Apple, Microsoft on Windows on Mac; Benchmarks

[GregA2]

Never used Windows XP pro that much...but I've used Win98SE to know it will die on you.

That's like saying, "I haven't tried off-roading in an F-150, but I know my Civic can't handle it."

(another car analogy- my bad....)

 

[ITR 81]

Come on, judging Windows XP bad because how windows 98 performed is like me saying OSX sucks because when I ran OS 8.1 I had to turned off my iMac by unplugging it more than shutting it down because it locked up so much. That was nearly 8 years ago!

When I say I haven't worked with XP Pro much...I mean I only worked with it in Mil. environment for approx. 3 yrs
I use to fix all the XP pro laptops and desktops in our unit.
We also ran OSX and Linux and we had less issues with OSX and Linux machines then XP...aka didn't die as much.
I don't think I said XP was bad but it's not much better then 98SE or NT.
But it should since it's basically a user friendly NT machine.
Vista reminds me alot of ME....eh..
Either way I've worked with alot of computers..about 20yrs working with Windows/Macs/Unix

Final judgement will come when Vista and Leo is released.

 

[ITR 81]

That's like saying, "I haven't tried off-roading in an F-150, but I know my Civic can't handle it."

(another car analogy- my bad....)

I don't think 3 yrs working with an OS is much time with it.
You need 4-5+ yrs to figure out an OS's in's and out's.

I doubt a reg. F150 would be able to handle off-roading either well..unless it's 4wd and has the off-road package.

A civic can go off road..but I'm only talking about dirt roads and such.
You probably could rally it if you set the sus up for it and give it some dirt gripping tyres.

 

[dornoforpyros]

"Windows is a great operating system," a Microsoft statement said. "We're pleased that Apple customers are excited about running it, and that Apple is responding to meet the demand."

Given the reaction to boot camp around here on MR I'd say this is a true statement.

 

[rish]

Bench marks

Guy's and Gals, regardless of what the bench marks say I ain't ever going to load up Windows nor do I really care whether at this stage its quicker.

My hard earned cash won't be going to old Bill and his pals in Redmond no sirree. I'm buying Mac and thats that regardless of bench marks.

As for tons of people would buy a Mac if it was the same price as a PC. Well lets think about this for a moment. A Mac will work right out of a box, you've got all these fantastic apps that work. Unlike an unfortunate person I know who bought a laptop with Windows XP Home edition installed on it thinking they had the entire suite of Microsoft apps. That putts now has to fork out a few hundred pounds just to get all the MS Office apps. All of a sudden that cheap laptop/pc is not so cheap after all. They will also have to purchase some decent antivirus software that will extensively protect their new machine from spyware/malware etc that will cost up to double figures at the least. So all of a sudden you find that the price is going up and that bargain no longer seems like one anymore. In fact I'll say that the poor git wishes the earth swallows them up before having to admit that they made a significant mistake.

Purchasing a Mac is value for money and with that you get a beautifully designed machine that you can actually enjoy using. I put up a question to my work colleagues today and asked how many of them could honestly say that they enjoy using their PC's at work. You know the response was not so surprising. None of them enjoyed using their machines and I think given a real choice they would turn their backs on Windows because it was nothing short of dull.

So with MS' announcement today that they are pleased that Mac owners will get use their OS and they think its good is nothing but absolute delusion. Even a hardened Windows person would have to admit the apparent truth, that MS could be further from the truth.

I'm making it my personal goal to ensure that every Windows user I come across switches even if they (for insecure reasons) want to run Windows OS on a mac. Train them on MAC OSX and get them off Windows, its the only way they'll see.

So people feel the fear as they say and do it punch it out there. This is an opportunity not a threat.

 

[Chrispy]

No nonsense at all. Here's why I haven't gotten any viruses the past years:

- I don't surf less reputable porn sites
- I don't download pirated software
- I don't open strange e-mail attachments

Pretty much the only way I can get a virus is if it infects the computer just by being connected to the net. This is what happened when I got the Blaster worm. I also mentioned this in my previous post.

