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Apple’s growth is not over, it won’t be the same as in the past but they can still grow.

Perhaps but we're at four years and counting with no growth, with iPhone demand and gross margins still not bottoming out yet.
 
Indeed. And I’m pretty certain it’s the overpriced derivative X iterations that drove people to hold on to their devices and curb demand –not the other way around.

Now financial analysts are looking deeper into the reported results and highlighting the problems Apple is facing with the iPhones sales. Shares are tanking at the moment
 
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Compared to one year ago, AAPL is actually underperforming S&P by 1.5%. AAPL is up 4% but, apparently, this has little to do with Apple per se.
Yep, Apple stock marches to the tune of its own drum.
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A stock can only go up for so long without a commensurate increase in real growth to support it. The market is always a game of confidence and musical chairs.
Market cap hit $1T once and is now on its way up again. Apple stock seems to defy conventional wisdom.
 
Yep, Apple stock marches to the tune of its own drum.
[doublepost=1564686745][/doublepost]
Market cap hit $1T once and is now on its way up again. Apple stock seems to defy conventional wisdom.

AAPL market cap is already at $949B. How quickly things change. One post on Twitter and billions are gone!
 
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Yep, Apple stock marches to the tune of its own drum.
[doublepost=1564686745][/doublepost]
Market cap hit $1T once and is now on its way up again. Apple stock seems to defy conventional wisdom.

What conventional wisdom does it defy? Valuation metrics placed on individual companies by the market varies all the time as companies go in and out of favor.
 
What conventional wisdom does it defy? Valuation metrics placed on individual companies by the market varies all the time as companies go in and out of favor.
The bolded. Market isn’t always reflective of financial metrics and the interpretation metrics can be manipulated.
[doublepost=1564687453][/doublepost]
AAPL market cap is already at $949B. How quickly things change. One post on Twitter and billions are gone!
And they could change just as fast the other way.
 
The bolded. Market isn’t always reflective of financial metrics and the interpretation metrics can be manipulated.
[doublepost=1564687453][/doublepost]
And they could change just as fast the other way.

The interpretation of metrics is done individually by market participants. There are analysts who generate and disseminate their own interpretations but ultimately a stock rises or falls by the collective interpretation of the market. The only way that can be manipulated is by the company itself in terms of its financial reporting but I don't see any evidence of Apple doing that.
 
Here, have a refill of your Kool-Aid.

Apple plays the market analysts, as well as the faithful fanbois, incredibly well, don’t they.

The reality is that while the company continued to make money, it did so by raising prices, not selling more premium products —- and that is a metric that became a worrisome trend from 2 years ago.

Fortunately, it appears that Apple was able to remove the variable that was at the core of these negatives, and will hopefully pull themselves out, starting 2021.

I am actually quite hopeful, in a long time, since Jony Ive was let go, and a more competent person was placed in charge of products.
I (generally) ignore him and a few others. During a time period where everyone got hit in the face, to acknowledge that Apple was the best at dodging most of the punches isn’t good enough. They want to pretend no blows landed.
 
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I'm guessing iPod Touch sales are less than 0.1% of the pie!

AFAIK, Google is still paying Apple billions to make them the default search engine on Apple products? Not sure which of those categories would address that though.
 
The interpretation of metrics is done individually by market participants. There are analysts who generate and disseminate their own interpretations but ultimately a stock rises or falls by the collective interpretation of the market. The only way that can be manipulated is by the company itself in terms of its financial reporting but I don't see any evidence of Apple doing that.
Financial metrics can be interpreted any way to form an opinion that could be seen as manipulation. See the various posts on this board for examples. And your of course correct on the collective of the market, it’s not predictable.
 
Perhaps but we're at four years and counting with no growth, with iPhone demand and gross margins still not bottoming out yet.

Oh, as I’ve said, for the first time in years, I am optimistic about Apple being able to generate significant growth in the future, again. They need another year to fix the product line and to start seeing benefits from Jony Ive’s departure. Those improved products won’t truly start to appear until 2021.

