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So you didn't get what I said.

I did, you just didn't get the reply.

No, they can't. And, with time, they're going to learn the hard way. Because more and more competitors are going to make equal devices and sell them on the platform that they don't restrict what you do with YOUR device.

Yup that is what happened with windows and linux machines

Yet :apple: endures.

Maybe some people like the way the controlled ecosystem works and will forgive its quirks for the sake of overall experience?

Too bad Apple and quality don't go hand in hand.

As they are so overpriced, moribund and of poor quality you are obviously not going to be buying one. Glad you are done with this decision. Good luck with whatever forums you will be moving on to.

Why does Apple get to control what people can buy?

Because it wants to, and because it can.

If you don't agree with it - then don't buy into it.
Its that simple.

You can petition for a 'Whack store' if you like.
But it probbaly won't happen if apple is moving to a business platform of selling to adults.
 
After making around $30,000 last year from the App Store, he’s essentially lost his income. And Wobble’s company, which was pulling in around $500 a day, is now making less than $10. Apple gave these developers the green light to build “sexy” apps, and now that they’ve built businesses around them, it’s tossing them aside without so much as an apology. To Apple, they’re expendable.

To apple they are probably a gross waste of talent and creativity.

If you have a team of app developers - why not developing something a bit more..... worthy?

Today is a grand day to grow up.
 
If i was Jobs they would be next on the list of "grow the flick up" list.

Go sell it to android.
 
Has the Supreme Court ruled on this?

That doesn't matter if companies keep going though the court of Eastern Texas (or whatever the proper name is) ;)

For a contract to be enforceable, It has to be presented prior to money changing hands, agreed upon, and signed. No matter what some judges may have falsely ruled in the past. If someone tries to tell me I'm subject to a contract that was never presented to me prior to money changing hands, they're out of their mind and I will take it up to the Supreme Court. Theres no way any sane person would agree to a contract post purchase, and no right minded judge will uphold such a contract.

Most boxes have attachments and disclaimers saying where the EULA is, that is sufficient in the USA.

BTW, a contract doesn't have to be signed. It can be verbal or electronic as well.

Imagine going to a car mechanic, getting the estimate, paying for the service, then after everything is done and you're ready to take your keys back, the mechanic says "by the way, you have to agree to these terms to be able to drive your car again…" and won't give you your keys back. You know how long that would stand up in court? Exactly.

Thats why, you got an estimate silly. :p

Only in certain instances, like the Psystar case, and they were incorrectly upheld. In other instances, they haven't held up so well. Not too long ago Microsoft was told that EULA have to be made available prior to purchase, thanks to a woman suing Best Buy and Microsoft over EULAs.

Would you like to explain how they were incorrectly upheld?

I DO own the software. I can't modify it and sell it as my own, the way Psystar was doing. But I DO own that copy. And I can do with it what I please as long as I don't try to pass it off as my own creation, copy it illegally, or anything like that. No one is in any place to tell me what I can or cannot do with it as long as I don't try to pass it off as my own creation or modify it and sell it.

In the end, Apple canNOT tell me what I can or cannot do with my devices that I PURCHASED with MY money.

But they can define the limits of the warranty within legal limits. But with your ramblings, it seems like you would be better suited at a Linux forum, with a Linux OS. Not here.
 
I actually feel utter disbelief at how so many people can carry on supporting Apple when they make decisions like this.

Presumably most iPhone owners are adults, as it is a "premium" device - there aren't many school/college kids that could afford one unless they have rich parents. What makes it okay for Apple to decide that these apps are inappropriate, when the amount of downloads that they've had obviously shows that some people like them? Why should Apple tell adults that they can't download these apps?

Apple should either add an adult section to the app store (it could even have a pop up disclaimer when you open it), add options to decide which genre of apps you want to display in the store, or allow people to install apps through other means.

It is of course up to Apple at the end of day, but censorship is ridiculous. If Apple allowed people to install apps through other means than their store, then that would solve the problem for everybody, no? The store can stay "clean" (violent games remain, while jokey apps like iWobble have to go ROFL) but then people have the option to install whatever they want outside of the app store, without invalidating their warranty.

