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Apple LCD Specs?

Re: Re: I can't stand some people

Originally posted by Fender2112


I perfer the expandablity of the tower. And this is my delima, is the expandabilty worth an extra $1300. The short term answer is no. But when spending this kind os money, I think about the long term (5-6 years in computer time).
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Again, with proper acknowlegement, $1300 over 5-6 years is a small price for a better system...

Most people don't keep a car tha long, enjoy using it less, and might even spend more money maintaining it :)
 
Re: cool, i guess...

Originally posted by suzerain
...the apple displays are decent.

i just wish they'd use industry standard connectors for them.
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The ADC connector *is* a variant of the VESA standard. It's not proprietary to Apple.
 
Re: is it worth the expense?

Another thing to think about - how much do you think you will really upgrade???
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Well, the last computer I bought (a mid level Power Computin 601) was in in 1997 and it had everything I needed. I was never going to need an upgrade. Since then I've added: a processor upgrade, more RAM, two hard drives, a 2-port USB card, a video capture card, a Zip drive (external), a CD-burner, and speakers.

The extra $1300 for the long term is not the issue. It's about Apple price gouging me now. Their 17" will most likely be widescreen. I'll want it and Apple will be the only ones selling it. And they'll charge whatever they want. I'm just not sure I'll buy it, not for $800.

And I'll choose to be sad:(
 
Originally posted by wallinbl


I think there is a third option: they enjoy wasting money...The prices are just plain ludicrous. $3000? Just buy one for $1000 and give me your extra $2000. I'll do something useful with it.
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The monitor he gets for $1K will not be the equal of Apple's $3K. Well, perhaps if it happens to be a bit...um..."thermally enhanced".

The 23" monitor costs Apple a good deal more than $1K, and probably closer to $2K or more.
 
>> The extra $1300 for the long term is not the issue. It's about Apple price gouging me now. Their 17" will most likely be widescreen. I'll want it and Apple will be the only ones selling it. And they'll charge whatever they want. I'm just not sure I'll buy it, not for $800. <<

And now you understand why Apple's market share is stagnant. PC clone market is based on price first, everything else secondary.

Apple can't ignore that forever. Eventually they must compete, or die.

Which brings up iPods and clothing (rumors for now) being sold. Easy money with good margins.
 
$800 for a 17" LCD? Not a bad deal a year ago. But with it's low and outdated brightness level, it should be $399 tops. Maybe a 19" for $800 would be nice, but still, nothing too amazing. I guess when I finally buy and LCD it won't be and Apple.
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True, I could buy a 1280 x 960 resolution 17" LCD for $200 less that has higher brightness and contrast levels than Apple's LCDs and a 16ms response time compared with 40ms.

Of course if it's a baby cinema display it's going to look really cool. I'd just prefer it if it was a 19" LCD with a 1536 x 960 resolution for the same price. It would be better on the eyes and It could display standard 320 x 240 or 640 x 480 video with pixel doubling instead of using anti-aliased scaling to fake a 640 x 480 res like a monitor with a 900 pixel width would have to do.
 
Compare like with like

Why is everyone comparing Apple Monitors with the cheapest that they can find? Compare with another style conscience manufacturer ie Sony:

15": $399 - $799
17": $649 - $699
17" Wide: $999
18": $799 - $1699
19": $999
20": $1999
23": $2999

So, let's see if all LCD's are the same, how can Sony have an entire range of 18" LCD that range in price from $799 - $1699? A 20.1" at $1799 looks about right - even better if it's a wide screen! 17" for $799 a bit high if it's the same as the current model, but if it's Wide Screen then a very good price. 23" for $2999 is exactly right. My problem is that there is a huge gap between the 17" for $799 and the 20.1" for $1799. they need something in the middle for those who want more than an iMac display but can't afford $1799.

Just my 2¢
 
Re: Apple Displays & Refresh Rates

Originally posted by porovaara
Apple better up the refresh rates on their monitors or they will still pale in comparison to any of the *cheaper* higher end LCD screens that are already out there. I really don't understand how people can choose an Apple screen over a Formac or equivelant display from Nec/Sharp when the latter two are not only cheaper but have better clarity and refresh times.

