Apple Launches 'Path to Apple Card' Program to Help Declined Applicants Get Approved

[Kabeyun]

I think this should be taught at school. Most people don't have the discipline or even understanding what debt actually means so we constantly see people buying stuff on their CC because they feel its like they 'have' the money only to later see them struggling with payments etc. Its hard to resist the temptation when we have this plastic thing that can buy us anything and we face the consequences after a while. It makes us feel as those two things are not connected and often people don't learn from this and keep doing the destructive behaviour their whole life. Reducing quality of life as the struggle is a burden on their everyday life. I feel that CC was the worst financial invention. I think its safe to say that without it most people would be better off and have a better quality of life.
So yeah, this should be taught at school as a 'life skill'. Along with cooking, taxes etc.
I think most people would appreciate it

Yours is a good idea but not a new one: two subjects, financial literacy and civics, have vanished from American primary education. This is why we can’t manage debt, can’t save for retirement, and don’t know how government works.

 

[compwiz1202]

You do pay for it one way or the other.

Same as with every rebate, it's all cooked into the prices. Sure if you do like the ladies on those couponing shows you might end up in the plus (with a truckload of work) but everyone else is just getting 50ct back for every $ they had been skimmed of before.

Heck even if the rebate isn't padded by the price, they still take a ridiculous amount of time, which I'm sure they do on purpose so all those rebates can be invested.

 

[Freida]

You are wrong or at least from my experience.
Using debit card doesn't show transaction as that shows up after few days but it shows you available balance which is correct.
Credit cards sux (although I use one but only for certain benefits).

They create illusion that you have more money and as a result people spend more than they would if the used just their debit card. Cash doesn't sux. In fact, cash is the best and easiest way to monitor your money but it has disadvantages also (like you can be robbed, or lose it etc.)

And as for interest, I hope you are kidding as the only interest you get these days is from investments and definitely not from having cash sitting on your current account. The "interest" they give you is laughable at best.

Checking accounts suck. The money from debit transactions don't clear immediately, so there's often an illusion that you have more or less than you actually have and it's off for a few days. You can write a check but maybe someone doesn't deposit it for 90 days.

To deal with that all, your options are:
1 - Have a check book (who does that?)
2 - Keep too much money in your checking account, where it's barely getting any interest.
3 - Risk having to pay overdraft fees.

Cash also sucks. It generates no interest, wastes time (slowing down transactions and counting/keeping track of it), and risks being lost or stolen.

Credit accounts are much better. As long as you pay it off every 2-4 weeks, interest only gets charged every 8 weeks. Leave your money in stocks or savings or bonds or wherever you can be on the receiving end of interest and just pay it off immediately.

Never do minimum payments on credit cards - that should be avoided just like overdraft fees on a debit account.

The two things people need to be taught are:
1 - Be aware of the interest on debts. If your interest on a debt is over ~5%, be aggressive about paying it off. Don't settle for minimum payments on those. Credit card should be paid in full every month.
2 - Have a weekly discretionary budget. Don't spend more than that. If you run out of the budget before the week is over, you're stuck with making yourself sandwiches or ramen noodles - no more fun food or eating out.

If a third thing were to be taught, I'd probably say something about having an emergency fund to cover at least 3 months of bills, and don't just leave the rest of the money piling up in a low interest saving account - once your emergency fund has all the money it needs in it, put your other money into stocks, MMSAs, bonds, etc...

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Yep. I've been to America many times and its not a place where I would want to live. The system there is so broken that its beyond repair. At least in my lifetime.
Its a shame because it is a beautiful country.

Yours is a good idea but not a new one: two subjects, financial literacy and civics, have vanished from American primary education. This is why we can’t manage debt, can’t save for retirement, and don’t know how government works.

 

[tegranjeet]

A bankruptcy sticks to your name. You can't get rid of it except with time.

Corporate credit is only associated with the company's name. Small businesses can easily declare bankruptcy and close and the officers can start a new company with no debts or record. It's a few hundred dollars to start a new company.

That's why it's not comparable. It's much harder to get credit for companies. An average small restaurant or retail store, if they were to get credit, would be paying easily 30-50% APR (merchant cash advances).

You're looking at the largest, most highly regulated public companies and banks. That's not the majority of businesses.

