Apple MacBook in May?

[sarcosis]

Before anybody says something, yes I know the new Intel iBooks are going to be called MacBooks.

Imagine this situation in a shop selling Macs:

Buyer: I'm interested in buying a MacBook
Retail Assistant: Sure, which one?
Buyer: (confused) the laptop, I mean...
Retail Assistant: Yes, the normal one or Pro? (Brings out both versions)
Buyer: Now I'm confused!

and

Buyer: I would like to buy a MacBook
Retail Assistant: OK, come this way and choose the specs you'd like on your new Mac (taking the buyer to a row of MacBooks on display)
Buyer: Oh no, sorry, I mean the powerful ones, MacBook Pro
Retail Assistant: Oh no probs, easy mistake there (takes the buyer to the MacBook Pros)


This could bring confusion with people buying their first Mac by telling which is MacBook or MacBook Pro or some simply calling the MBP as MacBook they can't be arsed to say "Pro" though that would really help to differnate both models.

I believe the new Intel iBook should be named differently to MacBook Pro, unlike some people I don't think MBP is named because it is a prosumer laptop so the consumer laptop is MacBook...

I think it is because the MacBook Pro is named in line with the Mac Pro (new name for Power Mac) so I would like the consumer laptop to remain as iBook or iMacBook using the "i" going with iMac. That wouldn't cause problems by saying which MacBook - the normal one or the Pro one.

That's a good point. This problem can be easily solved. If the sales person is doing his job, he should just not be talking orders, he should be qualifiying the user to the machine that would best fit his needs. If that is done, then there shouldn't be any problem. But most people just take orders, so we will see how this goes.

 

[Multimedia]

Steve Did Not Say That

As seen here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lr_ZVgYLAqs

Steve says that upto that point, Intel sales account for 50% of all Mac Sales. Thats shows how popular Apple and the Mac brand is right now. These TV ads, (sadly not in the UK) will answer many peoples questions. Although, i can bet that most people would buy an iMac to replace their own PC because of bootcamp. BUT, i sure do hope these Macbooks come out soon.

Even if its a lowkey event, It wont matter much, because people will buy them regardless.

Thanks for the link to those historic videos. Unfortunately that is not what Steve said. He said that they had completed converting 50% of the line to Intel - iMac, 15" MBP and now mini in 60 days. Next comes 17" MBP, iBooks then PowerMacs. That's what he said - not that the Intel Macs accounted for 50% of sales.

 

[AidenShaw]

Wait for the Conroe mini-towers coming in July

Therefore, there is no point in launching a machine that will: 1) almost kill the need for a MacMini; 2) kill the clear need for an iMac.

These arguments amuse me to no end....

Why wouldn't Apple try to sell as many computers as possible?

If there's a form factor that people prefer to what Apple is making now, why wouldn't Apple jump on the chance to increase their market share?

Apple's quarterly reports say "X Macs shipped", so if X can be made bigger, isn't that good?

Why would any company ignore potential sales in order to keep up sales volumes on computers that people know are compromises?

Wait until July, when for the price of a 1.66 GHz MiniMacIntel you can get a Dell or HP mini-tower with a dual-core 2.66 GHz Conroe, a 250 GB standard disk, a PCIe x16 graphics slot, room for additional optical or hard disks, spare PCI/PCIe slots, 8 GiB of *standard* RAM.... (not 8 GiB standard, but using cheap high volume DDR2 DIMMs, not the more expensive laptop SO-DIMMs)

Tell me in July that people should buy the $2700 Woodcrest-based PowerMac, not the $800 Dell.... Or that Apple is doing the right thing by sticking to its legacy model strategy.

 

[Multimedia]

Right On Alden!

These arguments amuse me to no end....

Why wouldn't Apple try to sell as many computers as possible?

If there's a form factor that people prefer to what Apple is making now, why wouldn't Apple jump on the chance to increase their market share?

Apple's quarterly reports say "X Macs shipped", so if X can be made bigger, isn't that good?

Why would any company ignore potential sales in order to keep up sales volumes on computers that people know are compromises?

