Apple Gets EU Warning to Open iOS to Third-Party Connected Devices

[gregmancuso]

So EU demands that third party devices can be integrated with iPhones on the same level as AW etc. What are the arguments against that demand?

I'd argue there is no reason to allow the same level of interoperability. The closeness of Apple's related products allows continuity and enhanced features.

Not dissimilar from the fact I cannot use an Apple Watch on a Samsung phone. Well, not without serious limitations. I can use. Samsung Gear watch on iOS today leveraging the Samsung Galaxy Watch (Gear S) app. I only just found that with a quick search so I really don't know how well the Gear watch will work on iOS, but it does appear to be much better than Apple Watch on Android. Obviously a Samsung Watch works much better and is more closely integration with a Samsung phone - as it should be.

 

[delsoul]

Apparently after you take away the UK Apple only have 26% of the EU market for handsets.
So the EU couldn’t use the monopoly justification but invented the “gatekeeper” ruling. Which is their arbitrary assessment of what having dominance is.

Notice that Spotify isn’t considered a “gatekeeper” even though it has 60%+ of the streaming market. There doesn’t seem to be any EU company that is designated a gatekeeper in the tech space.

I just think that the EU thinks Apples business model should be like Microsoft’s or Google. You sell an OS and let other third parties / OEM’s make money from that. Whereas apples business model has always been exclusive integrated services providing a unique advantage to those who buy into it.

So, can the EU determine a private companies business model? If Apple keeps going in the EU’s direction it will remove their competitive advantage as they would have to support all third party products as well as their own. For example, could Apple release another version of Vision Pro in the EU without making sure third party VR sets work with their OS?

It’s kind of crazy what the EU are going for here. Mainly because no customers have asked for this. Only other businesses that want to make money off apples systems.
But the EU are pretending that allowing third parties to make money off apples will improve the lives of EU customers. When the very fact that Apple has been successful actually points to the opposite. Integrated, opinionated systems are easier to use and thus better for customers who are willing to pay a premium for that approach.

In short, this is an EU shakedown that has very little to do with helping its citizens and more to do with enriching its companies that have failed in the tech sector.

Well said! Plain and simple, the European companies in their tech sector simply can't compete. At all. This is nothing more than trying to drag down the leader so their failed tech sector can try to play catch up. Nothing "fair" about forcefully handicapping a foreign company so your local ones can attempt to compete. It might sound harsh, but that's the business world. There's no participation trophies. There are no 'Let's talk about feelings...' type of speeches. It's bring your best to the market and if you don't, that's your problem. European companies should try harder and put their focus where it's most needed. South Korea reinvented their tech economy and markets, Japan, and the list goes on. I'm sure countries in Europe can do the same if they actually tried.

 

[macfacts]

I am curious, how many posters angry with EU are AAPL shareholders? We know some are. Of course they are interested in Apple being a monopoly and not so much in the customer benefits.

Better question is, how many angry with the EU live in the EU?

 

[I7guy]

Better question is, how many angry with the EU live in the EU?

A better question is how many angry with apple jump to android?

 

[macfacts]

That kind of point how can they build a competitive product if they have to give everything away for free to their competitor that they build.

If people download the Spotify app, they are now a Spotify customer. Spotify should be able to tell their customers through the app they can sign up on the web for lower price. And before some apple fan comes in saying they were apple customers first, they were EU citizens first before they were an apple customer.

 

[macfacts]

A better question is how many angry with apple jump to android?

Where is the list, sign me up.

 

[jlc1978]

The fact that Apple reports earnings as Europe rather than EMEA is immaterial as it only applies to corporate entities in the EU

However, it is relevant to the argument that some make about the size of Apple European revenue. When in fact, it’s not just Europe in the revenue numbers; it’s not an accounting issue, but it’s rather how the information is presented on the forum.

 

[surferfb]

If people download the Spotify app, they are now a Spotify customer. Spotify should be able to tell their customers through the app they can sign up on the web for lower price. And before some apple fan comes in saying they were apple customers first, they were EU citizens first before they were an apple customer.

While some will be surprised, I actually agree with this. I think Apple’s anti-steering prohibitions inside of apps are ridiculous (although I understand why Apple does it, and no, it’s not just about money).

