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Apple Pauses Electric Car Talks With Hyundai and Kia
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"CORRECTED-UPDATE 1-Hyundai Motor, Kia say they are not in talks with Apple on autonomous car development"
Not so, simply says they're not in talks about a driverless car!
Yeah, to me Hyundai and Kia are the LAST brands I would associate with Apple. Heck, even a Dodge would make more sense. Really, Tesla is the Apple of the automotive world. That would make the most sense if ever it was possible.
well, and now this ... who knows what's going on"CORRECTED-UPDATE 1-Hyundai Motor, Kia say they are not in talks with Apple on autonomous car development"
Not so, simply says they're not in talks about a driverless car!
Hyundai and Kia Now Say They Aren't in Discussions to Develop Apple Car
Following weeks of rampant Apple Car rumors, Hyundai and its subsidiary Kia today said they are not (or at least no longer) in discussions with Apple to co-operate on development of a self-driving electric vehicle, according to Bloomberg. Hyundai last month confirmed that Apple was in...
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Kia and Hyundai are great candidates. They're towards the front of the pack when it comes to a mainstream automaker in the EV space and have a focus on providing long warranties to their customers, which has built up a loyal fanbase.
They might not be fashionable, but they're very good cars, and Apple will worry about making it fashionable and charging premiums that legacy automakers could only dream of
For American market the vehicles that make the most money are SUVs and Trucks. I could see Apple making a SUV though I am not sure if it will be a small one or a larger one. I don't see them making a truck.
For cars, for some reason folks expect Camry pricing with Porsche performance and Mercedes Benz appointments. Not sure if Apple will bother chasing that segment.
Not to mention the best selling vehicle in the US is the F-150, and has been for years. That's why GM is rebranding Hummer as an EV and Ford is bringing out an electric F150.
I doubt the would do either as they would be very US centric vehicles and thus not likely to sell well overseas. Differing safety standards aside; I could not see someone motoring around a major European city in an SUV, let alone get out of a El Corte Inglés car park. The original Top Gear, with Hammond, May and Clarkson had some funny segments around driving a US vehicle in Europe, especially Clarkson's Ford GT.
A small crossover, the BMW X1 or X2 and its ilk would seem to be more likely if they went the SUV route.
I'd bet on Porsche performance with MB appointments and Rolls Royce pricing before we'd see Camry pricing.
Almost all your arguments were brought up with model 3 - now you bring it with cybertruck. This thing is just pure excitement!!!
The truck market is huge in the us and ford maybe G m will ofCourse have some e-truck - but they are playing very safe.
That’s unamerican - and not fun!
Hummer is a joke - almost everyone laughs about that show car - 20k orders and delivery when - 21/22 - iDknow
The quality issues you are mentioning - come on - a million Tesla’s is driving around and super safe - anything can be changed easily in cars and production - every major car company has super huge recalls!
Rivian seems a legit competitor and far more interesting than ford or g m.
To come back to apple - mobility is super exciting like smartphones were back then - the best to come - starting from 2025 (my prediction) we will see which company has a good offer and can crush competition.
Tesla has everything you need to be a winner - apple has nothing at the moment - just their fans and brand power! And even if they buy into a platform - which one ever - they probably will choose an eco-system approach - where they connect it to their eco-system and i am no longer interested in their eco-system - i want a new company succeed and crush apple !!!
Yeah they could do a crossover (which is just a taller wagon/hatchback), that would sell well everywhere. But it still doesn't rake in money like Trucks (Ford makes ALL their money from F150, think about that for a moment). It is also why the "big 3" were so quick to talk about electrification of their truck lines. Especially around the Cybertruck reveal timeframe, cause they know where their bread is buttered.
Sedan sales are declining/flat in the US. Apple would not be doing themselves any favors by making one at this point.
Americans Are Still Car Shopping: The Top 20 Selling Vehicles Despite A Global Pandemic
Despite a global pandemic that halted production and closed dealerships, American consumers are still buying cars. These are the top 20 selling vehicles through
www.forbes.com
Never said it wasn't but it remains to be seen how many Tesla will actually sell, if and when it comes out.
They are playing it safe because they know the truck market and their buyers.