Wait until July, when for the price of a 1.66 GHz MiniMacIntel you can get a Dell or HP mini-tower with a dual-core 2.66 GHz Conroe, a 250 GB standard disk, a PCIe x16 graphics slot, room for additional optical or hard disks, spare PCI/PCIe slots, 8 GiB of *standard* RAM.... (not 8 GiB standard, but using cheap high volume DDR2 DIMMs, not the more expensive laptop SO-DIMMs)

Tell me in July that people should buy the $2700 Woodcrest-based PowerMac, not the $800 Dell.... Or that Apple is doing the right thing by sticking to its legacy model strategy.

Bravo and I'll second that. Right now it does appear that Apple is behaiving in a clingy kind of way to the OLD-THINK instead of DIFFERENT-THINK. I do hope they snap out of it when, as you are fond of reminding us, they will be surrounded by radically cheaper alternative Intel processor computers. Going to be a lot harder for a customer to spend a lot more for a Mac that may only be marginally faster with the only differentiation being style and OS X.

 

[yadmonkey]

They're going to keep the iBook name. There might be some macbook 13" too, but they're going to keep iBook for the consumer notebook. Mark my words, or I'll eat something gross or something.

I'm marking your words!

Steve Jobs said in a recent interview that he wanted to have the name Mac in every computer they sell. That's part of why they re-branded the Powerbook. I think it'll just be the Macbook and the Macbook Pro instead of iBook and Powerbook.

 

[AidenShaw]

Bravo and I'll second that.
...
Going to be a lot harder for a customer to spend a lot more for a Mac that may only be marginally faster with the only differentiation being style and OS X.

Thanks.

But where does the "marginally faster" assumption come from?

With all the parts coming from the same bin, "marginally slower" is just as reasonable.

 

[peharri]

Peharri, if the answers were so obvious in your favor, Apple would've released one already...fact is, a non-AIO MidMac goes DIRECTLY against the margins presented by the iMac (or low-end MBs, for that matter).

I don't know why Apple hasn't released one, but I'm bewildered that you continue to claim, without justification, that the iMac and a mid-range headless Mac would occupy the same market.

People who want an AIO want AIOs. People who want headless Macs want headless. You don't want one and settle for the other. People who can't get iMacs might get Macbooks, but they certainly wouldn't want towers.

That's a fact. That's why *I'm* not buying a Mac any time soon. I actually want one, but Apple doesn't offer one that suits my needs. The PowerMac is too expensive, and arguably obsolete. The Mac mini is too underpowered. There is no Mac in the middle. The iMac is not an option, it is not a headless Mac, it wouldn't work.

Apple may agree with you, but they're wrong if they do. I know, personally, they're missing out on sales because of this. They simply do not have machines lined up for certain major markets. End of story. And your total lack of justification means I continue to be BEWILDERED that people think a mid-range headless Mac would compete with the AIO iMac. There is no justification for such a claim. If there was, people who claim this would explain it.

 

[milatchi]

I for one welcome our new MacBook overlords.

 

[vccavtech]

i know a little secrete

a friend of mine has a friend at the mac store who says they will be out by may 19th. i know that it makes it sound more like a rumor when i didn't hear about it myself, but i trust this guy.

 

[ImAlwaysRight]

Before anybody says something, yes I know the new Intel iBooks are going to be called MacBooks.

Imagine this situation in a shop selling Macs:

Buyer: I'm interested in buying a MacBook
Retail Assistant: Sure, which one?
Buyer: (confused) the laptop, I mean...
Retail Assistant: Yes, the normal one or Pro? (Brings out both versions)
Buyer: Now I'm confused!

and

Buyer: I would like to buy a MacBook
Retail Assistant: OK, come this way and choose the specs you'd like on your new Mac (taking the buyer to a row of MacBooks on display)
Buyer: Oh no, sorry, I mean the powerful ones, MacBook Pro
Retail Assistant: Oh no probs, easy mistake there (takes the buyer to the MacBook Pros)


This could bring confusion with people buying their first Mac by telling which is MacBook or MacBook Pro or some simply calling the MBP as MacBook they can't be arsed to say "Pro" though that would really help to differnate both models.

I believe the new Intel iBook should be named differently to MacBook Pro, unlike some people I don't think MBP is named because it is a prosumer laptop so the consumer laptop is MacBook...

