Apple Says 1,000 Fraudulent Reviews Were Detected Across Two Accounts Owned by 'Dash' Developer [Update: Developer Responds]

[Jgreg00]

No, he was not informed. They were two developer accounts with two email addresses. To me it does not matter if they were linked by the same credit card. I pay apps for my family, does it make me linked and responsible for my relatives' actions? Should my app store account be deleted when they do something wrong, without contacting ME ?

He gave her test hardware and used his credit card. That's enough to link them. These are developer accounts that are, and should be, held to a higher standard than you buying apps for your family. And yes, if someone in your family used your credit card, there are lots of sites where any other account using that card would also be banned, PayPal for example.

 

[0958400]

Welcome to World of Hypocrites.
[doublepost=1476161214][/doublepost]Another question that I am interested in: What exactly is a fraudulent review, if you can write 1,000 of them?
I thought you could only review an item once (and sometimes only, if it has been bought.)

 

[HeIIo]

Welcome to World of Hypocrites.
[doublepost=1476161214][/doublepost]Another question that I am interested in: What exactly is a fraudulent review, if you can write 1,000 of them?
I thought you could only review an item once (and sometimes only, if it has been bought.)

Typically it's paying a third party company to leave bogus positive reviews on your apps.

 

[johannnn]

https://blog.kapeli.com/dash-and-apple-my-side-of-the-story
Why is this guy so childish?
If you use your credit card to open an account that later is involved with review manipulation, it's your damn fault.
Admit it instead of putting up phone calls online.

 

[Mascots]

Apple apologists all over forgetting that we are doing business with Apple, investing hundreds to thousands of hours into the platform. Circumstantial evidence is **** to terminate a business contract over which is why Apple is being so public about this now, and why many people are pretty irritated with the direction.

Honestly, the fact that Apple let him back into the App Store is enough to say that Apple ****ed up (and knows it), and the control of publication for trying to twist the narrative is some sketchy **** that I do not like.

But then there are other issues: Schiler willing to step in to say he looked at it but not actually giving any information initially. Apple's saying, "we've been in contact for two years". The vague reference to two accounts and the reviews (was there actually fraudulent activity on or relating to his - they didn't say on purpose?). The banning of accounts (which were not linked but had the same financial information) without reaching out to them both...
Generally, Apple isn't doing themselves any favors in my eyes by trashing his reputation and livelihood based on circumstantial bs of which their own history does not back up.

 

[firewood]

Another question that I am interested in: What exactly is a fraudulent review, if you can write 1,000 of them?
I thought you could only review an item once (and sometimes only, if it has been bought.)

The "developer" could pay someone who has control of a bot farm of several thousand hacked PCs (all over the country/world) that happen to have iTunes accounts on them. Each bot downloads the app and automatically posts really positive but slightly different computer generated text.

If you don't keep up with the security updates, what is your PC or Mac doing in the middle of the night?

 

[peter2]

Honestly, it's laughable. Sock puppets or just people (with remarkably low post counts) desperate to see apple as the enemy. Doesn't matter. He committed massive fraud and is out. Enjoy

Why should Apple be the enemy? I made my company switch to Macs long time ago, so I guess I mostly appreciate what Apple does. But this case is a clear mistake of Apple (blindly following the rules that they themselves have established without sufficiently considering all scenarios that could, and did, occur).

If Apple did not make a mistake they would stand by their original decision now. It's just laughable how they are not able to simply say "sorry, our procedures did not properly handle this not completely common scenario, we will adapt them accordingly, sorry for the inconvenience". Problem solved.

 

[modeyabsolom]

You can choose your friends, but you can't choose your family...LOL! What this developer didn't think this would back fire in the end? Really!

 

[hoon2999]

Apple apologists all over forgetting that we are doing business with Apple, investing hundreds to thousands of hours into the platform. Circumstantial evidence is **** to terminate a business contract over which is why Apple is being so public about this now, and why many people are pretty irritated with the direction.

Honestly, the fact that Apple let him back into the App Store is enough to say that Apple ****ed up (and knows it), and the control of publication for trying to twist the narrative is some sketchy **** that I do not like.

But then there are other issues: Schiler willing to step in to say he looked at it but not actually giving any information initially. Apple's saying, "we've been in contact for two years". The vague reference to two accounts and the reviews (was there actually fraudulent activity on or relating to his - they didn't say on purpose?). The banning of accounts (which were not linked but had the same financial information) without reaching out to them both...
Generally, Apple isn't doing themselves any favors in my eyes by trashing his reputation and livelihood based on circumstantial bs.

Idk man. I mean I am just a casual Apple user who doesn't give a damn on how the situation resolves but posting a phone call conversation along with the story of creating accounts for "relatives" and handing them their workstation computer look a lot sketchy to me.

Even if his story is true, he should be accountable for whatever things going on with his linked-account. His credit card, his billing information, and his responsibilities. If he wants to cry about it, he should speak with the relative that he gave his account to.

