Apple Facing Class Action Lawsuit Over 'Error 53' iPhone 6 Bricking

[Zellio]

The problem is Timmy's Apple is way more anti-consumer than MS ever was. I don't think even at their peak arrogance would MS have had the balls to do something like this. Imagine if they detected a fake windows and burnt out your CPU to protect you from the viruses that come with pirated software.

Or what if they turned off your fans and burned out your cpu and gpu if your copy of windows wasn't genuine. Which sometimes you can get that error even if you have a legit copy.

I know, I was just making a point about the hypocrisy of people around here..

 

[LogicalApex]

Thanks for that, no one was aware that losing your key and having to get another one, or going to a locksmith who knows how to replace one, meant that the car WAS PERMANENTLY DISABLED.

Another crappy car analogy

Actually, the car can become permanently disabled until it is towed to the dealer for a reprogramming as the anti-theft immobilizer will kick in and can be a very expensive repair as someone noted earlier when dealing with another vehicle...

I tried the wrong key in a friend's Cadillac years ago and you wouldn't believe the trouble it caused. Somehow that totally disabled the car for some security reason. I think the car was towed and it was an expensive fix.

 

[C DM]

Thanks for that, no one was aware that losing your key and having to get another one, or going to a locksmith who knows how to replace one, meant that the car WAS PERMANENTLY DISABLED.

Another crappy car analogy

Seems analogous for the most part, just excluding the very last part of how it's handled by the manufacturer.

 

[Zellio]

Well a truck can be $50K an iPhone $0.7K. You don't see Apple spending weeks holding your phone for a lengthy repair like a car dealer would... They just swap the whole device out...

It's just $700, no big deal right?

Who the hell are you, a Kardashian?

 

[DevNull0]

Or what if they turned off your fans and burned out your cpu and gpu if your copy of windows wasn't genuine. Which sometimes you can get that error even if you have a legit copy.

I know, I was just making a point about the hypocrisy of people around here..

I got your point and I agree with you. There are some people here that are so in love with Apple that they twist their minds into pretzels to try and make the worst things Apple does seem good to them.

It would have been interesting to see the same people supporting Apple here condemning MS for the same thing first.

 

[LogicalApex]

It's just $700, no big deal right?

Who the hell are you, a Kardashian?

Not sure what insinuating I'm rich (or am not) have anything to do with what I said... Warranty repair costs are borne by Apple, not by me (shocker... I know). This is why Apple devices have very poor repair ability scores on iFixIt. Apple considers it cheaper to replace the device than to make field servicing an option.

Cars are severely more expensive so they still build them to ensure field servicing is possible and is the primary avenue of repair.

If you have a problem with this go talk to Apple... I'm not making their device design, manufacturing, and repair decisions.

How easy or hard it is to fix a product is reflective of how a manufacturer tries to keep their costs low during the warranty period. They don't build these items caring at all about what third party repairs will cost or what you do after your warranty expires.

If you tend to break your device you'd be better getting device insurance than cheapening out on repairs after buying something you couldn't afford to service...

 

[Zellio]

I got your point and I agree with you. There are some people here that are so in love with Apple that they twist their minds into pretzels to try and make the worst things Apple does seem good to them.

It would have been interesting to see the same people supporting Apple here condemning MS for the same thing first.

You'd imagine that they themselves would come first. I really like Apple, but I always tinkered with pcs (I also have my own tools, saws, etc, and tinker with pretty much everything). This sort of bull **** infuriates me. You would imagine that anyone paying money for something would feel the same way, but no...

Some of these people seem to act like they'd take a bullet for one of the Apple executives. Some people act like they'd defend Apple even if they ripped them off. I don't really get some of them.

 

[DevNull0]

If you tend to break your device you'd be better getting device insurance than cheapening out on repairs after buying something you couldn't afford to service...

