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Yep. I guess people here think $99/year covers IT ALL?
Apple could just make iOS development tools free of charge in the same way Google does with Android Studio and Microsoft do with Windows tools. They have the cash! They could also port the tools to Windows as well.

This would allow educational establishments to teach Swift in ICT lessons and for students to be able to create and distribute apps in class free of any sorts of charges.
 
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You're largely correct here actually. Apple and Google will still charge their commission for apps in their stores, as they have a right to. I did overstate the case a bit, since I suspect most devs will remain in the App Store. It will still be a cash cow for Apple, but devs will have an option for going around it if they want.

Thanks!

Yeah I, too, think most apps will stay in the App Store for simplicity. One-person devs making a tiny app might not want to deal with the hassles outside the store.

But games might be a different story. If a medium-to-large game developer can set up a website where you download their game and they don't have to pay Apple 30% to buy gems, or gold, or whatever... I think it's gonna be a goldrush (pun intended!)

Also... I wonder if sideloaded games and/or 3rd-party app store games will have to be checked by Apple in some way?

Will it be as simple as compiling the game and uploading it to your web server? Or will Apple still have to check it?

Because who knows what kind of shady a stuff could be in that game. Weekly charges or other nastiness.

If we think Apple has problems with scammy games in the App Store (and they do)... lord help those who download some scammy game from some scammy developer's website.

I get ads all the time in my Instagram feed for games. But it takes you to the App Store where it's (hopefully) safe.

Now imagine if it took you to some scammy website with a big green download button.

We always say "if you don't want to use sideloading or 3rd-party app stores... you don't have to..."

Well I imagine a lot of people will be sent there. Tricked.

But alas... I guess we'll have to put up with those risks to make Apple more competitive and less anti-trusty or whatever.

It'll be interesting to watch. Look at how much conversation we get in these forums before anything has actually changed!

:p
 
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Seriously? Well compare Apple Music against Spotify. Why should Apple Music profit from a 30% gain that Spotify has to pay. How would you solve it? So either Spotify doesn‘t need to pay anything like Apple Music, or the EU has to split Apple into Apple Hardware Inc and Apple Music Inc. This would also create equal conditions. Splitting companies is a well suited tool when it comes to fighting anti competitive behaviour.
Same is true for Apples IAP - why isn’t a company like Paypal allowed to offer a competing IAP service? Or why isn‘t my SNP IAP service i created allowed, too? I mean SNP would completely change the way we pay. Why is Apple allowed to block innovation? (If you wonder - SNP stands for SuperNaturalPayment System).

Sometimes things turn out to be very easy and sometimes people don‘t understand it, just bevause they don‘t want to understand it. But this the way our markets and our economy works.
It’s simple to me. Without apple, where is Spotify going to get subscribers? The web and android? How much would that cost them? If the built a phone that people wanted then apple couldn’t sell their music software in the Spotify App Store without giving a cut. Dave’s killer bread has to give up a cut to sell at Walmart. It’s the same thing. If Dave wants to build a store for just his bread he gives up nothing to anyone.
 
Random thought on this... Would a phone that has never installed "3rd party" apps potentially hold a higher resale value ?

Maybe Apple could add "Apple Certified" in the System information for phones that have ONLY used the official store.
 
And when I do not place it in the store and sell it via other methods Apple gets nada.
That is the point.
No one is stopping you from selling source code. But selling a packaged app outside the App Store will be useless since it has to be on the App Store to run on iOS devices.
 
No one is stopping you from selling source code. But selling a packaged app outside the App Store will be useless since it has to be on the App Store to run on iOS devices.

Think you missed the predecessor to these ... this was if there was a 3rd party app store (Apple forced to allow) - what or should Apple charge anything for Apps that never saw the App Store and sold 3rd party only.
 
I have XCode downloaded and am coding in it right now....all without paying Apple $99.
With not paying the $99/year you won’t be able to officially release on iOS App Store nor Mac App Store. Your app won’t be signed either, which means you will probably have a hard time getting anyone to run it. But good luck ??
 
With not paying the $99/year you won’t be able to officially release on iOS App Store nor Mac App Store. Your app won’t be signed either, which means you will probably have a hard time getting anyone to run it. But good luck ??
The $99 a year for becoming an official apple dev is a pittance compared to what it used to cost before the iPhone App Store became a thing. No one should be complaining about that cost.
 
Random thought on this... Would a phone that has never installed "3rd party" apps potentially hold a higher resale value ?

Maybe Apple could add "Apple Certified" in the System information for phones that have ONLY used the official store.
That’s a class action lawsuit in the making and there would be all kinds of a kerfuffle for Apple PR wise. This is why they are trying to stop this idiocy before it gains too much momentum.
 
Then advocate for more places to "shop" (meaning more than Android and Apple....not stores on each phone). Provide tax benefits or offer incentives/assistance to Microsoft or anyone wanting to start a competing product. Regulating the heck out of two massive companies does not fix the main problem - big tech. We need MORE companies involved, not extremely regulated 1 or 2 companies.

I don't like that its just Android and Apple. This doesn't solve the main issue.
I don‘t like Google to be the „only“ search engine. So what? It is a good search engine and it plays a dominant role. Google was regulated and told that it is forbidden to abuse its dominant role. If it does it has to pay looooots of money.

