Apple Lowering iTunes Prices in UK

[Nick012]

You do realise that the "extra 40%" is only a notional number don't you? Some things in euroland are marginally cheaper, but not much is actually 40% cheaper like for like than in the UK.

Well, considering dvds tend to be around 30% cheaper. I beg to differ.

 

[elgruga]

It's a start, but until they get European pricing down to the level of the US, I'll not be entirely happy.

99 cents = 51p, plus UK VAT @ 17.5% = 60p. Still a big difference from 74p.

A TAX of 17.5%!!!!!

The UK is NUTS - I suggest borrowing Madame Guillotine from your French neighbours and cleaning up the UK Government.

 

[porky]

Side note: guess those European media folk invited for a live stream must be in for something else... *mysterious* XD[/QUOTE]

Read my lips, it's about the launch of the iPhone in the other European country's! I know i'm right! I hope i'm right!

 

[elgruga]

This just in...

Torrents are still free.

A little iTunes, a little record store, a little LimeWire, some Torrents - throw in a bunch of friends with music you can copy and you have the perfect music cocktail for the working man or woman.

Aint that the truth?

 

[iDeal]

I am just glad that Apple decided to settle this without going through the courts.

If they had fought this tooth and nail and lost, it would have set an ugly legal precedent. Imagine, every single company that sells good/services would be forced to charge the same price across all countries without regard to differences in taxes etc.

That would lead to one of two things:
1: All countries would be forced to pay the highest prices
2: Companies would determine that many products would no longer be price competitive with "in-country" solutions and move out of the market all-together.

Either way, this is a very scary step in the wrong direction. (punishing retailers due to price differences of its' suppliers).

Hickman

I'm afraid I think you are living in cloud cuckoo land. The whole point of the EU is that it is a single market, note that phrase 'Single Market', single indicates one, market indicates a selling place, the EU has regulations in place to ensure that pricing is the same across the EU, for example it should not be cheaper for me to buy a car in France than in Britain, it is not the case. Also the EU seeks to normalize laws and taxes across the EU and to ensure a free market, for example I can drive across all of the continent without border controls, a country, for better or for worse is rendered to a member state. Costs for running companies should be very similar across the EU, are you seriously saying that it costs more to sell music digitally in Britain than in France?

 

[macinfojunkie]

Well, considering dvds tend to be around 30% cheaper. I beg to differ.

Honestly, I'd love to be wrong on this. Where are you getting full english language DVDs from @30% off discounted UK prices. A quick check on Amazon for The Bourne Ultimatum

UK (€ 16,77) (I can get 10% so would be €15,09)
Germany (€ 14,95) (pre-order discount price).
France (not listed!)
Don't even mention Ireland..... DVD prices there make me scream every time I'm there they are so high.

Ok not the most sophisticated of comparisons, but still hardly 30% cheaper in euroland.

Now cars, that's another matter!

 

[JW Pepper]

I think Apple has made a huge mistake here. It should have taken the EU on in the courts. The defence is simple, we (Apple) don't set the prices the record companies do. Apple will work on a margin and probably try to keep the margin the same which reflects he differing prices in different EU countries.

I believe that Apple did not want to go to court as it would have involved disclosure of commercial information, and have thrown down the gauntlet to the record companies instead.

 

[macinfojunkie]

A TAX of 17.5%!!!!!

The UK is NUTS - I suggest borrowing Madame Guillotine from your French neighbours and cleaning up the UK Government.

Someone tried to get rid of that shower in 1605 but failed miserably

 

[coolfactor]

This is the first thing I thought as well.

I would be much more inclined to buy music or video on iTunes if I had a choice of what's available everywhere. It is the 21st century already after-all and the Internet is a world-wide network, not a USA network.

- Most of my favorite TV shows are British, but you can't buy them from Canada.

- My favorite band right now is Swedish, and they have their music for sale on the label site in Sweden in non-DRM mp3's, but it isn't on iTunes, in Canada, the US or the UK.

- Living in Canada, why the f*ck should I have to do a deal with some dodgy eBay'er for an iTunes card so I can buy TV shows from iTunes USA when they are broadcast up here over the air?

If there is one area where Apple is quite a bit *behind* the curve it's internationalisation in general. Most American companies have these same kind of blinders on, but it would be very cool if Apple took the leadership here and became more of a world-wide company than just an American one.

Don't be so quick to judge. There's many other factors than just Apple *choosing* to focus most of its efforts in the US. Licensing is a big influencing factor. It takes many months longer to arrange international distribution rights than it does for local distribution rights. Exporting of [physical] goods across borders is another huge deal. Not simple as the Board of Directors saying "do it". Lots of red tape to cut through.

As a Canadian myself, I wish it was different, but it isn't. I've seen Apple respond to consumer demands, such as lowering Canadian pricing for iTunes Plus tracks... that happened 3 days after I emailed SJ about it. I was blown away they were already working on that.

 

[Matti]

A TAX of 17.5%!!!!!

