Apple Granted Patent for 'In-Cell' Touchscreen Display Concepts

[bergert]

what is the benefit ?

Former capacitive touch engineer here.

Aside from a thinner phone the only other difference is you might see would be the LCD layer moved up closer to the top lens glass.

And just maybe we finally see matte glass displays; because in an office setting reflections are an issue. So far one had to put a filter on the glass. Filter means reduced clarity and less vibrant colors. So Apple decided that the tradeoffs are not worth; i.e. less important than anti-glare; and many users (I know some personally) did not agree with that decision.

(while I'm a engineer; it still does not make me an expert in display technology - so this is just IMHO with some 30+ years of experience)

 

[nick_elt]

People saying "NEEDZ BIGGER BATTERY!11!!!" need to relax, this isn't an Android phone. Surely they are tuning iOS 6 to be better than iOS 5, and all of the new iPhone components point towards not only newer, faster and overall better technology, but also efficiency. Making the battery bigger doesn't fix the problem, it just slows it down. I would trust Apple is fixing the problem by making a more efficient and smarter phone.

You do realise that a bigget screen and LTE will use more power and the 4s battery isnt amazing. So its not just an Android problem.

 

[mdelvecchio]

Since Apple invests large sums of money into these companies and pays for their engineering and production teams, this is transferred via a work-for-hire which Apple had someone like Sharp or LG sign in exchange for producing the end-product.

So what you have (and again, I'm speculating, but this is probably how it went down), Apple wanted a thinner screen, came up with some ideas, paid for engineering time and experience, and completed the patent, paying the manufacturer for their rights to the intellectual property. Apple is now the owner of the patent and would be in charge of enforcing it instead of the manufacturer.

...exactly. if youve ever worked as a contractor or consultant, youll be quite familiar w/ work-for-hire contracts. it's not uncommon that despite me doing the design & implementation, all IP rights go to my client. i am merely their tool, the instrument of their will.

and i have no problem w/ that. it keeps me employed and enjoying life. same thing here, id wager.

 

[mactmaster]

Ultimate iPhone thinness http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7d-AGMMcsQ

 

[mdelvecchio]

How does a thinner device increase the battery load?

...it gives you more space to insert a larger capacity batter. thats it. currently thats the only way to provide substantial batter gains as the battery tech isnt improving very rapidly.

 

[faroZ06]

...it gives you more space to insert a larger capacity batter. thats it. currently thats the only way to provide substantial batter gains as the battery tech isnt improving very rapidly.

No, there's a misunderstanding. I'm talking about the thickness of the entire device. Sure making the screen thinner is good, but I don't care about it since they appear to be using it just to make the device thinner rather than using the space for more battery.

I'm fine with the thickness of the iPhone 3G. The iPhone 4 is a little too thin but still OK.

 

[satkin2]

Good to see that they are continuing to try and progress the technology that goes into the phones, even if it isn't a massive thing.

Not a big follower of patents, are they usually granted before they get put into use, or does it not matter if it's been filed?

 

[JHankwitz]

All of this research just to make it thinner, and I don't care about the thickness.

Thinner would likely make it more sensitive as well as use less power.

 

[el3ktro]

I find this patent award odd. Surely it must be limiting in some technical way not apparent. Why would Apple be able to patent a technology their suppliers would have been developing?

This has been developed by Apple in great part. The suppliers are only producing the in-cell panels and they may have developed new methods needed to produce this, but the in-cell tech itself comes from Apple.

 

[JHankwitz]

I just want a bigger battery.

More battery makes it bigger and heavier for those that don't need it. It would be foolish for Apple to make the product larger, heavier and more costly for the masses in order to please the few like you. If you are one of those that needs more battery, there is a variety of after-market battery cases available.

 

[dethmaShine]

I piece of me dies every time Apple gets a new patent, you can guarantee they will abuse it.

Are you Voldermort? How's it going anyway?

