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What does that make the 3rd gen Chromecasts then? "Gargantuan Value?" They're less than half the price and they can run 3rd party gaming service apps, including the ones the Apple TV is not trying to compete with (because it can't.)

Xcloud is nice.
 
Not really. I already own a Series X, a PS5 and a Switch. Not sure what Apple could bring to the market that is not covered by those devices.
I think the angle that Apple would try to take is that gaming in the Apple ecosystem means you can game anywhere. Take your games anywhere without having to bring any extra devices with you. Not sure how well it would work, but it is definitely interesting!
 
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"It's probably not designed to compete directly with the Xboxes and PlayStations of the world," added Twerdahl. "They bring something to the market that I think is unique and great for really hardcore gamers."

Which is funny, because that is the exact opposite of what Apple is telling a Judge in the Northern District of California in a fight with Epic. Apple's whole argument hinges on the fact they compete directly with Xbox, PlayStation, and Nintendo. Consistency, who cares these days 😂
 
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But why not make an ATV PRO that does compete with PS5 and XBox? I mean maybe there a those of us that don’t want to buy a console and an ATV. Merge the two and save us some money. Hey maybe merge it with the Home Pod also and you will get the best bad ass streaming/console/speaker in the market! Ok, I got too excited. Just make a console like ATV, would you? Pretty please.
I would love that, but it would be difficult for the following reasons (in my opinion):

1. While they could build the hardware, pricing the hardware would be an issue. As stated in the Epic lawsuit, Microsoft has never made money on the Xbox console sales, rather they get the money back via game sales (the Razor Blade profit model.) Apple has really never really (to my knowledge) used that model before, although they do make money on app store sales.

2. It's all about the games. Microsoft has been buying up lots of game studios, just to fill out their exclusive library. Apple would have to start completing in that inflated market with Sony/Microsoft, making acquisitions even more expensive.

3. Developer and Customer confidence: Apple has more that once promised increasing gaming tools/focus, but has then backtracked. (I am thinking of an interview a few years ago by former Doom/ID software's John Romero.) Customers in the high end gaming market are a skeptical bunch as well, and Apple would really need to work to win them over.

4. Censorship. Xbox/Sony have allowed some games in the past that have really tweaked off the "Think about the children" groups. Even the Wii had Manhunt 2, where you used the nunchucks as a strangulation wire motion in the game. I honestly don't think Apple is willing to have anything that controversial or violent on the service. (I believe they also prohibit lots of things the other consoles allow, as you can't do a civil war sim game accuratly without the stars and bars, or a WW2 game accurately without the Rising Sun or Nazi flag.)

At one point (maybe still) you were not allow to put firearm images in the app previews, I believe. I am not sure if that has changed. Good luck with putting anything sexual like are in some modern games as well.

(It's a double standard vs content in movies available on iTunes, I agree.)

Apple is doing a couple of good things for gaming however.

One of Microsoft's strengths is that the xbox/windows are build off of the same base. DX graphics pretty much are universal, so it makes porting very easy. Apple is even better, metal is metal is metal, and the game porting between iOS/ipados/macos/tvos should be extremely easy (even more so when intel macs are discontinued.)

iCloud makes universal same saves, should developers implement it. It should make it stupid easy for a gamer to pick up and play on any device.

I personally would love for apple to get into the "hardcore" game system market. They are putting some good things together, but I am very skeptical that they would follow through.
 
What does that make the 3rd gen Chromecasts then? "Gargantuan Value?" They're less than half the price and they can run 3rd party gaming service apps, including the ones the Apple TV is not trying to compete with (because it can't.)

Xcloud is nice.
3rd gen Chromecast can't even do 4K streaming.
 
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"It's probably not designed to compete directly with the Xboxes and PlayStations of the world," added Twerdahl. "They bring something to the market that I think is unique and great for really hardcore gamers."

Which is funny, because that is the exact opposite of what Apple is telling a Judge in the Northern District of California in a fight with Epic. Apple's whole argument hinges on the fact they compete directly with Xbox, PlayStation, and Nintendo. Consistency, who cares these days 😂
I don't understand why Microsoft and other are testifying for EPIC. It they win, either epic itself, or another company will turn around and use the same logic on the console maker's "exclusive app store."