Oh, I see. I should just pay whatever Apple says the repair should cost with no regard to reality. If I choose to go to a cheaper repair place, Apple has every right to punish me by destroying my phone. If I don't use touchID anyway so choose to repair it with a normal button to save a few bucks on a feature I don't even care about, Apple should punish me by bricking my phone. Do I understand your point now?

 

[Zellio]

Oh, I see. I should just pay whatever Apple says the repair should cost with no regard to reality. If I choose to go to a cheaper repair place, Apple has every right to punish me by destroying my phone. If I don't use touchID anyway so choose to repair it with a normal button to save a few bucks on a feature I don't even care about, Apple should punish me by bricking my phone. Do I understand your point now?

I wonder if this guy would change his tune if Apple made his repairs cost $2,000

Sadly, I'm probably putting too much faith if I thought he would.

 

[danny_w]

Please read this http://www.forbes.com/sites/danielf...s-are-mostly-paid-to-do-nothing/#59b46cec63c0

Completely irrelevant. I never claimed anybody but lawyers made money fr o m class action lawsuits. What I claimed was that if a class action lawsuit is filed the defendant almost always loses, whether by trial verdict (unlikley) or cash settlement. What I meant was that Apple is going to lose, one way or another. They have already created a PR nightmare all by themselves.

 

[DevNull0]

You'd imagine that they themselves would come first. I really like Apple, but I always tinkered with pcs (I also have my own tools, saws, etc, and tinker with pretty much everything). This sort of bull **** infuriates me. You would imagine that anyone paying money for something would feel the same way, but no...

I'm a firm believe of the motto "If you can't open it, you don't own it." I also tinker with pretty much everything.

I was a huge Apple fan, and since my powerbook G3 in 1999, I've averaged a new one every 2 years. But my last machine was a 2011 MBP. The first day, after I made sure everything worked, I upgraded the 4 gig of ram to 16 and replaced the HDD with an SSD, and I've replaced the SSD with larger ones twice since. I have zero interest in any of the non-servicable crap they sell now.

Some of these people seem to act like they'd take a bullet for one of the Apple executives. Some people act like they'd defend Apple even if they ripped them off. I don't really get some of them.

A lot of them do defend Apple ripping them off, even applauding Apple for still keeping the 16 gig model phones since anything that helps increase Apple's short term profit is a wonderful thing to them.

 

[sualpine]

I'm a firm believe of the motto "If you can't open it, you don't own it." I also tinker with pretty much everything.

I was a huge Apple fan, and since my powerbook G3 in 1999, I've averaged a new one every 2 years. But my last machine was a 2011 MBP. The first day, after I made sure everything worked, I upgraded the 4 gig of ram to 16 and replaced the HDD with an SSD, and I've replaced the SSD with larger ones twice since. I have zero interest in any of the non-servicable crap they sell now.



A lot of them do defend Apple ripping them off, even applauding Apple for still keeping the 16 gig model phones since anything that helps increase Apple's short term profit is a wonderful thing to them.

So which phone and tablet do you have that meets this criteria?

 

[trifid]

A lot of them do defend Apple ripping them off, even applauding Apple for still keeping the 16 gig model phones since anything that helps increase Apple's short term profit is a wonderful thing to them.

Indeed, I've found that fascinating. They defend things like 5400rpm on 4k iMac, soldered ram on a desktop computer even though there is no benefit to it (no, it's not more reliable), 16gb base iPhones for almost a decade even though SSD prices have drastically and exponentially decreased. I guess either they are all Apple stock holders and enjoy the profits, or just like to defend Apple. Either way it's something... interesting.

 

[69Mustang]

Not sure what insinuating I'm rich (or am not) have anything to do with what I said... Warranty repair costs are borne by Apple, not by me (shocker... I know). This is why Apple devices have very poor repair ability scores on iFixIt. Apple considers it cheaper to replace the device than to make field servicing an option.

Cars are severely more expensive so they still build them to ensure field servicing is possible and is the primary avenue of repair.

If you have a problem with this go talk to Apple... I'm not making their device design, manufacturing, and repair decisions.