 

[Nungster]

Now how cool is that,apple got a patent for a technology that others developed in the first place.
I hope samsung has patented all there is on Tv technology they have coz soon apple will go and hell will brake lose.

Well according to the way touchscreens are done today, this is significantly different. It is called In-cell touchsecreen. When this hits the market in a few months and you see the difference, guess what, there's a patent for that.

No worries, Samsung will copy it as well. Mark it though, this in-cell tech is truely different than current LCD touchscreen tech and Apple was awarded a patent for it.

 

[el3ktro]

Now how cool is that,apple got a patent for a technology that others developed in the first place.

That's wrong. Apple has filed this patent in June 2007 - even before the first iPhone went on sale. In-cell technology has in great part been developed by Apple. The technology to produce in-cell panels has been developed by Sharp and - I think - Toshiba.

 

[Mr Fusion]

All of this research just to make it thinner, and I don't care about the thickness.

..Just look at how big it looks compared to the finger.

If you want it thicker, you can do that with a protective case...

Thinner would likely make it more sensitive..

Uh...

 

[Prother]

STOP COMPLAINING ABOUT PRODUCTS BECOMING THINNER. Apple doesn't make compromises.

 

[Nungster]

I find this patent award odd. Surely it must be limiting in some technical way not apparent. Why would Apple be able to patent a technology their suppliers would have been developing?

And Microsoft trumpeting the small distance between screen and glass on the Surface tablets convinced me they were using in-cell and/or gorilla glass 2. Perhaps that is a reason for the cross-licensing agreement (well, one of many)? Apple doesn't see MS as a true threat to their business at this time and is willing to make the ally against google and android?

Apple performed the R&D on this technology and provided the means be it via OEM or in-house to develop this technology. Sharp and other manufacturers take the design spec and apply their mass production engineering to make the products on a grand scale. Apple certainly holds the IN-
Cell tech patent and I guarantee you that their manufacturing partners will hold patents on machines and processes that make the screens. When you invent and innovate you win!

 

[fabianjj]

See, this is the kind of technology that should be protected by patents. Real breakthroughs in the fundamental, physical way things work. Not the shape/size/color/location of a bit of UI chrome.

Could not agree more!

 

[tbrinkma]

Without patents, R&D has no purpose.

Can't quite agree with you there. R&D serves the same purpose with or without patents. The odds of R&D paying for itself, on the other hand...

Why spend money to develop something that's going to put you ahead of your competitors if they can just copy it without the R&D cost?

That's where you've got it right. We can argue about whether it's too easy to get patents these days (I think it is), or whether patents are awarded too broadly (I think they are), and whether software should be patentable (I don't think *any* branch of mathematics should be patentable), but it's hard to argue against the basic concept of patents as they relate to physical inventions.

You either license it out (FRAND) or you don't (with the former being more economical), which is your choice since you're the inventor of the IP and spent money to develop it. Like it or not IP defense and protection is the cornerstone of rewarding innovation, and Apple (or any other "patent troll") defending their IP is within their legal right. I would hardly consider it "abuse," especially if the patent was awarded in the first place and the appropriate licensing conditions were offered (which they probably were).

Unfortunately, you've conflated a couple things in this section.

You can license out a patent (or not) at your own whim, unless you've made a commitment as part of a standards-development process (or any other reason) to license out the patent under FRAND terms. If you *haven't* made that FRAND commitment, you can pick and choose to whom you do or don't license your patent, under whatever terms you desire.

Don't conflate the ability to licensing a patent with a commitment to license a patent under FRAND terms.

 

[mrxak]

All you people complaining about the iPhone being too thin as it is, you're missing the point. Thinner glass means they can stick a thicker battery in there without making the entire phone thinner.

 

[Zunjine]

All the people complaining about the focus on making components thinner really are missing the point. Obviously Apple has chosen to use the reduction to decrease the size of the handset but that choice is not a consequence of this or any other innovation that has lead to decreased component size. They could just as well have chosen to use the freed up space to make the battery larger or include additional padding to make the phone more robust.

