FE and iPhone 11.

Through Samsung without any trade-in or carrier/plan requirements, the 128GB Galaxy S21 FE 5G is $624.99 and the 256GB version is $694.99.

Through Apple without any trade-in or carrier/plan requirements, the 64GB iPhone 11 is $499 and the 128GB is $549.

In this example, the 128GB iPhone 11 is $75.99 less than the 128GB Galaxy S21 FE 5G.

 

[Jack Neill]

I'm still salty my MB 2,1 didn't get 10.8. I left my iPhone 7 on 14.8.1. iOS is so boring and mature at this point it doesn't even matter..

 

[babyexercise]

Feel free to share a link to the always "big discount" prices you had previously mentioned but all I can speak to are the prices (new devices, in the U.S.) I've seen for the S21 FE and iPhone 11.

Through Samsung without any trade-in or carrier/plan requirements, the 128GB Galaxy S21 FE 5G is $624.99 and the 256GB version is $694.99.

Through Apple without any trade-in or carrier/plan requirements, the 64GB iPhone 11 is $499 and the 128GB is $549.

In this example, the 128GB iPhone 11 is $75.99 less than the 128GB Galaxy S21 FE 5G.

https://m.price.com.hk/product.php?p=529218

round 50% of people over here use iphone so Samsung can just use lower price to get some sales number

 

[lartola]

Feel free to share a link to the always "big discount" prices you had previously mentioned but all I can speak to are the prices (new devices, in the U.S.) I've seen for the S21 FE and iPhone 11.

Through Samsung without any trade-in or carrier/plan requirements, the 128GB Galaxy S21 FE 5G is $624.99 and the 256GB version is $694.99.

Through Apple without any trade-in or carrier/plan requirements, the 64GB iPhone 11 is $499 and the 128GB is $549.

In this example, the 128GB iPhone 11 is $75.99 less than the 128GB Galaxy S21 FE 5G.

Not a very fair comparison. The iphone 11 is a much older device than the Galaxy S21, it is logical that it’s less expensive. The iphone 11 came out in the fall of 2019 while the S21 was announced in January 2021 and actually released several months later. You should have compared the S21 with the iphone 12, not the iphone 11.

 

[babyexercise]

Not a very fair comparison. The iphone 11 is a much older device than the Galaxy S21, it is logical that it’s less expensive. The iphone 11 came out in the fall of 2019 while the S21 was announced in January 2021 and actually released several months later. You should have compared the S21 with the iphone 12, not the iphone 11.

S21 FE was released may be a quarter before s22 released.

 

[cwwilson]

Backlash? Dude your phone is 6 years old, time to step up or step out lol.

 

[GangstersParadise]

Um, in the mammoth 35 pages of this thread has anyone mentioned that when Apple left the iPhone 5S behind with the release of iOS 13, that they continued to support the iPhone 5S with security updates on iOS 12, a full two years, after iOS 13 was released?

If Apple maintains this precedent, people with the iPhone 7 will have nothing to complain about as when iOS 16 is released, iphone 7 users will continue to enjoy security updates for 2 years on iOS 15.

If they immediately stop supporting iOS 15 with security update, I will write a nasty post here too. At the moment, though, based on precedent, there is probably nothing to complain about…..

This would be totally fine (hope so for watchOS 8)

 

[webkit]

Not a very fair comparison. The iphone 11 is a much older device than the Galaxy S21, it is logical that it’s less expensive. The iphone 11 came out in the fall of 2019 while the S21 was announced in January 2021 and actually released several months later. You should have compared the S21 with the iphone 12, not the iphone 11.

I did not pick the Samsung Galaxy S21 FE to compare. My comments were in response to someone else's post (#866) which brought up the Samsung FE.

 

[lartola]

S21 FE was released may be a quarter before s22 released.

Even more so, the price comparison with iphone 11 isn’t fair. They’re almost 3 years apart.

 

[webkit]

Even more so, the price comparison with iphone 11 isn’t fair. They’re almost 3 years apart.

Given that the discussion was largely about years of OS updates remaining, I think the iPhone 11 versus Samsung Galaxy S21 FE comparison is fairly reasonable.

We don't exactly know how many years the iPhone 11 will have left (Apple doesn't put this in writing) but it could be as long or longer than the number of years left for the Samsung phone.

 

[lartola]

Given that the discussion was largely about years of OS updates remaining, I think the iPhone 11 versus Samsung Galaxy S21 FE comparison is fairly reasonable.

We don't exactly know how many years the iPhone 11 will have left (Apple doesn't put this in writing) but it could be as long or longer than the number of years left for the Samsung phone.

Perhaps the number of years of OS updates comparison is fair, but not the price comparison. The iphone 11 is much older tech.

 

[bookofxero]

That comparison obviously makes sense to you in your mind.

Sorry maths are hard for you.

 

[webkit]

Perhaps the number of years of OS updates comparison is fair, but not the price comparison. The iphone 11 is much older tech.

While the iPhone 11 came out over two years earlier, due to the S21 FE launch delay, I wouldn't necessarily say it's "much older tech." The FE is a budget version of the regular Galaxy S21 and S22 and I think the older iPhone 11 still compares reasonably well but it can depend on one's needs. As mentioned, the number of years left of OS updates is as long or longer with the iPhone, which was the focus of the earlier discussion, and you can get that at a lower price (at least in the U.S.) with the iPhone 11.

 

[paas]

You are clairvoyants. How do you know how many years the iphone 11 will be supported? In the case of Samsung, we know something, in the case of Apple, nothing but assumptions.
I wonder how it is possible that you cannot see what the apple is about. If Apple said how many years the device will be supported, people would not buy older phones. Why would someone buy a phone with only two years' support? And if there is no information, people buy, for example, an iPhone 7 in 2019. This is a dishonest practice. Macbook Air 2017 has lost support! After 5 years! And you are talking about some long support from Apple. 5 years for a laptop is not a funny joke!

 

[Fat_Guy]

You are all looking at this from the wrong perspective. What Apple did to the iPhone 7 folk took - wait for it: COURAGE!!!!



(Sorry if anyone beat me to this but 36 pages is too much to wade through. BTW: I have a 6S Plus and I’m pissed it won’t get iOS 16, but seeing the iphone 7s ain't getting it either makes me feel a little bit better. Anyway I dont use it anymore as I have a 12 Pro Max. I haven’t even upgraded it to iOS 15 - but I’m still pissed off!!!!!)

 

[babyexercise]

You are clairvoyants. How do you know how many years the iphone 11 will be supported? In the case of Samsung, we know something, in the case of Apple, nothing but assumptions.
I wonder how it is possible that you cannot see what the apple is about. If Apple said how many years the device will be supported, people would not buy older phones. Why would someone buy a phone with only two years' support? And if there is no information, people buy, for example, an iPhone 7 in 2019. This is a dishonest practice. Macbook Air 2017 has lost support! After 5 years! And you are talking about some long support from Apple. 5 years for a laptop is not a funny joke!

Look at how many years 7s have then we all know, it was release in 2016 Sep and not getting to next IOS in this Sep, so only 5 years of support.

 

[I7guy]

Look at how many years 7s have then we all know, it was release in 2016 Sep and not getting to next IOS in this Sep, so only 5 years of support.

But likely to be really not useful in another 3 years or so.