Apple Refunded Me for Lion & I'm Switching Back to Snow Leopard Tomorrow.

Discussion in 'Mac OS X Lion (10.7)' started by HappyDude20, Aug 19, 2011.

  1. HappyDude20 macrumors 68020

    HappyDude20

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    #1
    I remember earlier this year I was awaiting Lion like a kid rushing to the Christmas tree on Christmas morning.

    Disappointed in terms of my interrupted workflow; mainly spaces and the little differences between SL & Lion, Apple gave me a full refund for Lion earlier today after I cataloged to them why I wanted to switch back.

    Truth is, though I somewhat enjoy the full screen apps and being able to zoom into any text within Safari and being able to 3-finger click on any word for it's meaning............ Lion wasn't for me, considering the difficulty in morning between "spaces" in mission control. Spaces in Snow Leopard was the be-all of productivity in my option.

    Rather than making it feel like this thread is a rant, I'll plainly mention this thread is so others can see in the sea of thread in MacRumors that many Lion users just aren't that happy. This saddens me to say considering I first got an Apple laptop with OSX Tiger..falling in love with it, Leopard and Snow Leopard.
    The truth is, I don't see myself purchasing Lion at all and have jumped in the pane filled with people that will be waiting for OSX 10.8 to come out in 2013-ish.
     
  2. Žalgiris macrumors 6502a

    Žalgiris

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  3. HappyDude20 thread starter macrumors 68020

    HappyDude20

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    #3
    I don't think as an individual you need to know this, just as a collective eyeing through the array of threads that another invested user isn't happy with Lion.

    I know this was a rant, but considering my unease with Lion, I'm standing by it.
     
  4. sidewinder macrumors 68020

    sidewinder

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    #4
    In other words, you don't like change and are not willing to look at how the changes Apple made could be incorporated into your work flow.

    S-
     
  5. HappyDude20 thread starter macrumors 68020

    HappyDude20

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    #5
    Not in other words, no. I'm a huge fan of change, when it works and improves my overall workflow. I was anticipating Lion for months on end hoping it would only add to my productivity but in truth has diminished it. I love Apple for being innovative and grand in their updates though I can't help but think Lion wasn't that well thought out.

    Some things are great and some things are not. The areas that aren't great really hinder my workflow. I don't open my MBP every morning to go on YouTube, Hulu or MRs only; I go only to tackle what I need to do, which changes everyday and Mission Control gets in the way. I miss Spaces and can do without the need of a multitude of finger gestures on my MBP, as Apple seems to have only added so many into Lion in the hopes of iPhone+Window users wanting to switch to Apple.

    I've always wanted to persuade my folks to get an Apple computer, though there is a bit of a learning curve with Lion and in no way would recommend it to my folks now. Not unless they had Snow Leopard.
     
  6. Taz Mangus macrumors 68040

    Taz Mangus

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    #6
    I have installed on an external drive Snow Leopard 10.6.8. I created the Snow Leopard install so that I could use DiskWarrior, if needed, on family member's Mac computers. Anyhow, I booted to Snow Leopard on my iMac and you know what, Snow Leopard felt like a dinosaur compared to Lion. This after only about 6 weeks of use with Lion. I can't see myself going back to Snow Leopard at this point. And considering how 10.7.1 has made Lion a lot for stable, there is really no reason to go back to Snow Leopard. Lion has been a joy to use on all 3 of my Mac computers.

    Two of the new features that I really enjoy in Lion are the clamshell mode for my MacBook Pro and the seperate user screen login in screen sharing. Also, Lion seems to feel snappier and more integrated then Snow Leopard. Lion gives my MacBook Pro more of a "instant on" feel to it, never had that in Snow Leopard. Pretty amazing considering that my MacBook Pro is now about 2 years old.
     
  7. sidewinder macrumors 68020

    sidewinder

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    #7
    Mission Control has changed how you might use spaces, but certainly not in a way that would be a big impact to anyone's overall work output. Most of the functionality is there. You just have to do somethings in a different. Even if you the functionality you used is gone, there are other ways to get there from here.

    10.7 would not be a problem for your parents. The learning curve would, at worst, be the same as 10.6.

    S-
     
  8. wxman2003 Suspended

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    #8
    Not every new OS is actually better than the previous one for all people. Just ask Microsoft about Vista. It's taken how many years since that debacle to put out a decent OS in Windows 7? Not comparing Lion to Vista, but the newest isn't always the best.

    As for me, I prefer Lion over SL. It seems Lion was designed for the general consumer. In other words, computer dummies such as me.
     