Is it just simple ignorance of the LCD market? Or does the style matter that much?
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This brings up an interesting point. All the rumors I've read talk about new screen sizes and enclosures. Now we all understand that size matters :D but has anyone heard anything about refresh rates? I read that the new flat panels from Sharp have 25 millisecond refreshes which eliminates ghosting. It would seem that with the importance Apple places on its video editing capabilities, having the best monitors for video playback would be important. Any thoughts?

Also, a common complaint about the current Apple LCD's is that while they are clear and bright, their enclosures do not make them well suited to take advantage of Apple's dual display technology. The width of the plastic enclosure creates almost 2 inches of plastic between panels when placed side by side. Hopefully Apple will address this as well.

-Eric
 
Adjustment Solution.

What if the new screens were mounted on a "Dumb" imac pedestal.
The arm would be similar or perhaps the same and the base would just be a counter weight.
 
Definitely a style thing...

EVERYBODY here that has an Apple LCD bought it MOSTLY for style and show... I don't care how you try to justify it. I bought it mostly for style too. Anyone buying specifically on specs (and a wee bit of style) would go Formac.

P.S. Dont give me that space saving crap, because it is still cheaper to buy a bigger desk, and if you can fit a television in your house, you can fit a CRT.
 
macwhispers.com is from Jack Campbell (MacTable)

Couldn't help but notice that MacWhispers.com is hosted on Jack Campbell's envestco.com site, just like mactable.com was and dvforge.com is.

All of his previous web page material is gone, including his energy consulting business, OptiCloth, DomainSoup, cardsites.com. etc.

For a refresher:
http://macintouch.com/mactable.html
 
Re: Compare like with like

Originally posted by JBracy
Sony:

15": $399 - $799
17": $649 - $699
17" Wide: $999
18": $799 - $1699
19": $999
20": $1999
23": $2999
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Looks like Apple came up with a better pricing model than I could have imagined!

17": $699
20": $1299
23": $1999

I'll start saving now!
 
Re: Adjustment Solution.

Originally posted by nicmac
What if the new screens were mounted on a "Dumb" imac pedestal.
The arm would be similar or perhaps the same and the base would just be a counter weight.
Click to expand...

And how wide would the dome for the 23" be?:D :rolleyes:
 
L26120A_Displays_DS.pdf has all the info on compatability with the new displays.

I was puzzled over why the 20" LCD had such a strange resolution and didn't just support 1600 x 1024 like the 22" model did, the pdf explains it. The 20" display is OS X only!

That's right, no cool widescreen display for OS 9 users unless they've got the extra cash for a 23" model. At least with the new pricing you can buy 2 17" LCDs for the price of the 20" model.

I've always wanted one of those widescreen monitors though, seen 'em on dark angel, both Brian Transeau and Hans Zimmer have them in their studios and I want one on my desk by the end of the year but I was hoping not to forced to an OS X only existence quite so soon.
 
is there any quantitative information on pixel refresh rates for Apple's LCDs? 'Lightning fast' in the tech specs just doesn't cut it for me.
 
Originally posted by mc68k
is there any quantitative information on pixel refresh rates for Apple's LCDs? 'Lightning fast' in the tech specs just doesn't cut it for me.
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All Apple LCDs have a 40ms pixel response, according to Formac.
 
Originally posted by mtk


All Apple LCDs have a 40ms pixel response, according to Formac.
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Thanks for that link. It's pretty sad that we have to go to Formac to find the specs for Apple.

They updated that pretty quickly.
 
Originally posted by mtk


All Apple LCDs have a 40ms pixel response, according to Formac.
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If this is true that is not good at all. Now it is not unusual to see LCDs with 16-25ms response time...
But I'll wait to see the official specs before making a judgement call on this.

