Arran
macrumors 603
So everyone signs up outside of the iOS app, right? And gets the lower price, yes?
What am I missing?
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Apple Says UK App Store Steering Rules Would Be 'Highly Intrusive'
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What am I missing?
surferfb
macrumors 68030
Citing a bunch of greedy developers who raise prices on their own customers so they can freeload on Apple’s hard work doesn’t do wonders for your argument. In those instances customers pay more because developers want all the benefits of being in the App Store without paying for it. And you call Apple greedy!
That must be why all the apps lowered their prices when Apple reduced the fee to 15% for almost all developers. Oh wait, that didn’t happen - developers kept prices the same and pocketed the difference:
After the 2021 cut from 30% to 15%, less than 5% of those developers’ apps showed any price decrease at all, and the 30%-to-15% drop on second-year auto-renewable subscriptions similarly produced price cuts on only a small minority of subscriptions. Spotify raised prices in the EU after the DMA.
Arran
macrumors 603
Apple banned developers from informing IOS user that they can get the same services for cheaper which is part of what this article is about. The CMA and the DMA rules is what is trying to stop Apple from preventing developers telling customers where to get the services for cheaper.
Arran
macrumors 603
1. Apple gave certain apps preferential treatment.
2. Apple got sued and governments passed rules preventing Apple from doing that.
Compote
macrumors 6502
WOW I guess now some red hat Americans will call the UK an enemy of the USA that hates freedom and inovation, or some foolishness we usually see when the EU enforces similar common sense, antitruts measures.
Compote
macrumors 6502
It doesn't affect how Apple's platform operates, but you'll just bark the same response even though you're wrong.
You're doubly wrong since, as it happens, the UK is a sovereign country that decides of its own laws.
You are, again, very welcome to take all you iThings back to Cupertino if you're unhappy.
I really can’t understand how anyone who feels so strongly about an “open ecosystem” can buy an iPhone.
I mean if an open ecosystem is what you care about, why do you have an iPhone?
I mean if an open ecosystem is what you care about, why do you have an iPhone?
Compote
macrumors 6502
That's ridiculous. Developpers don't want Apple STEALING their products and their rights.
Apple isn't a State, Apple doesn't levy taxes.
You understand that taxes are recouped by Apple at checkout, when the EU and the UK demand they pay their share, as well as penalties for breaking the law, but you want to pretend you do not understand when developpers recoup the Apple rackett on their apps?
What's even richer is you're implying it's Apple that did the work to get the Apps to the consumer. LOL. No devs, no apps. Devs make the apps, so devs get credit and money.
Another thing you do not see, is that devs are calling for alternate stores, so your argument that Apple is doing the hard work of providing a store, when nobody wants it, is completely beside the point.
Apple is mooching while producing no value, and it's hurting everyone.
After the UK demanded that Apple give them everyones personal data from all Apple users on the planet - even those who have never been and will never be in the UK - calling the UK an enemy to all nations seems perfectly reasonable to me.
Not even China demands that companies hand over the personal data of citizens outside their jurisdiction…
surferfb
macrumors 68030
Please explain to me how letting any random app link out to a website to accept payment does not change how Apple’s platform, which is highly focused on the safety of its customers and extols the benefits of a one-stop shop, operates?
I never said it wasn’t. I said apple “should” get to decide how its platform works.
As I mentioned above, Apple will continue to operate even if the UK government makes things worse for Apple’s customers, as they often do.
Apple is removing iCloud end-to-encryption features from the UK after government compelled it to add backdoors - 9to5Mac
Apple is removing the option to enable Advanced Data Protection for iCloud users in the United Kingdom. This feature let...
9to5mac.com
Arran
macrumors 603
Compote
macrumors 6502
This isn't about that.
Asking Apple to let alternatives to its App Store operate on its devices is a common sense, anti-trust measure.
We have laws in Europe, and Americans must abide by them.
I'll do you one better: Apple sells phones in China and makes all its products in China (some in India and probably some assembly in Brazil). And yet China is evil and there is no privacy and Apple surrenders all data.
We don't see you whatabouting about that.
Apple's not being anti-competitive, the U.K and the E.U. simply have nothing to compete with.
surferfb
macrumors 68030
Developers have no apps without using Apple’s intellectual property to build them. Apple deserves to be compensated for use of that property in the way they see fit. We don’t let developers stiff their landlords because they think their landlord is charging too much; same idea here.
