Yes. An off-used tactic in internet "arguing". Don't discredit the post, discredit the poster combined with the McNamara fallacy leads to interesting posts.
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Apple Releases New Firmware for AirPods 2, AirPods 3, AirPods Pro 1 and AirPods Max
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Oh I’m sure they will. They’re chasing the point where transparency mode cancels out more noise than the actual ANC mode. Only then will they be satisfied while high-fiving themselves and laughing out loud diabolically. They are that evil. Crazy stuff.
On a more serious note, I’m sure most people with Airpods have never properly cleaned them (blu-tack e.g) and have also never even considered replacing the original silicone tips they initially come with.
They decrease in elasticity and hence don’t seal as good anymore after a certain period of time. Other manufacturers like Sennheiser or Beyerdynamic advice their customers to replace them regularly (every couple of months) to maintain the best possible long term sound quality and ANC performance. A friend of mine with first gen AirPods Pro was quite amazed by how much better his pair sounded again and how much better the ANC was again after a proper cleaning and a replacement of his „worn-out“ ear tips.
But of course it’s usually the newest firmware to blame, every time a new one gets released, too. It really is astonishing how each and every manufacturer seems to be similarly evil to their customers with regard to firmware updates in correlation with decreasing ANC performance and sound quality. It’s literally the same phenomenon every single time.
Must be a huge conspiracy going on behind our backs
I won't get into the debate about engineering or programmed obsolescence.
My early take is as follows:
Initially the the ANC seemed worse.
The "discovery" alluded to:
Produces an interesting result. The mono setting disables the spatial sound (totally). However it does seem to improve the ANC.
In terms of :
The debate at least for me is that spatial sound improves the hearing experience if you are listening to music inside. ANC makes a huge difference if you are in a noisy location (walking outside, office space, airplane, etc).
Sounds more like a trade off rather than an improvement.
My early take is as follows:
Initially the the ANC seemed worse.
The "discovery" alluded to:
Produces an interesting result. The mono setting disables the spatial sound (totally). However it does seem to improve the ANC.
In terms of :
That was done prior to all this: regular cleaning and changing the ear tips.
The debate at least for me is that spatial sound improves the hearing experience if you are listening to music inside. ANC makes a huge difference if you are in a noisy location (walking outside, office space, airplane, etc).
Sounds more like a trade off rather than an improvement.
M2C This latest update seems to have made my APMax completely screw up Siri Home Kit commands. Using HPMini, Phone, Watch, TV remote everything works well. Commands while wearing the APMax are not even close to the request. I have not tried the APP2 yet...
Now back to the normal "discussion"...
Now back to the normal "discussion"...
I’ve had this ever since I got my AP2, I keep losing that first part of every track , it’s really frustrating!
Maybe that's what the Apple polishing cloth is for, I'll have to order one and clean my AirPods /sOh I’m sure they will. They’re chasing the point where transparency mode cancels out more noise than the actual ANC mode. Only then will they be satisfied while high-fiving themselves and laughing out loud diabolically. They are that evil. Crazy stuff.
On a more serious note, I’m sure most people with Airpods have never properly cleaned them (blu-tack e.g) and have also never even considered replacing the original silicone tips they initially come with.
They decrease in elasticity and hence don’t seal as good anymore after a certain period of time. Other manufacturers like Sennheiser or Beyerdynamic advice their customers to replace them regularly (every couple of months) to maintain the best possible long term sound quality and ANC performance. A friend of mine with first gen AirPods Pro was quite amazed by how much better his pair sounded again and how much better the ANC was again after a proper cleaning and a replacement of his „worn-out“ ear tips.
But of course it’s usually the newest firmware to blame, every time a new one gets released, too. It really is astonishing how each and every manufacturer seems to be similarly evil to their customers with regard to firmware updates in correlation with decreasing ANC performance and sound quality. It’s literally the same phenomenon every single time.
Must be a huge conspiracy going on behind our backs
What side are you on?