Considering the first years production sold out in 10 minutes and unlike Tesla limits it to their expected production capacity; which they are looking to expand. I'd say it was a successful, if a different, approach than Tesla's lets do a cash grab; and it will be out a few years before Tesla.
Tesla keeps having some scary issues - such as missing bolts in key components; and scoring near bottom in quality ratings.
It will be interesting to see who wins out and what happens to Tesla.
Exactly, and they know their market very well. I suspect the eF150 will do very well with fleets and tradesmen, especially if the TCO is lower than an ICE truck.
Ford's F150 has been the best selling vehicle in th US since the 80's. To look at it another way, Ford sells almost as many F150's in a year, and has done so for a number of years, as Tesla has since it started.
Sedan sales are declining/flat in the US. Apple would not be doing themselves any favors by making one at this point.
Americans Are Still Car Shopping: The Top 20 Selling Vehicles Despite A Global Pandemic
Despite a global pandemic that halted production and closed dealerships, American consumers are still buying cars. These are the top 20 selling vehicles through
Yea, crossovers and SUVs seem to be the in thing, especially with low gas prices.
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The Model 3 only has been improved and only for the cars made in January 2021. Model Y is still a disaster. I tried to buy it three times. I rejected it three times due to dozens of defects.
Hyundai is not Kia’s parent company. Hyundai owns 30% of Kia. Kia owns between 15% and 40% in a dozen of Hyundai-owned companies. They are also run by members of the same family (or at least used to be). Hyundai and Kia are like an uncle and a nephew. They are related but not members of the immediate family. Hyundai can’t tell Kia what to do, as Hyundai doesn’t own at least 50% plus one share of Kia.
What I don't get is why/how the MiC 3's (and soon Y's) are even better built than the ones from Fremont. Makes you wonder if Giga-Austin will have better or worse quality vehicles.
Well the Lucid CEO stated the other day they plan to do the same thing, eventually offer a Lucid model under $40k, of course a CEO can say anything but here is the thing, for Tesla to get to all of us, they need to realize what Musk said a few months ago, that Tesla would produce a model for $25k, he said they would by a certain year, can't remember the year, I gather from your statements you think this will happen.
Even if it does come to fruition, does it worry you that GM seems to be totally realigning their long term strategy toward a complete EV model lineup by 2035?
Say what you want about the Chevy Bolt but the technology behind it seems to be solid and a step above the Nissan Leaf, anyway the next three to five years should be interesting in the EV space.
It will be interesting to see if and when Tesla comes out with a sub 25+K car; but even if they do they still face a number of other challenges long term.
And it's not just GM, Ford and others as well; which means Tesla's window to get to net profitability is going to shrink, the question is how quickly will the credits dwindle to near zero. Tesla also has the challenge of building out a dealer network to sell and service a lot of cars. Web sales are nice, but once the early adopters are gone and competition heats up not being able to test drive one easily will hinder their growth.
You, the nest 3-5 years will be interesting as more of the traditional manufacturers ramp up EV choices.
It seems Apple is moving towards a different market than the average car buyer and towards some sort of autonomous fleet vehicle if rumors are correct.
That’s your good right - but model y was already better from the beginning than model 3.
you sound like someone who returns their Mac 2-3 times, too!
but please elaborate - WHAT where the issues exactly
Teals will relentlessly work towards a real good cheap EV - BUT i think it isn’t even necessary anymore. The world is RICH - you can sell gazillions of cars above the 35k price tag.
the bolt might be a solid car - but its not sexy and its not EV first - its just an ICE-V.
G M is a company that spends ways too much in bad marketing - now with that norway spot.
why should it worry me that they have an EV strategy. It’s a huge market with many new players - there’s a good chance that most of the old big auto will disappear.
FIAT and Peugeot are already merged - VW is fighting tooth and claw for survival - i have no idea what bmw and mercedes are doing - Mercedes recently split their brand in two.
expect a huge turmoil starting latest 2025 - when all the new EV start ups are pumping out cars like crazy.
if i was still in love with apple - i would say - 2025 is the right time where an apple under steve would have come out with an great icar - that blew away the rest with its easiness of use and tight integration!
I wouldn't call 15 Billion in operating profit fighting tooth and claw, even if it is down from 19 billion in 2019.
BMW was also profitable in 2020, with 7.4 billion Euros in operating profit.
