Apple Says It Has No Plans for Solely ARM-Based or Touchscreen Macs

[Ghost31]

Yes they will admit they're looking into ARM publicly for Intel to know...

Well i mean wtf would intel do about it anyway? Nothing.
[doublepost=1491551875][/doublepost]

Okay, it's happening. I stated earlier that my only real reason for not being on Windows already is because the apps/OS felt so "ugly" compared to macOS.

Turns out that I won't have to wait long for Windows to freshen up. Microsoft has fixed so much of the core over the years (vista, 7, 8 and now 10) that they can now finally focus on modernizing the GUIs and adding modern translucency and shadows. And they're now aiming for clean, clear GUIs with butter-smooth animations.

https://mspoweruser.com/project-neon-windows-10-first-look/

(and an earlier article https://mspoweruser.com/windows-10-...e-new-design-language-codenamed-project-neon/)

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It's officially happening: Windows is soon about to be pretty much equal with macOS in desktop beauty, maybe even more beautiful depending on what your personal taste is. I really like the fresh, clean, open surfaces of Microsoft's Project NEON design. It makes the flat, gray slabs of macOS titlebars look dated. And it's clear that they're aiming for full touch and virtual reality compatibility in their app design. They're looking to the future instead of being regressive. After suffering with Apple through their last five years of neglect and lazy coasting, it's very refreshing to see someone else innovating.

Looks like I'll be a Windows 11 + touchscreen + Cubase 9 convert soon. Because Project NEON literally eliminates my last remaining reluctance about switching to Windows. The design is finally becoming fresh, clean and modern. They have great multitouch screens and pen digitizers supported natively, and have incredibly fast top-rated hardware with tons of upgradability. The value is incredible, and the hardware rivals and even beats the Apple hardware these days, and the software is finally becoming as fresh (or in my opinion even fresher) than what's on macOS. My Safari and iTunes look absolutely ancient compared to Project NEON.

It's very clear to see that Apple has squandered their once-leading position in hardware and software design. Who could ever guess that Apple spending the last half-decade with their noses in the iOS crack and turning a blind eye to their aging desktops would now be coming back to bite them? The weirdest part is that they're so rich that they could easily have kept their desktops up to date, but they just took people for granted while continuing to shovel outdated and overpriced hardware and completely neglecting the professionals. And what's up with the last few macOS releases? Nothing particularly interesting. Mostly minor changes. (And of course the obligatory locking out fully capable older hardware for no reason just so that they could sell their "newer" outdated machines.)

This is it. Apple has lost me. Unless something changes with Apple between now and my next computer upgrade in 1-2 years, I am going to switch away and start thinking different, since Apple has clearly stopped thinking at all, and are rapidly losing their last remaining advantages. Hardware quality and reliability is now equal or much better on the Windows side. Hardware upgradability, expandability and prices are a million times better on the Windows side. And the Software and software design is catching up incredibly fast and is about to overtake Apple.

Having modern hardware, modern features like touch and pen input, access to hybrid devices, fast and upgradable and expandable hardware and access to tons of new and advanced software is definitely enough to switch already. And many people here have switched. When the new Project NEON comes out it's game over for Apple. Software design was the last reason I was holding out, and I suspect a lot of us chose Apple for their great, clean and beautiful software design. Well, that's all changing now. Microsoft's new design language is super clean and beautiful.

Apple, you dun goofed... I think you can still rise from the ashes and catch up, but it's too late for many of us. You've already lost me with this lazy, arrogant and neglectful bs from one of the richest companies of the world. It's sad. And I saw many other switchers on this forum who left for the same reasons. And even if Apple does catch up someday, there won't be any reason to switch back and go back to the same locked-down, overpriced and outdated hardware.

It takes a lot to leave a company and an ecosystem you used to rely on and love for decades. But they've sadly neglected us for so long that they actually had to arrange a press meeting and speak out about their neglect a few days ago just to re-assure us that we aren't forgotten. Which is sad as hell. How does a company like Apple let it get to such a sad point?! If nothing dramatically improves in the next year (and with their lack of vision, it does not look like it will), then it's goodbye from me too.

Apple is never going to relinquish their control freak behavior. They obviously want outdated and disposable hardware just to forcibly drive new hardware sales. I am so close to done with these freaks for good.

There is obviously a holy book of Apple somewhere: Thou must artificially limit all hardware and software to force the sheep to constantly buy new and shiny things.

Maybe that lazy attitude worked when their software was still leaps and bounds above Windows. But while Apple has been coasting along lazily, the competition has been advancing rapidly.

Tim Cook is a terrible leader for Apple. No vision. All number crunching and coasting and apologies instead of innovation... Which is awful for a company that existed entirely on its reputation for innovation. Apparently they didn't even realize they had a problem until they saw the constant disappointment from users year in and year out. Sad to see Apple this out of touch with reality. They'll have to snap out of it and wake up again someday, but at that point it'll be hard for them to win back users. They've got a lot of catching-up to do.

However, their first step should be to stop believing the myth of their own perfection and infallibility.

Thats a long post to simply say "Apple is so meh"

 

[SteveJobzniak]

Thats a long post to simply say "Apple is so meh"

Almost as long as taking half a decade to say "Sorry for neglecting you, but we're still alive and just want to tell you it will take another 12-18 more months for the new Mac Pro".

