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We should always think intellectually with matters like this.

If global warming is false and we don’t do anything: we lose a planet. Extinction or whatever.

Uh, might want to check your logic on this one. How exactly do we "lose a planet" if there's no global warming?
 
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Sure, if that floats your environmentalist boat. What's that got to do with them opposing the CPP? If green energy works for them, why should they give a crap about whether or not the CPP gets repealed?
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Simple answer Tax Credits!
 
It is difficult to tell if this is mere "white-knighting" on Apple's part, or if they are serious.

Tim licks his lips as greater profits stroll in, despite the profits being obscene as they are... not that I have a problem with their profits.

translation, "we can afford it and want a barrier to entry for other players"
Precisely.
 
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1.......98% of scientists agree. I always have a healthy suspicion about general statements expressed in percentages. 98% of 100 scientists is 98. I imagine that there are at least 98 university scientists funded by EPA grants who are willing to "agree".

You've fallen hook, line, and sinker for the Tobacco Strategy. If you're not sure what that is, do some research.

There is no scientific debate about the existence of man-made climate change. No more than there is debate about whether or not the Earth is flat. A gullible public + industrial/lobbyist money = "reasonable doubt." There is NO actual doubt. Zero.
 
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That could very well be the case. We still give the fossil fuel industry tens of billions of dollars in subsidies annually while they rake in record profits. It's good to see that we are finally investing in technologies that will hopefully lead to climate crisis solutions.

Utterly false. And we give several more billions to subsidize green energy. That's straight from the EIA. Scroll down to Myth #2 and read through the end of the article:

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/10/08/the-economist-fossil-fuel-subsidies-and-climate-disaster/

And since we're talking taxes, note that oil companies pay well more than the average S&P 500 company.
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renewable energy may, currently, be more expensive than non-renewable but the idea is to start mass producing it to lower costs for the rest of us. Apple was/is leading the way. By removing these requirements tRump is making it harder to lower costs. Polluting the environment is not forward thinking. America doesn't lead the way into the future by living in the past. We don't create new industries by relying on old technology. These rules are in place for a reason - our environment is polluted and people's lives/health are affected by it. Our economy also benefits because we create the new technologies that power the next wave of economic growth. If we don't do it some other country will - do we really want that?

What kind of garbage are you believing? Because the US has some of the best environmental qualities, in terms of cleanliness, in the world. "Our environment is polluted"????? What kind of blind statement is that? And guess what, the CPP, which is what this article is about, has never taken effect. It's rules have never been put in place, thank goodness. It is grossly full of government overreach and red tape. Go get educated. And follow the money, not the green hype.
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Thank you Apple for standing up for the environment and speaking out against this disastrous repeal!

Please read the post right before yours. You have no clue what you're talking about. Follow the money, not the green hype.
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No it wasn’t a war. It was an illegal invasion of a foreign country. Which I’d argue is way worse.

Don’t get me wrong I’m not for any of this. The US should stay out of everyone’s business but to call it war is technically untrue.

Please explain: how was the invasion of Iraq, or Afghanistan (not sure which one you're referring too), illegal?
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Good for Apple! please can all of the other big players do the same.

What is with trumps anti-Earth policy's ??? :mad:

Spoken like a truly uneducated greenie that's following the herd. This is about money, not the environment.
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This fundamentally is the tragedy of what passes for energy policy in the Trump administration. Whether one "believes" in climate change or not, it will still be the case that renewable energy is one of, if not the top, technology stories of the early 21st century. The shift away from hydrocarbons is happening faster than anyone expected, to the point where it is shocking both the fossil fuel and energy production industries. When those kinds of tectonic forces are at work, you have to make a choice: either lead or follow. While other nations lead, Trump and his cronies are pushing us hard not just to follow, but to stand at the end of the line, facing the wrong way.

Then let a free, undistorted market decide. If green energy is so competitive, then let it go unsubsidized.
 