So we’ll have one more year or “meh” products, and lack of growth, but should see an uptick in the Mac segments first, followed by iPhones in 2021 - hopefully.
 
Indeed. And I’m pretty certain it’s the overpriced derivative X iterations that drove people to hold on to their devices and curb demand –not the other way around.

You and @Burger Thing are absolutely, 100% right.

Not only has Apple driven away their premium upgrades with overpricing those models, but also by alienating those upgrades by removing the Home Button and dramatically altering the UI and thus the UX. I believe that people would have paid the price if the X product had still remained an iPhone. Instead Apple basically presented an overpriced Android phone (all the new “Home” gestures are identical to the same gestures on Android - to coin a phrase ‘innovate? my ass!’ “.
 
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I (generally) ignore him and a few others. During a time period where everyone got hit in the face, to acknowledge that Apple was the best at dodging most of the punches isn’t good enough. They want to pretend no blows landed.

Yep, agreed - it’s a combination of ‘typical apple fanboi’(*) and ignorance of market forces. Like you, I have a bunch of them on ‘ignore’ (and add new ones after I reply to them).



(*) they are the kind that not only applaud Apple removing the Home Button, but declares now ‘hating’ to Home Button, while perfectly ignoring that the ‘new’ Home Gestures Apple has introduced as a result are identical to what Android has (which has managed to provide a virtual Home Button’).
 
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Yep, agreed - it’s a combination of ‘typical apple fanboi’(*) and ignorance of market forces. Like you, I have a bunch of them on ‘ignore’ (and add new ones after I reply to them).



(*) they are the kind that not only applaud Apple removing the Home Button, but declares now ‘hating’ to Home Button, while perfectly ignoring that the ‘new’ Home Gestures Apple has introduced as a result are identical to what Android has (which has managed to provide a virtual Home Button’).
Well this Apple fan is not missing the home button. And that if Apple did copy the gestures, it’s payback for android copying the notch.

As far as Jony Ive departure, that incompetent helped make Apple what it is today. But no one is indespensable.
 
Owners get to share in profits. Buy the stock if you want to o own some of the earnings.

That statement should apply to Tim Cook as well.

Having every single shred of your privacy hoovered up by a company who's main business motivation is to sell that data? Hmm, let me think about that.

Google's main business isn't selling user data.
 
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As far as Jony Ive departure, that incompetent helped make Apple what it is today. But no one is indespensable.
It’s telling when you have to resort to a strawman, instead of sticking to facts. I never called Ive incompetent - he’s a very capable industrial designer that was part of a well-functioning team that made Apple at the time. Jony Ive was good as long as he had someone like Steve saying “no” or “this is crap” or “start over”, ie Jony Ive (like almost all designers) is good as long as he was given guidance and direction. Once Steve died, that team died - and with it, the restraint and focus that Jony Ive needed.

If Steve Jobs we’re capable to come back from the dead, he would fire a number of people, Jony chief amongst them (and no, he wouldn’t fire Tim Cook).

Anyway, like I stated in an earlier reply, you’re probably not capable of seeing the bigger picture here, which is why you confirmed what I said about fanbois...
 
It’s telling when you have to resort to a strawman, instead of sticking to facts. I never called Ive incompetent - he’s a very capable industrial designer that was part of a well-functioning team that made Apple at the time. Jony Ive was good as long as he had someone like Steve saying “no” or “this is crap” or “start over”, ie Jony Ive (like almost all designers) is good as long as he was given guidance and direction. Once Steve died, that team died - and with it, the restraint and focus that Jony Ive needed.

If Steve Jobs we’re capable to come back from the dead, he would fire a number of people, Jony chief amongst them (and no, he wouldn’t fire Tim Cook).

Anyway, like I stated in an earlier reply, you’re probably not capable of seeing the bigger picture here, which is why you confirmed what I said about fanbois...
The word "incompetent" aside (which was used and I thought you were alluding to Jony Ive https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...he-notch-in-2019.2132842/page-3#post-27598541), the lack of seeing the bigger picture, has been, imo, an endemic here. Armchair CEOs and CFOs reign supreme and so far, most of them have gotten little right about apple.
 
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