  9. Bathplug macrumors 6502a

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  10. rowley macrumors 6502

    rowley

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    #10
    My main kit is not really up to handling Lions at the moment.
    Planning on saving and getting myself an Christmas present with shiny new operating systems, from what I've heard so far about Lion, it's the way to go.
     
  11. flabbergast macrumors newbie

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    #11
    Change is good

    So that I am not blown out of this thread, Change is good.......if it is good change. I am hunting for a way to remove Lion and go back to Snow Leopard. I must not have enough RAM to fully enjoy all the New Changes provided with Lion. Plus the fact that with Lion I can not use any of my meaningful apps with out a resounding Crash.

    Can any of you tell me how to go back to S Leopard? What I have found out thus far is that S Leopard will not be able to utilize the files used by Lion

    I just want to participate in some good change so that I can use my Mac

    ----------

    After reading another post here, I have to say Apple did the same thing with Lion as Windows did with Vista, in my mind, but worst since Apple has always been at least 100 cuts above Windows for me. I have to say I am shocked.
     
  12. Žalgiris, Aug 20, 2011
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2011

    Žalgiris macrumors 6502a

    Žalgiris

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    #12
    That's poor understanding you have there. I have people using Lion that don't even know that OS changed. Most drastic UI change is of course Mission Control, but other than that it's basically Snow Leopard UI wise.


    I really don't see why it's a problem. It works great. I just bought it, downloaded, installed and am using. Happy user. I had some problems, but nothing special, just usual problems.
     
  13. Keleko macrumors 68000

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    Mar 26, 2008
    #13
    I find I'm in the opposite camp. I never used Spaces before because I found it pretty cumbersome to use. Mission Control and 3 finger swipe between desktops and full screen apps made it much easier to use with Lion. So Apple's change made me finally use a feature I didn't like and rarely used previously.
     
  14. innercr macrumors newbie

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    Aug 23, 2011
    #14
    I am also considering switching back to Snow Leopard for reasons outlined by the poster and elsewhere. I just can't understand why Apple decided to simply drop some good features replacing them with some that are only good for dumb users?
    Like, for instance, I can't use a pinch gesture to increase the size of folders and text instantly anymore. This now involves multiple steps.
    Then, what's up with this memory usage?? I used be able to run MBP, Dreamweaver, browser, VMWare Fusion with Windows inside and still have at least 1gb of RAM remaining available out of 4Gb onboard. Now it barely suffices to have 4 gbs for multiple tasks, never mind running the Fusion, which freezes the Mac to a point that I have to reboot.
    I think the beauty of Mac was that it could manage the processes much better than Windows, but that was before Lion. Now my MBP takes longer to recharge and it drives me crazy with all the ever running apps that I have to manually terminate to free up RAM.
    After Lion upgrade it runs like Windows - slow and it probably needs 6Gbs at the very least.
    This is the productivity flaw that I'd never want. Most users get rid of Mission Control and LaunchPad 'cause the advanced user does not need more ways to open the App folder, etc.
    There's also a practical question: Do I need a functional machine to get my work done or do I need a replica of iPad?
    That is not to say that a work cannot be done on Lion, it just comes at higher expense - more money spent on RAM and the OS itself that does not really change anything besides full screen apps that aren't even provided by third party vendors as they wrote no API for Lion.
    I could go on and on but most would get the idea..

    ----------

    You can go back SL and re-install from the disks or from the Time Machine backup if you've done one prior to upgrade.

    Here's a link to some guides: http://gigaom.com/apple/how-to-downgrade-from-lion-to-snow-leopard/
     
  15. thadoggfather, Aug 23, 2011
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2011

    thadoggfather macrumors G3

    thadoggfather

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    #15
    I too went back to SL.

    I prefer it.

    I might not actually buy another Mac.

    Been pleased with Tiger, Leopard, and SL.

    Lion, not so much.

    Reasons?

    buggy graphics driver (not as smooth on my 13" 2010 MBP), battery life got significantly worse, Preview is annoying to make changes in and with the duplicate thing, Google Chrome crashes a lot when you try to upload stuff, and Mission Control sucks compared to Expose (try opening a lot of windows and you'll see).

    Also, seeing all your files in Finder? why? having to reinstall SMB3 for XBMC, annoying.

    Just not a fan.
     
  16. phpmaven macrumors 68040

    phpmaven

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    #16
    Huh? What is there in Lion that would be hard to learn as opposed to Snow Leopard? You lost me there.
     
  17. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

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    #17
    I think you're looking at it wrong. People are not complaining because of change but rather apple's modifications made our work flow harder and gets in the way of an already efficient OS. Some of the stuff apple added does not improve user interaction but detracts
     
  18. denisvj macrumors regular

    denisvj

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    #18
    +1

    Same here

    Never used Space and with Lion I found it very useful .
     
