Apple Invites Media to October 30th Event in New York City

[Sabelonada]

I can see why you'd characterize the mini (and perhaps the MP) as "Walking Dead" (although that IS about to change); but I would hardly characterize the Apple TV in that manner. It's development has ALWAYS been a couple of years (3 or 4) between Updates; but, it just received an Update to the hardware last year, and the OS is in constant Development.
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But in a post-card-slot world, there is simply no reason to have a computer that can double as a cat sanctuary (ignoring the static electricity!).

Now one thing that I predicted (and I think Apple did, too) that never really happened was external TB-connected Card Cages. I know there were a couple; but the idea never really caught on. The only vestige of that concept that remains seems to be with eGPUs. But when the 2013 MP came out, I thought there would be the Sonnets and LaCies of the world that would soon come out with 4-slot external Peripheral-card enclosures, for use with TB-equipped Macs. But it just didn't ever really happen.

We aren't in a post-card-slot world. Thunderbolt 3 only offers 4 PCI-E lanes. There are growing numbers of computation heave workloads that need more than that. The Mac Pro is woefully under capable in enabling these sorts of tasks. This a direct result of the modular upgrade decision.

I doubt there will ever be a "post-card-slot world" as highly demanding tasks require the fast access and bandwidth provided by those primitive slots provided in ugly, large computers.

Apple has made high end computing on their devices difficult. That's on Tim and Jonny.

 

[MacsRuleOthersDrool]

The card cage never caught on because the concept that the ones that will come up with silly arguments is dated and not realistic. I would like for them to outline a single application that is better handled by a slot than an external device.

Playing the devil's advocate for a second, there ARE likely still a FEW (very few these days!) applications where the sheer torrent of data between "host" and "Peripheral" is too much even for TB3.

But then, those applications are PROBABLY too demanding even for current PCIe card-slots, too... So, you may still "win" by default, LOL!
[doublepost=1540311464][/doublepost]

We aren't in a post-card-slot world. Thunderbolt 3 only offers 4 PCI-E lanes. There are growing numbers of computation heave workloads that need more than that. The Mac Pro is woefully under capable in enabling these sorts of tasks. This a direct result of the modular upgrade decision.

I doubt there ever be a "post-card-slot world" as highly demanding tasks require the fast access and bandwidth provided by those primitive slots provided in ugly, large computers.

Apple has made high end computing on their devices difficult. That's on Tim and Jonny.

TB 3 has twice the RAW bandwidth of TB2 (which is what the 2013 MP has). TB2 couldn't really even manage 4k video without channel-bonding, while TB3 can drive TWO 4k Displays (or 1 5k Display, albeit with some trickery).

Interestingly enough; there isn't really that much difference in practical-use between PCIe 3.0 X 16 (card slot) vs. PCIe 3.0 X 4 (which can be achieved with TB3):

See:

https://www.hardwaresecrets.com/pci-express-3-0-vs-2-0-gaming-performance-gain/


I won't disagree that there is a theoretical advantage to card-slots in the very-most-demanding of applications; but, for one thing, I certainly wouldn't characterize that market segment as "growing", and for another, were there EVER any Cheese-Grater Mac Pro-compatible cards on the market that would have taken advantage of the total bandwidth of full-blown PCIe 3.0 X 16?

So, without availability of the cards to stick in those slots in the first place, what's the point?

 

[Val-kyrie]

Where are all the rumors for the upcoming MBA replacement?

Apple today sent out media invites for a second major 2018 event set to be held in New York City on Tuesday, October 30 at the Brooklyn Academy of Music, Howard Gilman Opera House.

Apple's October event, which will focus on products not introduced at the iPhone-centric event in September, will kick off at 10:00 a.m. Eastern Time.

Image via Neil Cybart​

Apple sent out multiple different Apple logo designs on the invitations that it sent out to members of the media, all of which feature the tagline "There's more in the making."

Image via Todd Haselton​

We're still awaiting multiple product refreshes before the end of 2018, including updates to several Mac models and the iPad Pro, which are likely to see a debut at the event.