There is a reason why the governments control the markets and fighting anti competitive behavior is one of their tasks. Some contries decided to have a social market economy and participation brings duties.

Again, so what? Just play by the rules.
 
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You guys are running out of countries that you're calling for Apple to pull out of.

Well I keep a list of them :) As someone mentioned in another reply, only US and China has never been called out. There were calls to pull supply chain out of China, but not operations.
 
They bring them up because there is no one complaining that they can't develop their own playstation games and sell them on their own website.

They don't, because walmart doesn't own you. Apple does however own iOS. You might own some aluminum and glass (assuming your phone is paid off - odds are, its not), but you don't own iOS, you have a very limited license to use it. So while Walmart can't tell you not to shop elsewhere, Apple can tell you what you can do with iOS.
Microsoft owns Windows, but they wouldn't be able to get away with restricting apps to their own store. There are a similar number of iOS devices in use worldwide as there are Windows devices in use. For any "they aren't a monopoly" arguments: I've described how iOS users are a captive market in another lengthy post, so I'm not going to repeat myself here. At the end of the day, there are well over 1 billion active users in the iOS market, and I view any argument that Apple is somehow entitled to 15- 30% of all transactions in that market for eternity as absurd.

Why is it absurd? Apple opened up the App Store to third party developers so they could a) develop less software and b) advertise that their phones have thousands of apps (now much more). Without developers, Apple's iPhone sales would be horrible at this point, probably single digit percentages of what they are now. Apple would be toiling away trying in vain to make enough apps to compete with Android's third party ecosystem, but there's no way they could do that on their own.

The cumulative development hours that third party developers have collectively put into building the iOS ecosystem massively dwarfs the time Apple has put into doing the same. The idea that Apple is responsible for 30% of that revenue is absurd if you think of it in terms development time spent. If Apple took a 0% cut they'd still have disproportionate gains based on man-hours put into it, just because of all the extra iOS devices they were able to sell. Apple deserves credit for creating a revolutionary device, and for making it so developer friendly. They have been rewarded massively in hardware sales because of it, but they are also massively overstating their role when it comes to third party software sales revenue.
 
Then you're ignoring it. We're talking literally hundreds of pages of combined forums posts in just the last few months. Most of the threads with many the same familiar faces, including yours and mine.

Look, you can acknowledge the stated reasons for "why it's such a big deal" without necessarily agreeing with those reasons.
Then explain it to me....Nobody has. I have never seen a direct reason why this is such a big flipping deal if nobody side loads on Android when the option already exists. What amazing great almighty app are we missing that is only available through side loading?
 
Have you ever tried doing third party on Android?
Google deliberately makes is cumbersome and keeps dropping in dire warnings of doom and gloom.

Many users abandon it when they start getting the pop-ups. The last third party store I added to my Android took 12 steps and had 3 "warnings". It does vary.
And app I use on an android device is exclusively only available on their website. Its not on the Play Store at all so yes I have.
 
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you can't seriously be trying to split that hair... of course I wasn't talking about developers in a more general context... seriously????
So its my fault by taking what you say? How am I supposed to read between the lines? You stated that as a fact, and I proved that fact to be false. Why not just admit it was a mistake for you to say that?
 
So its my fault by taking what you say? How am I supposed to read between the lines? You stated that as a fact, and I proved that fact to be false. Why not just admit it was a mistake for you to say that?
Try to become one with another, this is my suggestion to you as an individual
 
Why do you have an inherent right to download any arbitrary dev's app from the App Store? One of the arguments I frequently see folks make is that a dev should just make their own platform and ecosystem if they don't like Apple's or Google's terms. Well if you don't like a dev's distribution method, why don't you write your own app that does the same thing? Or even easier, download an app from the App Store from a competitor that fulfills that need. You're basically demanding the maintenance of a digital feudal system where Apple is the lord and devs are all vassals that must be subject that whatever Apple demands. All because you have some misplaced belief that catastrophic things will happen otherwise.
I am sorry but....what? People constantly counter all of this saying "nothing will change, you can keep your walled garden and NOTHING WILL CHANGE". YES IT WILL! And you just said so. So people need to stop saying "nothing will change".
 
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I am sorry but....what? People constantly counter all of this saying "nothing will change, you can keep your walled garden and NOTHING WILL CHANGE". YES IT WILL! And you just said so. So people need to stop saying "nothing will change".
Glad that we have come to an agreement that is a winnable situation for the parties that may be to come involved in time
 
Try to become one with another, this is my suggestion to you as an individual
I really don't understand what you mean. It was stated as a fact that it costs $99 a year without even having an app. I even quoted that exact sentence WITHOUT MODIFICATION. I said it was not true, and then I get called that I am splitting hairs?

Can we please for once have just a decent conversation on this site? I have been here for 10 years and its just SO BAD right now.

I have said stuff that was wrong before, and you know what I did? I SAID SORRY!
 
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I really don't understand what you mean. It was stated as a fact that it costs $99 a year without even having an app. I even quoted that exact sentence WITHOUT MODIFICATION. I said it was not true, and then I get called that I am splitting hairs?

Can we please for once have just a decent conversation on this site? I have been here for 10 years and its just SO BAD right now.

I have said stuff that was wrong before, and you know what I did? I SAID SORRY!
Thank you for taking the time to apologize. Your apology is accepted and we can move on from this issue at hand
 
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