Even if you don't appreciate these kinds of apps yourself, you should be able to realise how ridiculous it is that Apple are stopping adults from downloading apps they deem "inappropriate" just because of a few complaints.

What next? Will Apple start to replace swearing in emails/texts/safari with *** ? We don't need to be "protected" from this stuff.
 
Bit.. Wired?

Honestly, I cant believe how many people are anti-naked women. And it seems they are guys!! Speaks volumes of the Apple crowd. Being fortunate enough to come from an affluent part of the world.. I still cant say I would ever see/hear this from descent guys from around here.

Speaks volumes of computer geek guys on internet forums!!

Dont get me wrong I cant wait to bat off to the latest macbook pro release date.
 
The commenter you're talking about had a well reasoned argument. It had nothing to do with a sense of entitlement. And, as noted later on, the poster is not a teen...Well, I went to an American law school and I did pass .... and this type of censorship (that's what it is) may indeed be against the law. ..That's why I went android. I love Apple's hardware and software, but I can't support these practices. Vote with your dollar.


Well reasoned argument?? You're joking.

"1. I see an iphone as a miniature computer and I believe YOU should be in charge of what application you run on it."

The "argument" essentially starts with the conclusion. It starts with a belief/opinion, not a fact. And that belief/opinion is based entirely on the poster's asserted sense of entitlement. That's not a "reasoned" argument. And I also went to a U.S. law school, passed the bar, and that's how I know that this is not censorship and is not against the law. And you should too.
But your solution certainly is correct--vote with your dollar. If app freedom is more important to you, go with a platform which isn't in any way restricting the apps you can run.
 
Honestly, I cant believe how many people are anti-naked women.
\

I am not anti-naked women - its just that I can't be bothered to be offended by apple's decision to reign in some of the the tat.

What is lost? Revenue
What is gained? - a little more dignity

Its not censorship - its exercising aesthetic judgement - aka taste.

If you want a farting jiggling boob fest phone - you are free to choose another company.

If they ban Ulysees - THEN i will be concerned.
Until then. Meh.
 
Presumably most iPhone owners are adults, as it is a "premium" device - there aren't many school/college kids that could afford one unless they have rich parents. What makes it okay for Apple to decide that these apps are inappropriate, when the amount of downloads that they've had obviously shows that some people like them? Why should Apple tell adults that they can't download these apps?

Apple should either add an adult section to the app store (it could even have a pop up disclaimer when you open it), add options to decide which genre of apps you want to display in the store, or allow people to install apps through other means.

It is of course up to Apple at the end of day, but censorship is ridiculous. If Apple allowed people to install apps through other means than their store, then that would solve the problem for everybody, no? The store can stay "clean" (violent games remain, while jokey apps like iWobble have to go ROFL) but then people have the option to install whatever they want outside of the app store, without invalidating their warranty.

Even if you don't appreciate these kinds of apps yourself, you should be able to realise how ridiculous it is that Apple are stopping adults from downloading apps they deem "inappropriate" just because of a few complaints.

What next? Will Apple start to replace swearing in emails/texts/safari with *** ? We don't need to be "protected" from this stuff.


The post actually at times is coherent (but note that these apps run on the touch as well as the iPhone, and the touch is not a "premium device") before it stumbles into absurdity at the end. And it accidentally poses the interesting question:
"Why should Apple tell adults that they can't download these apps?"
Of course, the real question is why aapl "should be able to" tell adults what apps they can download. And the answer, like it or not, is because it's aapl's platform and app store and it gets to decide what it allows. That's it. Not complicated. There are no restrictions on content accessible on safari, just on apps running on aapl's OS. It's not censorship. It's not prudishness. It's a smart business decision.
 
Haven't seen this posted yet.

Over 5,000 "sexual" apps have been pulled from the store.

