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I use Apple Pay via the watch whenever possible. And I avoid Wal-Mart like the plague. Costco is where it's at! Their gasoline prices alone make the membership worth it.
 
Tried to use it today. Nothing ever popped up for me to scan. Cashier didn't understand how it worked. She told me I was supposed to take a picture of something. Fail.
 
Who even shops at walmart.... How can you stand the customers that shop there? It's so bad, there isn't one allowed within San Francisco. Let them expand, but it won't ever overtake apple pay... how about a post of Apple Pay in Target (the lesser of two evils)...?

According to their annual revenues, a lot of people. I live in an uper-middle class of Toronto. I have 3 Walmarts within a 20 minute drive of my place.
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Guess I'm confused... How can they not accept Apple Pay, Android Pay, etc.? All retailers, by regulation, will have to support chip reader card scanners by the end of this year (which also means NFC capable).

Not correct. While most Chip-n-PIN terminals have NFC capabilities, npot all don't and having to accept Chip-n-PIN does not force you to enable NFC.
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I don't know if canada still does this but when I visit Vancouver/Richmond to hit up some Dim Sum joints - they bring the little card swiping terminal to you at your table when you are ready to pay. Same goes for Hong Kong and Taiwan where I last visited 2 years ago.

In the US they take your card from you and go in the back. That's where the shady business can happen.

All but a few small places bring the terminal to the table since all transactions are Chip-n-PIN, most of those portable terminals do not support NFC.
 
A lot of mom and pop stores have NFC enabled terminals. I mean a lot. At least 95% of them that I go to. And I live in Arizona.
It's actually easier and cheaper for small stores to upgrade as most of them rent the terminal from the payment processor. New tech comes along, they get a new terminal. It's the big chains with the integrated POS/payment that are resisting because of the cost.
 
I will stay with my LooPay FOB at WalMart and Target until things change.

Apple Pay is still slow roll out for my taste. Most places I shop don't have it yet. But, take my LP FOB.

Gathering Info are the times we live in. I don't worry about it.
 
To be fair you can't get mad at Walmart for thinking different. That would be kind of ironic.

While Apple pay is good, so is competition. That said. I go in Walmart maybe once per year if that so the likelihood of me having their app installed is zero.
 
Re: the posters who haughtily claim they never shop at Walmart.

The Walmart closest to me is an okay place, clean and well stocked. I find it handy if I need something after most stores have closed (like auto speakers), or I need something in an emergency (like a snowblower when a storm is about to hit!)

Yet another Walmart, in a location frequented by people with low income, is not so nice.

So I wonder if the posters who diss shopping there, might live in less desirable locations to begin with.
 
Re: the posters who haughtily claim they never shop at Walmart.

The Walmart closest to me is an okay place, clean and well stocked. I find it handy if I need something after most stores have closed (like auto speakers), or I need something in an emergency (like a snowblower when a storm is about to hit!)

Yet another Walmart, in a location frequented by people with low income, is not so nice.

So I wonder if the posters who diss shopping there, might live in less desirable locations to begin with.

I think it's just "cool" to hate walmart.
 
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They all know that its just a matter of time. Walmart was hoping to cut out VISA and everyone else and take back their 3%, but its not going to happen.

It's not 3% on every transaction. Most people who shop at Walmart probably don't even qualify for a credit card. Most debit card transaction fees are capped at 1%+10 cents or around there. American Express probably gives Walmart a discount when people pay with their Bluebird debit/prepaid cards.

Walmart will never win the battle against the card networks, the card networks would stick together and hammer Walmart until Walmart eventually goes out of business.
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The other factor when talking about Walmart and Target....generally speaking, they are all about logistical efficiency. Point being that if Walmart has rolled out something clunky that causes already long check out times to get worse, you can bet on it being improved quickly and dramatically, or being scrapped. Neither will allow something that slows down the checkout process significantly to hang around long.

Walmart has some of the slowest cashiers in the nation. I just find it funny how you said that. :cool:
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Guess I'm confused... How can they not accept Apple Pay, Android Pay, etc.? All retailers, by regulation, will have to support chip reader card scanners by the end of this year (which also means NFC capable).

You have no clue what you're talking about.

First, the liability shift for merchants (aside from gas pumps) was last October, not this October coming up.

Second, the liability shift for ATM's is in October 2016, while the gas pump shift is in 2017.

EMV and NFC aren't connected in any way when it comes to the liability shift, yet.
 
IEMV and NFC aren't connected in any way when it comes to the liability shift, yet.

Visa has always had an incentive program to entice merchants to move fully into EMV. This program saves the merchant money by not having to do an annual PCI assessment.

One of the conditions is:

"At least 75 percent of the merchant’s total transaction (chip and magnetic-stripe) count must originate from fully enabled dual-interface (contact/contactless) terminals that are capable of processing complete chip transactions."
 
0.05% + 23 cents, IIRC.

And I hate it. Most debit card rewards programs are eliminated now, and those that exist are measly. Also, the % of free checking accounts has gone down since the mandatory reduction in debit card interchange fees, all while our politicians were stupid enough to believe merchants wouldn't take advantage of it and lower their prices instead.
 
And I hate it. Most debit card rewards programs are eliminated now, and those that exist are measly. Also, the % of free checking accounts has gone down since the mandatory reduction in debit card interchange fees, all while our politicians were stupid enough to believe merchants wouldn't take advantage of it and lower their prices instead.

I'm wondering whether a lot of the "rewards" we've gotten were precisely because of the waste in the system. People in Europe and elsewhere seem to like using debit cards with no rewards just fine due to them still being less hassle than cash.

Besides, isn't your advice to always use a credit card for everything?
 
