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Apple, iPod, and CD Copy Protection

I don't quite understand how this would work, assuming they make this deal.

If I buy a protected CD, I presumably can play the CD on my CD player and copy a protected version of any song from the CD to my Mac, for downloading into my iPod. Can I also play the song on my Mac? On a certain number of computers? On all computers? Can I burn them in mixes to my own CDs?

If the songs are in a protected format on my Mac, what uses would be allowed and not allowed? Do computers have to be authorized to play the music? If so, who would be the authorization authority?
 
Freg3000 says... "But the scenario is that Apple says no since they want the only way to get that type of music onto iPods is to buy it from the iTMS"

First of all, Apple is not that stupid... They DO NOT want music from the iTunes store to be the ONLY music playable on the iPod. Which is why we can currently rip music from our CD collection, that was the whole point of iTunes... before there was an iPod and before there was an iTunes Music Store, iTunes was an app to allow you to rip and listen to your music on your computer.

Secondly, from what I've read of a few posts elsewhere, people have been able to rip music off these "protected" CDs on their Macs, because these stupid CDs only know how to protect themselves when loaded into a Windows PC.
 
suzerain said:
Anything that legitimizes these stupid copy-protected CDs is bad, IMO. Myself, I would prefer to see these CDs remain incompatible with the iPod, so that people would have fewer reasons to buy them in the first place.

This will only make it more likely that these stupid copy-protection schemes will continue, furthering the problems such as buying CDs that don't even work in certain older CD players, and so forth.

Sorry, but under the fair use laws, I should have the right to make copies of my CDs for myself. Anything that gets in the way of that is wrong. I say, don't help these *******s out. :mad:
Click to expand...

EXACTLY. I totally agree with you. Legitimizing copy-protected CDs is NOT the way to go. I think Apple will say NO to this, and they should. There is NO reason to support Macrovision and it's DRM. You have iTunes music store to get DRM versions, or if you get the CD, you should be able to rip it in whatever format you want.
 
Wow

It never ceases to amaze me how many people are willing to cheer on one monopolizing corporation against another as if it is some sports event or turf battle. Don't get me wrong, I adore Apple products and I abhor using MS anything. That being said, at the corporate level, away from the beautiful addictive technology, we're talking about two institutions with one goal in mind: getting us to part with our hard-earned dollars. Getting wrapped up in which company is better than all the others misses the point that we are all beholden to major corporations in every aspect of our lives. Whoops! There goes democracy. Bring on the plutocracy. :mad: :(
 
mjtomlin said:
Freg3000 says... "But the scenario is that Apple says no since they want the only way to get that type of music onto iPods is to buy it from the iTMS"

First of all, Apple is not that stupid... They DO NOT want music from the iTunes store to be the ONLY music playable on the iPod. Which is why we can currently rip music from our CD collection, that was the whole point of iTunes... before there was an iPod and before there was an iTunes Music Store, iTunes was an app to allow you to rip and listen to your music on your computer.
Click to expand...

Exactly. That is why they SHOULD NOT support "copy protection" on CDs that are BOUGHT.

mjtomlin said:
Secondly, from what I've read of a few posts elsewhere, people have been able to rip music off these "protected" CDs on their Macs, because these stupid CDs only know how to protect themselves when loaded into a Windows PC.
Click to expand...

The only way I see copy protection working is this:
You buy the CD. You decide to rip it to your iPod via iTunes. iTunes looks on the CD, sees it has "copy protection", then adds some sort of AAC id tag on it saying YOU ripped it. It would assume you had a Apple iTunes store ID.

But I don't see Apple supporting or doing this. Copy protection doesn't do anything positive for anyone.
 
I haven't run across a CD that iTunes couldn't import. One CD I can think of (Foo Fighters "There Is Nothing Left To Lose") that I couldn't rip with other programs before iTunes came out for Windows and that was because of the Enhanced Media on it (some videos and stuff)

I don't really buy many CDs anymore, Could someone list a CD that is copyprotected from itunes?
 
128bps encoded AAC on CDs..

Who said any AAC files appearing on CDs would be only 128bps? There is no reason why record companies couldn't record the files at a higher bit rate?
 
Stella said:
128bps encoded AAC on CDs..

Who said any AAC files appearing on CDs would be only 128bps? There is no reason why record companies couldn't record the files at a higher bit rate?
Click to expand...

Ok, but WHY? I paid for the CD. Why do I have to SETTLE for some rate that someone else sets???

I think that is the whole point. If I buy a $15 CD, I want to do whatever I want with it. Rip to iPod, etc, etc, however I want.
 
license it!!!! come on you know you want to!!! think of the benifits. . . . more revenue . . . more money for R&D . . . cooler products. . more revenue. . . get it?
 
Read the fine print...

Ummm...did anybody read this part?:

"Software will be loaded on the music CDs that will help create a new copy-protected file in a form that can be played on an iPod, or on Microsoft-compatible players such as the Rio Karma, or on whatever else a consumer might be using. "

How stingee can you get? I don't want special software on my computer to help me rip a cd...I have iTunes for that. Shame on the record companies for trying to manipulate digital music when you BUY the CD.

