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Apple Planning November Launch of Apple Pay in Canada

macmurray said:
Scotia Momentum Visa Infinite. It has a $99 annual fee, +$29 for supplementary cards, but we get around $800 a year cash back on it so it pays for itself pretty quickly. They have two other Momentum cards with a lower annual/no fee with lower cash back levels as well.

Glad to hear that ApplePay shouldn't affect the cash back. Now we just need it to launch!
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you have to be careful though with cards with Anual fees

Sounds like it is worth it for you, but someone who spends significantly less might end up spending MORE on the annual fee than they make back! (I would actually lose about $20/year if I had gotten that card)
 
LordVic said:
I think that this might be one of the biggest barriers to these services in Canada.

We have very strict regulations regarding privacy and dissemination of personal information.

Basically: any company operating in Canada cannot keep and store personal information without several steps
1. Giving you an "opt in" to collect information. "opt out" isn't enough, you have to consciously say 'yes'

2. The collection of the information must be clearly identified to why it is collected, and how it is to be used.

3. The information collected can only be used for the purposes identified in the above uses and Cannot be used for purposes not expressly agreed upon.

4. The information, once no longer usable by those outlined purposes, must be destroyed / scrubbed of identifiable information and cannot be in the future used or linked to an identifiable individual.

5. At no point can identifiable personal information ever be sold to 3rd parties.

though, there are even more rules, these are the big ones that passed in the PIPEDA act. https://www.priv.gc.ca/leg_c/leg_c_p_e.asp


However, you are completely incorrect in how Google, Apple and most of the big players use your data. They do not take it, and resell your data. They take it, Use advanced statistics and algorithms for it, and then sell the resulting information. There's no personal information being sold. What they're selling is "from our statistics, X amount of people Enjoy Y products, so, pay us Z amount of money and we'll make sure they those X people see your adds."

if you believe your personal information is being directly sold to other's by google or apple, you've believed way too much of the FUD in here.
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That's more of a detriment to Google.

Apple isn't interested in collecting personal data with Apple Pay. They know they'd get slammed by regulatory bodies for that. They just want to keep you in their ecosystem.
 
"The banks are open to an agreement, but they aren’t happy with Apple’s fee proposals and are concerned about security vulnerabilities like the ones that U.S. banks experienced as they rolled out the service, the people said."

Several red herrings in that statement:
- banks Are afraid of losing even 0.15% fee to Apple;
- banks don't see their current credit card system as being fraud-u-listicly weak as the current USA mag stripe system is (therefore, they see Apple's fee as being inordinately high for a service that doesn't solve an expensive immediate or future problem;
- they are VERY worried about giving Apple a foothold in this market, by granting them mind-share. The risk here is that wide-spread use (and confidence in) Apple Pay will act as a gateway for Apple to eventually sherlock the banks (and credit card networks) by either/both opening up its own network, or (egads!) it's own bank*.

The banks are hiding behind a security ruse to play for time, hoping to get better terms from Apple as a result; if they never come to terms, they, in a strategic sense, would be much happier. The security reality is that Pay is much more secure than almost any other solution heretofore, and that the recent problems stemmed from banks choosing little to no verification ("green path") for the cards being added into the Pay system.

I'm not clear if the interchange fees charged by the card networks and banks are in line with the U.S., or not, but if they are more in line with the very low caps proposed in the EU, then an Apple service fee as large as that in the U.S. (Especially for a service not likely to be seen by banks as in their interest) will be near to insurmountable.

If Apple is playing the long game, then getting Pay up and running, even if being limited to a break-even fee, is essential. (Of course, Apple, in order to not tip its hand, will have to try to demand the same fee as in the U.S., perhaps adjusted for local fraud rates and any fee cap, as well as reinforcing the idea that the service is not a Trojan springboard into banking, but is only there to support the sale of its hardware.)