The UK is NUTS - I suggest borrowing Madame Guillotine from your French neighbours and cleaning up the UK Government.

That's actually very low VAT. (IIRC) UK has the third lowest VAT in EU. In Finland (where I live) it's 21,5%.

Oh and I don't have any need for guillotine. I'm very happy with the things that those taxes allows my goverment to do.

 

[dasein]

So why can't somebody living in the UK buy something from the US iTunes store? What, you're not allowed to do this if you're billing address is not in the US? Even then, you could just buy some US iTunes gift cards on your next trip to the US and use those. No?

It has nothing to do with anything other than governments.

 

[nja247]

5p is 5p and lots of 5ps soon add up. And keeping our own currency? The euro is getting stronger and stronger all the time and at some point in the future, it'll probably match the pound. I could care less whether my money has a £, a € or a $ on it and I certainly don't care who's face is on the back of it.

The pound, what a pain in the arse! The Queen, bless her, but I could get used to not seeing her face if it meant a common currency in Europe.

I hate cash conversion fees, they get you there and then once you're back.

 

[GroundLoop]

I'm afraid I think you are living in cloud cuckoo land. The whole point of the EU is that it is a single market, note that phrase 'Single Market', single indicates one, market indicates a selling place, the EU has regulations in place to ensure that pricing is the same across the EU, for example it should not be cheaper for me to buy a car in France than in Britain, it is not the case. Also the EU seeks to normalize laws and taxes across the EU and to ensure a free market, for example I can drive across all of the continent without border controls, a country, for better or for worse is rendered to a member state. Costs for running companies should be very similar across the EU, are you seriously saying that it costs more to sell music digitally in Britain than in France?

But, as of this point in time, the EU is NOT a unified market. Each member has its own laws, regulations, fees, taxes, etc, etc. Therefore, there will be price differences across the individual members. If the EU can unify and standardize all of this then the prices should be, and likely will be, identical.

By your own words, "the EU seeks to normalize laws and taxes across the EU and to ensure a free market". This, by definition, means that it is not completed. It is you that is not living in reality.

As for different prices in France and Britain with current music, if you believe that the content providers have different wholesale prices in each country, which they are currently legally allowed to do, then yes, I do believe that there are additional costs. Are the taxes exactly the same in the two countries?

There will be price differences until there is a unified world government where all businesses follow the same laws, have the same tax regulations, and have the same currency.

Hickman

 

[moniker]

Just lowering UK prices is not good enough. They should allow purchasing from any EU country. At the moment some Eu countries can't use the service at all.

And they shouldn't force me to use the service in one country only. I mostly work in other EU countries and even have a flat abroad now. I'm still forced to buy from the UK shop.

 

[nja247]

A TAX of 17.5%!!!!!

The UK is NUTS - I suggest borrowing Madame Guillotine from your French neighbours and cleaning up the UK Government.

Interesting, being that the OECD has the UK and Canada just about on par in terms of average income tax (UK slightly more, 2-3%) however Canada having a 6% higher corporate tax compared to the UK.

However, VAT, or sales tax in Canada is lower than in the UK, though not by much (depending on province). While your province may claim to have low sales tax rate, in actuality when you combine Federal (hidden) and Province sales tax, you find that the folks in Prince Edward Island actually pay on average a 15.5% tax, Quebec an average combined tax of 12.875%, Ontario combined at 13%, etc. (It's all on Wikipedia).

Thus, you're that THAT much lower -- unless you're in Alberta with its 5% sales tax.

 

[moniker]

sometimes you just got to love the EU.

there is no reason beyond pure greed why music exec's charge more for music in UK. (normally i'm for free market's where everyone can charge whatever they want. but the music industry is such a mess they deserve a kick in the b*&&)

But in a free market you should certainly be allowed to buy from wherever you like.

 

[samab]

I think you are seeing this too pessimistic. Currently record companies and Apple can point to the mess known as European IP laws. To go further than this would require those laws to be sorted. Just last week Comission gave statement that this is exactly what they plan to do. I think that todays decision is just about stopping companies from exploiting and profiting from current situation.

The problem is that the EC always talk big, but individual European nations will do whatever they want to do --- which is to protect their own little turf.

The EC has no case whatsoever --- there is no anti-trust concern because Apple doesn't have a monopolistic market share in music download. And the record companies are just respecting individual nation's IP laws.

We have already seen how Apple bypassed the simlocking laws by selling unlocked iphones for insanely high price. Why not raise the itunes fees in the rest of Europe to match the high UK price?

 

[nja247]

But in a free market you should certainly be allowed to buy from wherever you like.

This aspect of the market IS NOT liberalised yet, thus there will be differences in prices. We can speculate about tax, etc. (VAT in UK is actually 2.1% LOWER than France btw), but the truth is everyone (any company in operation), including Apple knows it's customary to charge customers in Britain more for goods.

