If Apple wants to slow down JailBreaking, they could by making at$t stop the data discrimination policy. Data is data. If you have a fixed plan (2gb) then tethering cost more is highway robbery. How many JB just for PDANet and MyWi. I bet these alone account for quite a few JB's.
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Apple Investigating iOS Vulnerability Allowing Web-Based Jailbreak
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Ahem, have you really thought this through?
By your logic if I can afford a gun I should also be able to point and shoot wherever I want.
That's after I've written off my Viper and some poor other innocent road users.
I seem to recall when opening my iPhone box there were terms and conditions of ownership, which I accepted by opening the box. My recollection of the terms is a bit fuzzy, but I'm dead sure there are terms and conditions you must agree to before using iTunes, which is how you are meant to manage your iPhone.
So guess what... if you bought an iPhone, you've agreed to its terms and conditions of use. I'm pretty sure those terms don't say: "you bought it - you can do whatever you like with it".
What is clear is that Apple can't stop you jailbreaking your phone. It's just that you can't blame them when it slows down, craps out, or whatever because of what you've done.
Just like you can't blame the Viper manufacturers if you "jailbreak" your Viper by disabling the stability control and antilock braking so you can do power slides and other fun stuff, then end up going through your neighbour's front fence.
the only thing that is crystal clear is that you cannot think logically at all!
no matter how you look at this analogy, it's unbelievable stupid!
first of all, guns don't have mechanisms or "licens agreements" that prevent you from modifying them or using them anywhere... if you use a gun to kill people, it's just like using an iphone to kill people from a legal standpoint (even if it's far more difficult to do that with the latter)
there are no legally valid conditions to use a product once you but it! once it's yours you can use it however you wish... software producers (and other IP producers) tend to make many wild claims - which sometimes sound threatning - but which have absolutely no legal basis, like: you don't own the software and you can't resell it, you can't reverse engineer it, etc.
the analogy is logically invalid! if you modify the software of a car computer, you're not damaging the car computer itself but the mechanical machinery the computer controls... mobile phones are miniature computers themselves and cannot be damaged by modified software, and producers of such devices should be forced to offer warranty to devices with modified software, just as desktop, notebook and netbook producers have to offer warranty for their devices, no matter what software they come with and no matter what software you install afterwards...
It's probably already been said...
But Apple is making a mistake to not provide an official path to allow jailbreaking as the incentive now is for white hats to conceal holes rather than report them to Apple. If there was an official path to disabling the authentication layer (to allow unsigned code to run) for users who wished to do so their would be no reason to hide exploitable bugs and all of our phones would be safer because of it. They could make all sorts of disclaimers and so forth to discourage users from doing so, even void our warranties (which is dumb, but I suppose they have the right to do so if they can claim that unsigned code could potentially damage devices.) But the fact is, there are legitimate reasons to be able to run unsigned code, and Apple is only shooting themselves in the foot to prevent it. This exploit would have otherwise been reported to Apple who could have had a security patch in place before it went wild.
But Apple is making a mistake to not provide an official path to allow jailbreaking as the incentive now is for white hats to conceal holes rather than report them to Apple. If there was an official path to disabling the authentication layer (to allow unsigned code to run) for users who wished to do so their would be no reason to hide exploitable bugs and all of our phones would be safer because of it. They could make all sorts of disclaimers and so forth to discourage users from doing so, even void our warranties (which is dumb, but I suppose they have the right to do so if they can claim that unsigned code could potentially damage devices.) But the fact is, there are legitimate reasons to be able to run unsigned code, and Apple is only shooting themselves in the foot to prevent it. This exploit would have otherwise been reported to Apple who could have had a security patch in place before it went wild.
Depending on the nature of the software, in the US it may be illegal to reverse engineer software if it can circumvent copy protection or other IP security measures. Whether the DMCA is good law or not is irrelevant, because it's applicable. And more law like it is being passed by a variety of western countries, because (mostly) secure walled gardens are conducive to commerce.