That said, it has almost nothing to do with what this article is about, outside of also being a requirement of the DMA. The DMA does lots of things - a few I agree with, most are extreme overreaches. Broken clock right twice a day, and all that.

 

[Abazigal]

I am curious, how many posters angry with EU are AAPL shareholders? We know some are. Of course they are interested in Apple being a monopoly and not so much in the customer benefits.

Zero Apple stock still, if it lends me any added credibility. And I am not angry with the EU. Simply calling it as I see it.

 

[MacUser09]

"Today is the first time we use specification proceedings under the DMA to guide Apple towards effective compliance with its interoperability obligations through constructive dialogue."

Don't they mean "force Apple"?

 

[The_Gream]

And once again the masses are forgetting. Our big tech companies are only as big as they are because these government bodies allowed them to buy up all the small guys. I have no tears to shed for greedy, short sighted politicians.

The intent of the DMA is like Obama Care - good. Yet, in action they are both piss poor substitutions for politicians not wanting to be accountable for the decisions they and those before them made. They lust for power and bathe in greed at the cost of whomever won’t lick their boot straps. When they feel threatened, they weave tall tails and lies to get the people to look at someone else and blame that person for the problems created by our elected leaders.

Come on people, stop being so blind. Nether Apple not the EU has your interest at heart. Apple’s interest is to please the shareholders. The EU (any government really) leader’s interest is in covering up the crap they have pulled to save their own hides at the end of the day. France is near to or already is violating EU as their debt (not sure if is citizens debt or government) beyond the allowed limit for membership. People knew that Putin was up to no good, long before his current attack on Ukraine, and yet EU members continued to funnel money into Russia for cheap oil.

This is a sorry state of failure. Personally, if I was Tim I would tell the shareholders to shut up and sit down. Then begin winding down all operations in the EU economic bloc. This wouldn’t be just a stop sales of goods. It would be closer of all the stores, server farms, R&D centers etc. Then I would tell the EU leaders, “Until you figure out what it is you really want, we will not do business in your boarders. Once you do figure it out and make it clear, we will look and see if it is financially wise for us to reinvest in your economy.”
Any country writing laws that rely on the “spirit” vs the letter are idiots. Taking a story from the Bible: the Hebrews had been given the spirit of the law as well as the letter “love GOD and have no other gods before him… etc” and these people still failed to grasp it and wondered in the wilderness for 40 years. Many years later, even with the letter of law saying you should not covet another man’s wife and shell not kill, their king spied a hot babe bathing and ended up sending her husband off to die so he can have his way with her. He broke the spirit of the law, but not the letter for she was now a widow and he didn’t kill her husband so he wasn’t a murder.
Humans are stupid… you have to spell it out in simple for them. Both what you want and what will happen if they follow as well as what will happen if they don’t.

 

[The_Gream]

Notice how the pro-apple side keeps bringing up this word.

Innovation has to have mass practical use, not serve as profits for Apple with maybe a bit of real life applicability.

The average consumer doesn't give two ***** about this, either. This isn't 2012 anymore - everyone knows companies copy each other all the time.

You do realize, that many of the open standards you use everyday, were contributed to by Apple and other companies and they don’t get any money for it. USB might be owned by Intel or had been their brain child, but I am pretty sure it was an Apple engineer who helped make it become what it is today. USB-C is lighting 2.0. Apple, Google, Microsoft etc all have key staff ether on the boards or working at these open-source/standards places constantly pushing forward new innovations. Innovation doesn’t have to be a whole new thing, it can be small steps that improve an already existing item. It doesn’t have to make them a ton of money today, but a nice steady stream works wonders over the years for gizmos and gadgets.

 

[Naraxus]

If you want to play in the EU's courts, you play by the EU's rules. I don't see what's complicated about that.

It's not complicated but when that said court makes up rules on the fly that don't apply to, and certainly aren't being enforced equally (hello Spotify), and arbitrarily punishes the other players it's like playing football with one hand tied behind your back.

 

[Naraxus]

Certainly an an interesting product strategy. "No, I don't want to make a competitive product anymore"

Why make a competitive product when you know you'll be selectively punished for competing by arbitrary rules?