Besides, isn't your advice to always use a credit card for everything?
'
In the United States, absolutely, because we have the best credit/charge cards in the world. AMEX isn't as generous in other countries with their perks and rewards structure, and neither are Visa, MasterCard, or Discover. Not only do we have the best rewards system in the world for credit cards, but we also have the least secure payment system of first world countries, well, at least until EMV is accepted everywhere, and merchants are smart enough to not accept the card if the chip isn't being read correctly, rather than accepting a mag-stripe.

I'm wondering whether a lot of the "rewards" we've gotten were precisely because of the waste in the system.

The United States is a free market... But that doofus, Durbin, had to stick his hands where they didn't belong, and it's completely screwed up the debit card system resulting in higher bank fees, more bank fees, delay in EMV certifications, and a lower or eliminated rewards structure for most debit cards. I guess Durbin doesn't understand what a capitalist free market is, but then again, politicians don't know anything about this country, they just pretend they do.

So if the debit card market is in demand enough where merchants need/are willing to accept debit cards at a 3% or 4% interchange rate, that's their problem, not ours. Hopefully the next president will ask congress to look back into the Durbin amendment and have it eliminated.

People in Europe and elsewhere seem to like using debit cards with no rewards just fine due to them still being less hassle than cash.

That is because they have a much different system than we do here.

Europeans seem to think differently than Americans when it come to debt, mainly because they don't live the same way we do. Europe was never seen as the economic powerhouse of the world in the past like the U.S was.

Their credit card rewards are less "nice" than ours. Their banks are more advanced than ours too.

For example, they've moved on to contact-less cards with chip & pin capabilities, as you already know. The banks over there, from what I've heard, also have instant funds transfers from one financial institution to another, and have moved to a check-less society where the government had actually thought about getting rid of them for legal use entirely.
 
Although it's been a little slower rollout than expected, I am regularly using ApplePay at:
  • Walgreen
  • Lowes Foods
  • Fresh Market
  • Jimmy John's
  • Office Depot
  • Best Buy
  • vending machines at work
It looks like Chipotle is starting to use it, maybe? I saw a new .))) icon on their cash register.

In other words, Wal-mart is not relevant for me. I avoid that place like the plague.

If they ignore ApplePay, they may have the same fate as MCX.

THIS!
 
In the United States, absolutely, because we have the best credit/charge cards in the world. AMEX isn't as generous in other countries with their perks and rewards structure, and neither are Visa, MasterCard, or Discover. Not only do we have the best rewards system in the world for credit cards, but we also have the least secure payment system of first world countries, well, at least until EMV is accepted everywhere, and merchants are smart enough to not accept the card if the chip isn't being read correctly, rather than accepting a mag-stripe.

In the past the current rates were justified by "fraud prevention". But if that's no longer as huge of a concern (thanks to EMV and other technologies), how else do you justify those rates? When you swipe a card it's basically computers doing all the work behind the scenes, so it's not like there's a significant amount of manual effort either.

IMO, a reduction in swipe fees is inevitable for both debit and credit. Durbin just accelerated it on the debit side is all.

The United States is a free market... But that doofus, Durbin, had to stick his hands where they didn't belong, and it's completely screwed up the debit card system resulting in higher bank fees, more bank fees, delay in EMV certifications, and a lower or eliminated rewards structure for most debit cards. I guess Durbin doesn't understand what a capitalist free market is, but then again, politicians don't know anything about this country, they just pretend they do.

So if the debit card market is in demand enough where merchants need/are willing to accept debit cards at a 3% or 4% interchange rate, that's their problem, not ours. Hopefully the next president will ask congress to look back into the Durbin amendment and have it eliminated.

It's a free market on the banks' side. Merchants' choices are basically:
  1. Only accept cash.
  2. Only accept debit cards over the debit networks.
  3. Accept Visa/MC (+ maybe AmEx/Discover).
1 and 2 are definitely doable but it's far more of a challenge than just accepting all cards. Not to mention that in some cases customers basically bypass the merchants' preferences and choose to run their debit cards over Visa/MC. Which, coincidentally, is why Home Depot and Walmart are suing the latter right now.

Europeans seem to think differently than Americans when it come to debt

Honestly, maybe that's a good thing.
 
In the past the current rates were justified by "fraud prevention". But if that's no longer as huge of a concern (thanks to EMV and other technologies), how else do you justify those rates?

As Visa recently told Congress, the fraud just moves elsewhere.

In the case of a switch to EMV for in person purchases, criminals move to online purchases, and worse: theft after shoulder surfing a PIN, and ATM card capture after skimming the PIN.

For example, between 2005 and 2013 during the UK switch to chip & PIN, overall fraud actually increased by almost 10%.

When you swipe a card it's basically computers doing all the work behind the scenes, so it's not like there's a significant amount of manual effort either.

In the US, there's been heavy server side R&D into real time fraud detection (which is one reason the US was able to wait much longer to switch to EMV).
 
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This seems smart. A universal app that people with Android/iPhone/Windows can use.

I'm an Australian and only AMEX and ANZ offer Apple Pay. Almost no one uses it because it is still faster to pull out a card and PayWave.
 
This seems smart. A universal app that people with Android/iPhone/Windows can use.

I'm an Australian and only AMEX and ANZ offer Apple Pay. Almost no one uses it because it is still faster to pull out a card and PayWave.

If only it was actually convenient.

Edit: Walmart Pay, that is.
 
As Visa recently told Congress, the fraud just moves elsewhere.

Good thing there are already solutions to help with that.

In the US, there's been heavy server side R&D into real time fraud detection (which is one reason the US was able to wait much longer to switch to EMV).

A lot of that is a one-time cost. Not to mention that they'll very likely be able to kill a lot of the heuristics thanks to EMV.
 
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