People will always find a way around the problem, whether you like it or not. :cool:
 
i doubt jobs will bother licensing this. he said before, he doesn't believe in copy protection. he believes in putting in some protection as long as it's very un-intrusive and will not hinder use for 99% of the users. as someone else posted earlier, he will not legitimize a copy protection scheme that seems to distrust majority users and above all, cripples an established format such as a CD.

it's one thing to put in mild DRM on a music file - an up and coming format for music distribution with the public yet to have a common understanding on how they work. it's quite another to "cripple" an existing, ubiquitous format like the CD. jobs will say it's distrusting and annoyance for majority users to endorse CD-level copy protection.

and with the iPod as popular as it is, labels has to listen to apple. when users find out CDs are incompatible with their iPods, they will boycott the CD, not iPod.
 
Maybe not good.

Every protected CD I tried acted as a normal CD on my mac, incl. ripping in iTunes. :confused:
If Apple makes a deal with them, maybe the protections will work on mac then. :(
But, with the iPod dominance, it may be the time for Apple to challenge WMP, by this means or another. I'm not sure protected CD will have a long life when labels realize that it has no effect on piracy...
 
Can we stop calling these things "copy protected CDs"? Music CDs are already compatible with the iPod. Copy protected disks pretending to be CDs cause problems with all kinds of equipment and Apple should not be encouraging their distribution. I hope they'll have the good sense to say no.
 
mjtomlin said:
Freg3000 says... "But the scenario is that Apple says no since they want the only way to get that type of music onto iPods is to buy it from the iTMS"

First of all, Apple is not that stupid... They DO NOT want music from the iTunes store to be the ONLY music playable on the iPod. Which is why we can currently rip music from our CD collection, that was the whole point of iTunes... before there was an iPod and before there was an iTunes Music Store, iTunes was an app to allow you to rip and listen to your music on your computer.

Secondly, from what I've read of a few posts elsewhere, people have been able to rip music off these "protected" CDs on their Macs, because these stupid CDs only know how to protect themselves when loaded into a Windows PC.
Click to expand...

I hope you're right.
 
If you want to give customers the full quality and the full choice into which format they want to convert their music (and I would settle for nothing else) and if you want to prevent (illegal) file-sharing at the same time, the OS would have to allow only the ripping of music into DRMed files (as in Fairplay-AACs or Fairplay-AppleLossless or Fairplay-OggVorbis (not that the latter would already exist) etc.).
Microsoft is going into this direction with Paladium (or whatever is is called). But I think it is going to be a very long way until Apple is forced to follow them (hopefully never) and forcing Linux to so as well will be even harder.
By that time we will probably all have a microship implanted which monitors all our movements, actions, thoughts....
 
I hear a lot of people talking about copyrights, fair use laws and the such. I too agree that if you purchase a cd you should be able to copy it to whatever player/computer/format/etc. that you use to listen or store that music you legally bought and paid for. But unfortunately we're stuck with it (copyright protection) for now and that Apple would be foolish NOT to license it. It would cement their place in the music market.
 
Loge said:
Can we stop calling these things "copy protected CDs"? Music CDs are already compatible with the iPod. Copy protected disks pretending to be CDs cause problems with all kinds of equipment and Apple should not be encouraging their distribution. I hope they'll have the good sense to say no.
Click to expand...

excellent point. we are way past the point where customers would accept anything but fully rippable CDs. if they are somehow crippled, i'd definitely demand a refund as it's not what i expect CDs to be and it's borderline fraud to claim these are music CDs. and i am sure i wouldn't be the only one who expect CDs to be what it has always been and continue to be that way - fully compatible with all CD players, PC or otherwise, and can be ripped into arbitrary format of my own choosing.
 
Sounds like a pretty good idea, and I'm not surprised about the number of complaints, as I have had to return CDs for this reason. It must be done properly though. I can think of quite a few people who would be unhappy if there were just 128kbps MP3/AAC on the CD, People want choice over the file size and format type.

I would also like it if there was a way you could get the digital tracks (by this I mean mp3/AAC etc. I realise CDs are digital) if you bought the vinyl, maybe include a CD that could not be played on a CD player but had the tracks to put onto an iPod. I don't really listen to CDs anymore I just use iTunes or iPod and I'd love to collect vinyl rather than CDs but I can't afford to have two copies. If I buy the CD I get or can make the digital tracks, so why not if I buy vinyl, I know I can use a line in but it is lots of effort.
 
License it for a penny if you have to. But make this happen.

You've got billions in cash. License the darned thing and don't quibble over nickels.
 
Fuchal said:
I've personally never run across a CD that my superdrive powerbook couldn't rip... but I do have a few CDs that will ONLY read in my powerbook... my cd players (old) say they aren't cds. :D
Click to expand...

I found this to be the case, too. I read on the forums somewhere that someone couldn't rip the On and On album from Jack Johnson. DRM issues were discussed a bit. I bought it some time ago and had not brought it in to the house yet and, thus, had not ripped it to my Mac. Well, upon insertion iTunes crashed. But, when I reopened iTunes, the CD names came up care of the CDDB and it ripped without a problem. Though, now that I write this, I'm not sure if I tried playing a track to verify integrity.
 
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