Logically, this same rule would prohibit (or allow workarounds) to lockout chips/software, then not only will the console makers lose money on each sales, but they won't be able to get as many direct sales, and the shovel ware will start flooding the market. (A good history lesson is the 1983 video game crash, the Atari 2600 did not have any lockout chips or other security, and the unlicensed games almost doomed the industry.)
 
Yeah we kind of figured it can’t compete with gaming consoles whenever we realized the new remote doesn’t have telemetry built in like the old ones. I’m not getting rid of the old one just yet but you can still connect your PS4 or Xbox controller to the Apple TV if need be.

Honest question: What advantages does Apple TV bring to a Smart TV?

My TV already has a smart hub that does more than I can use, it can record shows and AirPlay comes built into it, so I can seamlessly mirror my iPhone or iPad screen, or even use it as a monitor wirelessly. I do not even have a set top box, the TV can already handle the TV-input from the provider.
As a former internet installer I can brutally tell you that your Smart Tv’s integrated WIFI card is not the best, customers would literally place tv’s in the middle of dead spots in the house and not get the best wifi coverage because of dead spots and back then they didn’t have mesh networks and also 9/10 customers wouldn’t have an ethernet connection nearby but I can attest to the notion that chrome casts, roku and amazon fire boxes do not compare to the wifi and gigabit ethernet connection from the Apple TV.

Add in the Homekit and you are golden but some customers don’t have this issue if the Modem is literally right next to the tv in apartment complexes but in older houses where networks weren’t a thing when houses were built decades ago, it was a big issue sometimes but streaming boxes focus All their power to providing the best at home experience.

I love the new remote just by looking at that On/Off button, one of the biggest complaints from the previous generations due to the fact that the other ones were completely sensitive to touch, heck you could breathe and the Apple tv would turn on by itself lololol

But I remember the days when it was priced at 99.99
 
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We don't play games on ATV4K.

If I bought the new one, apart from the 20 bucks, why would I want to buy the 64GB model over the 32GB model? I'm not clear what that storage is actually used for.
 
Considering the PS5 has only like additional 8 apps you can download, it's not really a fair comparison. Plus, as the owner of a high-end smart TV, an LG OLED, the streaming interface/app usage stinks.
 
I may be wrong here, but I dont think TV apps allow for iTunes Extras, whereas the ATV does. Also I prefer to use infuse over the built in NAS browser in my smart TV. Other than that... I really dont see the need for a dedicated ATV box anymore. I do have two 4K ATVs but I wouldn't buy another and certainly have no plans to upgrade.

I'm also very disappointed that they don't use DTS MA or Dolby Tru-HD for their sound - why are we still having to put up with lossy sound codecs?
 
Honest question: What advantages does Apple TV bring to a Smart TV?

My TV already has a smart hub that does more than I can use, it can record shows and AirPlay comes built into it, so I can seamlessly mirror my iPhone or iPad screen, or even use it as a monitor wirelessly. I do not even have a set top box, the TV can already handle the TV-input from the provider.
The fisrt advantage of AirPlay actually working reliably, which it does not on my smart TV. The second is the UI being smooth instead of a lagfest.
 
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Did Apple really suggest the ATV was meant to directly compete with Xbox or PlayStation? Can’t say I remember that if they did and I really hope no one ever seriously thought the ATV and PlayStation were in the same category.
No, but MS and Sony sorta did by making their consoles have features similar to the ATV. The consoles cost more but not a ton more, meaning some people might get the console even if they're not going to be playing so many games.

The most memorable example of this was the PS3 back when it was new and could play BluRay despite costing similar or even less than dedicated BluRay players. (This was before streaming was popular, and people actually cared about BluRay.)
 
Honest question: What advantages does Apple TV bring to a Smart TV?

My TV already has a smart hub that does more than I can use, it can record shows and AirPlay comes built into it, so I can seamlessly mirror my iPhone or iPad screen, or even use it as a monitor wirelessly. I do not even have a set top box, the TV can already handle the TV-input from the provider.
You get Apple’s software quality and don’t lose support and updates 1-2 years in. It’s a complete no-brainer.
 
