Apple Likely Planning to Use Bigger, Lower Resolution Displays for Cheaper Vision Headset

[knowsuchpeace]

just for some display panel context:
quest 2 = 3.5 million pixels per display, LCD
quest 3 = 4.5 million pixels per display, LCD
rumored apple vision basic = ~5.5 million pixels per display, micro-OLED
avp = 11.5 million pixels per display, micro-OLED

there's a big gap between the LCD contrast ratio, black levels, and pixel density of the micro-OLED displays apple is currently using. there is plenty of room for a middleground there for a base model vision headset.

 

[joecomo]

It’s not a terrible compromise. The larger display will likely yield less barrel distortion and maybe more fov.

ok - I was wondering, why you need a small display. So larger display + Lower density -> similar amount of pixels but more distortion.

What about making the display curved - wouldn't that solve the distortion issues?

 

[thebart]

If it’s tethered to iPhone, could it just be in form factor of glasses, since it doesn’t need all the computing power on device? Probably also a smaller battery. If it turns out to be a AR device instead of VR, it would be interesting.

The AVP needs an external 3100mAh battery and that gets it 2-2.5h use. iPhone 15's battery has about 3300. Let's say optimistically the AV SE only needs half as much power for itself, it'll still kill your phone battery when the phone is doing the all the processing and powering the AV's display and sensors. And you still need your phone for all the phone stuff

More likely, there's still a battery pack that you dock your phone to and the tether line carries both data and power

 

[H.E. Pennypacker]

That’s called having no “vision” of the future. It’s truly a device that shows what’s coming and the only exciting new “innovation” they’ve had in years

You can’t be good at everything. Sometimes it’s not a bad thing to stay within your core competency.

 

[nathansz]

What is a “lot” in the first place? Seems pointless to really go there.

Let’s call a “lot” more than half

It’s not pointless to go there, in the sense that it’s interesting to speculate about just how much this product has failed

Unfortunately we’ll never actually know because Apple will never tell

And 400,000 sold is just barely half of the 750,000 manufactured

So thanks for anchoring my point

 

[knowsuchpeace]

ok - I was wondering, why you need a small display. So larger display + Lower density -> similar amount of pixels but more distortion.

What about making the display curved - wouldn't that solve the distortion issues?

the more dense a display is, the more complicated the lens system needs to be in order to magnify the tinier pixels and to correct for distortion. curving the displays makes it even more difficult to solve for distortions and makes a smaller sweet spot for where the eye ball needs to sit in order to see the whole display clearly

 

[Amazing Iceman]

Can you help me with an example?

Here’s one:

Surgeons embrace Apple Vision Pro for advanced medical procedures

As surgeons in other countries get a chance to work with the Apple Vision Pro, they are seeing it as a revolutionary tool — and a big improvement on previous headsets.

appleinsider.com

eXeX & AdventHealth Surgery Center Innovation Tower Pioneer Use of Apple Vision Pro in Joint Replacement Surgery

/PRNewswire/ -- eXeX, a leader in artificial intelligence enhanced surgical logistics software, has achieved a world first by successfully utilizing the Apple...

www.prnewswire.com

 

[aknabi]

Bummer is I have the quest and the only thing I use it for is table tennis, boxing and VR Golf (with a club attachment)... for these it does really well... I just could use more resolution... that's what AVP brings to the table... Friends have the AVP and for them it's great as an external monitor on the plane or cafe... for that you want more resolution. Also would love to take virtual tours of Ancient Rome, etc and have it feel real... for those you want more resolution... if it's one notch less then you're basically getting the Quest 3... and Apple won't have much to differentiate (plus Meta has the ecosystem advantage)... need to get volume driven cost reduction on that panel (and do the other reductions like the nonsense front display, lighter/lower cost case materials, etc)

 

[spaxxedout]

ok - I was wondering, why you need a small display. So larger display + Lower density -> similar amount of pixels but more distortion.

What about making the display curved - wouldn't that solve the distortion issues?

Something like that. The Vision Pro zooms in on the display whereas the quest 3 zooms out. One would think that the optimal display would be in the middle, but I digress that optical engineering is way over my head. Highly recommend kgontech.com if interested in deep dives.

 

[Amazing Iceman]

Regular VR headsets aren’t particularly expensive anymore so claimaing the dislike is due to “cant afford it” is a lazy, inaccurate argument.

The CyberTruck is bad because it sucks in even mild off-road situations, has multiple compromises due to its design, and it really isn’t a very good truck.

Regular VR Headsets have existed for decades; you could even use your phone for VR using a special $10 case and a hand controller.
The AVP is beyond a Regular VR Headset, completely different category.
Don’t compare a Ford Fiesta with a Porsche.

You may dislike something or say it’s not for you. But to express “hate for this and that” it’s not normal. I’ve only heard little girls say it a lot.