 

[ValO]

Yes, that would be very good, but apple would have to put in a pointer on IOS. They really need to make a specific IOS for iPad.

There is a pointer in ios already.
When using the onscreen keyboard on an iphone 6s or higher and you press it (3d touch) the keyboard will become a trackpad and a pointer appears.

 

[lysingur]

I wouldn't be surprised if there is already a version of macOS that can be run on ARM-based Macs located somewhere in Cupertino. Apple is being coy by saying there is no plan for ARM-based Macs knowing full well that more and more of the tasks performed by Macs are now supplanted by iPad. In other words, the iPad of the future will be the entry-level Mac of today.

And people keeping talking about recompilation in the case of a switch to ARM as if it's not already happening and as if it's some herculean task. Most of the applications that regular consumers need are already available on iOS. And just in case you haven't been paying attention, Apple is merging a lot of the underlying frameworks in macOS and iOS, if not paving the way for the switch, at least making writing programs for both platforms a lot easier.

Apple can, of course, decide not to make the switch if Intel gets their act together but all the signs point to their preparing for the inevitable. The only differences between macOS and iOS two years from now would mostly be cosmetic with merging of APIs, e.g. Metal, programming language, i.e. Swift and file system, i.e. APFS.

 

[weup togo]

Not as an official Project. Otherwise, they wouldn't have taken over a year to do the switchover. OS X on Intel started out as ONE Engineer's pet-project. After he had it sorta working, he pitched it to his boss, who told him to go out and buy a Vaio and get it working on that, then they pitched it to Jobs, and THEN it was "green-lighted".

But it really didn't exist "from the beginning", like many rumors claim.

You're referring to one former engineer's publicized version of what happened. It wasn't nearly that simple. And my timeline is 100% accurate.

OpenStep was cross platform, and Avie was an avid believer in leveraging certain forcing functions to ensure purity of design. Mac OS X was built on a UDF filesystem from the Rhapsody days and many years into OS X's shipping history for the sole reason of preventing careless engineers from introducing case sensitivity bugs. It caused lots of headaches but he believed it was worth it to deliver better hygiene.

Avie felt the same way about cross-compilation. There are certain bugs that are immediately apparent if you cross-compile code. NeXT's entire build system was x86-based. After the reverse acquisition, the entire thing (Seaport) was relocated and made the base for building Rhapsody/OS X. It was actually a performance downgrade for builds to move from the enterprise-grade Intel hardware to relatively puny PowerPC hardware. But building on both big-endian and little-endian CPUs was always a requirement for as much code as possible.

Ultimately the switch came down to a power play between Avie and Jon Rubenstein that had been going on for years. Avie had been pushing for x86 but Jon had more clout. It wasn't until IBM made SJ look like a fool on stage with the false predictions about the G5 hitting 3 GHz one year from intro that Avie finally prevailed. That's when Transitive was hired to bring their code translator to the platform to preserve binary compatibility with existing PPC apps. That was the moment when the science project turned into a real thing.

JK was instrumental in moving it toward productization but it was not in any way his invention.

 

[f-boy]

However, the most ambitious is a product called "Duet". It was designed by a couple of ex-Apple engineers, and exists as a two-tiered product. Both connect only over USB/Lightning (no WiFi), citing performance as the reason. However, for your acceptance of the use of a cable between your iPad/iPhone and your Mac/Windows machine, you get a "non-laggy" experience, that lives up to the promise of being "genuinely useful".

"Duet" costs $20, and offers basic second-display/touch interface support for macOS and Windows. It even offers "Virtual TouchBar" emulation for Sierra. It works with all Macs running 10.9 and up, all Windows machines running Windows 8 and up, and ALL iPads and iPhones running iOS 7 and up.

https://www.duetdisplay.com

"Duet Pro" is a subscription model, $20 per year, and adds Apple Pencil (with pressure support), and possibly more. It runs on the same desktop OSes, but obviously requires an iPad Pro with Apple Pencil. That product is CLEARLY aimed squarely at the "Turn your iPad into a Digitizer/Drawing Tablet" market.

https://www.duetdisplay.com/pro/

My feeling is that Apple will eventually buy Duet, and integrate it into macOS (and lose the Windows baggage, like they did with eMagic's Logic). But even if they don't, $20, or $20/yr (helps fund ongoing development, which seems reasonable for what has got to be a very tightly-coded product, and ensures continued OS and iOS support), seems pretty reasonable for a product that looks like it delivers on its promises.

Full Disclosure: I haven't used either product; but they look REALLY well-done, and at $20, are firmly in the "Give it a try" price-point.

I have it and use an iPad Air 2 to "finger paint" in applications like Adobe illustrator an Photoshop. It's awesome!

 

[sledgehammer89]

Why no iOS UI in Touch mode and macOS UI in Desktop Mode? Universal Apps on iOS prove, that that display size doesn't matter. Input device (touch or mouse pointer) should (must) do the same.

 

[IamInvincible]

Steve Jobs' Apple would have had a Mac Pad Pro out by now because it is a symmetric, efficient, simple concept that is considerate of what people emotionally want.

Having people use MacBook and an ipad and 2 different operating systems and a bunch of dongles to connect everything instead of a magsafe is a big mess, no beauty or symmetry or simplicity in it, and probably done out of consideration for profitability. Jobs' Apple did things out of consideration for the ease, simplicity, and intuitive desires of the customer and would have 1 product, with one operating system: a Mac Pad Pro