Just used it for the first time this weekend. Honestly, it is pretty cool. I do appreciate the card number is different on the receipt than my actual card. Obviously that's the point of it; security, but I appreciate it
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Apple Pay Said to Launch in Switzerland on June 13
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I've never seen a receipt show anymore than the last 4-digits of the credit card number, so, I'm unsure of your security concerns with that?
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Aside from USA gas stations discounting by 4¢/gal for cash, I've never seen another merchant offer this.
In the USA, the cost to upgrade to NFC POS is about 500$/terminal if using the kind like the big merchants use (in Europe, the sixt terminal upgrades are more expensive.)
The cost of shifting the liability back to the card companies w/a square chip/NFC terminal is under 100$, with a fixed transaction fee of around 2.75% (IDRE); I assume this is comparable to fees using a standard POS terminal.
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The point of a different number assigned to your iPhone or Apple Watch is that if the POS terminal is comprimised (remember Target?) your card and account is in affected.
Hackers can get your alias account 24/7 and not make use of it because it is tokenized with an auto generated single use pin.
I no longer fear tossing receipts (except for non Apple Pay transactions) in the trash anymore and when I see ApplePay on my monthly statement, I move on to the next item. It certainly speeds up monthly reconciliations.
In the USA, the cost to upgrade to NFC POS is about 500$/terminal if using the kind like the big merchants use (in Europe, the sixt terminal upgrades are more expensive.)
The cost of shifting the liability back to the card companies w/a square chip/NFC terminal is under 100$, with a fixed transaction fee of around 2.75% (IDRE); I assume this is comparable to fees using a standard POS terminal.
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@RedO: you're focused the wrong thing.
The point of a different number assigned to your iPhone or Apple Watch is that if the POS terminal is comprimised (remember Target?) your card and account is in affected.
Hackers can get your alias account 24/7 and not make use of it because it is tokenized with an auto generated single use pin.
I no longer fear tossing receipts (except for non Apple Pay transactions) in the trash anymore and when I see ApplePay on my monthly statement, I move on to the next item. It certainly speeds up monthly reconciliations.
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I'm not talking about the AP transaction. I'm talking about the receipt, any merchant receipt, where a CC was used, which is what the poster was talking about.
The vending machines at my work charge 10c extra if you use a card, plus a lot of food places around me have $5-10 minimums--with most allowing card use for less if you're willing to pay 25-50c extra. YMMV of course.
And 2.75% + monthly fees is still more than a lot of places would like to spend. Hence why Walmart et al keep suing Visa. (Yes, I'm aware Walmart doesn't pay anything near that, but they'd still like card processing to be nearly free.)
Also parking meters! In Lausanne, many new parking meters support contactless. I've payed myself with the watch.
Even if not doesn't come to Switzerland, you can still use your Apple Pay. If a contactless terminal is present you can use Apple Pay. Germany has no Apple Pay, but I used it there on several occasions.
I was looking for this last week but didn't see yet. I'm sure the desire to avoid emptying the coin box will drive changes.
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I bought my Apple Watch in Augsburg a year ago. Wasn't able to use Apple Pay for anything (not even buying watch in Apple Store) until I was back in Switzerland. Few POS terminals there seemed to have NFC.
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Understood and agreed.
But as far as the receipt goes, it's not that important (assuming that all merchants hide most of the number). But the big security improvement is everything that goes on behind the scenes that culminated in printing the receipt. There is novo get any real way for your number to really go astray using ApplePay.
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Or, people are ready to use Apple Pay as credit card usage here increases (Coop and Migros offer free credit cards) and the merger of Twint and PayMit is a desperate move by them to try and keep a share of the market. That's how I see it. However, I'll actually be disappointed when Apple Pay finally arrives here as I've been using it for months with a UK credit card and I enjoy seeing the surprised faces of the cashiers as I wave my phone next to the contactless reader.
Even the last 4 digits make a difference
Even
Working in finance, believe me, that can be enough sometimes.
Sorry man, there's absolutely nothing anyone can do with a receipt showing the last 4-digits of a CC number on a merchant's receipt ... zip, zero, zilch ... what, guess the other 12 numbers?
Because if that were the case Apple Pay is in trouble, because the Wallet App shows the last 4-digits of my CC ... yikes ... now of course they'll have to hack my iPhone to see it and good luck with that.
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I've heard both arguments for and against this risk. Please cite some examples if misuse of a receipt with obscured numbers.
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Yes, despair, Apple is clearly doomed by a pre-paid payment system that no one outside of Switzerland will ever hear of.
I'm sure the brain trust behind these systems said something like that Palm CEO of long ago said about Apple entering the mobile phone business (paraphrase): "finance is hard, if apple thinks they are just going to waltz into the finance business they had better think again."
The reality is the Swiss economy depends on a large chunk of tourism and none of those visitors will be using the home grown solution so the payment infrastructure will have to continue to support Apple Pay.
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I suspect it's the same as in Poland.
Contactless payments are... how to call it... normal. They were introduced a long time ago, banks can issue you even a sticker with NFC that you can use for paying.
Banks with mobile carries have even work it through to be independent of your phone/system and you can have a special SIM card with NFC. Only US stands in place with technology.
And it's not about introducing, but about widespread usage and acceptance.
Citi used to have those in the states. The banks are so stupid here they offer contactless stickers and cards in other countries, but then go, "Oh, it's the United States, we'll do it everywhere but here. "
I sure hope you are joking. or else you are spectacularly misinformed of what good credit cards can offer if used correctly.
just a few things that my BMO credit card does and it isn't even the best one.