Plus, what about his relative? Did he or she just starting to make those fake reviews just to support him? I mean, more than 1000 reviews man. That person must be really dedicated. And the relative never informed the account owner about their action afterward?? I seriously don't know. It just sounds very sketchy and total fake story just to fit into whatever Apple stated in their conversation.

 

[Solomani]

Update: The developer behind Dash has shared his side of the story, placing the blame on a relative whose Apple Developer Program Membership he paid for.

I blame Cousin It! He did saucy things and made sketchy reviews at the App Store!

 

[HumpYourWayUp]

"The developer behind Dash has shared his side of the story, placing the blame on a relative whose Apple Developer Program Membership he paid for.
He says he was not aware his account was linked to another until Friday and that he was not notified about any wrongdoing."

This sounds very fishy. I think the Dash developer is not completely honest!
[doublepost=1476163046][/doublepost]

That begs the question of how it was determined that Dash was a "successful" app, to begin with. Was it due to the large number of fraudulent positive reviews, perhaps?

1000 fraudulent reviews are fraudulent reviews!

 

[Mascots]

Idk man. I mean I am just a casual Apple user who doesn't give a damn on how the situation resolves but posting a phone call conversation along with the story of creating accounts for "relatives" and handing them their workstation computer look a lot sketchy to me.

Even if his story is true, he should be accountable for whatever things going on with his linked-account. His credit card, his billing information, and his responsibilities. If he wants to cry about it, he should speak with the relative that he gave his account to.

Plus, what about his relative? Did he or she just starting to make those fake reviews just to support him? I mean, more than 1000 reviews man. That person must be really dedicated. And the relative never informed the account owner about their action afterward?? I seriously don't know. It just sounds very sketchy and total fake story just to fit into whatever Apple stated in their conversation.

A crappy person who wanted in the App Store for the gold rush and discovered a more mischievous way to make money. Many people outside of the US don't have ways to pay and if you had a golden goose, would you try to find the gold? But either way, it's all stupid circumstantial.

If that is the case and he should be held accountable, what about Apple ID's that have their passwords given up to those Chinese-based "free app store"-apps which then uses it to register fraudulent activity on Apple Dev servers in order to exploit and download apps and IAPs without pay? Technically, you gave up your password, but in reality, you weren't involved in nefarious activity, just listening to a prompt for seemingly legit things. Should you lose your entire account or just have the bad-actor activity removed? How will they approach these situations in the future (because they're coming, too).

Also, there's a couple things that Apple screwed up: Apple found fraudulent reviews on one account, not both and none relating to his other account with Dash. Apple also lied about the communication they had with the developer "over the last two years". Then, as they were trying to work together, they released a press release which essentially trashed his reputation.
This is not any more proof than what Phil offered us and we've seen caught them in lies.

 

[asiga]

Even if the guy has responsibility for the reviews, which isn't clear yet, Apple is responsible for much worse behavior, such as (but not only) not allowing supporting older iOS releases at the App Store, automatically wasting devices storage for updates you don't want, and a large etc everybody knows.

The very same way they canceled this account is even more wrongdoing than the alleged facts. But that's part of the nowadays Apple clueless way of doing things.

 

[johannnn]

Even if the guy has responsibility for the reviews, which isn't clear yet, Apple is responsible for much worse behavior, such as (but not only) not allowing supporting older iOS releases at the App Store, automatically wasting devices storage for updates you don't want, and a large etc everybody knows.

If you prefer an insecure OS then post a new thread about it.

Apple found fraudulent reviews on one account, not both and none relating to his other account with Dash.

Why should you not be responsible for accounts linked to a credit card with YOUR name?

 

[Mascots]

Why should you not be responsible for accounts linked to a credit card with YOUR name?

Have some perspective.

 

[ErikGrim]

He's so dumb. Its illegal to record a conversation with a party located in California and not have consent of that party. He's so screwed and not getting his account reinstated.

Now, in addition to not understanding how laws work in America, add international law to the mix

 

[hoon2999]

A crappy person who wanted in the App Store for the gold rush and discovered a more mischievous way to make money. Many people outside of the US don't have ways to pay and if you had a golden goose, would you try to find the gold? But either way, it's all stupid circumstantial.

If that is the case and he should be held accountable, what about Apple ID's that have their passwords given up to those Chinese-based "free app store"-apps which then uses it to register fraudulent activity on Apple Dev servers in order to exploit and download apps and IAPs without pay? Technically, you gave up your password, but in reality, you weren't involved in nefarious activity, just listening to a prompt for seemingly legit things. Should you lose your entire account or just have the bad-actor activity removed? How will they approach these situations in the future (because they're coming, too).

Also, there's a couple things that Apple screwed up: Apple found fraudulent reviews on one account, not both and none relating to his other account with Dash. Apple also lied about the communication they had with the developer "over the last two years". Then, as they were trying to work together, they released a press release which essentially trashed his reputation.
This is not any more proof than what Phil offered us and we've seen caught them in lies.

