Apple in Talks to Bring Ads to Apple TV+

[npmacuser5]

I don’t pay for ads.

Yes you do pay for ads. How do you pay. You pay more for ad free with cash or you pay with your time watching or waiting for ads to finish. Plus you probably pay for the delivery also. Whenever one sees the word free, it really means one does not know how they are paying. No free lunch.

 

[mazz0]

Wow, I really wasn't expecting anyone to take the "me ripping DVDs and sharing the files isn't piracy" line.

Can you post a link from a reliable source to a single Plex user who was sharing content that they'd 100% paid for via Plex to a small group of friends (under five in my case) that was convicted of piracy in the USA?

No I can't, I suspect that never happens. How would you even get caught? Small scale generally doesn't get prosecuted (that's why so many people feel safe to do it), that doesn't stop it being illegal.

While you're at it, can you also post a link to the universal law in the USA that states that sharing your media library which contains only content that you've paid for with a small number of friends via Plex is illegal?

Now this I probably could do, if I wanted to do a lot of googling, but I'm not going to, that sounds like even more work than setting up a Plex server! I did, however, aks ChatGPT:

Is it illegal in the US to share digital copies of films you bought on disk?

In the United States, sharing digital copies of films you bought on disk is generally considered illegal under copyright law. Here are some key points to understand why this is the case:

### Copyright Law
1. **Copyright Protection**: Films are protected by copyright law, which grants the copyright holder exclusive rights to reproduce, distribute, perform, and display the work.

2. **Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA)**: The DMCA further strengthens copyright protections, making it illegal to circumvent digital rights management (DRM) technologies that control access to copyrighted works.

### Fair Use Doctrine
3. **Fair Use Limitations**: While the fair use doctrine allows for limited use of copyrighted materials without permission (such as for criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, or research), it does not generally extend to distributing complete copies of a film.

### Personal Use
4. **Personal Backup**: You are typically allowed to make a backup copy of a film you own for personal use, but this does not include distributing that copy to others.

### Distribution
5. **Unauthorized Sharing**: Sharing digital copies, even if you legally purchased the original disk, constitutes distribution, which is an exclusive right of the copyright holder. Sharing such copies without permission is considered copyright infringement.

### Legal Consequences
6. **Penalties**: Unauthorized distribution of copyrighted materials can lead to civil and criminal penalties, including fines and potential jail time.

In summary, while you may own a physical copy of a film, this does not grant you the right to distribute digital copies. Sharing digital copies of films without permission from the copyright holder is illegal in the US.


What if you only share it with a small number of friends?

Even if you share digital copies of films with a small number of friends, it is still generally considered illegal under U.S. copyright law. Here's why:

### Distribution Rights
1. **Exclusive Rights**: The copyright holder has the exclusive right to distribute their work. This right is not limited by the scale of distribution; whether you share with one person or many, it still constitutes unauthorized distribution.

### Copyright Infringement
2. **Unauthorized Sharing**: Sharing with a small group of friends is still unauthorized and constitutes copyright infringement, regardless of the number of people involved.

### No Fair Use
3. **Not Fair Use**: The fair use doctrine does not typically cover sharing complete copies of films for entertainment purposes, even with a small group.

### Legal Risks
4. **Potential Consequences**: While the risk of legal action might be lower for sharing with a small group, it is still present. Copyright holders can pursue legal action for any unauthorized distribution.

### Digital Rights Management (DRM)
5. **Circumvention**: If sharing involves circumventing DRM protections, this adds another layer of illegality under the DMCA.

### Personal Use Exception
6. **Limited to Personal Use**: The personal use exception typically allows you to make a copy for yourself, but not to share that copy with others.

In summary, sharing digital copies of films with a small number of friends without permission from the copyright holder is still illegal and can expose you to legal risks.

Now of course ChatGPT isn't a proper legal source, so by all means continue believing both myself and GPT-4 are wrong if you want. Personally I think you know I'm right, and you're just a bit miffed and in denial about it because it hadn't occurred to you before that what you were doing was illegal. I don't think you should worry about it though - you and your friends are almost certainly not going to get caught, and in my opinion the fact that it's illegal has no bearing on it's morality, so you shouldn't feel any worse about it now than you did when you thought it was legal.

 

[jimimac71]

The final nail in the coffin of AppleTV

Roku owns the #1 spot in streaming hardware.
I still think the Apple TV hardware is nothing special.

 

[iMac The Knife]

Wow, I really wasn't expecting anyone to take the "me ripping DVDs and sharing the files isn't piracy" line.