I think it is because the MacBook Pro is named in line with the Mac Pro (new name for Power Mac) so I would like the consumer laptop to remain as iBook or iMacBook using the "i" going with iMac. That wouldn't cause problems by saying which MacBook - the normal one or the Pro one.

I don't really see the issue with the two names MacBook/MacBook Pro. I seriously doubt someone will confuse the two once it comes down screen size and, more importantly, total price. If someone really is confused about the models, that's what the sales people are for anyway.

a friend of mine has a friend at the mac store who says they will be out by may 19th. i know that it makes it sound more like a rumor when i didn't hear about it myself, but i trust this guy.

It's been mentioned many times before, but Apple Store employees know absolutely nothing when it comes to new models coming out. Once when I was in for a computer repair, I talked to the senior manager about rumored products, and he told me even he doesn't know when new products are coming out. I suppose that is why Apple generally releases new products on a Tuesday -- so they can time deliveries for Monday for the managers to get new products ready after close on Monday for the store opening Tuesday morning, and keep rumors to a minimum. If you've ever noticed, often full specs are published to rumor sites the day before release. That's because with all the retail locations, some employee is bound to end up an "anonymous source."

It's good that your friend's friend even knows about the MacBooks, though. That means s/he probably keeps up with sites like this one. Most Apple Store employees are pretty clueless if you ever try to hold a conversation with them about rumored, soon-to-be-released products. I've had more than one blank stare when bringing rumored products up in conversation with them, so much so that I don't even bother mentioning it anymore.

 

[aswitcher]

Wait until July, when for the price of a 1.66 GHz MiniMacIntel you can get a Dell or HP mini-tower with a dual-core 2.66 GHz Conroe, a 250 GB standard disk, a PCIe x16 graphics slot, room for additional optical or hard disks, spare PCI/PCIe slots, 8 GiB of *standard* RAM.... (not 8 GiB standard, but using cheap high volume DDR2 DIMMs, not the more expensive laptop SO-DIMMs)

Tell me in July that people should buy the $2700 Woodcrest-based PowerMac, not the $800 Dell.... Or that Apple is doing the right thing by sticking to its legacy model strategy.

Such a machine be a near perfect next Mac for me. I want the grunt of an iMac (or even grunter) without the screen and with a bit more flexibility. Macmini dont cut it but a Mac made of full sized cheaper PC parts would...

 

[50548]

These arguments amuse me to no end....

Why wouldn't Apple try to sell as many computers as possible?

If there's a form factor that people prefer to what Apple is making now, why wouldn't Apple jump on the chance to increase their market share?

Apple's quarterly reports say "X Macs shipped", so if X can be made bigger, isn't that good?

Why would any company ignore potential sales in order to keep up sales volumes on computers that people know are compromises?

Wait until July, when for the price of a 1.66 GHz MiniMacIntel you can get a Dell or HP mini-tower with a dual-core 2.66 GHz Conroe, a 250 GB standard disk, a PCIe x16 graphics slot, room for additional optical or hard disks, spare PCI/PCIe slots, 8 GiB of *standard* RAM.... (not 8 GiB standard, but using cheap high volume DDR2 DIMMs, not the more expensive laptop SO-DIMMs)

Tell me in July that people should buy the $2700 Woodcrest-based PowerMac, not the $800 Dell.... Or that Apple is doing the right thing by sticking to its legacy model strategy.

Well, you must have been amused since...forever then, because that's Apple's business model for ages. You make three very basic mistakes in your assumptions:

1) Apple has NEVER cared about number of Macs shipped, or overall market share...it's about return of investment to its shareholders and profitability. Luckily, with the iPod and the Halo effect, we are able to see a gradual growth in market share, and this IS good PROVIDED Apple's desired margins are kept.

Does that happen now? Yes. Will it happen with your daydreamed mini-Tower? Not necessarily, and Apple is FULLY aware of that.

2) Second basic mistake: you keep on assuming that your opinion (and of a few others in MR) represents the will of the market.

I, for one, couldn't care less about a damn mini-Tower. I don't wanna buy a new monitor, I don't wanna mess with connections and cables, I don't need expansion slots as my iMac already gives me EVERYTHING I need.

I want a clear computing solution, and there is NO comparable offer to the iMac in the ordinary PC/Winblows market. And that's why you see iMacs flying off the shelves. Their price is WONDERFUL and the set of features incomparable to the rest.