The developer in the main thread article called Apple and asked what the new rules were. The reply was basically:

  • No images of women in bikinis (Ice skating tights are not OK either)
  • No images of men in bikinis.
  • No skin.
  • No silhouettes that indicate that Wobble can be used for wobbling boobs
  • No sexual connotations or innuendo: boobs, babes, booty, sex – all banned
  • Nothing that can be sexually arousing
  • No apps will be approved that in any way imply sexual content.
 
Don't believe everything you read on the internets

If you really think that is an accurate explanation of a new aapl policy, then I have a bridge to sell you. Stay tuned.
 
No doubt those particular rules were responses to his questions about his own app. Still, they hint at Apple's new direction.

When they wanted to brag about quantity of apps, a lot more was okay. Now they can be more discerning.


That's what is so obnoxious about this entire thread--it's being driven by a developer, some others with financial interests, a few hit whore bloggers, and some trolls.
As far as "bragging" I sort of agree (IIRC, wobble boobs was turned down/booted a while back before making some changes).
There's no doubt that the rules have been fuzzy, misunderstood, and misapplied in the past (such as permitting the baby shaking app). I think aapl's original position was more PG, which slipped over time into PG13. Wherever you draw the line, someone will be pissed. It would be a lot easier not to draw any lines at all, but since apps developers use aapl's SDK, that could get real ugly real fast. Even having a an R/NC17 apps section has problems and I think aapl knows what it's doing to stay away from that. For now. In the future, I think there's a place for an open portal to get outside the aapl apps ecosystem where aapl has nothing to do it. But that will be awhile.
 
Has the Supreme Court ruled on this?

For a contract to be enforceable, It has to be presented prior to money changing hands, agreed upon, and signed. No matter what some judges may have falsely ruled in the past.

You are completely wrong. It is a fundamental basis of contract law that contracts do NOT have to be signed. Every time you go to the supermarket and buy a box of cereal you are entering a contract with the supermarket to exchange cash for cereal, and no one signs anything. There are traditional exceptions to the "no signature required" rule, and, as I mentioned, these are listed in what is traditionally called the "Statute of Frauds." These include things like transfers of real estate and contracts for marriage. There are also various other types of contract that, by modern statute, require signatures, but these are the exception, not the rule. The Supreme Court and every other court has ruled consistently with this basic concept.

If someone tries to tell me I'm subject to a contract that was never presented to me prior to money changing hands, they're out of their mind and I will take it up to the Supreme Court. Theres no way any sane person would agree to a contract post purchase, and no right minded judge will uphold such a contract.

Again, you are wrong. Again, every time you purchase a good you are engaging in a contract without seeing something in writing prior to exchanging money. These contracts are governed by the Uniform Commercial Code which defines the rules for these contracts.

There are furthermore at least two common law contract theories - implied-in-fact and implied-in-law - that mean you don't have to see the contract first. If you see someone building a fence in your yard for your benefit, and you don't stop him, you have to pay him. You are subject to an implied-in-law contract even though you didn't know the terms ahead of time.

If someone does something for you, and you pay them, even without knowing the terms of a contract, you are both acting like there is a contract, and thus you may be bound by an implied-in-fact contract, even though you didn't even know the terms of the contract.

You say you'll take it up with the Supreme Court, but you'll never get there - there are 500 years of consistent case law undermining your position.

Imagine going to a car mechanic, getting the estimate, paying for the service, then after everything is done and you're ready to take your keys back, the mechanic says "by the way, you have to agree to these terms to be able to drive your car again…" and won't give you your keys back. You know how long that would stand up in court? Exactly.

But that's not at all the same thing. In this situation you have a contract, and one party is attempting to modify the terms. He can't do that.


Only in certain instances, like the Psystar case, and they were incorrectly upheld. In other instances, they haven't held up so well. Not too long ago Microsoft was told that EULA have to be made available prior to purchase, thanks to a woman suing Best Buy and Microsoft over EULAs.

You are wrong. Psystar was absolutely correctly decided, and there will be no appeal because the appeals court will refuse to hear the case.

Please cite the Microsoft case. The courts have generally held that a EULA can be presented post purchase as long as if the consumer refuses the EULA he can return the software for a refund.