  19. harcosparky macrumors 68020

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    #19

    Human nature is to resist change, even change that will improve ones workflow.

    I recall when a manufacturing plant I worked in switched over to a new phone system that was computerized. People pizzed and moaned about having to learn a new system. Comments like " why do I need to " park " a call, why not just put it on " hold ".

    Three months in and a coworker in an assembly area got a phone call that was received in the office area. In the old system the call would have been put on hold and he would have had to run to the office area to pick up that call at the phone it was received on. However he was able to turn around and " unpark " that call and pick it up in the factory area. He was one of those who complained the loudest about the new system and when I brought it up to his attention he agreed that he must have been crazy to resist.

    I am fairly certain that if at the time of install he had the choice to go back to the old system he would have, but he was not given a choice and was forced to adapt. Often times people will revert back to a previous situation without really giving the new one a chance.


    Personally I have not fully switched to LION but I am almost there. I had it installed on a system along a Snow Leopard system and migrated slowly over to it. We are about 97% there and so far, so good.
     
  20. jbyun04 macrumors 6502a

    jbyun04

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    #20
    Another one here.

    I tried to like Spaces but I just couldn't. The way it is now in Lion, I like being able to swipe to the next space where I can have one dedicated to PS and another dedicated to textmate and another dedicated to browser. Some reason, I just couldn't stand it in SL but now with Mission Control and swiping it's a lot better to use.
     
  21. sidewinder macrumors 68020

    sidewinder

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    #21
    Some of the stuff Apple added detracts from user interaction in who's opinion? As far as I cam concerned, the changes made have vastly improved my my interaction with the OS. And I have been using some form of Mac OS since December, 1983. I think the vast majority of users out there tend to agree.

    What I see here, for the most part, is a subset of people whining because Apple has changed how things work and taking no steps to see if what Apple has changed is actually better.

    Do you think Apple made these changes because they thought they were making the user experience worse? If you do, well, there is no help for you. Apple made these changes to improve the experience. If you don't like change, you certainly are not going to think any of the changes are improvements.

    As I said previously, I embraced the changes and looked for ways to use the changes to improve how I work. I found them. You guys can either figure it out for yourselves, stick with 10.6.x until you can't get hardware for it, or move on to a different platform. Because I can pretty much guarantee that Apple is not going to change it back...

    Scott
     
  22. MartiNZ macrumors 65816

    MartiNZ

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    #22
    The difference being that MS allowed people with new hardware to downgrade to XP for like 4 years after the fact ... or are they still doing that now even? Post-Lion-Release Apple hardware is not capable of reverting to Snow Leopard, and so in even the reasonably short term there is no way back to the better version of the OS (SL). If you want to jump the software ship you pretty much have to jump the hardware ship as well, except for the fact that Macs run Windows better than most PCs, so I might stay for that fact.

    Oh and Vista never tried to make decisions for me; it was indeed one of the most subservient OSes, with UAC always making sure things were as I wanted them - maybe it took things too far, but it never decided which version of a file I wanted; and as a result it never lost the files I wanted when working with network/external drives. In that respect it had so many ups on Lion it isn't funny.
     
  23. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

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    #23
    In my opinion since its my work flow. I see that you think its an improvement in your opinion. You can't go and tell people they're afraid of change just because you see Lion in a positive aspect. I like change, I usually load beta OSs at the first chance I get.

    One reason I like OSX over windows is that it allows me to do my work without getting in the way. I can easily use my apps and not have the OS impact my performance, or the performance of the machine. Neither one of those items is true with Lion. There are many reports that Lion slows down a lot of people's computers and the stuff added in is either eye candy that does little or makes life harder for users.
     
  24. sidewinder macrumors 68020

    sidewinder

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    #24
    mayflynn,

    Explain how the changes Apple has made has hurt your workflow and how you cannot change your workflow to take advantages of the changes.....

    Oh, let's discount the little bugs (that obviously will get fixed) and whatnot since SL had them too.

    S-
     
  25. maflynn, Aug 23, 2011
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2011

    maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

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    #25
    One easy one is the lack of save as. I prefer maintaing my documents in an organization I choose and I prefer creating many of them with save as. Now I have to find alternatives.

    An OS' job is to run programs, a good OS does not get in the way of people working. Lion gets in the way. Why should I be forced to change my workflow and those changes actually do not improve my work flow but decreases it.

    My point is that Lion makes me work harder for me. You like it and it works well for you. You cannot go and now state that its going to be great for everyone they just need to change what they're doing to enjoy the OSX greatness.
     

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