The thing to remember about the ATV version of the A12 is that it's always going to be plugged in. That will boost performance versus use in hardware that needed to conserve battery life.

There's also the possibility that Apple could tweak the overall clock speeds up a bit as well for the same reason.
tvOS was designed to be 24/7 on. If this has been a A12X that might have been somewhat acceptable.

The Apple A12 Bionic is a System on a Chip (SoC) from Apple that is found in the iPhone Xs and Xr. It was announced late 2018 and offers 6 cores divided in 2 performance cores and four power efficiency cores. Compared to the previous A11 Bionic, the A12 should offer a 15% improved CPU performance for the performance cores and a 50% lower power consumption for the efficiency cores (both according to Apple).

Also the A12 bionic is 982 days old. The previous ATV4K based on the A10X according to Apple's Environmental Report, the device would/should only use 5.77 watts when streaming 4k HDR content.

Thats less then the usual 6 watt LED lightbulb so energy efficiency is not really a plus. :D
 
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It'd be nice if they would allow a browser app and pairing with keyboard and mouse (I think keyboard is already allowed) to make it a very simple basic computer. I'm sure they don't want to cut into mac sales, but this would be great for kids to do homework, etc.
 
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We don't play games on ATV4K.

If I bought the new one, apart from the 20 bucks, why would I want to buy the 64GB model over the 32GB model? I'm not clear what that storage is actually used for.
The storage is used to hold various temporary data.

For example consider the app Infuse, which is like Plex (only far far nicer). This downloads and stores movie posters and suchlike for all the content in your movie library. (So the movies are stored somewhere else, like on an SMB share, but the posters are stored in the Apple TV).

Likewise while you are watching content, some of it is stored ahead of what you are currently watching to provide a buffer. This may not seem like much but if you are like me and watching content in multiple apps at once (one for exercise, one while doing chores, one while relaxing) then it adds up.

You can live with less storage, but consequences will be that all this "volatile" storage will occasionally be thrown away to make space for new data. You'll switch to Infuse and it will take a few seconds to re-download the posters. Or switch back to the exercise movie, and there's a few seconds glitch as the video buffer is re-downloaded.

Look, it's all bearable. I bought the cheaper (32GB) aTV HD a few years ago because I wasn't sure quite how I would use it. And it's been fine through all those years since then. But this time round I will definitely get the 64GB -- why put up with occasional delays, albeit of only a few seconds, if you can get rid of them for just an extra $20?
 
Actually try Infuse. Infuse is "Apple-like". Plex is "Windows/Linux-like".
I find Infuse so much easier to deal with and so much nicer to look at. I have it playing movies off a drive connected my mac mini, and shared via SMB -- works very nicely.
(If you are using macOS Mojave or later you do need to set some permission to share the external drive via SMB -- be sure you do that otherwise neither Plex nor Infuse will see the drive.)
 
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I have an AppleTV 1080p and a PS5, and hands down, the AppleTV is the better media experience. The PS5s apps are way too low quality — persistent bugs, buffering issues, inconsistent UI. One of the big reasons I got it when I did was to move the AppleTv to another room but then I just ended up buying another one because anything that's not Gaming on the PS5 is just sub-par.
 
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Actually try Infuse. Infuse is "Apple-like". Plex is "Windows/Linux-like".
I find Infuse so much easier to deal with and so much nicer to look at. I have it playing movies off a drive connected my mac mini, and shared via SMB -- works very nicely.
(If you are using macOS Mojave or later you do need to set some permission to share the external drive via SMB -- be sure you do that otherwise neither Plex nor Infuse will see the drive.)

I did — wasn't a big fan, but admittedly it was a while back and may have improved.

Edit: I just remembered I hated how it scanned through a timeline — it made arbitrary jumps based on the length of the media (clicking back could jump 2:03 if it was a movie, or 14 seconds if it was a show), rather than a set amount of time (say, 10 or 30 second jumps forward or back). That annoyed me. Plus Plex has a PS5 app so I can see my media on more devices.
 
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