Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Apple Reportedly Quits NFL Sunday Ticket Streaming Negotiations
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Good. They’d kill it. They’re not in the tv production business and they’re terrible at it.
I think the NFL Sunday Ticket and blackouts are the dumbest thing in TV Sports for sure. But the NFL is NOT losing fans. Their ratings are higher than ever, and of the top 20 TV shows from each year, like 19 of them are NFL games.
However, NFL reportedly considered that price point too low, given it needs to "protect the interests" of CBS and Fox, its Sunday afternoon broadcast partners.
This is an interesting take. It reads like the NFL wants to protect the interests of CBS and Fox, who only air games in a market that is designated by the particular game in question. Then, that game is blocked out of that broadcast area on Sunday Ticket. So CBS and Fox would not be losing any money.
Example: I am from Massachusetts. I live in the Jacksonville, FL broadcast area. My team is the New England Patriots. Yesterday, that game was not available to me in my local market. So I would have been able to watch on Sunday Ticket. Fox (who oddly was airing a game of two AFC teams when they normally handle NFC) did not have an afternoon game on in my local market.
The Tampa Bay game on CBS was aired here. So I could watch that. If I had Sunday Ticket, I would not have been able to watch that game on Sunday Ticket instead of over-the-air.
So what I REALLY think they mean is one of two things.
The less likely? Not having Sunday Ticket, I can only watch the Jaguars game when it is airing. I can't make a choice to watch an "out of market" game (say I wanted to watch Colts/Vikings) instead of the Jags/Cowboys. Well, Sunday Ticket would allow me to do that now, so that doesn't pass the "protect the interest" of CBS/Fox. My options today (watch no game if I don't want to watch the Jags, watch the Jags, or subscribe to Sunday Ticket and watch an out-of-market game) would be identical next season if Apple picks up Sunday Ticket, no matter how they charge customers.
The more likely? The NFL wants to "protect the interests" of their contracts with CBS and Fox. They don't want Apple to "give Sunday Ticket away" on their $6.99/mo service, thus devaluing what CBS thinks is worth paying for the rights.
That is what I think is the real "protect the interests" - you know, like "protect the shield" means that the Ideal Gas Law, and laws of physics do more harm to the "integrity of the game" than rape, domestic violence and concussions.
I think Apple for a limited time wanted to include it in the streaming price... BUT they wanted that streaming price to go way up to the likes of Netflix / Disney territory. Maybe $12.99-19.99 with the NFL included. The problem for the NFL is once users get used to getting Sunday Ticket "for free" (I know it really isn't) then in 4 years when Apple was no longer interested in the rights it would make it nearly impossible for another party to charge a premium price for it. Imagine Apple including it with their streaming service and then in the future someone trying to sell it as a $300-500 package for the year, people would scream.
I agree with much of what you wrote however remember these two things... 1. never underestimate how short sighted and stupid the NFL is and 2. never underestimate Apple's business acumen, then is a reason they are one of the most profitable companies in the world... they don't do that by throwing excess money away for now reason.
I actually don't even have an issue with the price if it means I can watch all of my teams games. My issue is the fact I can't even get Sunday Ticket stand alone because I live in a location that offers Directv, so they won't sell me just the Sunday ticket package.
many fan's love it because it lets you never miss an out of market team game. I'm a big Bears fan but will be moving from Chicago soon after 5 decades here... you bet I still want to see all my team's games.
NFL blackouts are crazy, it is such a mess of broadcasting rights right now. I plunked down $24 to get watch another game yesterday only to find out "watch" means "listen" in NFL broadcasting language. I was really hoping Apple would give me an excuse to pay them to clean this mess up.
I wonder what the demographics are for the people who currently pay for Sunday Ticket. I used to get it (probably 10 years ago now), but I suspect it's mostly folks in my generation (X) or older. I don't foresee my kids' generation, that grew up with YouTube and Netflix, shelling out $200-$400 for this service. I can't even justify it at this point, and I love football (go Rams, horns up!).
Great reply and largely agree. Only thing I'd add is that how'd those deals work out for DIrectTV and AT&T?
You never know, NFL might "reopen" talks with Apple at the last second if they can't get what they want from Google/Amazon/yada.
I just want anyone other than DirecTV.
I just want anyone other than DirecTV.
HobeSoundDarryl
macrumors G5
The NFL will be completely fine without Apple, as they have always been. Their high-value content and ratings only seem to grow every year... just like Apple's high value production seems to only grow every year.