Disprove it.
and what does it have to do with quantitative theory?
oh, so my one day old - or 6 week old - APP2 are “worn and torn”?
Yeah, I guess AppleCare should expire after two weeks.
ios 16 now shows noise reduction from AirPods ANC.
it is fact, and it is quantitative.
it is not anecdotal.
“relax”? My APP2 replaced APP1 whose ANC magically degraded with firmware 4E71.
the brand new case has parasitic battery loss every night. Fact.
and now after six weeks my APP2 ANC is trash, thanks to firmware 5B58.
Cleaning ear tips on brand new AirPods Pro? That makes no sense.
And I keep them on with ANC with no music playing. That is, you cannot even enable spatial sound.
I agree. The vast majority of ANC problems with APP Gen 1 and 2 stem from clogged vents and defective sensitive MEMS mics.
It took Apple 1 year to create a service program for APP Gen 1, because the return rate had been through the roof, with many customers swapping them more than 7-8 times. Apple prevented a class action lawsuit this way.
They tried to reduce the problem by recessing the vents. Originally, the vents were flush with the AirPod’s surface. By recessing the vents, they tried to give users a bit of “buffer room”, so that ear wax, dust, sweat, dead skin cells etc wouldn’t be pressed through the vent grid with force when making contact with the ear. This didn’t fix the fundamental problem. Depending on how you handle them, it merely delayed the issue.
Even with this high return rate, AirPods are one of the most profitable products at Apple, making them billions. Since the battery can’t be swapped out, it’s a money-printing machine when many people upgrade after max. 3 years.
Critical thinking isn’t everybody’s strong suit, especially on the internet. Thankfully, Apple introduced a function with APP Gen 1, the fit test, that helps to narrow the issue down. This isn’t a gimmick, it actually works. It plays a reference signal and listens to the output with its microphone. If the pressure is in the correct range, it passes the fit test. This is only the case when:
1. There is a good enough seal
2. The vents aren’t clogged up
3. The microphones aren’t damaged
If you passed the fit test initially or do with a new pair, but using your old tips, and now don’t, then you will experience a decline in ANC and bass performance.
If you pass the fit test and still feel that there is a drop in ANC / bass performance, then it is most likely just a placebo effect. You can sell people in the audio realm all sorts of snake oil and they think that it improves the sound, when it is scientifically impossible.
Examples:
- CD “demagnetizers”
- 2000$ cables
- CD scraping devices that scrape the outer edge of the plastic substrate layer
- USB “re-clocking” devices
Apple didn’t move the grid on APP Gen 2 due to design reasons or for fun. They moved it further away from the ear, in hope of preventing the accumulation of dirt in them.
Cleaning them with Blu Tack can help for a while, but also bears the risk of pushing fragments through the grid.
If you use alcohol to clean the vents, it will sip through into the AirPod, sooner or later destroying the very sensitive MEMS microphones. Water has enough surface tension to get stuck on the vent to a certain degree, but alcohol doesn’t, it goes right through.
Using compressed air will clear the vents for a while, but will ultimately damage the mics as well. It’s just a ****** design to begin with.
The best you can do is to clean them from the start with a microfiber cloth, several times per day. Don’t touch the vents, not even with the microfiber cloth. Swap the microfiber cloth or wash them regularly, because otherwise you just smear skin oil back onto them. Clean the tips with water and a tiny drop of soap, but detach them before you do. Then dry them thoroughly before re-attaching them.
Btw, other ANC headphones, like Sony’s popular XM series also have issues, but with moisture buildup. It’s so bad that it corrodes the screws inside. But even they have a gluey sticky tape inside the earpod, near the vent opening to trap dust and prevent it from getting stuck in the MEMs mic membrane. If this happens, the mic will create random noise, ruining the audio signal.
Many of these ANC headphones use arrays of them, meaning several microphones, inside, outside and for the purpose of figuring out the directionality of noise. The more mics are used, the higher the probability that at least 1 will fail over time. And 1 is all it takes, as they all provide a part of a signal into the same audio pipe - the signal that users then listen to.