I just ran a full virus scan and scanned for spyware using adaware and spybot on my system and it came up clean. Not one thing was found. Mikael is correct in pointing out some simple rules to follow that will keep your computer safe. Running behind a hardware router makes life on the PC side even safer yet. When the blaster virus came around I was spared for this reason. Again, I'm not trying to be a troll here but I just want to make sure both sides are heard. I love macs and when the intel iBooks come out I may snag one if the price is right. However, I also see windows as a functional, productive and imporving operating system. It has come a long way since Windows 98. Adding 64 bit capability to the core (granted a little late in the game) is helping Windows get where it should have been years ago. My biggest gripe with windows is that it is ugly

 

[dpaanlka]

I think Microsoft is confusing the fact that some software only runs on Windows as meaning Windows itself is a great OS.

Mac users, let us not forget we have great software that doesn't run on Windows.

For starters:

• the entire Final Cut Studio
• iMovie, iPhoto, Garageband
• iWork, Keynote

 

[Evangelion]

I don't think I was whining. I was just stating what MS said.

Maybe they are being honest (for once)? I mean, Apple says that OS X requires 256MB of RAM. Would anyone here run OS X with 256MB of RAM ?

Vista will need atleast 1GB to run and play a game or two.

I don't think so. If the game doesn't need 1GB of RAM, it will work just fine with less RAM.

 

[dpaanlka]

I just ran a full virus scan and scanned for spyware using adaware and spybot on my system and it came up clean.

Because you are actively keeping your system secure doesn't mean that Windows is secure. How can you explain all of the people that you see every day with tons of viruses and crap?

The point is we (still) don't have to keep watching out for Viruses. We can download all the illegal stuff we want, look at all the porn we want, and open all the emails we want and not worry about anything.

In conclusion: we should'nt be required to constantly and actively keep our systems secure as part of daily computer use

Saying otherwise is just making excuses.

 

[Chrispy]

Because you are actively keeping your system secure doesn't mean that Windows is secure. How can you explain all of the people that you see every day with tons of viruses and crap?

The point is we (still) don't have to keep watching out for Viruses. We can download all the illegal stuff we want, look at all the porn we want, and open all the emails we want and not worry about anything.

In conclusion: we should'nt be required to constantly and actively keep our systems secure as part of daily computer use

Saying otherwise is just making excuses.

That is a fair statement and you will get no argument from me there. However, I would hope mac users do practice some safe computing habits. Just because you are invincible today does not mean in the future you won't get burned. But yes, you can be "more free" with you computing habits on a mac

 

[dpaanlka]

Well good, just so long as we agree then.

I just get irritated by the argument PC geeks always give me of "Windows doesn't suck, see I have no viruses..."

BTW: yes, in the future we "may" have some viruses... but they've been saying that for six years now and it still hasnt happened yet.

 

[longofest]

Because you are actively keeping your system secure doesn't mean that Windows is secure. How can you explain all of the people that you see every day with tons of viruses and crap?

The point is we (still) don't have to keep watching out for Viruses. We can download all the illegal stuff we want, look at all the porn we want, and open all the emails we want and not worry about anything.

In conclusion: we should'nt be required to constantly and actively keep our systems secure as part of daily computer use

Saying otherwise is just making excuses.

I use windows at work and as a gaming computer at home (it is accompanied by 3 macs at home). I have not gotten a virus on any of these computers in about 3 years. Spyware scans occasionally picks up some malicious cookie or a low-level threat or two, but in general they stay clean.

The reason for this is because a) I don't go to suspect websites, and b) I keep all auto-update functionality running and keep the systems patched.

Your notion of "we should'nt be required to constantly and actively keep our systems secure as part of daily computer use" is as stupid as saying "I shouldn't be required to maintain or lock my car in order for it to not break or get hijacked."

I'm not making excuses for any company here. Microsoft is a huge target for a heck of a lot of malicious coders, so yes they have more actual exploitations in the field. However, that does not exclude the fact that our beloved Mac OS X has had many more security vulnerabilities discovered over the past few years (especially critical ones), even if they haven't been exploited to their full potential.

I'm not putting out FUD here... I'm just trying to keep us Mac users honest. Especially as our market share grows, getting over-confident is very dangerous. We all have to remember to use basic security principles in our daily lives, whether we are on Mac or XP.