How easy or hard it is to fix a product is reflective of how a manufacturer tries to keep their costs low during the warranty period. They don't build these items caring at all about what third party repairs will cost or what you do after your warranty expires.

If you tend to break your device you'd be better getting device insurance than cheapening out on repairs after buying something you couldn't afford to service...

The problem with your car analogy is it shades the narrative of the point you're trying to relate it to. Take your Merc key analogy. Wrong key disables Merc. Okay. Still not analogous. The unauthorized part doesn't disable the phone.

 

[DevNull0]

Indeed, I've found that fascinating. They defend things like 5400rpm on 4k iMac, soldered ram on a desktop computer even though there is no benefit to it (no, it's not more reliable), 16gb base iPhones for almost a decade even though SSD prices have drastically and exponentially decreased. I guess either they are all Apple stock holders and enjoy the profits, or just like to defend Apple. Either way it's something... interesting.

I doubt they make as much off their stock (if any) as they overpay because of these ripoffs.

A top end latest model mac mini is an inferior computer to the mid-range from 2012. And the new one has soldered ram. The Mac Pro hasn't been updated since 2013 and is still at 2013 prices.

It's one thing to say I love using Apple products, so even though this is a crappy thing for them to do I'm still going ot buy a mac. But these people actually go out and say Apple's choices are good for the consumer in some way.

The 16 gig base memory in the iPhone is even worse than it sounds. Screen resolution is much higher (so apps are larger), the camera is higher resolution, the OS takes more space. The cpu/gpu supports higher end games that take even more space that's not available. And the actual cost for flash today is less than 10% what it was when the 16 gig base model came out in 2010.

 

[Recognition]

I'm a firm believe of the motto "If you can't open it, you don't own it." I also tinker with pretty much everything.

I was a huge Apple fan, and since my powerbook G3 in 1999, I've averaged a new one every 2 years. But my last machine was a 2011 MBP. The first day, after I made sure everything worked, I upgraded the 4 gig of ram to 16 and replaced the HDD with an SSD, and I've replaced the SSD with larger ones twice since. I have zero interest in any of the non-servicable crap they sell now.



A lot of them do defend Apple ripping them off, even applauding Apple for still keeping the 16 gig model phones since anything that helps increase Apple's short term profit is a wonderful thing to them.

Which mobile phone do you open up and tinker with at the moment?

I used to take apart the Nokia 5110 when it was 'the' phone to have. I changed the SMD LEDS to blue. Very cool at the time, in a very geeky way!

But I wouldn't dare take any of my Apple stuff apart, to expensive if I damage it and not much to change inside anyway!

Got a raspberry Pi to satisfy my tinkering needs

 

[LogicalApex]

Oh, I see. I should just pay whatever Apple says the repair should cost with no regard to reality. If I choose to go to a cheaper repair place, Apple has every right to punish me by destroying my phone. If I don't use touchID anyway so choose to repair it with a normal button to save a few bucks on a feature I don't even care about, Apple should punish me by bricking my phone. Do I understand your point now?

The problem is that reality is shifting and this is the reality of the present. I'm not saying it is ideal, but this is where we are...

Apple has no duty to care about third party parts or third party repairs. If you chose to do a third party repair then it is on you to deal with the fallout of that repair. This is the same in cars, but it is why you'll often see third party shops warranty their work independently of the manufacturer who has no duty to cover their work.

The fact our devices can now be updated after we purchase them means you have a floating risk as a consumer if your purchase a third party part or get a third party repair. What we're seeing now is why you'll probably see future repairs at reputable shops being warrantied going forward for a period of time.

Apple has no duty to care about your desire to save money. I am not saying you shouldn't be able to save money, but it isn't Apple's job to care about that... This has been established rules or how we do aftermarket repairs forever all across our economy.

The problem with your car analogy is it shades the narrative of the point you're trying to relate it to. Take your Merc key analogy. Wrong key disables Merc. Okay. Still not analogous. The unauthorized part doesn't disable the phone.