I DO own the software. I can't modify it and sell it as my own, the way Psystar was doing. But I DO own that copy.

You contradict yourself. You claim to own the software. If you owned it you could modify it and sell it as you own. So clearly you don't own the software.

You may own the copy - you certainly own the physical medium. That's a licensing issue.

And I can do with it what I please as long as I don't try to pass it off as my own creation, copy it illegally, or anything like that. No one is in any place to tell me what I can or cannot do with it as long as I don't try to pass it off as my own creation or modify it and sell it.


There is no such prohibition as "pass it off as my own creation." Copyright law says you cannot copy it, create a derivative work, distribute it, perform it in public, etc. except for certain exceptions (you can create a copy in memory in order to run the software, for example). The DMCA says you cannot circumvent technical measures.

And the EULA, which is perfectly legal in the U.S., and which is an enforceable contract (if you choose not to agree to it, you cannot use the software), places further limitations on your use.



[QUOTE}
In the end, Apple canNOT tell me what I can or cannot do with my devices that I PURCHASED with MY money.[/QUOTE]

Yes they can. You are creating a legal framework that does not exist. You are like one of those people who claims the Constitution forbids federal income tax, and thus refuses to pay. As a Federal District Court judge once told me, those people can refuse to admit that the law is the law, but that isn't going to stop him from throwing them into jail.

You may not like the law, but the correct path would be to try and get it changed and not to deny that the law is the law.
 
First of all, this is not censorship. Apple is a private company and as such has the right to do what they want within their App store. If I let loose with a tirade of bad language and attached a few nudie pictures to a post like this you can bet it would be removed quickly. Is that censorship? No, because a private company has the right to decide what they do with their property. Can I print dirty stories in the newspaper and sell it on the corner? Well why the heck not -- they can't censor me! Actually, I cold do that. If the paper let me. But they don't HAVE to let me. they won't even sell me an ad with naked women in it, no matter how tasteful it is. OK, so censorship protestors, put it away. If you're on the censorship bandwagon, get off, you're wrong. Open your own app store for your own device, and sell what you want.

It's clearly a matter of what Apple wants to do, and what they want customers to think about their store. I'm thinking they'd rather have the larger majority believing they keep adult materials out, than that they help supply adult materials to the masses. BTW, lets not confuse porn and adult. Pornographic materials be they photos, games, sounds, movies, stories, et al are ILLEGAL in this country -- adult materials are NOT. I Hate that the world doesn't understand that.

I'm curious on two things, myself however. How would kids get access to the app store? Don't you need a credit card, etc to get in, and buy things? So if you're under 18 you don't have a card right? isn't that how most adult sites work? You need a CC to get in, which generally means you're an adult. of course now that you can buy debit cards that work like CC's, and that you can buy them from vending machines even.... I imagine that gets you around the adult requirement -- so that also makes all the adult web sites available to all, doesn't it?

Oh, and hey Apple -- as long as you're at it, why not approve and eliminate all the violent and sexual music from the iTunes store! Just a thought.
 
[QUOTE}
In the end, Apple canNOT tell me what I can or cannot do with my devices that I PURCHASED with MY money.[/QUOTE]

As near as I can tell, Apple is NOT telling you what you can do with your device, which you purchased from them. They are telling you what you can do with the device you purchased, when interfaced with their system. You want to jailbreak it and run what you want, go for it. But at that time, Apple no longer has to support the device, provide you access to their services such as iTunes or the App store, and ATT or whoever does no longer have to provide you service or benefits. YOU are deciding to not accept what they want to offer, and go out on your own, doing what YOU want to do with the device.