 

[Chrispy]

Well good, just so long as we agree then.

I just get irritated by the argument PC geeks always give me of "Windows doesn't suck, see I have no viruses..."

BTW: yes, in the future we "may" have some viruses... but they've been saying that for six years now and it still hasnt happened yet.

Haha I see what you mean. I was not trying to say windows is better by any means. I just wanted to point out that it was getting better as time passes. OSX is still clearly the easier to use OS by far

 

[Counter]

I think Microsoft is confusing the fact that some software only runs on Windows as meaning Windows itself is a great OS.

Mac users, let us not forget we have great software that doesn't run on Windows.

For starters:

• the entire Final Cut Studio
• iMovie, iPhoto, Garageband
• iWork, Keynote

Microsoft aren't confusing any facts with that statement.

Facts come second or third when it comes to business.

Think about the perfect (read: pro windows) statement they could release on hearing of BootCamp coming out.

That was it.

They were hardly going to word a response which was inline with Apples reasons of releasing BootCamp.

Apple: BootCamp is to get users to switch
Microsoft: We praise Apple for meeting the enormous demand of their user base for a better operating system.

Okay, so it wasn't that extreme. But they want to word it as close to that as they can get away with.

This is business.

 

[shigzeo]

haha, right

That's like saying, "I haven't tried off-roading in an F-150, but I know my Civic can't handle it."

(another car analogy- my bad....)

i am sure that a ford f150 is an american truck, so your analogy is great. windows 98 was the os that ran on a thread of silk while trying to suspend a bridge. xp is another machine. it is great i think. i prefer osx, but xp has its advantages and i must agree, it is no civic. though, if an f150 is a truck, id never buy it!

cheers

 

[dpaanlka]

Your notion of "we should'nt be required to constantly and actively keep our systems secure as part of daily computer use" is as stupid as saying "I shouldn't be required to maintain or lock my car in order for it to not break or get hijacked."

Thats a terrible anology. I prevent my computer from getting stolen by locking my bedroom door. When a piece of my hardware breaks, I replace it (maintain it).

If a car's ECU was capeable of getting a demobilizing and corruptive virus (rather easily mind you) every single one of that particular make and model would be recalled, and there would be a huge public inquiry into what was done wrong. The carmaker would have to release public apologese and fix every example for free, and offer compensation.

Could you imagine Microsoft or any PC maker doing that?

 

[Mikael]

I just get irritated by the argument PC geeks always give me of "Windows doesn't suck, see I have no viruses..."

Guess I'm one of those geeks, huh? Anyway, I already told you that I wasn't implying that Windows is a secure OS. I was merely pointing out that the pitfalls are easy to avoid. I don't feel the need to pirate software and what not and because of this I have had an extremely pleasant Windows experience the past decade. Those three "rules" I wrote in my previous post might also be useful for Mac users that want to run Windows occassionally.

Going slightly back on topic, I might also mention that the fact that Macs can now run Windows is extremely important to me, since I run programs that are not available on Mac.

 

[dpaanlka]

I was merely pointing out that the pitfalls are easy to avoid. I don't feel the need to pirate software and what not

So then what about aunts and grandmas that also get viruses? Are they downloading illegal software and looking at porn too?

Still just making excuses based on your own experiences, which seem a far cry from what appears to be a majority of PC users.

 

[shigzeo]

not a car key, a virus

I use windows at work and as a gaming computer at home (it is accompanied by 3 macs at home). I have not gotten a virus on any of these computers in about 3 years. Spyware scans occasionally picks up some malicious cookie or a low-level threat or two, but in general they stay clean.

The reason for this is because a) I don't go to suspect websites, and b) I keep all auto-update functionality running and keep the systems patched.

Your notion of "we should'nt be required to constantly and actively keep our systems secure as part of daily computer use" is as stupid as saying "I shouldn't be required to maintain or lock my car in order for it to not break or get hijacked."

I'm not making excuses for any company here. Microsoft is a huge target for a heck of a lot of malicious coders, so yes they have more actual exploitations in the field. However, that does not exclude the fact that our beloved Mac OS X has had many more security vulnerabilities discovered over the past few years (especially critical ones), even if they haven't been exploited to their full potential.