Many people have CyberTrucks and love them... Not my kind of vehicle, it looks like a school project to reproduce the movie Mad Max using thin cans.

 

[Amazing Iceman]

I don’t see VP, under any work scenario, being more efficient or cheaper than a normal workstation and 2 or 3 basic monitors.

If you are looking for basic monitors, Best Buy has them for $200.00 or less.

Another VP productivity example:

CAD App for Apple Vision Pro - Onshape

With the Onshape Vision app for the Apple Vision Pro, product developers can experience immersive design reviews, better training and instruction, explore customization options, and more.

www.onshape.com

 

[Zwhaler]

Tricky premise. The Apple tax will surely make this still triple the price of a quest 3. But with inferior displays to the AVP, how much different will this really be from the Quest? Apple may end up making the competition look really good.

 

[Hajj.david]

"but its limited production capacity of up to 900,000 panels per year"

I think someone is being wildly overoptimistic about sales figures.

Don't forget its two panels per unit so thats like 450k

 

[darngooddesign]

Regular VR Headsets have existed for decades; you could even use your phone for VR using a special $10 case and a hand controller.
The AVP is beyond a Regular VR Headset, completely different category.
Don’t compare a Ford Fiesta with a Porsche.

You may dislike something or say it’s not for you. But to express “hate for this and that” it’s not normal. I’ve only heard little girls say it a lot.

May people have CyberTrucks and love them... Not my kind of vehicle, it looks like a school project to reproduce the movie Mad Max using thin cans.

A couple of things worth mentioning:

You misinterpreted my post.
Your assumption of what I think about Vision Pro is incorrect.
I wasn’t comparing VP to a cheap (for VR) headset.
Owners might like their CyberTruck, but it still sucks at being a pickup truck.

 

[GrayFlannel]

If you are looking for basic monitors, Best Buy has them for $200.00 or less.

We have all we need.

 

[GrayFlannel]

Here’s one:

Surgeons embrace Apple Vision Pro for advanced medical procedures

As surgeons in other countries get a chance to work with the Apple Vision Pro, they are seeing it as a revolutionary tool — and a big improvement on previous headsets.

appleinsider.com

eXeX & AdventHealth Surgery Center Innovation Tower Pioneer Use of Apple Vision Pro in Joint Replacement Surgery

/PRNewswire/ -- eXeX, a leader in artificial intelligence enhanced surgical logistics software, has achieved a world first by successfully utilizing the Apple...

www.prnewswire.com

Yes, I mentioned that one.

 

[mansplains]

As long as it has more pixels than Quest Pro, I won't complain. But the price really needs to be at least 33% what the pro is.

It will certainly be at least 33%, it will be 110%!

 

[kcwookie]

oh really, I thought they were going to use smaller, higher res, more expensive displays for a cheaper device

That's what most people wanted. They wanted a big deal for nothing. I love my AVP and believe I got more than my money's worth.

 

[DeepWebinar]

Don’t compare a Ford Fiesta with a Porsche.

*groan* oh brother 🤦‍♀️

I’ve only heard little girls say it a lot.

*GROAN* oh brotherrrrrrrr 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️

 

[DeepWebinar]

it’s incredible how maladaptive the responses from the AVP ppl are getting on here. idk if living in the content prison is making them testy, but these ppl are really making a case for this not being a product for the normal consumer

 

[SAIRUS]

Apple seriously needs to add support for glasses (yes this is highly technical as eye tracking would need to be adjusted) and knock out the front display.

Then leverage a bluetooth setup for running the display via mobile device. So just push the minimal information to render the AR. The bluetooth pairing can leverage some custom apple chips.

 

[citysnaps]

Let’s call a “lot” more than half

It’s not pointless to go there, in the sense that it’s interesting to speculate about just how much this product has failed

Unfortunately we’ll never actually know because Apple will never tell

And 400,000 sold is just barely half of the 750,000 manufactured

So thanks for anchoring my point

400,000 sold at $3,500= $1.4 Billion in sales. And $652 Million in gross profit margin. All within 5 months of AVP availability.

Not a bad failure.

 

[darngooddesign]

it’s incredible how maladaptive the responses from the AVP ppl are getting on here. idk if living in the content prison is making them testy, but these ppl are really making a case for this not being a product for the normal consumer

This first version is not really for regular consumers. The following versions, especially the less expensive model, will target them.

 

[Rychiar]

You can’t be good at everything. Sometimes it’s not a bad thing to stay within your core competency.

I think the Vision Pro is the best thing they’ve done since the iPhone came out. First thing I’ve found truly exciting and new and still a joy to use months after buying . Nothing else has has the magical wow factor

 

[citysnaps]

I think the Vision Pro is the best thing they’ve done since the iPhone came out. First thing I’ve found truly exciting and new and still a joy to use months after buying . Nothing else has has the magical wow factor

I agree. The potential is huge. Home Depot using AVP to help customers designing kitchens just scratches the surface.