No I can't, I suspect that never happens. How would you even get caught? Small scale generally doesn't get prosecuted (that's why so many people feel safe to do it), that doesn't stop it being illegal.


Now this I probably could do, if I wanted to do a lot of googling, but I'm not going to, that sounds like even more work than setting up a Plex server! I did, however, aks ChatGPT:



Now of course ChatGPT isn't a proper legal source, so by all means continue believing both myself and GPT-4 are wrong if you want. Personally I think you know I'm right, and you're just a bit miffed and in denial about it because it hadn't occurred to you before that what you were doing was illegal. I don't think you should worry about it though - you and your friends are almost certainly not going to get caught, and in my opinion the fact that it's illegal has no bearing on it's morality, so you shouldn't feel any worse about it now than you did when you thought it was legal.

From my understanding, while it is a legal grey area, there is no law on the books in the USA where I could be successfully prosecuted for sharing media that I've paid for with a small group of friends on Plex. Therefore, until I see said law and people in my exact position being successfully prosecuted for it, I am not doing anything illegal. If it were illegal to do what I am doing, Plex would've been shutdown long ago.

 

[mazz0]

From my understanding, while it is a legal grey area, there is no law on the books in the USA where I could be successfully prosecuted for sharing media that I've paid for with a small group of friends on Plex. Therefore, until I see said law and people in my exact position being successfully prosecuted for it, I am not doing anything illegal. If it were illegal to do what I am doing, Plex would've been shutdown long ago.

This might sound rude, but I don’t mean it to: unless you’re a lawyer, I think GPT is more likely to be right about this than you are just based on your “understanding”, especially since your understanding seems to be based on whether people get prosecuted for it, which is not a valid measure of whether something is legal or not.

And no, Plex aren’t doing anything illegal, and it’s perfectly possible to use Plex without pirating, just like you can use BitTorrent for legal purposes. The existence of software that can be used for legal and illegal purposes doesn’t make every use of that software legal.

 

[iMac The Knife]

This might sound rude, but I don’t mean it to: unless you’re a lawyer, I think GPT is more likely to be right about this than you are just based on your “understanding”, especially since your understanding seems to be based on whether people get prosecuted for it, which is not a valid measure of whether something is legal or not.

And no, Plex aren’t doing anything illegal, and it’s perfectly possible to use Plex without pirating, just like you can use BitTorrent for legal purposes. The existence of software that can be used for legal and illegal purposes doesn’t make every use of that software legal.

Trust me, I've consulted my attorneys regarding this matter. I will follow their advice over ChatGPT any day. My point stands. And no, I don't think you are being rude at all. I appreciate a lively debate.

 

[Gasu E.]

Step 4: complain on Macrumors

That's step 1.

 

[gleepskip]

And no, Plex aren’t doing anything illegal, and it’s perfectly possible to use Plex without pirating, just like you can use BitTorrent for legal purposes. The existence of software that can be used for legal and illegal purposes doesn’t make every use of that software legal.

People overly concerned about decisions others make that have no impact on themselves are weird.

 

[Gasu E.]

Idk how I feel about this really. I hate ads. Did I grow up watching ads on tv my whole younger life? Yes. Do I watch them now? I try not to.

Apple did not have good success when they tried going into the ad business before (I know this is different) but I’m sure they are going to explore ways to bring in more revenue. At this point I really don’t care as long as they keep ATV+ around and keep up the pretty good programming to watch. I’m just to that point in my life I just don’t care. Whatever is going to happen, is going to happen.

There's different ways to insert ads. One way is to have ads only before the show. A second is to insert a few at regular intervals, reasonably far apart-- say, minimum of 15 minutes. I find the first way completely tolerable, and the third okay if it's the service is at a very low cost. A third way is to insert them willy-nilly. I recall one service that would show me the same add 3-5 times in a row, maybe 7-10 times during a given show. It was horrible, and I've chosen not to patronize the advertiser due to oversaturation.

 

[webkit]

From my understanding, while it is a legal grey area, there is no law on the books in the USA where I could be successfully prosecuted for sharing media that I've paid for with a small group of friends on Plex. Therefore, until I see said law and people in my exact position being successfully prosecuted for it, I am not doing anything illegal. If it were illegal to do what I am doing, Plex would've been shutdown long ago.

There are "legal" ways to use Plex as well as potentially some "illegal" ways. Similar can be said about other types of online services.

Have you read the terms of service for Plex and would you say you are abiding by everything in the terms of service?

Terms of Service

Revised March 19, 2025 By using or otherwise accessing the Plex website, a Plex software, mobile, or web application(s), or...

www.plex.tv

 

[iMac The Knife]

There are "legal" ways to use Plex as well as potentially some "illegal" ways. Similar can be said for other types of online services.