Image via Lance Ulanoff​

2018 iPad Pro models are expected to adopt an iPhone X-style design with no Home button, slimmer bezels, and a TrueDepth camera system that will enable Face ID for biometric authentication.

Image via Joanna Stern​

While the iPad Pro is expected to continue to use an LCD rather than OLED due to the high price of OLED displays, rumors suggest it could adopt a USB-C port instead of a Lightning port and that the headphone jack could potentially be eliminated.

2018 iPad Pro mockup by Álvaro Pabesio​

Along with new iPad Pro models, we're also expecting refreshes to the MacBook line. Refreshed 12-inch MacBooks are said to be in the works, and based on rumors, Apple has developed a low-cost notebook with a Retina display that could be positioned as an updated MacBook Air.

The Mac mini, which has not been updated for more than 1,400 days, is expected to be refreshed for the first time since 2014. We don't know a lot about what to expect for the Mac mini update, but upgraded internals and faster processors are a sure thing.

It's possible that at this iPad and Mac-focused event, we'll also hear more about the modular Mac Pro that Apple is working on for a 2019 debut.

Apple's 2018 keynote event will begin at 10:00 a.m. Eastern Time. Apple typically streams the event live on its website and on Apple TV, but for those who are unable to watch, MacRumors will be providing full event coverage both on MacRumors.com and through our MacRumorsLive Twitter account.

Article Link: Apple Invites Media to October 30th Event in New York City

 

[navaira]

Where are all the rumors for the upcoming MBA replacement?

I was actually thinking that Macrumors announcing the "iPad and Mac event" is a bit of wishful thinking, because I don't think there's anything confirming Macs will even get a mention.

Watch that MBA replacement be a new cheap iPad with Magic Keyboard Butterfly Switch Third Generation...

 

[Sabelonada]

Playing the devil's advocate for a second, there ARE likely still a FEW (very few these days!) applications where the sheer torrent of data between "host" and "Peripheral" is too much even for TB3.

But then, those applications are PROBABLY too demanding even for current PCIe card-slots, too... So, you may still "win" by default, LOL!
[doublepost=1540311464][/doublepost]
TB 3 has twice the RAW bandwidth of TB2 (which is what the 2013 MP has). TB2 couldn't really even manage 4k video without channel-bonding, while TB3 can drive TWO 4k Displays (or 1 5k Display, albeit with some trickery).

Interestingly enough; there isn't really that much difference in practical-use between PCIe 3.0 X 16 (card slot) vs. PCIe 3.0 X 4 (which can be achieved with TB3):

See:

https://www.hardwaresecrets.com/pci-express-3-0-vs-2-0-gaming-performance-gain/


I won't disagree that there is a theoretical advantage to card-slots in the very-most-demanding of applications; but, for one thing, I certainly wouldn't characterize that market segment as "growing", and for another, were there EVER any Cheese-Grater Mac Pro-compatible cards on the market that would have taken advantage of the total bandwidth of full-blown PCIe 3.0 X 16?

So, without availability of the cards to stick in those slots in the first place, what's the point?

Gaming benchmarks aren't the best indicator that "there isn't really that much of a difference" between PCIe 3.0 x 16 vs 4. One of the benchmarks showed no difference, indicating the game was probably CPU bound. On the rest it seemed the minimum was 7%. For a professional, having a machine that is a a minimum 7% less effective at it's job than a comparable Windows or Linux machine is a waste of money.

I am thinking about deep learning in particular. ANY Mac is a poor choice. This is a growing field from which Apple has effectively eliminated itself for consideration. In this field, work can be done using an eGPU, but it is much less effective and slower than using a dedicated board.

We are not and will not ever be in a slot free world for high computing. The fact that Apple doesn't really cater to this market doesn't seem to have hurt its bottom line in the slightest.

It's unfortunate because MacOS is a great Unix system. It's why I dipped my toe into the water. Now, Apple really doesn't have a good offering in that arena.

 

[MacsRuleOthersDrool]

Gaming benchmarks aren't the best indicator that "there isn't really that much of a difference" between PCIe 3.0 x 16 vs 4. One of the benchmarks showed no difference, indicating the game was probably CPU bound. On the rest it seemed the minimum was 7%. For a professional, having a machine that is a a minimum 7% less effective at it's job than a comparable Windows or Linux machine is a waste of money.