NicoMan
 
Originally posted by NicoMan
If this is true that is not good at all. Now it is not unusual to see LCDs with 16-25ms response time...
But I'll wait to see the official specs before making a judgement call on this.
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The official specs say 'lightning fast'. Unless someone can find out the manufacturer and model, then it's all heresay.

I bet the 20" are better than the 15" 17" and 22", but not better than Formac or some other higher-quality manufactuer.
 
Originally posted by mc68k
is there any quantitative information on pixel refresh rates for Apple's LCDs? 'Lightning fast' in the tech specs just doesn't cut it for me.
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The 23-inch Cinema uses the #LM230W01 panel from LG.Philips and has a manufacturer response time spec of 40ms/typical and 60ms/maximum.

The 20.1-inch Cinema uses the #F8964 IPS panel from Chi Mei Optoelectronics and has a manufacturer response time spec of 26ms/typical and 32ms/maximum.

I don't have a datasheet here on the existing 17-inch holdover Studio Display's panel.

There is a new 23-inch panel coming from Philips in March, the#LM230W02, with (draft) response time specs of 24ms/typical and 36ms/maximum. The mechanical specs are the same as the existing panel, so it's a drop-in swap. It has not yet been designated as Apple-only, but there is no ordering/pricing info being passed down through LG distribution, which indicates that it is a captive OEM product... for who else but Apple?

Edit:

Wow. I just visited Formac's site and saw the comparison chart. Holy moly... where did they get these "specs?" First, the panel Apple is simplifying as a "20 inch" is actually 20.1" diagonally. Second, the refresh rates are dead wrong (see above). Third, all Formac did was clip Apple's conservative published brightness spec of 230 Nits, when it's really 235. Fourth, they've somehow made a binary factor out of the term, "Color Accurate," and accuse Apple of having worse color accuracy that the much-hyped supposed color accuracy of their display. And fifth, where on earth did the spec for "LCD Quality" come from, and who decided that Formac's was "Better," and Apple's was merely, "Good?"

Anyone wanting the spec sheet for the panel used in the 20-inch Apple display merely has to pretend to be a potential OEM buyer, email Chi Mei Optoelectronics at sales@cmo.com.tw, and request the sheet for their panel #F8964 IPS.

*geez* ... ...
 
Originally posted by powerjack


The 23-inch Cinema uses the #LM230W01 panel from LG.Philips and has a manufacturer response time spec of 40ms/typical and 60ms/maximum.
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I was waiting to buy a 23' until I found out the response time, and now finding out that its 40ms I dont think its that great anymore. Yes $1999 is a great price, but 40ms would create to much ghosting.

The thing I dont understand is, I have seen the 23' before and it seemed as though it has a "lightning fast pixel response" as apple claims. Is there anyway to explain how this monitor seems so good, but has a 40ms response time ?

Originally posted by powerjack


There is a new 23-inch panel coming from Philips in March, the#LM230W02, with (draft) response time specs of 24ms/typical and 36ms/maximum. The mechanical specs are the same as the existing panel, so it's a drop-in swap. It has not yet been designated as Apple-only, but there is no ordering/pricing info being passed down through LG distribution, which indicates that it is a captive OEM product... for who else but Apple?
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So does that mean that Apple will update the 23' pannel with this 24ms one ? And would that drive the price up ?
 
Originally posted by zer0army


So does that mean that Apple will update the 23' pannel with this 24ms one ? And would that drive the price up ?
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I'm almost definitely sure that it won't raise the price, because it wouldn't make sense first of all, and Apple doesn't raise prices, they just upgrade and leave prices where they are or add new variations to product lines.
 
What's up with some LCDs having 600:1 contrast ratio??? :confused: :confused:
I don't know if I believe them! Sony's top of the line LCDs have contrast ratios of 350, like Apples.

Also I'd like to see more about Apple response times, 40ms sounds WAY to high, if you can get 16ms else where. I know some manufactures cheat and put only the up time or down time to make it sound better than it is. The normal measurement is for a pixel to go up and down, so 16ms might in fact be 32ms+
 
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