So, tl;dr:
99.9%: It’s NOT the firmware.
It took Apple 1 year to create a service program for APP Gen 1, because the return rate had been through the roof, with many customers swapping them more than 7-8 times. Apple prevented a class action lawsuit this way.
They tried to reduce the problem by recessing the vents. Originally, the vents were flush with the AirPod’s surface. By recessing the vents, they tried to give users a bit of “buffer room”, so that ear wax, dust, sweat, dead skin cells etc wouldn’t be pressed through the vent grid with force when making contact with the ear. This didn’t fix the fundamental problem. Depending on how you handle them, it merely delayed the issue.
Even with this high return rate, AirPods are one of the most profitable products at Apple, making them billions. Since the battery can’t be swapped out, it’s a money-printing machine when many people upgrade after max. 3 years.
Critical thinking isn’t everybody’s strong suit, especially on the internet. Thankfully, Apple introduced a function with APP Gen 1, the fit test, that helps to narrow the issue down. This isn’t a gimmick, it actually works. It plays a reference signal and listens to the output with its microphone. If the pressure is in the correct range, it passes the fit test. This is only the case when:
1. There is a good enough seal
2. The vents aren’t clogged up
3. The microphones aren’t damaged
If you passed the fit test initially or do with a new pair, but using your old tips, and now don’t, then you will experience a decline in ANC and bass performance.
If you pass the fit test and still feel that there is a drop in ANC / bass performance, then it is most likely just a placebo effect. You can sell people in the audio realm all sorts of snake oil and they think that it improves the sound, when it is scientifically impossible.
Examples:
- CD “demagnetizers”
- 2000$ cables
- CD scraping devices that scrape the outer edge of the plastic substrate layer
- USB “re-clocking” devices
Apple didn’t move the grid on APP Gen 2 due to design reasons or for fun. They moved it further away from the ear, in hope of preventing the accumulation of dirt in them.
Cleaning them with Blu Tack can help for a while, but also bears the risk of pushing fragments through the grid.
If you use alcohol to clean the vents, it will sip through into the AirPod, sooner or later destroying the very sensitive MEMS microphones. Water has enough surface tension to get stuck on the vent to a certain degree, but alcohol doesn’t, it goes right through.
Using compressed air will clear the vents for a while, but will ultimately damage the mics as well. It’s just a ****** design to begin with.
The best you can do is to clean them from the start with a microfiber cloth, several times per day. Don’t touch the vents, not even with the microfiber cloth. Swap the microfiber cloth or wash them regularly, because otherwise you just smear skin oil back onto them. Clean the tips with water and a tiny drop of soap, but detach them before you do. Then dry them thoroughly before re-attaching them.
Btw, other ANC headphones, like Sony’s popular XM series also have issues, but with moisture buildup. It’s so bad that it corrodes the screws inside. But even they have a gluey sticky tape inside the earpod, near the vent opening to trap dust and prevent it from getting stuck in the MEMs mic membrane. If this happens, the mic will create random noise, ruining the audio signal.
Many of these ANC headphones use arrays of them, meaning several microphones, inside, outside and for the purpose of figuring out the directionality of noise. The more mics are used, the higher the probability that at least 1 will fail over time. And 1 is all it takes, as they all provide a part of a signal into the same audio pipe - the signal that users then listen to.
So, tl;dr:
99.9%: It’s NOT the firmware.
Thanks for that. Reading post like this is a nice reminder that not everything and everybody is lost on the internet
It is refreshing to see that people can actually bring up proper arguments and know what they are talking about without just wanting to troll or discredit others.
One thing I've noticed on my AirPods Max: the tones indicating Transparency and Noise Cancelling mode play at about half the volume when audio is being played. It's a welcome change -- I've always thought those tones were a bit loud. Oddly they seem to be the same volume as before when there's nothing playing. I'm not sure if AirPods Pro play these same tones? I don't have a pair.
Also, the new Siri sound is definitely much improved.