*eventually, Apple might choose to do this to keep its growth rate on track (it already has enough resources to do it if it chose, but such a big step will be saved for when the Company is much larger and needs big initiatives to overcome the "financial law of large numbers". Apple is giving the banks a chance to get into bed with them, until such time as Apple chooses to disrupt their industry and decimate them.
 
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lunarworks said:
That's more of a detriment to Google.

Apple isn't interested in collecting personal data with Apple Pay. They know they'd get slammed by regulatory bodies for that. They just want to keep you in their ecosystem.
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I know. a lot of companies get turned off by these regulations and just avoid doing business here, Even if they're not violating the laws.

Facebook was made a strong example of a few years back when they changed their security and privacy policy to be more open (we all remember zuckerburgs big "there will be no private information" statement).
https://www.priv.gc.ca/cf-dc/2009/2009_008_0716_e.asp


Canadian regulators told him outright "if you want Canadians on your site, then you fix your laws". the CRTC/Canadian regulators were about ready to ban facebook outright and file charges against him. (PIPEDA can in fact find people criminally negligent, even if they are incorporated)
 
LordVic said:
you have to be careful though with cards with Anual fees

Sounds like it is worth it for you, but someone who spends significantly less might end up spending MORE on the annual fee than they make back! (I would actually lose about $20/year if I had gotten that card)
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Oh absolutely. You have to do the math for your situation. We (my wife and I) made a decision to filter all spending through these cards and it ends up netting us quite a bit of cash every year. The other thing to keep in mind is make sure you pay the entire balance off every month, otherwise the interest and annual fees will end up eclipsing any cash back you've earned (and the bank is counting on this). Be the smart fish, take the bait but leave the hook (thanks YNAB)!
 
Wow, well that's about time! These banks just own Canadians! 6 banks taking 90% of customers means that we have no competition and the banks can walk all over us with fees and policies. The old guys that run them know nothing about technology and think that they're app that requires a huge amount of administration to use could replace Apple pay. Who's going to use Royals wallet app at a till? You're telling me I'm going to walk up to the till, type in my encrypted password, then pay. Canadians are patient, but not sure if they would wait for me to do that in line. The banks here haven't even integrated the thumb print scanner into they're apps. While I'm happy to see that we might see Apple pay in November, I question why it isn't coming out now, 7 months after release. 6 banks would take no time for apple, as they're rolling out with 30 per week in the states. Canadian banks suck!
 
so annoying with these banks, why isn't my fingerprint good enough? why worry and just try to delay something and try to milk more money.

This should have been ready 6 months ago. They are all just trying to prevent the inevitable so things like RBC's SecureCloud...etc can take hold before applepay comes in and take over.
 
macmurray said:
Oh absolutely. You have to do the math for your situation. We (my wife and I) made a decision to filter all spending through these cards and it ends up netting us quite a bit of cash every year. The other thing to keep in mind is make sure you pay the entire balance off every month, otherwise the interest and annual fees will end up eclipsing any cash back you've earned (and the bank is counting on this). Be the smart fish, take the bait but leave the hook (thanks YNAB)!
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its great to have such options.

I opted tog o for the simple PC mastercard. No Annaul fees. I do the same. I spend everything on this card for the rewards, carry zero balance on it, at the end of the year I get about $100 back in free groceries.

I really don't spend a lot outside my fixed costs :p
 
roadbloc said:
I don't want my information being spread about thanks. No matter how secure it's meant to be. I'd like the info I gave to the bank to stay with the bank.


How do you know this? Do you know all of the details behind Apple's agreements with the UK banks over ApplePay. Do share if you do. With a reliable source please.


Again, do you know this for definite or are you just saying that because Apple said it? What is more secure about Apple Pay then the current NFC system already set up by the banks

Eh? It has everything to do with the banks. It was Apple who wanted to distance themselves from services like Google Wallet by bypassing the card companies and going straight to the banks.
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Um.. Why worry about apple pay when in the UK you can almost run a documentry using only cctv camera footage. Add in satellite, mobile footage, remote audio acquisition and your got yourself a doc film. Now that was over a decade ago when I worked with the intel community, before moving into telecom industry.
 