I'm sorry, but what world do you live in? Try calling Dell for support if you're running Solaris. They'll hang up on you. I have never once received (or expected, for that matter) technical support for ad hoc setups from anyone, hardware manufacturers or otherwise, when their support agreement explicitly states that they only support certain configurations, and most of them do. Hell, when I ran Linux my ISP gave me unending grief if I had to call them.
And why should a software developer be forced to support their product after it's been tampered with in an unpredictable way?
How could they possibly conceal this hole, if all that Apple has to do is to take a brand new phone and go through the process of jail-breaking it?
This Article is not About Jailbreaking!
Sorry to be grumpy, but why do all these threads about the exploit/vulnerability turn into discussions about jailbreaking? When the jailbreak was announced, we had a 40-page thread maturely discussing () the pros and cons. A bit later we get an article discussing the vulnerability itself, but it turns into another 'constructive' debate on jailbreaking. And now, Apple acknowledge the vulnerability (or as close as Apple ever get to acknowledging anything) and... we get another multi-page thread about jailbreaking with people making exactly the same points that they made in the previous two posts.
I'm sure by now everyone realises that this vulnerability is not a result of the jailbreak, right? The JB is just an example of the vulnerability being exploited. There's a lot of good discussion on this, it's just a shame it all gets lost in all the 'listen to me tell you why JB is great/evil for the third time' posts. We know. We heard you the first time.
That's it, I've done now.
Sorry to be grumpy, but why do all these threads about the exploit/vulnerability turn into discussions about jailbreaking? When the jailbreak was announced, we had a 40-page thread maturely discussing (
) the pros and cons. A bit later we get an article discussing the vulnerability itself, but it turns into another 'constructive' debate on jailbreaking. And now, Apple acknowledge the vulnerability (or as close as Apple ever get to acknowledging anything) and... we get another multi-page thread about jailbreaking with people making exactly the same points that they made in the previous two posts.I'm sure by now everyone realises that this vulnerability is not a result of the jailbreak, right? The JB is just an example of the vulnerability being exploited. There's a lot of good discussion on this, it's just a shame it all gets lost in all the 'listen to me tell you why JB is great/evil for the third time' posts. We know. We heard you the first time.
That's it, I've done now.
Lol, "We're investigating". Reminds me of my days back as a Gamemaster for Blizzard.
When no one had any idea about if the issue was real or not, or we simply had no idea about what that issue was, we were told to simply say: (wait for it...)
"Hello and thank you for reporting this issue. We are aware of this and are investigating the issue you have addressed."
- Ticket closed, no further investigation.
When no one had any idea about if the issue was real or not, or we simply had no idea about what that issue was, we were told to simply say: (wait for it...)
"Hello and thank you for reporting this issue. We are aware of this and are investigating the issue you have addressed."
- Ticket closed, no further investigation.
To me, it isn't really a point of good or bad, but a point of freedom and idealism. I don't own an iPhone, but that's much more based on the merits of what it does or does not do not matching up with what I do or do not do. I do own a different smartphone which is, in some ways, also locked down (though not quite as thoroughly as an iPhone).
That doesn't mean I shouldn't speak against locked-down hardware or software if I believe it is wrong, however. Using a piece of software or hardware that is locked down and speaking out against locked down software and hardware isn't hypocritical or any sort of paradox. It's pragmatism -- use the best tool for the job, but speak freely about how it's imperfect. I greatly respect those who can both speak their views and completely act how they preach (people such as Richard Stallman, for an example related to software freedom), but it's not something I usually find myself in a position to easily, or at all, do.
Funny thing is that those "new" features were already available w/ a JB iOS3.x in some form.
Wallpaper - winterboard
Folders - Category
Multitask - Backgrounder
Now who is taking who's ideas?
Sad that Apple has not look into lockinfo yet. Probably one of the biggest reason why I jailbreak.
I jailbreak for one app, Backgrounder. If the good folks over at Apple would allow this to work on the iPhone/iPad I wouldn't see the need to jailbreak. I have the unlimited 3G on both devices so tethering really isn't an issue but it's nice to know I can if I want to.