Obviously they feel most people value a thinner device over a longer battery life. And isn't this the safer bet? Those who want an extended battery life can add an external battery (and remove it if they don't need it!) and those who value robustness can add a rock hard protective case. Everyone wins! But if Apple chose to go for the bigger battery/extra casing, those of us who value thinness wouldn't be able to do a thing about it.

 

[ConCat]

If you want it thicker, you can do that with a protective case. It could even include a supplemental battery.

If they make it thick for you, there would be no way for me to be satisfied, because I want it thin.

So I'm glad Apple is designing products for me and not for you.

Reading comprehension fail. I never said I want it thicker, I said I don't need it thinner.

It's nice how indifferent you claim to be to my needs though. Gives me the warm fuzzies. I'll endeavor to care as little about your needs in the future.

 

[faroZ06]

More battery makes it bigger and heavier for those that don't need it. It would be foolish for Apple to make the product larger, heavier and more costly for the masses in order to please the few like you. If you are one of those that needs more battery, there is a variety of after-market battery cases available.

No, they don't need to make it bigger. Just use the space freed up from thinner components to add a bigger battery instead of just making the device way thinner than it needs to be. Isn't the iPhone 4 already thin enough?

 

[kdarling]

Why would you assume that this was in development in 2006? Touchscreen technology wasn't nearly as seriously being pursued, let alone 'make it one tenth of a millimeter thinner' touchscreen technology, at that point.

Touchscreen technology has been the subject of heavy R&D by commercial, space and military interests since at least the late 1980s.

This is just way too scientific for me to understand, could someone elaborate on the potentials of this technology? ( Other than the thinness of the phone)

Two less layers (glass and glue) to mess with the display.

There was a recent article about the problems with low yield using in-cell right now, btw:

After TPK losing its touch panel orders from Apple because of its inability to produce an in-cell panel with the required quality and quantity, now the blessed Japan Display (joint-venture of Sony, Hitachi and Toshiba), LG Display and Sharp, are having troubles with the new technology.

They were only estimated to produce 4-5 million in-cell displays in July, while Apple has booked 20-25 million for the third quarter, in order to fill the initial iPhone 5 demand.

The issues are not with the technology per se, but rather with producing enough yield to warrant the expensive manufacturing process.

Japan Display is supposedly the one with the highest yield rates, and they barely touch the 50% mark, supply chain sources say. LGD, which initially was said to be improving its rates to 70-80%, is now allegedly unable to scale those into mass production, while Sharp hasn't even budged from the very low yield it managed to achieve in the first place.

Apple has reportedly put Sharp under probation, and will evaluate its production methods and results from scratch, while it is said to subsidize each panel from the others with $10-$15 to make it worth their while. - article

 

[stevedun]

We're talking about, what, 1.5mm here? Does anyone know if that particular space can even be applied to battery in this device? I'm no battery expert, but let's not assume that just because you have an extra 1.5mm you can simply add "moar batteryz!"

If this makes the screen brighter, awesome. If it brings the LCD layer closer to the surface (and my eyes can see it), awesome. If this trims a few dollars off the production price that can be used (in part) for future R&D, awesome. Hey, if it means the possibility for a better battery in the future, awesome. Any combination of these benefits would be nice.

 

[djphat2000]

I wish Apple would cut it out already with making it thinner. You'd think they won't be satisfied till the iPhone is paper-thin... It's bordering on too thin at this point. Give me a bigger battery, more RAM, a more powerful GPU or CPU and I'd be happy. I don't need a thinner device.

How do you expect to get more battery (space), faster CPU/GPU (more space for larger chip), more RAM (more space for larger chips)?

You need to make room for those things. Mainly for the battery. As with current Li-Ion's you will need to increase size for more life/power to supply that device with.

Not to mention all electronics are meant to get smaller/lighter/thinner since the digital age started. Unless you like your old analog tape cassette walkman?