Makes sense, it seems sad that banks are allowed to issue credit with high APR so easily to people who will keep digging a deeper hole. I just think the federal government wouldn't be so kind, but maybe they would, as it "drives the economy". This behavior will eventually drive it into the ground. Might take awhile though and we can print money to make things artificially seem ok.

 

[AZMecha]

Apple wants more people to have Apple cards since we're approaching the holiday season...

 

[Creator74]

This is pretty cool. All other cards just decline you and bury you under disclosure mail.

I had 798 credit score and never had any issues with my other cards ,also have few high balance cards and Apple Card application is declined what a joke lol plus i own business

 

[bigchrisfgb]

As a European I was stunned when I heard that in the US people still used paper cheques and pay bills manually. We do everything with a bank account, money transfer and auto pay. We get our "paycheck" directly to the account, the bills get deducted automatically from the same account. No late fees, no forgotten payments, no fraud, no money lost in the mail. I haven't been inside a bank for 25 years, you can do everything online or by phone.

This. Apple has gone down the wrong route in my opinion. They should have opened a fintech bank, not create a credit card. With the bank they could get rid of the fee’s that American banks charge in comparison to European banking. They could have pushed people over to direct debits and money management in their apps.
Banks like Starling and Monzo in the UK have pretty much nailed down what banking should be these days, and the route an Apple Bank should have went down. Monzo is soon to launch in the USA, with a USA banking licence, and Starling is soon to launch in the EU with an EU banking licence, both obviously have a UK banking licence.
Although I prefer Starling and their app, I don’t think Apple would be doing much wrong if they went ahead and bought Monzo.
For all you USA readers out there, I’d recommend keeping an aye out for Monzo for when they launch.

 

[lkrupp]

Thats quite a nice thing to put out there. I have only been rejected once and it was from a company called V12, who subsequently let my fiancé take out finance and he has no money. Would have loved to have found out their reasoning, I am all within 20% of my limits.

That's what people don't understand about credit worthiness. Having balances with 20% of the card's limit is bad. It's the percentage of total credit being used that's important. If all your credit limits add up to say, $10K the credit reporting companies don't want to see more than a certain percentage of those limits in use. If it's more than 10% then your credit rating starts to drop. It doesn't matter if you are always on time with your payments in this this case. You are using too much of your total credit. So if you have $10K of credit and you are paying on $8K of debt you are are not a good risk.

To see how this works establish an account at Credit Karma. They have tutorials on how to get your rating up.

 

[Techwatcher]

This is pretty cool. All other cards just decline you and bury you under disclosure mail.

Yeah this is actually cool stuff. Good on Apple.

 

[Topher227]

Well, here's to me hoping I receive an invitation to this program.
I have some charge offs from 5+ years ago with zero late payments since then, but GS doesn't want to lend me a cent.

 

[dontwalkhand]

Honestly for people with crappy credit, the Apple Card would probably be the best card for them, considering all of the payment reminders, and tools to help you manage your money are all built into the app, more than likely people will want to pay off the entire balance right away instead of letting it linger like other cards.

 

[Tech198]

I think Apple, and users, will find there is allot more to just reducing, and/or paying back.You may be applying for a better service, unlike credit cards, but the same approve process must somewhat still still is decided..

Weather reducing limit is a myth, and allot of other so-called myths, no idea.

 

[Rigby]

As a European I was stunned when I heard that in the US people still used paper cheques and pay bills manually. We do everything with a bank account, money transfer and auto pay. We get our "paycheck" directly to the account, the bills get deducted automatically from the same account. No late fees, no forgotten payments, no fraud, no money lost in the mail. I haven't been inside a bank for 25 years, you can do everything online or by phone.

It's not really like that anymore (except for old luddites who refuse to change). "Paychecks" are usually deposited directly into a checking account these days, and you can pay most bills automatically using ACH (debit from a checking account) or with a credit/debit card. I don't remember the last time I wrote a check.

But I do enjoy the credit card rewards that we get here in the US. You just have to know how to use them properly (pay back in full every month).

 

[TravelsInBlue]

Unless you’re barely starting out and building your credit, if you can’t get approved for a card, you probably shouldn’t be getting one in the first place.