Didn't Steve Jobs fly a pirate flag outside of his corporate headquarters for many years? Arghhhh!
Didn't Steve Jobs fly a pirate flag outside of his corporate headquarters for many years? Arghhhh!
Breaking news
Unconfirmed rumor....Apple has completed study and solution is to post a video of an HTC Desire being rooted remotely. Caption explains that it happens to all phones.
Unconfirmed rumor....Apple has completed study and solution is to post a video of an HTC Desire being rooted remotely. Caption explains that it happens to all phones.
Jailbreaking is just a way to enable customers to do those things that should have been possible in the first place. There should be (international) laws against "walled garden" business practices. It should be illegal for Apple and other corporations to sell software and hardware platforms that are so tightly closed.
However, I don't jailbreak my iPhone because - I - don't have a real need for that, but that does not mean that I am comfortable with the digital jail that I'm carrying around with me. It's a principle question.
On the more practical and urgent side, right now I do have a need for a working operating system on my iPhone that does not slow down the phone to a grinding halt or that lets applications crash that worked just fine with the previous version, for example Navigon or the game Plants vs. Zombies. It's not a big deal if a game crashes, but what iOS4 did to my navigational software is simply unacceptable.
At this point in time, I don't care whether iOS 4 has vulnerabilities or security holes. iOS 4 simply is a slow and unstable mess. So far, it appears to be the Vista of mobile phone operating systems. I need something that works reliably and that provides an acceptable performance. Thus I'm seriously considering a downgrade.
As a matter of fact, I know for certain that their business support unit won't hang up on you. They will help you. I've been there and done that - last year, 64-Bit Ubuntu Linux was not supported on their servers but still their technical support helped me install Dell's diagnosis software on Ubuntu Linux.
Also, you are obviously not up to date. Dell is now selling servers with Solaris. Duh!
PS: The other poster was talking about WARRANTY, not about support! Those are two different shoes.
However, I don't jailbreak my iPhone because - I - don't have a real need for that, but that does not mean that I am comfortable with the digital jail that I'm carrying around with me. It's a principle question.
On the more practical and urgent side, right now I do have a need for a working operating system on my iPhone that does not slow down the phone to a grinding halt or that lets applications crash that worked just fine with the previous version, for example Navigon or the game Plants vs. Zombies. It's not a big deal if a game crashes, but what iOS4 did to my navigational software is simply unacceptable.
At this point in time, I don't care whether iOS 4 has vulnerabilities or security holes. iOS 4 simply is a slow and unstable mess. So far, it appears to be the Vista of mobile phone operating systems. I need something that works reliably and that provides an acceptable performance. Thus I'm seriously considering a downgrade.
As a matter of fact, I know for certain that their business support unit won't hang up on you. They will help you. I've been there and done that - last year, 64-Bit Ubuntu Linux was not supported on their servers but still their technical support helped me install Dell's diagnosis software on Ubuntu Linux.
Also, you are obviously not up to date. Dell is now selling servers with Solaris. Duh!
PS: The other poster was talking about WARRANTY, not about support! Those are two different shoes.
Many industries operate this way. The most notable that comes to mind would be that of the game console industry
Why is it wrong to have hw and sw tied together? Why should it be illegal?
Not saying I disagree as, well, I jb my iphones and run a hackintosh lol
Can't have users enjoying choice....now can we? Once upon a time Steve Jobs said that Apple believed in choice when talking about Internet Explorer. How times have changed
Funny thing is, to fix the PDF exploit, you need to JB your phone and then get the update. Yes, right now, you need to JailBreak your phone to make it more secure.
Choice is very much defined by your point of view. Phone manufacturers think jailbreaking or rooting your phone is a bad idea and I must agree.
Like I said, its all about choice. You don't have to want it but its obvious a very large portion of iPhone/iPod/iPad owners do want these abilities.
If Apple would give us this out of the box then vulnerabilities like these wouldn't be made public in such a way.