I'm not putting out FUD here... I'm just trying to keep us Mac users honest. Especially as our market share grows, getting over-confident is very dangerous. We all have to remember to use basic security principles in our daily lives, whether we are on Mac or XP.

i just must agree here so completely. osx is as safe as a person on a deserted island and has been so for yonks when considering viruses. windows has been the london onto which the dreaded virus of "sean of the dead" was unleashed. those zombies may not yet be on the desert island, but rest assured they will be. we have had many many threatening files and warnings of late in our osx, we need to be vigilant. just like our bodies being susceptible, and some more than others, we need to vaccinate, exercise reguarly and keep a watch on our computing diets. if we do open up strange jpeg files and go to certain sites, osx will be connected to london by an enlarging land bridge; that is the day that i must learn to swim.

 

[knewsom]

yep, I'm happy - here's why.

FINALLY FINALLY FINALLY I can play Total War and all the other PC games that I've been missing out on for bleeding YEARS, not the least of which being the new DnD online game! YES!

As the Mac OS grows in popularity (and it will - for a variety of reasons), the demand for NATIVE games will increase. As that happens, the NUMBER of native games will increase. Thing is, it'll take years for this to happen, and it'll probably also take the Mac OS releasing liscense to other computer manufacturers before this will happen, but in the meantime, I can run games in Windoze, and do everything else in my beloved Tiger.

...personally, I can't WAIT for that to happen, I'd LOVE to run Final Cut Pro on a 17" Alienware laptop with a built in RAID-0. Sweeeeet.

 

[whocares]

Something is wrong here. Windows is outperforming OS X on almost every test. Especially the second one. How does Windows do better than a Mac in PHOTOSHOP? And how is it that the Intel Mac was half as fast as the PPC Mac? I don't understand this at all.

Don't care too much for numbers... All I konw is that my 3+ years old G3 iBook with 10.3 feels much snappier than my (work) top of the line vaio laptop running some variant of Windows. It's so surprise I think I should have the SONY checked by IT dept.

 

[dpaanlka]

i just must agree here so completely. osx is as safe as a person on a deserted island

sigh... we've been hearing this for years... almost as often as "Apple will be bankrupt by years end"

i dont fully believe this argument works

 

[whocares]

Who runs 20-25 apps at once? Seriously?

I do:

  PID  TT  STAT      TIME COMMAND
    1  ??  Ss     0:00.00 /sbin/init 
    2  ??  Ss     0:00.60 /sbin/mach_init 
   82  ??  Ss     0:00.17 /usr/sbin/syslogd -s -m 0
   88  ??  Ss     0:03.57 kextd
   90  ??  Ss     0:05.94 /usr/sbin/configd
   91  ??  Ss     0:00.36 /usr/sbin/diskarbitrationd
   96  ??  Ss     0:01.12 /usr/sbin/notifyd
  121  ??  Ss     0:02.87 netinfod -s local
  123  ??  Ss     0:08.32 update
  126  ??  Ss     0:00.00 dynamic_pager -F /private/var/vm/swapfile
  146  ??  Ss     0:00.01 /usr/sbin/KernelEventAgent
  147  ??  Ss     0:00.08 cron
  153  ??  Ss     0:00.00 /Library/StartupItems/Tablet/TabletDriverRelauncher
  159  ??  Ss     0:01.17 /System/Library/CoreServices/coreservicesd
  160  ??  S      0:00.02 /usr/libexec/ioupsd
  161  ??  Ss     0:00.82 /usr/sbin/distnoted
  165  ??  Ss     0:00.88 /usr/sbin/mDNSResponder
  175  ??  Ss     0:00.52 /System/Library/CoreServices/SecurityServer -X
  183  ??  Ss     5:45.23 /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Frameworks/CoreGraphics.framework/Resources/WindowServer -daemon
  185  ??  Ss     0:24.31 /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Frameworks/ATS.framework/Support/ATSServer
  188  ??  Ss     0:02.47 /System/Library/CoreServices/loginwindow.app/Contents/MacOS/loginwindow console
  193  ??  Ss     0:00.98 /usr/sbin/DirectoryService
  205  ??  S      0:00.43 /Library/StartupItems/Tablet/TabletDriver.app/Contents/MacOS/TabletDriver
  215  ??  Ss     0:00.01 /usr/libexec/crashreporterd
  256  ??  S      0:00.06 sh ./bin/safe_mysqld --user=mysql
  269  ??  Ss     0:06.46 /usr/sbin/cupsd
  277  ??  S      0:00.04 /usr/local/mysql-3.23.53/bin/mysqld --defaults-extra-file=/usr/local/mysql-3.23.53/data/my.cnf --basedir=/usr/local/mysql-3.23.53 --
  278  ??  Ss     0:01.13 /usr/sbin/AppleFileServer
  279  ??  Ss     0:01.47 /usr/sbin/httpd
  296  ??  Ss     0:00.00 xinetd -inetd_compat -pidfile /var/run/xinetd.pid
  297  ??  S      0:00.00 /usr/sbin/httpd
  298  ??  Ss     0:00.55 /System/Library/CoreServices/pbs
  304  ??  S      0:04.45 /System/Library/CoreServices/Dock.app/Contents/MacOS/Dock -psn_0_655361
  305  ??  S      0:11.63 /System/Library/CoreServices/SystemUIServer.app/Contents/MacOS/SystemUIServer -psn_0_786433
  306  ??  S      0:02.88 /System/Library/CoreServices/Finder.app/Contents/MacOS/Finder -psn_0_917505
  340  ??  Ss     0:02.61 ntpd -f /var/run/ntp.drift -p /var/run/ntpd.pid
  355  ??  Ss     0:00.00 nfsiod -n 4
  368  ??  Ss     0:00.00 rpc.lockd -w
  371  ??  Ss     0:00.08 /usr/sbin/automount -f -m /Network -nsl
  374  ??  Ss     0:00.03 /usr/sbin/automount -f -m /automount/Servers -fstab -mnt /private/Network/Servers -m /automount/static -static -mnt /private/automou
  379  ??  Ss     0:00.14 /Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/HAL/iSightAudio.plugin/Contents/Resources/IIDCAssistant.bundle/Contents/MacOS/IIDCAssistant
  381  ??  S      0:24.27 /Applications/Utilities/Terminal.app/Contents/MacOS/Terminal -psn_0_1048577
  382  ??  S      0:00.60 /Applications/iApps/iCal.app/Contents/Resources/iCalAlarmScheduler.app/Contents/MacOS/iCalAlarmScheduler -psn_0_1179649
  383  ??  S      0:03.15 /Users/dom/Library/PreferencePanes/Synergy.prefPane/Contents/Resources/Synergy.app/Contents/MacOS/Synergy -psn_0_1310721
  388  ??  S      1:21.66 /Applications/iApps/Mail.app/Contents/MacOS/Mail -psn_0_1703937
  544  ??  Ss     0:00.54 /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/InstantMessage.framework/iChatAgent.app/Contents/MacOS/iChatAgent
  632  ??  Ss     0:00.02 /System/Library/CoreServices/BezelUI/BezelUIServer
  696  ??  Ss     0:03.48 /usr/sbin/lookupd
  712  ??  S     11:45.59 /Applications/Internet/Safari.app/Contents/MacOS/Safari -psn_0_4194305
  714  ??  Ss     0:00.05 slpd -f /etc/slpsa.conf
  386 std  Ss     0:00.10 -tcsh
  799 std  R+     0:00.00 ps -ax

Yeah, I'm in a silly mood.

 

[Kingsly]

"Windows is a great operating system,"

Can someone confirm this rumor? Perhaps some blurry pics to accompany it? Until then, I call }[..

Those benches pitting OSX against XP worry me. C'mon Apple, get it together with Open GL.

 

[drewyboy]

Ok ok ok, I think arguing our points aren't gona change anyone else's opinion. I can say I've never gone to any questionable websites or opened questionable email yet have gotten screwed up the butt w/ windows, yet someone else out there will say, they've done the same thing and not had a problem. I could riddle off all the problems I've had with windows, and someone out there will say they've had the same problems with OS X. We can argue which operating system is better and explain why, but the others will say theirs does the same as good if not better. The bottom line is, YOU will buy whatever product YOU prefer.