I am thinking about deep learning in particular. ANY Mac is a poor choice. This is a growing field from which Apple has effectively eliminated itself for consideration. In this field, work can be done using an eGPU, but it is much less effective and slower than using a dedicated board.

We are not and will not ever be in a slot free world for high computing. The fact that Apple doesn't really cater to this market doesn't seem to have hurt its bottom line in the slightest.

It's unfortunate because MacOS is a great Unix system. It's why I dipped my toe into the water. Now, Apple really doesn't have a good offering in that arena.

I agree that the game(s) that showed no difference where likely CPU (or otherwise) bound, and that games probably aren't the most-optimal comparison; but it was all I could find without turning a Forum Post into an all-day research project...

However, your attempt to blow a 7% difference into something even REMOTELY significant in the real-world is laughable. Period.

"Deep Learning" is a niche-within-a-niche "field"; but I would submit that the REAL bottleneck in those computations is NOT data-handling; but rather, COMPUTATION; which is no slower for a GPU at the end of a TB cable than it is for that same GPU stuffed into a PCIe slot.

Oh, and NEVER say "Never". Time marches on. What seemed like Science Fiction even a decade or two ago is commonplace today...

And yes, macOS IS a wonderful (perhaps the world's MOST wonderful, overall) Unix system. That hasn't changed.

 

[PeterJP]

"Deep Learning" is a niche-within-a-niche "field"; but I would submit that the REAL bottleneck in those computations is NOT data-handling; but rather, COMPUTATION; which is no slower for a GPU at the end of a TB cable than it is for that same GPU stuffed into a PCIe slot

There are several interesting bits of information being thrown around in this thread. Deep learning isn't that niche. But most of it is being done on server farms, not on desktop machines. So in practice, deep-learning-on-my-own-machine is, indeed, niche-within-a-niche.
Most people I know in AI or data science use MBPs connected to servers.

 

[Brammy]

I have the first-gen 12.9 and I love it. That said, the issues I have with it are mainly software and OS related. I want Word to have more features. I want Scrivener to have more features. None of these are in Apple's control. Although in April I finish grad school so I won't have to deal with Word much anyway.

So, since my 12.9 still doesn't feel slow, unless the hardware really knocks my socks off or there are iOS-12 features no ones has discovered, I am going to wait until the post-iOS 13 IPP to upgrade.

 

[inkswamp]

Just my similar anecdotal evidence that shows Macs, and particularly iMac Pros, being used in many creative professional environments.

My comment was not anecdotal. You ignored the part where I point out that...

"It's pretty clear from Apple's sales that they're not gaining new converts in those areas."

Apple's sales are falling off, meaning creative professionals are likely moving away from the platform. I worked for a national media company that included designers, editors, videographers and photographers that announced plans to eliminate thousands of Macs company-wide last year. That's not anecdotal.

 

[turbineseaplane]

This is a crucial keynote for Apple. It will show us their direction for next few years. If there is nothing interesting (nice tech for a reasonable price), I will have to get out of the ecosystem.

Well said..

Whatever direction Mac hardware takes next is going to be my main indicator.

If we are never again getting good keyboards (as one main example), I'll have to move on with my next laptop purchase.

 

[Brammy]

This is a crucial keynote for Apple. It will show us their direction for next few years. If there is nothing interesting (nice tech for a reasonable price), I will have to get out of the ecosystem.

I think next year's WWDC will be that. We will start to see what the Marzipan apps will look like, and get a clue about the future of iOS. I think/hope that iOS 13 will be a big release for iPads again.

 

[tcador]

Well said..

Whatever direction Mac hardware takes next is going to be my main indicator.

If we are never again getting good keyboards (as one main example), I'll have to move on with my next laptop purchase.

Never thought I’d say it but I’m in the same boat.

 

[navaira]

Never thought I’d say it but I’m in the same boat.

+1. At this point they have no products left that I would be interested in.

 

[Ishayu]

Looking forward to this.