You may not want these things but others do. Look at the Mac or a PC as a perfect example. You just might want to sit down and do something real quick and not do anything else with the computer. While another person will want to tear OS X apart and look at how it works and customize it to their desires. Why shouldn't they be able to? Just because you don't want to does that mean Apple should sell Mac OS X completely locked down like iOS? No? So, why should iOS be so locked down? It shouldn't be. Users should have the choice. They can use it as they do now or completely open it up if they so desire.
Why is it a bad idea?
An iPhone is a lot more than a phone. It's a pocket Mac. And I should be able to use it the same way I use my Mac. However I like and being able to do whatever I want to it.
Furthermore, I should be able to use it on whatever network I so desire.
Very large portion? A good three quarters of my friends, probably 11ish people or so, own iPhones, iPod Touches, and iPads, and not a single one has cracked them. Most of them are computer professionals of one stripe or another. Naturally, I don't care what anyone does with their hardware. And I'm not naive enough to think that if there were no recreational cracking community there'd be no exploits; of course there would be. I really don't care either way, as long as the hobbyist cruft can stay as far away from my iPhone as possible. I just take a dim view of the outrage. Apple doesn't have to accommodate people trying to violate their licensing agreements.
I really fail to see how this is a perfect example, as I don't see my iPhone as a general purpose computer purely because it runs a distribution of UNIX. It's covered in interfaces designed to isolate the user from the bare metal beneath, possibly for a reason.
When I'm using an OS X machine more often than not I'm doing some form of video editing or data visualization along with light development. OS X is a general purpose OS that runs on PCs. Because I need to do development tasks once and a while I expect a very pliant OS. Now, for personal tasks, If Apple, and the developers who sell me the software I use, would guarantee a more reliable system with easier management of licensing in exchange for a more secured (in their perspective) OS, I'd jump on it. I already use Steam for gaming, and that's essentially an App Store for PC games. It's reliable, reasonable, and has a great selection.
I dunno. The outrage over walled gardens flies past me, but perhaps that's because my hobbies don't involve modern computers. It's the way of the future, though.
yeah, I guess so, it's pretty hard to spot sarcasm with so many fanatics around...
well, that's pretty bad then..
don't you think it's kinda stupid to assume that people who jailbrake for any other reasons than those mentioned by you, do so in order to steal apps?!
no, apple has to give complete access to the phone's APIs to developers and let owners install WHATEVER THEY WISH! if they get "burned" installing bad stuff or messing mindlessly with the OS, then it's simply their personal responsibility for that, as it is the responsibility of ordinary pc owners for their actions if they get fook up the os or install malware...
LOL! how could unsigned software "damage" such a device?
regardless of whether it's signed or unsigned, the code is just code that's going to be "executed" by the integrated circuits... also any other elctronic components have their physical limits of operation so that they can't really get "damaged" by the instructions they get from the main cpu (if they get damaged, they're defective)
the signed/unsigned aspect is a software one, whose purpose is to prevent you from running whatever you whish on YOUR device, which is your property (and no, the code is not the property of the device maker, as some IP fanatics tend to claim)
with such restrictions in effect you'll be forced to get all the stuff you want from the manufacturer of the device or its partners... the manufacturer will get paid by anything you use, in one way or another...