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What I care about, not paying higher premiums and deductibles when those that refuse health coverage rack up six figure health bills. Their choice their expense, no excuses or ways out of paying the entire bill. Young are the worst, I am healthy so who needs the expense. They do, that stupid thing you did with the BASE jumping that broke half your bones. Keeping Healthcare managable, all need to be in the pool.
What BASE jumping did I do now? Let’s not make a straw man out of this.
 
Remembering when the EPA was the EPA and not a subverted government department.

The EPA you remember, which I assume was the one that existed under the prior administration, outlived its usefulness a long time ago. If anything, Pruitt is returning it to its rightful place. EPA has easily been the worst regulation creating office in the US government for some time. It was not that way when it was first created in the early 70's, when real environmental concerns existed and were solved fairly quickly. The EPA's been using junk science for decades to prop up false environmental stories (the ozone hole, AGW) to try and remain relevant.
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There are legal and monetary penalties for not having car insurance as well, yet no conservatives harp about it. This is such a lame, tired argument which shows a total misunderstanding of basic math as it relates to underwriting, cost sharing, and risk exposure in the insurance market. Sure, insurance companies could not engage in spreading risk exposure across the population, but your individual health insurance rates would be astronomical.

Wrong. It's completely on point in regards to healthcare (but not really this article, but I digress). Your premise is false: car insurance is an invalid comparison to health insurance because driving is a privilege and not a right. No one is forced to buy car insurance; you buy it to legally operate a vehicle on the road. I shouldn't be forced to buy a good from anyone just for being a living citizen.
 
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This is not correct. Coal and nuclear are becoming non-competitive because natural gas fired production is so much cheaper. It has nothing to do with renewal sources.

I agree and disagree. Natural gas is much cheaper than coal and nuclear, but even the gas industry is struggling. Renewable generation can operate in the red yet still compete with gas plants.
 
It's very interesting how there's never any mention of the effects of over-population anymore, including mass migration from areas of the world that effectively just export people.

What's the environmental impact of man-made climate change and pollution by increasing the number of people so drastically? All those extra mouths to feed, people to transport, houses to heat/cool, garbage, waste, etc...

Oh, this is so rich! Ever heard of Paul R. Ehrlich????? Might want to read about his massively wrong predictions about population size before you go making your own.
 
I wonder if your ideal approach to any problem is to fix it when it gets bad enough? Your point here seems to be hospitals are unnecessary if everyone in a community is healthy at the moment. Forget about health screening, dental cleaning, or vaccines. As long as the population isn’t seriously ill, any of those efforts is just inventing issues to solve.

Uh, your reply doesn't make sense. Please explain how hospitals, health screenings, and so forth, has anything to do with what I said? Are you trying to say that pollution causes health problems?
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This is for
npmacuser5:
If you're referring to tax credits that Apple won't get as a result of repealing the CPP, then yes, I agree. Which only goes to show that Apple is far more concerned about money than the environment. This is corporate green-washing.
 
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What BASE jumping did I do now? Let’s not make a straw man out of this.
As long as you are willing to pay when stuff happens to you or your family, no problems. Just used it as an example.
 
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The fact you quoted that site tells me all I need to know. In other words, ignore everything you say regarding climate. I imagine you also spend a lot of time over at Infowars. They are both about as accurate.

The fact that you didn't actually read the article, which sites data directly from the US government, tells me that you'd rather argue against a straw man than against facts.
 
Uh, your reply doesn't make sense. Please explain how hospitals, health screenings, and so forth, has anything to do with what I said? Are you trying to say that pollution causes health problems?
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This is for
npmacuser5:
If you're referring to tax credits that Apple won't get as a result of repealing the CPP, then yes, I agree. Which only goes to show that Apple is far more concerned about money than the environment. This is corporate green-washing.
Tax incentives are powerful business tools. Like cities spending billions to attract a sports team. Is the sports team bad because they take the best deal? Sorry to burst your image, business is always about business first.
 
The fact that you didn't actually read the article, which sites data directly from the US government, tells me that you'd rather argue against a straw man than against facts.