The key may disable to car immediately, but if, for whatever reason, it didn't disable the car immediately and it happened a week or month or year later the reality would still be the same. Mercedes would charge you for an expensive repair and fob replacement.

No need to split hairs on this here. The core question is how much of a duty does the manufacturer have to care about third party repairs and components. Established US case law says none. It is the job of the third party part maker to ensure their part meets 100% OEM standards and the job of the repair person to ensure they perform a repair equal to the OEM. If they can't they should refuse to perform the repair...

It would be like getting a part replaced at Auto Zone on your Mercedes and then complaining to Mercedes when the part fails because the Auto Zone tech wasn't able to install it correctly. Re-syncing the TouchID sensor is a key component of replacing it...

 

[DevNull0]

Apple has no duty to care about third party parts or third party repairs. If you chose to do a third party repair then it is on you to deal with the fallout of that repair. This is the same in cars, but it is why you'll often see third party shops warranty their work independently of the manufacturer who has no duty to cover their work.

But Apple does care about your third party repair. They go out of their way to destroy your phone if you do a third party repair. If they leave you to suffer the fallout on your own that's fine. They don't. The repair could work fine, but Apple takes deliberate action to destroy your phone.

This is not at all the same as cars. I can do whatever I want to my car, the manufacturer doesn't care when i bring it in. They don't come back and say since I used a non-approved air freshener, they had to destroy the engine.

Apple has no duty to care about your desire to save money.

But Apple does care. They destroy your phone if you don't give them their profit on your repair.

Established US case law says none. It is the job of the third party part maker to ensure their part meets 100% OEM standards and the job of the repair person to ensure they perform a repair equal to the OEM.

Right, and if I do a repair that works 100% to my satisfaction (doesn't have to be 100% to original functionality, it's my phone and I can do whatever I want with it), and Apple later decides they don't want to allow that and so they will retroactively go out of their way to destroy my phone, that is not legal and they will get sued.

It would be like getting a part replaced at Auto Zone on your Mercedes and then complaining to Mercedes when the part fails because the Auto Zone tech wasn't able to install it correctly. Re-syncing the TouchID sensor is a key component of replacing it...

How many times are you going to repeat your broken car analogy???

It is none of Mercedes business what I do with the car I own. If I want to rip out the damn immobilizer and make it so the car starts by shorting two wires under the steering wheel together, it's my car and I can do that. If Mercedes doesn't like it and destroys my car because of that, you think it's okay? If I want to smash out all the windows and drive it that way, it's my car and I can run it that way. Mercedes can't force me to replace them or destroy my engine if I refuse. If a piece of the broken window glass gets into the engine and destroys it, that's my own problem. But Mercedes can't come along and destroy it for me.

 

[Batman89]

It amazes me how little people actually care about their security (and do not confuse security with privacy here). Apple is trying to protect its users, but they are too stupid to realize.

They are doing this to protect you, not as a "screw you for trying to fix your own phone." People will always see what they want to see though, I suppose.

How about locking the phone and needing the Apple ID and Password (typed) in order to use the phone? "Hey we noticed the Touch ID may have been tampered with. Please type in your Apple ID and Password to confirm that it's you"

Really, is bricking the phone a solution?

This is a legit case.

 

[ZipZap]

and then Apple pushes update to 9.3 to disable error and everything goes away.

But that is exactly the point of the suit. Apple will do nothing unless compelled and users don't want to wait years for apple to get around to doing something (as is their mantra).

 

[69Mustang]

The key may disable to car immediately, but if, for whatever reason, it didn't disable the car immediately and it happened a week or month or year later the reality would still be the same. Mercedes would charge you for an expensive repair and fob replacement.

No need to split hairs on this here. The core question is how much of a duty does the manufacturer have to care about third party repairs and components. Established US case law says none. It is the job of the third party part maker to ensure their part meets 100% OEM standards and the job of the repair person to ensure they perform a repair equal to the OEM. If they can't they should refuse to perform the repair...