Have you read the terms of service for Plex and would you say you are abiding by everything in the terms of service?

Terms of Service

Revised March 19, 2025 By using or otherwise accessing the Plex website, a Plex software, mobile, or web application(s), or...

www.plex.tv

I've had my attorneys review Plex's terms of service and yes, I am abiding by everything for my use case. I made sure of this before I did anything using Plex.

 

[turbineseaplane]

It’s sad to be watching the beginning of the end for Apple. Lack luster products, poor to Microsoft level software, constant updates, privacy degradation, now the introduction of ads to bolster a failing bottom line. Valuation above all else, it’s a bad ethos.

This is the end result of having an Ops guy in charge (as opposed to a product person)

Very sad to watch as Tim just destroys the whole thing, piece by piece

 

[thoralf]

I only see Apple TV+ as a bonus to the Premium subscription.
But if they really **** it up like this, I will unbundle my subscription and cancel Apple TV+.

**** ads!

 

[mazz0]

Trust me, I've consulted my attorneys regarding this matter. I will follow their advice over ChatGPT any day. My point stands. And no, I don't think you are being rude at all. I appreciate a lively debate.

Your lawyers told you it’s legal to rip DVDs and share the digital copies with other people? Surprised you didn’t mention that earlier. How many people did they say you’re legally allowed to share them with? Obviously there’s a threshold, or you could just share with the whole world, and essentially piracy would be entirely legal, so presumably they know what the threshold is?

 

[mazz0]

People overly concerned about decisions others make that have no impact on themselves are weird.

I couldn’t care less about what they do, as I said I watch pirated content myself. This is a discussion about facts, not about whether people should or shouldn’t be doing things.

 

[Harthag]

There are always ways to minimize the costs. My T-Mobile plan (with 20% hookup discount for life...hopefully) has Netflix and Hulu w/ ads, and ATV+. I use my dad's login for Max. Amex Platinum card credits 100% of the cost of Disney+ (ad free) each month.

For everything else I use a Superbox S3 Pro w/ VPN. No real setup needed. Installed Kodi w/ Seren add-on + real debrid on it.

When the day comes where I need to pay (more) for content with ads those services will be canceled and I'll sail the high seas some more.

 

[iMac The Knife]

Your lawyers told you it’s legal to rip DVDs and share the digital copies with other people? Surprised you didn’t mention that earlier. How many people did they say you’re legally allowed to share them with? Obviously there’s a threshold, or you could just share with the whole world, and essentially piracy would be entirely legal, so presumably they know what the threshold is?

Yes, that is what they've told me. Since it is another grey area legally in regard to fair use and they've never seen specifics on the number, they advised me to share with a group consisting of no more than ten people to be on the safe side, until there is more clarification on all of this...if that ever happens.

 

[jimimac71]

As Julia Child used to say during PBS pledge drives, "There's no such thing as a free lunch."
I also remember the old saying, "Don't copy that floppy."
I think people should wait and see what Apple does.
Hulu charges an extra $10/months for their service with no ads. That's excessive to me.

 

[GalileoSeven]

There's only one real option left
🏴‍☠️🏴‍☠️🏴‍☠️🏴‍☠️

 

[MallardDuck]

The day they start ads, I cancel.

 

[sleven]

You know what you can do with your ads. I was about to sign up for Apple TV+ but now I won't go near it with a ten foot pole. Ad supported tv is free

Ad supported tv can be free, but without the content.

 

[triptolemus]

The ads that people are complaining about on here are the "intrusive" ads that can appear with ad-supported plans during a show/movie, which is different.

On a paid service, all ads are intrusive, full stop.

 

[webkit]

On a paid service, all ads are intrusive, full stop.

In that case, "intrusive" ads have long existed even on pay premium channels going back to 1970s. Today's streaming services are really no different in that regard.

 

[ThirteenXIII]

It just takes one brave move from one CEO. I guess Microsoft already took the baby step on windows. And getting a PC without bloat ware isn’t easy.

Apple made the first move on the charger. We had one year of Samsung running ads mocking Apple for that and then they followed.

It just takes one CEO

I dont think the charger thing is that big of a deal.

 

[ninecows]

I dont think the charger thing is that big of a deal.

Good on you. We had to buy new chargers because the old USB-A/lightning were worn out and Apple kindly supplied USB-C/lightning with the new phones. So we were still left with e-waste despite apples promises about a green world.

Either way the principle is the same. Increase profit by selling less for the same price or more.