Even liars tell the truth some of the time - doesn’t make them trustworthy. It’s irrelevant if they occasionally tell the truth or use actual data when their end goal is to deceive people about climate change. That’s the oldest trick in the book for conspiracy nuts. Sprinkle in just enough facts to sound credible to trick people into believing the BS that follows.

The other article you linked was by Ross McKitrick, another climate denier who uses similar tactics.

If these are your sources, then I stand by my original comment: nothing you say should be taken seriously regarding climate.
 
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LOL Fraser Institute.
Did you see what I said about the Tobacco Strategy?
Do you know what the Fraser Institute is? It's a conservative thinktank founded by a logging baron. They specialize in creating media narratives for industry. It's the Tobacco Strategy in a nutshell. It is NOT a scientific foundation.

Let me state plainly: I could not care less what non-scientists, industry lobbyists, political pundits, or internet commenters have to say. There is ZERO scientific uncertainty that man-made climate change is real :)
 
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Tim Cook for president! And then he could bring all of his Apple clowns with him to the cabinet. Couldn't be any worse than the past four or five administrations.

No way! If Tim Cook was president, the world would be forced to run *Apple's way* only. Keep it limited.. and have options. Everyone would cave in overnight.
 
Uh, your reply doesn't make sense. Please explain how hospitals, health screenings, and so forth, has anything to do with what I said? Are you trying to say that pollution causes health problems?
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This is for
npmacuser5:
If you're referring to tax credits that Apple won't get as a result of repealing the CPP, then yes, I agree. Which only goes to show that Apple is far more concerned about money than the environment. This is corporate green-washing.

Was trying to make a juxtaposition to make it easier for you to understand the necessity of EPA. Pretty simple concept there. After fixing those serious issues, EPA’s mission at the moment would be the prevention of environmental devastation.
 
You seem to have some idea that every location that uses renewable power needs to have solar panels and wind turbines attached directly to it. That's not how it works, AT ALL. The electrical system is like a big bucket of water. Power generation companies dump into it, and customers pull out of it. Customers pay the rates for the type of power they use, and those payments get routed to the companies that generated the power. So if a company generates power using renewable, customers just buy power out of the bucket at the rate for renewable power, and those companies get paid for it.



You are at the same time correct and ignorant of the topic. This is indeed how it works and that's exactly how it should work. You seem to imply that it's all smoke and mirrors and isn't really environmental at all. You are wrong. Read my explanation above, which is the only sensical way it can work.
NO, I don't seem anything. Just common sense when Apple has many stores that are in large shared spaces like malls. It is very unlikely all these malls use 100% green power.
 
Well don't leave us hanging!!!

What, are we doing cliffhanger endings in forum posts now?

Well, you gotta wait until next week, when the new episode airs. ;)

On a serious note, i don’t even remember, what point I wanted to make. It made sense in my head at first but then I realized, that he probably would have a too easy comeback to that, so I deleted it. Well, some of it....
 
I don't understand your point. Trump has been all about regulation reduction. Doesn't that help everyone who's trying to change and, in this case, toward renewal source energy?
It might be if he was also about reducing the favorable tax treatment for the extraction industries. Which of course he is not.
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It's very interesting how there's never any mention of the effects of over-population anymore, including mass migration from areas of the world that effectively just export people.

What's the environmental impact of man-made climate change and pollution by increasing the number of people so drastically? All those extra mouths to feed, people to transport, houses to heat/cool, garbage, waste, etc...
People have been talking about it for at least 250 years. That’s how long population based catastrophe has been right around the corner.
 
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Uh, might want to check your logic on this one. How exactly do we "lose a planet" if there's no global warming?
Because global warming is just one of the many ways our planet is already being compromised :rolleyes:
Species extinctions, ocean acidification, habitat loss (and loss of biodiversity), nuclear waste that's slowly leaking into the Columbia River, smog in the developing world, synthetic hormones that don't break down and have now infiltrated almost every water source, etc. etc.
 
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