It would be like getting a part replaced at Auto Zone on your Mercedes and then complaining to Mercedes when the part fails because the Auto Zone tech wasn't able to install it correctly. Re-syncing the TouchID sensor is a key component of replacing it...

Pardon, but I'll skip commenting on your car analogy. Clearly those who use them think they're apropos. Who am I to disavow them of that notion.

Bolded: Spanning 3 thread and over 1000 posts, I don't think anyone has claimed Apple has a duty to care about 3rd repairs and components. The main complaint has been Apple has no right to brick someone's phone, especially for what is an optional feature. Touch ID is an optional feature. It's not required for an iPhone to work.

If Apple disabled access to the secure enclave and provided notification instead of bricking the phone, people wouldn't have an issue. The problem with bricking the phone is it doesn't belong to Apple. Everyone doesn't use Touch ID.

 

[997440]

Pardon, but I'll skip commenting on your car analogy. Clearly those who use them think they're apropos. Who am I to disavow them of that notion.

Bolded: Spanning 3 thread and over 1000 posts, I don't think anyone has claimed Apple has a duty to care about 3rd repairs and components. The main complaint has been Apple has no right to brick someone's phone, especially for what is an optional feature. Touch ID is an optional feature. It's not required for an iPhone to work.

If Apple disabled access to the secure enclave and provided notification instead of bricking the phone, people wouldn't have an issue. The problem with bricking the phone is it doesn't belong to Apple. Everyone doesn't use Touch ID.

And, Apple should've provided this information at the point of sale --

These parts 'abcde...' MUST be repaired/replaced at Apple or at an AASP because they have security implications for the user. If these parts 'abcde...' are repaired/replaced at an unapproved facility, your device's self-security check will completely disable your device. We, at Apple, take the protection of your personal information seriously.

 

[LogicalApex]

Pardon, but I'll skip commenting on your car analogy. Clearly those who use them think they're apropos. Who am I to disavow them of that notion.

Bolded: Spanning 3 thread and over 1000 posts, I don't think anyone has claimed Apple has a duty to care about 3rd repairs and components. The main complaint has been Apple has no right to brick someone's phone, especially for what is an optional feature. Touch ID is an optional feature. It's not required for an iPhone to work.

If Apple disabled access to the secure enclave and provided notification instead of bricking the phone, people wouldn't have an issue. The problem with bricking the phone is it doesn't belong to Apple. Everyone doesn't use Touch ID.

The class action hinges on one major claim... Whether Apple failed to warn users that this error could happen. You can read the brief they filed with the court if you want...

http://d34q5zng4744bn.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2016-02-11-Apple-Error-53-Plfs-Complaint.pdf

I doubt they will win, but this law firm is just hoping Apple settles and they can make chunk in legal fees and send people $20 coupons off an accessory from the Apple store...

But I'm done with the discussion. There isn't much actually being shared here. People are digging into trenches and that doesn't facilitate genuine discussion.

 

[Gudi]

So basically I should not buy a Mac. Thanks!

Well, of course a standardized self-build PC is way more repairable and upgradable than a proprietary all-in-one Mac. This is Apples solution for offering PCI expansion slots on a Mac. It kind of looks as if the Mac is run by a small PC.

PC Does What?​

 

[Tech198]

I agree with Apple that no one would wanna use TouhID when someone has your fingerprints and your phone gets stolen after an attempted update/restore, due to this Error 53 mishap not doing its job and making your phone unusable till u get it fixed by Apple, I also agree that Apple doesn't make it clear either..

If i got my phone stolen, this is exactly want i would want.... I can't use it, but neither can the person who stole it.. And isn't that the idea ?

They don't exactly say "you *must* get the phone serviced at an Apple authorized service center in the event of issues happening*.

It's your choice where u take it.... but in fine print they say "oh, by the way, we didn't tell you this ..."whispers""