Also, the new Siri sound is definitely much improved.
I hope apple sends you a check for how much you defend them. I have cleaned them (do regularly) and also changed the tips. Again, this isn't my first rodeo, but to say they haven't gotten worse over time with firmware updates is laughable, even for an apple die-hard...Oh I’m sure they will. They’re chasing the point where transparency mode cancels out more noise than the actual ANC mode. Only then will they be satisfied while high-fiving themselves and laughing out loud diabolically. They are that evil. Crazy stuff.
On a more serious note, I’m sure most people with Airpods have never properly cleaned them (blu-tack e.g) and have also never even considered replacing the original silicone tips they initially come with.
They decrease in elasticity and hence don’t seal as good anymore after a certain period of time. Other manufacturers like Sennheiser or Beyerdynamic advice their customers to replace them regularly (every couple of months) to maintain the best possible long term sound quality and ANC performance. A friend of mine with first gen AirPods Pro was quite amazed by how much better his pair sounded again and how much better the ANC was again after a proper cleaning and a replacement of his „worn-out“ ear tips.
But of course it’s usually the newest firmware to blame, every time a new one gets released, too. It really is astonishing how each and every manufacturer seems to be similarly evil to their customers with regard to firmware updates in correlation with decreasing ANC performance and sound quality. It’s literally the same phenomenon every single time.
Must be a huge conspiracy going on behind our backs
I'm in no way compensated by but I will say that ANC sounds just fine on my APP 1 and APM.
I use my APM daily, especially with podcasts when I'm working. --Love them!
HOWEVER, my APP 1 have been replaced twice(!) for ANC and Ear Fit tests failing. I had one set replaced and a week later they died. --Both sets failed at the GB during their testing.
I use my APM daily, especially with podcasts when I'm working. --Love them!
HOWEVER, my APP 1 have been replaced twice(!) for ANC and Ear Fit tests failing. I had one set replaced and a week later they died. --Both sets failed at the GB during their testing.
I too had my APP 1 replaced twice. But since July last year this set has performed pretty nicely.I'm in no way compensated by but I will say that ANC sounds just fine on my APP 1 and APM.
I use my APM daily, especially with podcasts when I'm working. --Love them!
HOWEVER, my APP 1 have been replaced twice(!) for ANC and Ear Fit tests failing. I had one set replaced and a week later they died. --Both sets failed at the GB during their testing.
For those of you posting that you have measured and seen a reduction in ANC, how are you measuring it? What measurements are you getting? How are you testing?
I keep seeing assertions of reduced ANC but where is the data? I’ve asked a couple of times and all I get is crickets.
I keep seeing assertions of reduced ANC but where is the data? I’ve asked a couple of times and all I get is crickets.
The Firmware updates were easy to complete and easy to confirm. I have original Airpods, Airpods Pro 1 and Air Pods Pro 2 (I just never get rid of them, as the old ones come in handy.). The APP2 were already updated. All I had to do to update the APP1 was to put them in my ears and use them (I was on a phone call for about 20 minutes), and the Firmware updated. The original AP’s, I just paired them with my iPhone and let them sit there and later they were updated.
And, BTW, the Firmware update made a HUGE improvement in the sound for the APP1’s, where they were muddy before, they sound very close to the APP2’s now.
All of the Apple Air Pods and Pros are remarkable … at least they have been for me.
And, BTW, the Firmware update made a HUGE improvement in the sound for the APP1’s, where they were muddy before, they sound very close to the APP2’s now.
All of the Apple Air Pods and Pros are remarkable … at least they have been for me.
Like the last update to the HomePod changed the output characteristics for the better, the same for the APP1, IMO. While it was a few weeks since I last wore them, I'm remembering (yes, this is anecdotal) the sound has more punch.
I said it could also be a bug. Or just perception.
Or are you claiming Apple made their product worse one month after launch…. Out of, what, malice?
It is anecdotal - because ambient noise is not constant. Unless you measure under exactly the same conditions with both firmwares, any data measured will be unreliable.