3) If you just wanna talk about price, keep buying a beloved Dell, ma boy. Apple's line-up is ALREADY competitive enough to fight for the mid-range PC market, and we all know you can buy a crappy machine for 399 at Wal-Mart or Aldi...does it run OS X? Does it have iLife? Does it carry the design and quality of an Apple? Never.

Be assured that a MacPro woodcrest will blow the doors away of most PCs in the same range; but for those on a budget, why not buy a beige box? 1% of market share increase for Apple already means billions more...it doesn't need a cutthroat fight for low prices.

In addition, your flawed assumption also presumes that the MacMini will stand still in space and time, receiving no updates until your vapor Dell/HP towers come to the market. As you said in previous posts, the Conroes Dell will receive ARE the Conroes Apple will receive, at the same time if not sooner. As for the rest of your specs, the only "advantage" to the PC tower is the presence of a PCI slot...but again, MOST consumers don't even know what it's for...they don't need it.

 

[monkeyandy]

Macbook Tuesday! May 9th!

LoopRumors think that new MacBooks could be out next Tuesday. Check out the following link:

http://looprumors.com/index.php?macbooks-tuesday

I hope its true!

 

[longsilver]

iMac Update?

I'm looking forward to seeing the spec on what will, I agree, most probably be called the Macbook. I do wonder whether we might see some minor upgrades to the iMac as well - anyone heard anything on that front?

What makes me particularly curious is the fact that the Apple UK online refurb store is selling the iMac 17" 1.83GHz Intel Core Duo /512 /160 /SD /ATIX1600-128MB /BT /AP at a 16% discount and the iMac 20" 2GHz Intel Core Duo /512 /250 /SD /ATIX1600-128MB /BT /AP at a 15% discount. Neither is listed as a "Refurb" model.

Are these models appearing on any other refurb stores? Is this just a one-off or an attempt to shift some inventory in anticipation of a speed-bump?

 

[Coyote2006]

I expect something like this:

http://www.asus.com/products4.aspx?l1=5&l2=26&l3=0&model=1067&modelmenu=1

 

[vccavtech]

LoopRumors think that new MacBooks could be out next Tuesday. Check out the following link:

http://looprumors.com/index.php?macbooks-tuesday

I hope its true!

I think they mean that the apple store people find out tuesday, but dont get to release them till the 19th

 

[peharri]

LoopRumors think that new MacBooks could be out next Tuesday. Check out the following link:

http://looprumors.com/index.php?macbooks-tuesday

I hope its true!

I'm not seeing anything that might qualify as a launch event for the machine on that day, so I'm going to say no on this one. How do they know they're Macbooks anyway? There's almost certainly an upgraded MBP in the pipeline because the 17" is kicking the 15"'s rear at the moment, to give one example of something we know is going to happen. I'm not saying it's the new 15" MBP, it might be an upgraded iPod nano, a set of 5.1 speakers, or a whole bunch of other things that wouldn't merit a launch event, assuming there's any truth to the rumor to begin with.

No launch event = no MacBook.

Be patient... it's coming, it's just not here yet. All the pieces have to fall in place first.

 

[AidenShaw]

2) Second basic mistake: you keep on assuming that your opinion (and of a few others in MR) represents the will of the market.

I, for one, couldn't care less about a damn mini-Tower. I don't wanna buy a new monitor, I don't wanna mess with connections and cables, I don't need expansion slots as my iMac already gives me EVERYTHING I need.

Then you and people like you will continue to buy iMacs, and any mini-tower sales are just additional profit to return to the shareholders.

But, it seems like I'm not the only one who assumes that his own opinion is the "will of the market".

Be assured that a MacPro woodcrest will blow the doors away of most PCs in the same range...

If "door blowing" means performance, I'm actually quite assured that an Apple Woodcrest will perform exactly the same as an HP Woodcrest - subject to obvious external component choices. The CPU, chipset, memory, disk controller, network, ... will be the same.

For example, put a 10K RPM Raptor in one and a 7.2K RPM disk in the other, and run a disk benchmark. The one with the Raptor (be it Apple or HP) will almost certainly win.