You have the device, you own it, and can do what you please. However doing what you want is different that trying to tell Apple or whoever to also do what you want. They say "If you want to use our apps, songs, service, etc. here is the contract. If you don't like the rules of that contract don't use them, and don't agree to the contract". It's their game and their rules. You are free to build your own game and have your own rules. It just doesn't apply to someone elses game. It's like putting a quarter in a Pac-Man game and insisting that since YOU paid for the game, it's YOUR game, and you should get an infinite supply of Pac-Men to play with. You're playing in their court. If you don't like the rules, don't play there. Take your device, erase it and build your own system to do what you want. But don't tell Apple or anyone else that it's your device and they should cater their system to your whims. That's not how it goes. You bought the device knowing how it worked, and within what framework it was designed to work. If you were not prepared to work within that framework you should have either purchased a different device, or should know how to code it your way from the ground up.
 
I've been thinking more on this. Forget the boobs. The nub of the issue is that a particular class of app has been banned in the middle of a product lifecycle. There's an established user base who, quite rightly, expect ongoing support and updates, but the means to deliver it is gone.

What if the class of apps had been medical apps (because Apple's lawyers were suddenly scared of potential liability)? What do all the current users do? For all practical purposes, they're high and dry.

Or what if the class was "Navigation Apps", some of which cost $99.00. Is it just tough luck for the customer if they expected periodic map updates and bug fixes when they handed over their cash? Are they due a refund? And from who?
 
Interesting questions about what the implications would be if a useful class of apps that needed regular upgrades were axed.

But in this case the reason for axeing was to make the product more mature by phasing out the more immature content.
 
Haven't seen this posted yet.

Over 5,000 "sexual" apps have been pulled from the store.

The developer in the main thread article called Apple and asked what the new rules were. The reply was basically:

  • No images of women in bikinis (Ice skating tights are not OK either)
  • No images of men in bikinis.
  • No skin.
  • No silhouettes that indicate that Wobble can be used for wobbling boobs
  • No sexual connotations or innuendo: boobs, babes, booty, sex – all banned
  • Nothing that can be sexually arousing
  • No apps will be approved that in any way imply sexual content.

But probably A-Ok to have a image of the Solder or a Guy with a gun.

Also OK to shot / beat / run over with the car someone in the game.

Really sick society. Not much better then Taliban if you ask me....
 
Really sick society. Not much better then Taliban if you ask me....

In this case, replace "society" with "CEO", as one older man is ultimately responsible for Apple's policies.

Re: Taliban. Naw, more cartoon like. It reminds me of that guy Cocteau in charge of the Joy-joy West Coast in Demolition Man, and Edgar Friendly's tirade against him and his followers:

"You see, according to Cocteau's plan, I'm the enemy, 'cause I like to think; I like to read. I'm into freedom of speech and freedom of choice. I'm the kind of guy who likes to sit in a greasy spoon and wonder, "Gee, should I have the T-bone steak or the jumbo rack of barbecued ribs with the side order of gravy fries?" I WANT high cholesterol. I wanna eat bacon and butter and BUCKETS of cheese, okay? I want to smoke a Cuban cigar the size of Cincinnati in the non-smoking section. I want to run through the streets naked with green Jell-o all over my body reading Playboy magazine. Why? Because I suddenly might feel the need to, okay, pal?

"I've SEEN the future. Do you know what it is? It's a 47-year-old virgin sitting around in his beige pajamas, drinking a banana-broccoli shake, singing "I'm an Oscar Meyer Wiener".


Perhaps what they should've done in the movie was to have all the Morality Statute Machines (the ones that give out tickets for cursing), sport an Apple logo.

j/k :) Seriously, Apple is supposedly changing their policies in response to developer and user pressure. If there was more than one sanctioned app store, then I doubt anyone would care.
 
Has the Supreme Court ruled on this?

For a contract to be enforceable, It has to be presented prior to money changing hands, agreed upon, and signed. No matter what some judges may have falsely ruled in the past. If someone tries to tell me I'm subject to a contract that was never presented to me prior to money changing hands, they're out of their mind and I will take it up to the Supreme Court.

Just another point to ruin your day - it's not up to the Supreme Court. Federal courts can't hear contract disputes unless there is diversity jurisdiction. This means you have to have more than $75,000 in controversy.

Unless you can gin up some sort of constitutional argument or find some federal statute at issue, you'll be arguing in state courts, and they will follow a line of jurisprudence dating back to 16th century England.
 
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