And Apple IS fantastic at squeezing every possible penny of profit out of anything and everything they touch... which may be why potential media partners keep walking away from Apple deals (not enough in a new deal with Apple for them).
Net result for AppleTV+/AppleTV: hardly any content, thus nearly requiring the service be given away to keep a relatively small number of "subscribers" vs. the bigger boys willing to share the profit bounty with media partners so they can actually get the content on their service.
Again too bad: NFL ST will likely bring on a lot of new paying subscribers for whoever gets to offer it. More AppleTV boxes in households and more PAYING subscribers for AppleTV+ would have been good for the potential of both product and service. Instead, we can watch mostly the same stuff over and over again while awaiting a couple of new episodes of this and that each month. Apple's home grown content may be terrific and award winning... but there's only so many times one can re-watch even the finest media ever made. Apple's service could use some big content deals instead of pretty much working these potentials to come out the same way: someone ELSE gets the deal... plus the new customers that want to watch the content in each deal.
When it comes to media acquisition/partnering, Apple seems to be the king of could've: could've purchased the WHOLE Warner library, could've purchased the WHOLE 20th Century Fox library, could've owned the exclusive to NFL Thursday Night Football, could've owned a couple of AAA gaming houses, could've owned the WHOLE MGM library, etc. Rumors fly, build, then start leaking Apple wanting too much and then someone else announces THEY got the deal. Over and over and over again.
Last edited:
I found a way to watch live streams of NFL without paying but I doubt that is legal. I would pay a reasonable price to watch the games if it isn't available in my area. At least the playoff games are available to watch legally.
HobeSoundDarryl
macrumors G5
I never even considered AT&T myself but I saw plenty about how much the old (independent) DirecTV valued NFL ST as a new subscriber motivator and as a retention tool. Based on that- and admittedly subjectively since I wasn't privy to the numbers as any kind of insider- I suspect NFL ST was a major driver in helping young, small DirecTV grow a paying subscriber base large enough to become a big player... exactly what young, small AppleTV+ could use these days.
Love it or hate it (I'm somewhere in the middle myself), NFL is POPULAR content in North America. Apple getting an exclusive to all but the Sunday, Monday and Thursday broadcasts would have motivated at least the middling-to-bigger NFL fans to buy AppleTV and/or subscribe to AppleTV+ (meaning PAY for it). Even if some of us HATE football, more AppleTV boxes in households motivates more to want to do deals with Apple in the future to get their content on AppleTV. So there would be THAT win even for those who would never buy NFL ST on AppleTV/AppleTV+.
Whoever does get it will likely enjoy that audience for whatever term they get exclusive rights to almost all games.
This is the saddest news of the weekend. I believe that the NFL has made a very big mistake. Apple was the perfect partner for them. The biggest problem that the NFL has had with Sunday Ticket is that they have a limited number of subscribers due to the very high price. I have been a subscriber for over 20 years. It’s very hard to send 500 dollars a season to them just so I can watch one team play out of my home city. Especially when you are a fan of one of the most popular teams and have many of your games on national free tv. Apple offered the perfect deal. The league would get its three billion dollars a year ( yes that’s three billion a year) and the fans would get it for free. All as long as you subscribe to Apple TV+. Who would not be happy to pay 7 dollars a month not 500 dollars a year. And you would get whatever Apple can come up with for shows in addition. There shows are starting to get more popular and are getting awards for their quality. It’s a win win for everyone. But the NFL says no. They are just like so many people are today. They just don’t know what is good for them.
You know, if the sticking point is the local broadcast deals and Apple's insistence on no blackouts, maybe there's a compromise where Apple TV+ would supply the user's local broadcast stream for any game that normally would have been blacked out under the old rules.
That way, Apple TV+ still becomes the one-stop spot for all NFL games, but the interests of the local broadcast partners (and their ad revenue) would still be protected.
That way, Apple TV+ still becomes the one-stop spot for all NFL games, but the interests of the local broadcast partners (and their ad revenue) would still be protected.
Remember you said the "local" game on CBS was only available over-the-air. I think that protects the broadcast partners. The other thing you mentioned is how rolling the NFL into AppleTV/+ could be perceived as devaluing, I am not sure that's the case since broadcast is free, but I do know bars etc have to pay HEFTY licensing fees. I think that could have been the real stickler and where the "devaluing" idea came from.
Yes! One thing that the brain deprived NFL people could not figure out- after you got apple to pay 300 percent more for the games what could you tell your broadcasting partners?