This is a make-it-or-break-it moment for me. Either I'll be satisfied and switch to the Mac for the foreseeable future, or I'll be disappointed and try to get out, going towards the Linux world. If this happens, I'll probably also leave the iPhone, Apple music, and many other such services behind, because I cannot deal with Windows any longer, and I cannot deal with Apple's crappy hardware either.

Above all else, I pray for a great graphics card, preferably one that I can swap (but if the machine is cheap enough, I can accept not having that ability)

If the perfect machine turns out to be the Mac Pro and it comes out in a few months from now, I can wait that long. Not a problem.

 

[Brammy]

If the perfect machine turns out to be the Mac Pro and it comes out in a few months from now, I can wait that long. Not a problem.

Apple has said the Mac Pro is not coming out this year. I think we will see it at WWDC next year.

 

[Sabelonada]

Apple has said the Mac Pro is not coming out this year. I think we will see it at WWDC next year.

Didn't they tease the current Mac Pro late in the year prior to its availability?

 

[Brammy]

Didn't they tease the current Mac Pro late in the year prior to its availability?

No.

"After an initial recap in what they’d done over the past year, including MacBooks and the iMac Pro, I was given the day’s first piece of news: the long-awaited Mac Pro update will not arrive before 2019.

When we got the news that it wouldn’t arrive in 2017, there was some implicit messaging that 2018 was not guaranteed either (we were told “not this year,” but not “definitely next year”). This time around, Boger was succinct: the promised Mac Pro will be a 2019 product."

 

[wdwpsu]

Traditionally, for Mac events, how soon after are they available? Is it the same as iphone -- orders start in several weeks, available a week after that?

 

[Sabelonada]

No.

"After an initial recap in what they’d done over the past year, including MacBooks and the iMac Pro, I was given the day’s first piece of news: the long-awaited Mac Pro update will not arrive before 2019.

When we got the news that it wouldn’t arrive in 2017, there was some implicit messaging that 2018 was not guaranteed either (we were told “not this year,” but not “definitely next year”). This time around, Boger was succinct: the promised Mac Pro will be a 2019 product."

I thought the original announcement of the round Mac Pro was late with availability the next year. Not the current vaporware announcement from earlier this year.

I guess it was at WWDC with late 2013 availability. I had that backwards in my head.

 

[Brammy]

I thought the original announcement of the round Mac Pro was late with availability the next year. Not the current vaporware announcement from earlier this year.

And didn't they just barely get it in that year too?

 

[Jeremiwvi]

If Apple is having this in NYC there is a big reason... they built Steve Jobs theater for events like this so if it’s not there why??? What’s in NYC that’s unique.

Music, Broadway, art... it’s in an opera house.

It will have something to do with audio, HomePod integration, new speaker system, interaction of new devices in regard to this. My guess is the location was chosen for acoustics to show off some new toys. It would be pretty dramatic if they did the entire presentation with audio from linked homepods.

 

[Ishayu]

Apple has said the Mac Pro is not coming out this year. I think we will see it at WWDC next year.

You might be right, but I have a strong feeling we're going to get a "sneak preview for all our closest friends" just like we did with the iMac Pro and the Mac Pro 2013, but then it actually comes out next year.

The reason I suspect they'll do this is because the pro user segment is in a dire situation. Apple simply cannot afford to not say anything anymore if they want to keep that segment.

If we don't get that, oh well. Hopefully one of the other computers will be nice. If not, I'll buy some RAM for my existing PC and start my transition to Linux.

 

[Brammy]

The reason I suspect they'll do this is because the pro user segment is in a dire situation. Apple simply cannot afford to not say anything anymore if they want to keep that segment.

The iMac Pro probably serves a lot of the Pro market fairly well. The iMac Pro was a WWDC reveal and shipped in November. I doubt seriously the new Mac Pro is far enough along for a sneak peak. I mean, they showed off AirPower 13 months ago and it hasn't been seen since.

My money is on WWDC for the Mac Pro.

 

[darkcompass]

The new Mac mini is almost certainly coming

I'll believe it when I see it (mid afternoon tomorrow for a change here in the UK).

 

[navaira]

I LOVE the fact that for once we really don't know almost everything that's going to happen. Love love love it. We'll all still whine and complain, but at least we don't know about what yet