 

[dontwalkhand]

As a European I was stunned when I heard that in the US people still used paper cheques and pay bills manually. We do everything with a bank account, money transfer and auto pay. We get our "paycheck" directly to the account, the bills get deducted automatically from the same account. No late fees, no forgotten payments, no fraud, no money lost in the mail. I haven't been inside a bank for 25 years, you can do everything online or by phone.

Do you really think we do it this way? I have been living in America all my life, and I use Apple Pay 90% of my day, paychecks are just in name only, as they are really just direct deposits to a bank account, bills are deducted automatically, and I haven't been inside of a bank branch in 20 years, other than when I went to go open the actual account, which was when I was a teenager. I don't carry any cash usually, unless its a few bucks I keep in my wallet to give to the homeless. I never wrote a check once in my life, and even pay my rent with Apple Pay and a debit card.

Most of my friends and family are in the same boat. I don't know anyone who still writes checks unless they're 85+.

 

[swingerofbirch]

Yep they probably skirted the rules on purpose to advertise the app. I doubt I would have heard about it otherwise.

The fundamental problem is you're not going to get anybody competent to teach it in high school when they can get paid far more being a financial advisor/broker. Plus they don't have to deal with teens.

Same thing with computer programming and engineering classes. You got to pay professor-level salaries, and even then that's barely competitive in hot fields like AI.

So many universities now use mostly adjunct professors who get poverty wages--teach at two or three colleges and just get paid a few thousand per course. I bet a lot would like a regular salaried job.

As a European I was stunned when I heard that in the US people still used paper cheques and pay bills manually. We do everything with a bank account, money transfer and auto pay. We get our "paycheck" directly to the account, the bills get deducted automatically from the same account. No late fees, no forgotten payments, no fraud, no money lost in the mail. I haven't been inside a bank for 25 years, you can do everything online or by phone.

As a European, have you heard of Germany?

 

[C DM]

No, you're the type of person everyone should hate. We should all take a look at where that cashback is coming from. It's bogus. We are taking money from merchants and smaller businesses, who must in turn, raise prices. The banks love that behavior.

Would we really see lower prices if something like cashback/rewards and all that didn't exist?

 

[dontwalkhand]

Don't believe the news.

Everybody in the US uses electronic payments for receiving their paycheck. Banks and utilities offer electronic bill pay. Mortgages are paid electronically. The US Government is banned by law from sending checks unless you're old, disabled, in a foreign country, etc.

Apple Card doesn't let you send in a check.

The majority of checks are business-to-business for relatively large amounts of money that would be uneconomical for card, but not big enough for a wire.


You most definitely can have ACH fraud. Page 10 and 33 and 41:

https://www.ukfinance.org.uk/system/files/Fraud%20The%20Facts%202019%20-%20FINAL%20ONLINE.pdf

You don't need to go to the bank to deposit a US check. You open your smartphone app, take a picture. Businesses use check scanners. Or else stick it in the ATM, where it's instantly scanned.

The US checking system is universal. You can pay anybody with a check. That's why in 2003 it was modernized by Check 21 to allow checks to clear digitally. Essentially a check has become a digital transaction with an image file attached.

Europe had issues with checks because of differing currencies and differing national banking systems. That's why it was largely abandoned. Europe is only now transitioning to digital check clearing, I think the UK switched one or two years ago.

That's why checks in Europe and checks in the US are very different in terms of cost, time, and convenience.

What this guy said

 

[compwiz1202]

Would we really see lower prices of cash back and all that didn't exist?

Plus the large % of people who carry balances will more than pay for the ones who use the cash back and rewards perfectly. Same as all the clueless card players in a casino pay for the ones who know what they are doing and get lucky.

 

[Pirate!]

Would we really see lower prices of cash back and all that didn't exist?

Potentially. Without those kinds of rewards (or getting rid of all rewards in general) the transaction fees paid by merchants *should* decrease by a decent percentage, relatively (as fees on rewards cards are significantly more expensive than debit or basic credit cards).

 

[bigchrisfgb]

Do you really think we do it this way? I have been living in America all my life, and I use Apple Pay 90% of my day, paychecks are just in name only, as they are really just direct deposits to a bank account, bills are deducted automatically, and I haven't been inside of a bank branch in 20 years, other than when I went to go open the actual account, which was when I was a teenager. I don't carry any cash usually, unless its a few bucks I keep in my wallet to give to the homeless. I never wrote a check once in my life, and even pay my rent with Apple Pay and a debit card.