- 1.75% cash back on all purchases
- free roadside assistance and towing
- extended warranty for 2 yrs on all purchases
- 180 days protection from theft and damage on all purchases
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If you're from the U.S you sound completely ridiculous. No offense.
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You do realize that's the last four of the token number right?
On the merchant receipt, if you use Apple Pay, it shows the last 4-digits of the DEVICE NUMBER tied to the CC; if you use your CC WITHOUT Apple Pay, the last 4-digits of your CC are shown on the receipt. The picture of my CC, in Apple Wallet, shows the last 4-digits of that CC.
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It's called Phising? But hey man, I'm glad you're naive enough to think this stuff is actually secure.
I surely am spectacularly misinformed.
I'm not from the U.S. None taken.
I'm obviously from Switzerland and can't - yet - think on one advantage Apple Pay would have if I need to apply for a free but not so free credit card. They end up charging you all kind of fees for almost every single transaction right ?
But as I said I am spectacularly misinformed. Maybe my fellow swiss members could enlighten me with all the great advantages or disadvantages that would come with a free MasterCard SupercardPlus.
According to the summary I've attached below, the benefits of the MC Coop Supercard aren't as rich as those seen with the free CC's on offer in the USA. There are also a lot of little administrative charges that one doesn't tend to see with USA based free cards.
From the summary, advantages seem to be that one does earn Supercard points when shopping at other merchants and there is purchase return insurance (the details are scant, and I'm going to do some more research), and if the card issuer buys into Apple Pay, then there is this advantage.
I'm going to look for more expanded AGB's (GT&C) to see what other benefits there might be (but I also note that this card is issued by Credit Suisse who as a member of the Swiss banking oligarchy is good at charging high fees for not commensurately better customer service.)
http://www.coop.ch/pb/site/common2/..._SCplus_Leistungsuebersicht_D.pdf?secure=true
COOP AGB's:
http://www.coop.ch/pb/site/common2/...DF/ab_01072015_AGB_Consumer_D.pdf?secure=true
MIGROS:
Migros CC (issued by Ceremba, former GE Capital) is similar to that from Coop. It doesn't seem to offer purchase return insurance but it does offer a better travel insurance than the Coop card does. Depending on the relative redemption value of Cumulus vs Supercard points, the rewards for out of system purchases seem greater with Migros 1 pt/2 CHF than with Coop 1 pt/3 CHF.
MIGROS AGB:
https://www.migros.ch/dam/jcr:94fe7...a/Cembra_Cumulus_MC_Feetable_V3-01-2016_D.PDF
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Fees only apply to transactions that are not in CHF.
In other countries, Apple Pay also works with debit cards, so there is no technical reason why you couldn't use Apple Pay with your Maestro card. Cornèr doesn't issue debit cards AFAIK, so it's more a question of when a Swiss bank like CS or UBS caves and offers Apple Pay with its products.
Switzerland tends to charge for everything. In the UK, where I'm from, banks fall over themselves to offer free credit cards and you can set up direct debits so the full amount is paid off each month. The CC companies make their money in the fees they charge to the merchants in cases like mine.
Switzerland is only just starting to go down this route, as until recently the only way to get a "free" credit card was to buy a half-price pass for the trains and have it incorporated in that (a deal no longer possible). Most people pay for things in cash or use a debit card. In a country with relatively high salaries, almost permanently low inflation and hence close-to-zero interest rates there's really no need to put items on credit.
Apple Pay, at launch here, seems to only be being supported by banks which charge for their credit cards and hence I don't see it being a success. The advantages of paying by CC (not carrying large amounts of cash, usually some kind of insurance, the fact if the card is scammed the money's not coming directly out of your bank like a debit card) don't outweigh the annual fee for most people and hence Apple Pay won't be popular.
The fact that Coop and Migros are the two main (only?) providers of annual-fee-free credit cards here, and they are invested in TWINT (a competitor to Apple Pay) means any progress will be slow. And hardly anyone will care.
Switzerland is only just starting to go down this route, as until recently the only way to get a "free" credit card was to buy a half-price pass for the trains and have it incorporated in that (a deal no longer possible). Most people pay for things in cash or use a debit card. In a country with relatively high salaries, almost permanently low inflation and hence close-to-zero interest rates there's really no need to put items on credit.
Apple Pay, at launch here, seems to only be being supported by banks which charge for their credit cards and hence I don't see it being a success. The advantages of paying by CC (not carrying large amounts of cash, usually some kind of insurance, the fact if the card is scammed the money's not coming directly out of your bank like a debit card) don't outweigh the annual fee for most people and hence Apple Pay won't be popular.
The fact that Coop and Migros are the two main (only?) providers of annual-fee-free credit cards here, and they are invested in TWINT (a competitor to Apple Pay) means any progress will be slow. And hardly anyone will care.
I used Boon app to add my danish cards. Zero issues, works like a charm. Only thing is top up takes a bit too long in my opinion. I have no ida if it's my internet connection or high Boon user load. Oh and update app resolution.
I agree with your analysis. It will be interesting to see how this situation evolves.
I know plenty of folks that do have a credit card, but few use them.
I did a review of the terms & conditions doc for both the Migros and coop annual-fee-free cards, and was surprised at the thin benefits (Coop had purchase return insurance and Migros had travel insurance) and array of fees for things that are free with a USA-issued card.
I think the same folks that holler "protectionism" at Apple for reserving the TouchID function to its Apple Pay will push the idea of the Twint partners blocking Apple Pay like the now-dead CurrentC consortium did. (The difference being Twint seems to be based on a better tech than CurrentC was so Twint uptake should generally be better.)