Edit: Whether OSX is faster or slower than XP on the Mac Pro Woodcrest is a different question.​

The Apple will probably have a more elegant, more expensive case. The appearance of the case is rather minor in my purchasing decision, however. A tower lives in the shadows under the desk. I don't want to give up the space on the desk, and no matter how quiet the fans may be they're quieter on the floor.

I'd rather have room for extra disks, optical drives, easy opening - than "pretty".

In addition, your flawed assumption also presumes that the MacMini will stand still in space and time, receiving no updates until your vapor Dell/HP towers come to the market. As you said in previous posts, the Conroes Dell will receive ARE the Conroes Apple will receive, at the same time if not sooner.

Well, everyone already has Conroes - the manufacturers have samples, and prototype units can be seen in the wild. Just Yahoo! for "conroe benchmarks" and tell me that they are vapor....

As for the rest of your specs, the only "advantage" to the PC tower is the presence of a PCI slot...but again, MOST consumers don't even know what it's for...they don't need it.

Actually, the advantages of a mini-tower over the mini are:

• PCIe slots, as you say
• Upgradeable PCIe graphics slot (in addition to the integrated graphics - it's possible to have both)
• Standard DDR2 DIMMs, not laptop SO-DIMMs (cheaper per GiB)
• Standard 3.5" SATA disks (up to 750 GB per disk)
• Space for 2nd optical/hard disk (or more)
• Much better cooling
• Conroe possible in mini-tower, mini would have trouble cooling a Conroe (Conroe's TDP is 65 watts, vs 35 watts for Merom)

Perhaps "Aiden's mini-tower" will actually be a pizza-box or a convertible (many mini-towers can be placed horizontally or vertically).

It may be the Apple MCE (Media Center Edition), in a form-factor the same width as a standard audio or video component.

The mini can't be a true MCE, the disks are far too small and it would be very difficult to get several TV tuners and the requisite array of connectors into it.

A mini-tower or pizza box, on the other hand, could easily have 1.5 TB of disk space and a PCIe tuner card - with plenty of room for connections. The consumer may not know or care what a PCIe slot is - but she'll certainly appreciate the ability to have the TV tuner in an MCE.

Plus, a pizza box could be styled like other video components - I wouldn't want an odd white plastic box in my component stack, that would be ugly.

 

[840quadra]

I have to agree with AS on many points, and want to add a couple more.

The only way that any new Intel Macintosh computer would be faster when compared to others in the market, would be for one of the following reasons.

1. The Apple computer being compared to a similar HP, Dell, or other, came with better quality internal components that offer marginal improvements over the competition of the time.

2. The software being run on the Macintosh runs better on BSD based OS X as compared to the same software being run on Windows. This could possibly be the only reason that some software is faster on a Mac, when compared to Windows systems running on similar Intel hardware.

The only things that will make Apple hardware stand out when compared to the competition, will be the software that can run on their OS, and the OS itself. This has been a part of the equation even back in the 100% PowerPC days, and is nothing new.


And for the record, this reply came from an Apple Computer fan, with 90% Apple hardware in his home.

 

[AidenShaw]

2. The software being run on the Macintosh runs better on BSD based OS X as compared to the same software being run on Windows.

This could possibly be the only reason that some software is faster on a Mac, when compared to Windows systems running on similar Intel hardware.

Or slower - such as the claimed problems that OSX has with regards to handling thread scheduling.

My "exactly" the same was a hardware-to-hardware comparison, assuming that the same software runs on both.

Once you start comparing two different operating systems, even with the "same" application, the picture will be less clear.

The choice of compiler and compiler options can make a huge difference. In general, Microsoft's Visual Studio will generate better code than gcc - but one might find that the app on the Apple is compiled for SSE3 optimization, whereas the Windows app might be MMX.

The post I was replying to said

"a MacPro woodcrest will blow the doors away of most PCs in the same range"​

Had the claim been

"OSX on a MacPro woodcrest will blow the doors away of most Woodcrest Windows PCs in the same range"​

the story would have been different.

In the end, it'll be a "win some, lose some" situation.

By the way, as far as "unix underpinnings" goes - that's probably not going to be important. It certainly hasn't proven to be important for Windows vs. Linux -- there's no clear performance advantage across the board for either one.