Most of my friends and family are in the same boat. I don't know anyone who still writes checks unless they're 85+.

Your banking system is still a rip off though, and you have to jump through hoops to not be charged for your accounts. It actually punishes people who earn less.
A couple of weeks ago I had the same conversation about how messed up your banking system is as the post a made just a little further up.
I took a screenshot of the terms and conditions and charges for a standard checking account from one of your bigger banks to show what I mean.

The terms and conditions were essentially that you had to have a certain amount of money going into your account each month. You had to make sure that you used your card so many times etc. In Canada I believe most of the banks charge you for your using your debit card too many time’s unless you pay so much into your account and/or pay for a premium account.

Here in the UK banking is essentially free. You can use your card as many time’s as you like, free of charge, pay however much you need to pay/or earn into your account without charge etc. Of course you can get premium accounts, but hardly anyone has one, and I believe there is a law where you are legally entitled to have a bank account, unless you have been declared bankrupt.

Your banking system has so much more catching up that it needs to do. In comparison the UK consumers were just sick of not seeing transactions appear in their accounts for a few days and the growing need to be able to use your card abroad without charges which lead to fintech banks coming in and shaking things up.
The US banking system is crying out for those fintech banks to open up in the US, and are crying out for someone like Apple to lead the charge towards consumers moving their accounts over.

 

[1146331]

This is actually something I support from Apple and other credit-card programs should provide something similar to all applicants.

The current credit card system aims to exclude minorities and less fortunate people, and when they do approve applicants they ensure they have a sky high-interest rate that they'll never be able to pay off if they don't pay the card before the interest kicks in.

 

[konqerror]

Here in the UK banking is essentially free. You can use your card as many time’s as you like, free of charge, pay however much you need to pay/or earn into your account without charge etc. Of course you can get premium accounts, but hardly anyone has one, and I believe there is a law where you are legally entitled to have a bank account, unless you have been declared bankrupt.

Don't act so smug. The secret with UK banks is that they get their profits from the overdraft facilities with 40% interest rates they bundle with your account. That's why it's "free".

Your checking accounts are basically credit cards in a different name.

 

[1146331]

I think this should be taught at school. Most people don't have the discipline or even understanding what debt actually means so we constantly see people buying stuff on their CC because they feel its like they 'have' the money only to later see them struggling with payments etc. Its hard to resist the temptation when we have this plastic thing that can buy us anything and we face the consequences after a while. It makes us feel as those two things are not connected and often people don't learn from this and keep doing the destructive behaviour their whole life. Reducing quality of life as the struggle is a burden on their everyday life. I feel that CC was the worst financial invention. I think its safe to say that without it most people would be better off and have a better quality of life.
So yeah, this should be taught at school as a 'life skill'. Along with cooking, taxes etc.
I think most people would appreciate it

I 100% agree and it is egregious that we teach stupid SJW classes at school as well as music / art history classes, but we don't do the one thing that will enable the future to be successful in the real world:

• Debt and financial management (The importance of saving for rainy days [or months] for when you need an emergency fund)
• How to do taxes [and not get audited/destroyed by the IRS]
• Reading basic contracts such as rental contracts, mortgage contracts, etc, so they can learn to comprehend some of the legal jargon and not get screwed over [especially by insurance companies]
• Available government and private programs to help guide them to a path of success in the event they need money, food, healthcare, and other assistive programs.

So that's more than pone thing, but you get the gist.

 

[CausticSoda]

... also have few high balance cards and Apple Card application is declined what a joke lol plus i own business

Available credit (i.e. even amounts unused) counts against you in a credit assessment. It is not a "joke lol", and the fact you own a business is not in itself immediately relevant. I am not having a go at you, but am really pointing out that most people don't have a clue how how credit scoring works. Your credit score, as a number, means little. Creditors see no "score" number. Creditors have different ways of assessing your circumstances, and apply their own formulae to your information. The "score" gives you a very vague indication as to how you might be seen on average, but means nothing in its own right. Lender "X" might see you as an ideal risk for them, and lender "Y" might not accept or want your potential business for dozens of reasons. It is a very, very complicated business. Credit "scores" try to simplify it for Joe Public, but often fail and cause angst, or even anger, in the process. This is an example of basic financial education that should be taught in school.