 

[moniker]

The EU is basically forcing buisinesses (in this case Apple) to regulate prices across multiple demographics without consideration to all of the other variables (taxes, licenses, strength of currency, etc) that vary based on the country in which they operate.

Net income less cost of living etc is quite similar in most EU countries. I earn a lot more in the UK than in Spain, for example, but once all my ordinary costs are paid I have about the same amount of money left in my pocket.

And the price of songs is still likely to differ somewhat among countries due to different rates of VAT.

 

[Peel]

Yeah, but how will the record companies prove that the song you have on your iPod was downloaded from the US? Or does Apple somehow detect your physical location and prevent you from downloading if you're not in the US? Just wondering, because it seems strange that a lot of people would not do what I said earlier -- use an US purchased iTunes gift card to pay for downloads from the US iTunes store to a computer located overseas.

Good questions. I'm a US citizen, and will be moving to London in the end of March for a couple years for work. Since I'll keep my US bank cards, and accounts (in addition to the British ones I get once I move), I should still be able to purchase from the US store, and unless they're monitoring IP addresses, they shouldn't be able to tell.

I wonder if they would actually prevent me from purchasing from the UK store then, since my itunes acct was set up in the US - say someone gave me a UK iTunes card as a gift, I may not be able to redeam it.

 

[moniker]

Most of the clothing sold in the UK is made in India and is way cheaper in India and comparatively cheaper in the US as well as compared to the UK. A Pepsi/Coke in the UK is more expensive than the US as well... so is water, so is food, etc. So I guess you don't eat, drink, wear anything?

And a Hasselblad camera, that is manufactured in Sweden, is substantially more expensive in Sweden and the rest of the EU than in the US (comparing net prices here).

 

[theBB]

I wonder if they would actually prevent me from purchasing from the UK store then, since my itunes acct was set up in the US - say someone gave me a UK iTunes card as a gift, I may not be able to redeam it.

I think you'll need to open up a new account on iTunes to purchase from the UK store. You should be able to authorize both accounts on your computer, but still it is a bit of a hassle.

The UK price is actually £949, so the difference is actually about 17.5%.

Is it Apple's fault UK VAT is so high? He is comparing the prices before sales taxes.

 

[nja247]

The problem is that the EC always talk big, but individual European nations will do whatever they want to do --- which is to protect their own little turf.

Well no, because if the area in question has been liberalised (regulated) then the member state must follow EU rules. In this case it has not and thus your comment makes no sense.

The EC has no case whatsoever --- there is no anti-trust concern because Apple doesn't have a monopolistic market share in music download. And the record companies are just respecting individual nation's IP laws.

And? I recall the Commission stating this as well. A complaint and an investigation into that complaint does not equal a "case".

We have already seen how Apple bypassed the simlocking laws by selling unlocked iphones for insanely high price. Why not raise the itunes fees in the rest of Europe to match the high UK price?

Bypassed how exactly? Through compliance, albeit at higher prices? Higher price at point of sale does not mean that the buyer may not actually save money in the long run. Do not under-estimate the amount of savings that can be obtained by having the ability to swap SIMs to avoid international roaming charges. Further those laws had nothing to do with the EU, it was France and Germany specifically.

 

[Matti]

The problem is that the EC always talk big, but individual European nations will do whatever they want to do --- which is to protect their own little turf.

The EC has no case whatsoever --- there is no anti-trust concern because Apple doesn't have a monopolistic market share in music download. And the record companies are just respecting individual nation's IP laws.

EU has done helluva lot for free trade in Europe. Compare Europe pre-Treaty of Rome to Europe today. They have opened up trade in so many areas that it would be pointless to list all here. They will do it to digital music. It might take some time, but it will come. It's better to have this complex Union, than to not have Union at all.

We have already seen how Apple bypassed the simlocking laws by selling unlocked iphones for insanely high price. Why not raise the itunes fees in the rest of Europe to match the high UK price?

Simlocking has nothing to with EU. You are confusing local french law and EU.

Pricing isn't the problem. It's their right as private company. I don't care if Apple charges people living in UK million pounds per song as long as they don't create artificial trade barriers.

I doubt Apple has guts to rise prices in euro-zone to UK level. It's pretty clear that this decision was temporary solution to complex problem and Comission is propably following iTMS very closely.

 

[nja247]

Good questions. I'm a US citizen, and will be moving to London in the end of March for a couple years for work. Since I'll keep my US bank cards, and accounts (in addition to the British ones I get once I move), I should still be able to purchase from the US store, and unless they're monitoring IP addresses, they shouldn't be able to tell.

I wonder if they would actually prevent me from purchasing from the UK store then, since my itunes acct was set up in the US - say someone gave me a UK iTunes card as a gift, I may not be able to redeam it.

Similar situation here. You'll have no issue using your US iTunes in the UK. When I want to buy anything from iTunes, I log out of my UK account and into my US account to save money. Occasionally I'm stuck using the UK account regardless when the US store doesn't have the song I want.