 

[ohthehorror]

At some point, it will make more sense for Apple to stop selling in the EU than comply with this nonsense.

You win the internet for the dumbest post of the year so far. Carry on.

 

[macfacts]

It's not complicated but when that said court makes up rules on the fly that don't apply to, and certainly aren't being enforced equally (hello Spotify), and arbitrarily punishes the other players it's like playing football with one hand tied behind your back.

Please quote the rule Spotify is not following.

 

[iPadified]

I'd argue there is no reason to allow the same level of interoperability. The closeness of Apple's related products allows continuity and enhanced features.

Not dissimilar from the fact I cannot use an Apple Watch on a Samsung phone. Well, not without serious limitations. I can use. Samsung Gear watch on iOS today leveraging the Samsung Galaxy Watch (Gear S) app. I only just found that with a quick search so I really don't know how well the Gear watch will work on iOS, but it does appear to be much better than Apple Watch on Android. Obviously a Samsung Watch works much better and is more closely integration with a Samsung phone - as it should be.

What would be the disadvantage of say a Rolex having the same interoperability as an AW?

Is the poor performance of AW on Android a lack of access to key features or only a bad implementation?

 

[iPadified]

Better question is, how many angry with the EU live in the EU?

A good estimate is about 20%. Usually the far left and right wings are the most EU critical people. They are also Putin fans or looks longingly back to state communism. The 80% do their best to suppress these extremists.

 

[iPadified]

Rather, the EU is doing what the US would have done if the latter had no homegrown tech giants to call their own.

I think you overstate the self interests of EU. EU is a liberal project with a strong belief in a market economy. Oh, we have giants as well but in other fields like big Pharma. Both Bernie Sanders and Trump want to regulate the price on diabetes medicine. Is that not interference?

 

[Ethosik]

You're kind of ignoring the difficulties that come with switching platforms. All the apps, games, accessories, all things someone that switches will have to buy again.

It's like moving houses. It's as easy as closing on the new place and selling the old one. Don't worry about packing up your belongings!

That can be said about any product ever. Want to switch from PS5 to Xbox? Have to rebuy all of your games! Want to switch from the Epic Games Store to Steam? Need to rebuy the game (which I have done with 6 games since Epic likes to buy exclusive deals).

 

[Ethosik]

Is innovation dead on MacOS?

As a macOS lover and despises Windows....yes. Why am I still forced to use Windows for many apps, and games? The BIGGEST thing from Apple AT ALL this year for me was built in Window Tiling. That says a lot about where macOS is currently.

 

[dredlew]

You mean Europe that isn't scared of bullying over green bubbles? buys android and doesn't care?

Dream on if you think most people will care if they pull out, Pixel, Galaxy, one plus, nothing etc watch China bring their A game.

The hit to profits would end Tims reign.

It’s irrelevant whether more people use Android in Europe. There are millions of Apple users and people involved in the sale of Apple devices. The mere threat of Apple wanting to shutter their business would create an untenable situation for the EC.

The EC may force companies how to do business but the one thing they can’t do is force them to do business at all.

 

[Ethosik]

I dont want Apple to be just like others. You still don’t get it, do you.

I want Apple to be Apple, as Jobs intended. Not some random also-brand.

I want it to be closed, secure and just working. Even at cost of closed ecosystem.

I don’t want to pair Apple Watch with some other noname phone and experience sub par behavior which EC will NEVER be able to improve.

If market decides otherwise and I will stand alone with this opinion, Apple will go bankrupt, but not that some EU bureaucrats will in their delusional mind bend the market the way that every company will become equally soulless. Not the effing way.

Yep. Customer experience is at the core at Apple. The deepest core of Apple's identity. So things are locked down, their products work MUCH BETTER together than anything else. Android + Windows is worse than iPhone + macOS integration.

 

[antonrg]

This is... not a good thing. Like many here, you're serving Apple's interests by taking this stance.

It's the "don't like x? use y" argument except there are special circumstances that make this an exception

No, it’s a matter of security. I prefer Apple because I want to keep everything in one place. Not have the back doors open in the system for anyone to do whatever they want.

 

[antonrg]

In short, this is an EU shakedown that has very little to do with helping its citizens and more to do with enriching its companies that have failed in the tech sector.

THANK YOU!