I understand there is a chance of his link-account being used by those hackers. But I don't think that removes his responsibilities in any way. His credit card, his billing informations, and his responsibilities. And for some reason, his relative got a keylogger and handed the account. And those hackers been using the account to write fraud reviews for his app to trigger detection from Apple. Chance is slight but possible. But for more than 2 years???! Afaik you have to renew dev account every 1 year and sometimes Apple force you to reenter security code of the card before charging. But him mentioning in his post, not acknowledging he made an account for relative until last Friday sounds really sketchy to me. Unless he has really bad memories. (Correct me if I'm wrong)

Have some perspective.

But that does not excuse whoever handing them payment information to not be responsible. Imagine someone co-sogning a loan becuz a dev does not have citizenship here. Co-signer is still resposible for anything happens later no matter what.

 

[CarlJ]

That begs the question of how it was determined that Dash was a "successful" app, to begin with. Was it due to the large number of fraudulent positive reviews, perhaps?

No, I think it's being referred to that way because a lot of developers like it and use it. I like it and use it. I didn't decide to use it by reading the reviews for it on the App Store (I'm not sure I ever saw any of those), I was convinced to use it by lots of positive references to it from other developers (some of them well known) in a lot of different places on the web. In any case, it appears the fraudulent reviews weren't for Dash, but for a bunch of run-of-the-mill apps associated with the other developer account in play here.
[doublepost=1476166081][/doublepost]For anyone still paying attention, DaringFireball has a fairly cogent writeup on this brouhaha, including the more recent bits (second account and such).

 

[Feenician]

Even if the guy has responsibility for the reviews, which isn't clear yet, Apple is responsible for much worse behavior, such as (but not only) not allowing supporting older iOS releases at the App Store, automatically wasting devices storage for updates you don't want, and a large etc everybody knows

Hey every body! Let's all defraud Apple and App Store customers due to their heinous crime of not supporting older ios releases in the app store. It's ok because Macrumors forums user asiga says it is!

Some of the stuff written here is just... well, I'd rather not be banned

 

[tennisproha]

I listened to the recording. Side note, I'm not sure it's legal to record someone without first letting them know.

Jesus ****ing Christ! Talk about beating a dead horse… "your account was LINKED to an account with fraudulent ****ing activity." Literally on repeat for 5 minutes. ****s sake!

I think Apples right on this. If your ever providing financial support for something, that means your taking responsibility for it. There's no two ways about it. Developer might've not known but that's his fault. It's not Apples job to inform all accounts. That's his responsibility. Plenty of metaphors for this so I'm not even gonna start.

 

[scoobydoo99]

...I didn't decide to use it by reading the reviews for it on the App Store (I'm not sure I ever saw any of those), I was convinced to use it by lots of positive references to it from other developers (some of them well known) in a lot of different places on the web. ...

And what makes you think all those reviews on OTHER sites were legit?

In the end, the guy was a scumbag trying to mislead buyers and Apple nabbed him. Good riddance.

 

[CB1234]

I disagree completely. These are the exact types of activities Apple should publicize. Whether popular or not, if this is true: "We will terminate developer accounts for ratings and review fraud, including actions designed to hurt other developers. This is a responsibility that we take very seriously, on behalf of all of our customers and developers." Apple should have 1. Booted them at least a year ago instead of allowing Dash's developer to reap revenue. A cynic would say Apple reaped as well. 2. Made the reasoning known to discourage any other devs from trying similar activities. 3. Realized "We looked into and found fraud" from Schiller wasn't going to be a sufficient answer when the guy was swearing innocence to anyone who'd listen.

I'm happy the truth came out. It still makes me ask: 2 years? Really?

I disagree with you on this one... When someone commits a first crime, you don't just string him up and shoot him down, just to make an example for others.. Apple tried to work with him to amend his way and become a good citizen, only when he didn't change his ways, did they took stance to cut him out...

I do agree with you, that after 2 years of trying, they should have publicised some facts as a deterrent to others..

PS: I do enjoy reading your posts as they are well balanced thought out comments. Makes a change from reading absolute dross some people post.

 

[CarlJ]

And what makes you think all those reviews on OTHER sites were legit?

So, you're saying you think he had some sort of mind control or coercion over well-known-by-name developers in the community, and either forced them to write positive comments about his app, or hacked into their blogs and wrote such comments himself (without them discovering this afterwards?). He may or may not be a bad guy (I've never met him; his software is good, his personal character doesn't come off so well in things he's posted over this), but you're suggesting a level of control over others that gets into tinfoil-hat territory. Go read the article on daringfireball about this (the whole article, not just a paragraph or two), it's fairly even-handled.

 

[metsjetsfan]

The "developer" could pay someone who has control of a bot farm of several thousand hacked PCs (all over the country/world) that happen to have iTunes accounts on them. Each bot downloads the app and automatically posts really positive but slightly different computer generated text.

If you don't keep up with the security updates, what is your PC or Mac doing in the middle of the night?

But why is that specific second account tied to those 1000 fraudulent reviews? If you hired or bought a bot or a review farm do you have to give them your developer account?? Cant you just use a bot or a human farm without a second account

 

[Amazing Iceman]

What a mess!
Lesson: Keep your business to yourself. Want to help a friend or relative? Give them an iTunes Card.