Tesla, OTOH, was in the red yet again in operating profit.
I expect it will get interetsing before then, as the major manufacturers bring out more EVs and Hybrids. BMW is ramping up with new EVs, GM has the Hummer, Ford the F150.
It will be interesting to see how Apple responds to the different dynamics of the car market vs its current ones; unlike their other products, they can't rely on the existing sales and service network for the rumored Apple Car. That will drive initial costs up and may result in year over year losses; will Apple decide it's worth it or use it to showcase technology they can then sell to other carmakers? Or will they forgo the consumer directly and sell a transporation system and not cars?
ofCourse well established car companies make profits. I mean come on ... but vw has huge credit lines and liability’s - they have an enormous internal transformation going on...
The question is more if anyone wants to buy into (whatever apple has) ecosystem. Taking HomeKit as an example i would say NOooo.
Apple is a disgusting partner to deal with - and car companies always wanted to keep everything in their hand.
So only economic turmoil or some Kia Hyundai madness can bring apple into the car game.
Effectively there’s nothing to win for ANY company dealing with apple or google - they are one of the most toxic companies today - capture everything and anything.
FANG is the legion of doom, 😆
Apple car is like apple television - its just to keep the door open - and i hope no one will step in their trap!
On the other hand i use only HomeKit devices on wlan base - because there’s no company with an consistent eco-system - it’s completely non-understandable to me WHY no major company can defeat apple?!?
Hence from todays view - apple can do whatever they do - it will work out the one way or another - if companies are not apple to step up to them.
Some notes from someone working in the auto industry:
1. Established car companies make profits - I'm not really sure what your point is here. Automakers are large, complex businesses, and every car line is very different. Some vehicles are cash cows in all markets, some make money only in some markets but are tolerated elsewhere because the additional volume helps offset the investment, some are loss leaders kept to maintain a presence in the segment (i.e. all small cars that aren't called Fiat 500). Big automakers making money is far from a given
2. Ecosystems - These aren't really an issue for automakers. Google and Apple provide the means to offer the interface and the automakers make them available to the end user as a cost of doing business. The infotainment interface in my car is Android Auto 99% of the time. It's easy and well integrated with everything else (Whatsapp, Spotify etc.), much like Apple Carplay, and for such an insignificant on-cost for the automaker, it's a pretty big red flag to not have it.
3. Apple as a disgusting partner - Difficult, definitely. Disgusting? Not at all. Look at Amazon's electric fleet from Rivian. If you have a customer that's willing to piggyback off a platform you already have, foot the engineering and tooling bill for 100,000 vehicles with guaranteed profit as a contract manufacturer, you at least listen, especially if the continued move away from ICE vehicles leaves you with under or unutilised facilities. It's far from easy to negotiate on a situation like that because of issues such as dealer networks, warranty, after-sales service etc, but to say there's nothing to win is far from true
The GM statement is a throwaway line that does not add to the discussion and the Chevy Bolt is a total EV with a battery that is over 200 miles range, it does appear that GM did not put much effort in advertising the Bolt, I would be worried though in that their liquid cooled batteries display they are technologically proficient and if they truly are about to turn the battleship fully into EV, they seem to have a battery advantage over Ford and Nissan.
You've accused others of being Tesla short sellers, well your posts seem to indicate you might be a Tesla stock investor, more throwaway stuff, car mergers, again, yeah so what, that is how the industry evolved over the past thirty years to survive, where are your specifics, just a lot of rah-rah Tesla, Apple sucks, the car industry are all idiots.
The world is rich, again, another vapid statement, Musk made it a priority to say he envisioned the company's overall goal would be to produce an affordable car, he made 25k the realization of that goal.
If you think Tesla and their largest shareholders are not worried about competition, well, if that were true they all should be fired for incompetence.
VW, what are they currently, number two or number three in the net revenue lead for worldwide automobile companies, but keep tossing out nonsensical statements.
Contract manufacturing isn’t uncommon in the industry. Apple hired plenty from Tesla and vice versa so I think they know their value rather well at this stage.
Apple and Tesla in my opinion want different approaches. Tesla wants to be leading while Apple wants to repeat the iPod formula and wait until the base technology is all readily available and then fuse hardware/ software and potentially services together.