Jmwh said:
I don't believe they will wait until November in Canada it doesn't make any sense. If it will take that long then they don't have an agreement yet.
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This is my thought/fear as well. Why so long if they're already negotiating.
 
great news! Apple Pay will right away be much bigger in Canada than in US because NFC is so ubiquitous here. and with all big 5 banks on board most people will have access to it with at least some of their existing cards.
I do hope it happens before the next iphone launch. I probably won't upgrade my iphone this year unless Apple Pay is here.
 
Damn, my no-fee bank Tangerine is not listed. Usually they're ahead of the curve with tech stuff like this since they done actually have physical branches. Here's hoping that changes.

Also, does anyone know if Amex is supported since the card I have doesn't seem to be affiliated with a bank? (Amex Simply Cash)
 
Thinking more about it (and it may just be me being optimistic), but maybe the 6 month delay is to give them time to work out implementing a secondary authentication method. So maybe talks are moving ahead, but it's hanging on Apple implementing such system.

Exciting news!
 
taran420 said:
I don't get why people hate on apple for not releasing things worldwide. If they had a choice why wouldn't they? They have to work with that countries rules and regulations and get all sorts of clearance.

For example iTunes Radio in Canada, they likely have to go through CRTC and boy are they a bunch of *******s. I'm sure each country has its own organization that apple needs to negotiate with before launching services.

I'm sure Apple isn't against making profit by launching worldwide from the get go ��
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I think we dislike the fact that if we buy Apple products we don't exactly get a discount for not getting the full feature set - in-fact I think in the UK we pay more than anywhere else in the world now for Apple products ($1283 for steel 42mm Apple watch!), not only do we not have Apple Pay but still no sign of even getting Apple Radio! We've been using wireless payments for quite a while at most major outlets, the infrastructure is in place...
 
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Finally!! I wish it was planned for sooner than November but it's better late than never. Just about every store I shop at has contactless payment terminals so Canada is the perfect place to make use of Apple Pay.
 
Chrisbc said:
The banks here haven't even integrated the thumb print scanner into they're apps.
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Tangerine uses TouchID to access the login screen on their app as an additional security measure. They also have passbook integration for quickly checking your account balances and recent transactions.
 
I thoughts theyd be aiming for September, to coincide with the new iPhone launch.

And I was really hoping the UK would be involved by then, if not before. We have NFC credit and debit cards so most shops already have readers.
 
macmurray said:
November?! I mean, yay! But November? That's 6 months and a new iPhone away... Oh well, at least it's (maybe) on the horizon (provided our greedy banks aren't too greedy).

Canada is WAY more prepared for contactless mobile payments, I tap my credit card/debit card basically every time I use them. Once ApplePay launches we'll be able to use it virtually everywhere!

My only concern is I have a GREAT cash back credit card that we use for all purchases. 4% on gas and groceries, 2% on drug stores and recurring payments and 1% on everything else. I wonder if I'll still have these perks if paying through ApplePay? Is there a precedent for a card like this in the US? Do the rewards stay the same regardless of if you pay with the card itself or with ApplePay?
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Yes. I still get cash back with my CC through Apple Pay. The only difference is the added security because retailers can't store your cc information.
 
V.K. said:
great news! Apple Pay will right away be much bigger in Canada than in US because NFC is so ubiquitous here. and with all big 5 banks on board most people will have access to it with at least some of their existing cards.
I do hope it happens before the next iphone launch. I probably won't upgrade my iphone this year unless Apple Pay is here.
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Unless your retailers revolt because they risk loosing tracking data.

That's what we've had here at some of our retailers 'CVS? RiteAid? who worked at launched, but blocked it because they lose the ability to datamine their customers.

There is a huge consortium of retailers who reject NFC now for this reason alone.
 
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