leaving the device "open" in the case of apple, the consequences and the advantages/disadvantages would likely be as follows:
free apps:
for you: you'd have far more truly free apps because programmers wouldn't have to pay apple an yearly fee to apple and wouldn't have to use costly workaround for some apps
for apple: apple wouldn't get the revenue it gets now because those who make free apps wouldn't pay the yearly fee
paid apps:
for you: most apps would very likely be cheaper because no one is going to take 30% from the price of your apps (there are free markets, you can set up your free website, etc,) and because, if you have to refund a user, no one is going to retain a portion of the price of the app (as apple ca do now keeping for them the 30% while you have to refund the full price, in case someone request a refund)
for apple: apple wouldn't get money from all the commercial apps sold and wouldn't be able to retain fees in case of refunds (they could of course continue with their app store, but there would be far fewer apps)
other aspects involving apps:
for you: there'd be a huge diversity of useful apps, some of them taking advantage of the phone internal functions, others taking advantage of other technologies currently forbidden by apple
for apple: apple would lose revenue from its partners (like at&t) because more and more apps would use free resources and offer free services instead of relying on paid services
example: call recording apps (at least before iphone4/iOS4 - I don't know about the new phone/os) have to use the internet and a third party server in order to work - that means more data transmitted and more money paid to carriers and apple... without any restrictions in place, such apps could store de recordings on iphone itself and the audio files could be easily copied to computers
music, videos, books & related stuff:
for you: you would be able to connect you're iphone/ipad/whatever to your computer just as you can do it with usb flash memory or any "normal" smartphone that supports usb mass storage.. you could first download the content to your pc using your cheap and fast broadband connection, without paying any mobile carrier anything and you'd be able to create directories and copy anything you wish (music, videos, pdfs, photos) and then open them on the devices without any restrictions... also, you'd be able to save media content and ebooks from the internet without any restrictions directly from the iphone/ipad, without any paid apps and strange tricks (like sending pdfs by email)
for apple: they'd lose the huge cash cow called itunes... almost all the restrictions are created in such a way that the user is forced to use itunes and the internet for just about anything... besides the revenue apple gets from both paid and free apps/media/whatever apple also gets revenue from carriers for the traffic created by those who use itunes directly from their mobile devices
Write to the flash memory continuously for example. Do calculations in the background sucking energy from the battery and making it's life span shorter.
Very funny to see a jail breakers frustration when half way through the jail break the 3G drops out or the dudes phone is bricked during the process... or even better the web site is hijacked in the near future and all these phones are bricked... three cheers for the dev team!
Um...you cant brick an iPhone through jailbreaking....no matter how badly you screw up, you can always restore via iTunes. DFU mode exists for this very reason.
Lets be honest - the folk in here bitching that jailbreaking is 'bad' are stupid. Now, I'm not being a troll or narrow minded. Here are the clear FACTS:
- As above, Jailbreaking cant brick your phone
- It gives you access to MORE APPS
- Unlocking is possible - why should your $500 phone be locked to a crappy network?
- It has no negative effects on Wi-Fi, 3G or bluetooth as some foold would have you beleive
- You have complete, unrestricted control over your phone (I.e root access)
- Custom SMS Tones
- Easy custom ringtones
- Multitasking existed waaaay before 4.0
- The list goes on...
As I said above, anyone who thinks jailbreaking is bad are stupid. Let the bashing begin!
and don't give me crap about how its 'not the way lord Steve wanted it to be'. When I pay £450 for a phone, I don't want to be told what I can and cant use it for.
You'd be pissed if Steve told you you could no longer install apps on your Mac unless Apple has approved them! (and seriously, if you think THAT is a good idea then you need therapy!)
There's nothing to stop ANY app doing that even in Apple's App store. You do know they don't check code - they just open the app up, play around and hit approve.
Take the recent tether flashlight - that could have been used to force wifi on all the time, draining the battery...a bug in his code could have caused the CPU to overhead...its all relative.
reverse engineering is used for a variety of things, not only for bypassing IP security measures... and many aspects of the DMCA and related laws are not extremely clear in all circumstances... for example, apple claimed that jailbreaking is violating the DMCA for a variety of resons among which the fact that it allows to run pirated content... another example is that of DeCSS product - the author was detained, interrogated and what not, but finally all charges were dropped... also, in many European countries reverse engineering is explicitly allowed by national legislation (if I'm not mistaken there's also some EU directive that specifically permits such things)
I was talking about warranty for hardware, not about support for software... no matter what OS you have , be it windows, linux, solaris or even some variant of hackintosh, dell has to replace/repair anything that is hardware related (defective displays, hdds, video cards, wifi cards and so on)
even when it comes to software support, if offered for free, it's always limited: for example if you mess up terribly with your windows 7, no one is going to assist you live for an unlimited time or repair it for you for free
no, software developers are neither forced nor expected to offer support for modified software! but electronics hardware manufacturers are expected to offer warranty for their stuff regardless of the software used on their products!