I’m implying that without Apple developers’ apps don’t function. So they should compensate Apple for that use in the way Apple asks. If they don’t like Apple’s terms they don’t have to develop for Apple.
Apple and the App Store both produce a massive amount of value for customers and for developers, which is why developers make significantly more money on the App Store than the play store.
Because liking iOS, iPadOS, or macOS doesn't obligate you to defend every decision the company that makes them makes. You can use a product and still think specific practices are less than ideal, bad or anticompetitive. Plenty of us run every platform combination there is and aren't loyal to any single vendor's whims.
Same logic as citizenship. Living somewhere doesn't mean you approve of everything the government does. You can criticize it, vote against it, push for it to change. And before anyone says "well just switch phones," that's exactly the point, people still don't do it over this, because the rest of the ecosystem works for them. That's not hypocrisy.
Not true. Not all profit seeking activity is greedy.
Compote
macrumors 6502
People have already explained it to you. There is a payment and download method on the App Store.Please explain to me how letting any random app link out to a website to accept payment does not change how Apple’s platform, which is highly focused on the safety of its customers and extols the benefits of a one-stop shop, operates?
I never said it wasn’t. I said apple “should” get to decide how its platform works.
As I mentioned above, Apple will continue to operate even if the UK government makes things worse for Apple’s customers, as they often do.
Apple is removing iCloud end-to-encryption features from the UK after government compelled it to add backdoors - 9to5Mac
Apple is removing the option to enable Advanced Data Protection for iCloud users in the United Kingdom. This feature let...
The devs won't be using it.
That doesn't disrupt the App store.
Just like there's a bra store where I never buy anything. I'm not disrupting the way they function. I'm just not a customer there.
You have an issue with anti-monopoly policies. You have an issue with actual freedom. You want everything technofeudal, which is exactly what Apple tries to achieve. To have a fiefdom over which their rule, from which they punction taxes.
You "never said the UK didn't have laws", AND YET, you said that the law shouldn't apply to Apple. So you DID say that the UK doesn't have the right to write its own laws. It's fair to say you're a gaslighter. It's safe to say you're doing a poor job of it.
"Apple will continue to operate" is your cope for "Apple will be compelled to abide by the law or risks massive fines or be expelled from the UK market". So, again, you're trying to go out on a limb with the last word, but you didn't have the last word, did you? The UK will have the last word, and Apple will obey. It will only hurt Apple's bottom line to punish its own customers. So, instead of stealing from people at every AppStore checkout, they'll raise prices on their devices. That's allowed. That's what the UK wants. That will only hurt Apple, not the customers, not the devs.
And if you believe people won't punish Apple for thinking it's above laws designed to protect them... you're wrong again.
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surferfb
macrumors 68030
A related point is that a lot of tech enthusiasts don’t understand that many people like Apple because of the restrictions, not in spite of them.
The fact that there’s one place to get apps, and if you buy one from there it’s not going to hose your device or steal your credit card, and if you don’t like the service it’s super easy to cancel is a huge selling point.
I do understand why those who want to force Apple open do; if open software was important to me and I cared about privacy and a well designed OS as much as I do then I’d probably be right there with them.
But I don’t think their desires are more important than Apple’s, or the majority of Apple’s customers who prefer things how they are. In my opinion they want to have their cake and eat it too, which is totally understandable, but it’s not how the world works. If it’s that important to you, use Android, if it’s lower down the priority list then sure complain, but trying to get the government to force your preference over Apple’s and most of its customers is, in my opinion, a step too far.
Then stay within that restriction. Nobody is asking you to sideload, use 3rd party stores, use 3rd party payment processing. Just stay within those restrictions. However, i should be allowed to go outside if i choose to.
My point was more you lost the power to make snarky comments when the UK started trying to apply its own laws to every person on the planet. All those people you were mocking for saying the UK hates freedom - I mean they kind of have a point, when the UK is trying to apply its laws on other nations citizens…
As for China, I don’t think I understand your point. Apple follows the laws in China, as it should. Corporations should not be above the law.
And I have no clue where you are getting China is evil from.
That is all absolutely fair. It is just the way some commentators post, it sounds like having a open ecosystem is the single most important factor in the world to them.
BaldiMac
macrumors G3
Ahh. I did misremember the source of the study. Ad hominem aside, feel free to cite your own data. A few counter examples doesn't change the point. And certainly doesn’t change the math.
As usual, the same lie is used to support this argument. Again, less than 2% of apps pay 30%.