Apple Seeds Mac OS X 10.3.5

[JFreak]

That's a good observation. And it's strange because being based on BSD you would think it would have the oldest and most stable networking code of any system.

there's nothing wrong with networking in the low level - that has been perfected in the 70's. apple however tries to make some high-level networking in their operating system, and that takes a lot of trial-and-error to make it perfect.

...or would you be happy with just a physical network interface and a tcp/ip stack? you can after all do whatever you want with it. via command-line interface. it's all there.

as mac is all about gui, i have come to expect being able to easily connect to network shares, too, via gui. i have become so lazy i don't want to use terminal whenever i want to do whatever in some remote resource. apple is doing a good job here, and while the features have been there for a while, they are far from optimized and still not bug-free.

 

[MikeTheC]

i have become so lazy i don't want to use terminal whenever i want to do whatever in some remote resource. apple is doing a good job here, and while the features have been there for a while, they are far from optimized and still not bug-free.

To say nothing of capitalizing your "i"s. Sorry, not a nitpick but an observation.

BTW, I agree with you, and no, I wouldn't want an exclusively command-line interface for that either.

 

[AirUncleP]

A doctor once told me "THE ENEMY OF GOOD IS BETTER"
True in some cases.
When it comes to Mac OS', I don't see it.
Keep leading us forward APPLE Inc.

P.S. Any Job openings in Denver?

 

[FoxyKaye]

there's nothing wrong with networking in the low level - that has been perfected in the 70's. apple however tries to make some high-level networking in their operating system, and that takes a lot of trial-and-error to make it perfect.

Agreed - I also think Apple is doing their best to make the entire OS conform to standards, so that the high-level proprietary stuff translates down to the BSD commands in an elegant fashion. I imagine this is why there are also frequent "network" improvements in OS updates.

Compare this to Microsoft, who if I recall correctly, briefly floated the idea of creating their own proprietary version of TCP/IP a few years ago. Gods, can you imagine, MS TCP/IP? They've already screwed Java up enough.

Any way the deck gets cut, I'd rather have frequent OS updates from Apple than deal with M$ constantly trying to create their own standards and force them on other folks so that they can get away with otherwise ridiculous OS command handling that circumvents time-tested things like, oh, security. I mean, this is at least part of the reason Windows is always getting hacked by viruses that exploit security flaws created by these types of workarounds in the OS.

OS X = Secure
Windows = Scary

 

[garybUK]

Networking (SMB) on MAC OS is provided by the courtosy of Samba (with a few tweaks), they have been developing Samba to work with Microsoft's CIFS by trial and error (Microsoft dont release their code), thats why you see constant network updates, plus the fact Apple are trying to integrate this software into the finder, its always going to be problematic at best because Microsoft dont want you sharing using their technology, they would rather you install the Apple Services in Windows Server.

One area i find really bad in OSX in regards to networking (more so than windows sharing) is FTP, my god why cant they put a simple ftp client into safari or something like IE, why mount it as a drive, this never seems to work properly, instead i have to use cyberduck

 

[MacinDoc]

The irony for me is that I can't run Panther at home b/c I have an upgraded Beige G3 (OK, well, I could, but there's still a lot of interfacing work left to be done), but I run Panther at work on an old G3/350 iMac.

Do you mean that there are interfacing problems with xpostfacto? I was thinking of upgrading to Panther, too, and I had read that most of the problems had been ironed out. If there are still problems, I may wait to upgrade my OS...

BTW, did you ever try changing the jumper settings to overclock your G3 desktop (hey, except for the processor, it's even more overhauled than mine!)

 

[roadwarrior]

Do you mean that there are interfacing problems with xpostfacto? I was thinking of upgrading to Panther, too, and I had read that most of the problems had been ironed out. If there are still problems, I may wait to upgrade my OS...

BTW, did you ever try changing the jumper settings to overclock your G3 desktop (hey, except for the processor, it's even more overhauled than mine!)

I'm not quite sure what he means by that either. I've got Panther running on a PowerMac 7300 upgraded to a G3/300 using XPostFacto with no problems.

 

[JFreak]

One area i find really bad in OSX in regards to networking is FTP, my god why cant they put a simple ftp client into safari or something like IE, why mount it as a drive, this never seems to work properly.

i think you are wrong here. if you want a full-reatured ftp gui client, try transmit by www.panic.com or if you can, use it via command-line. that is as good as it gets. and the ftp thingy in idiot explorer has always sucked, no matter how to look at it.

on the other hand, the way apple mounts ftp connections as "drives" the same way they mount other shares, well, that's good - one less thing for newbies to learn. just give them a proper link to a resource and let them use it as a "drive". (by the way, these are "mounts", not "drives". osx doesn't care if it's a local hard drive or a network share. a mount is a mount and introduced as a directory under /Volumes which is hidden in finder to avoid confusion. i think apple does wonderful job with making it simple for a regular user.)

what i want apple to do about ftp is to make it happen securely, too. i cannot believe sftp doesn't work the way ftp does. at least here in europe the standard ftp is more and more being banned because it is insecure. almost everyone here uses secure ftp.

 

[garybUK]

what i want apple to do about ftp is to make it happen securely, too. i cannot believe sftp doesn't work the way ftp does. at least here in europe the standard ftp is more and more being banned because it is insecure. almost everyone here uses secure ftp.

I agree but the authentication on a volume mount from a ftp server seems to take FOREVER!!! might be because im behind a proxy but other ftp clients work fine. typically i just use the fetch command in terminal, a lot easier.

But i have to disagree about the ftp client in ie, it works fine, for downloading only. Click a link and its there you are browing the ftp site in the browser and it works fine, click the file and save it... of course this one feature still doesn't make me want to have IE installed on my G5

yes sftp is kind of a rudamentry implementation for any security centric network, im shocked apple didn't include support for this in their UI.

 

[vannote]

That's a good observation. And it's strange because being based on BSD you would think it would have the oldest and most stable networking code of any system.

BSD (FreeBSD) is in the middle of revamping some of its networking code with v/5.x. I remember reading somewhere that Apple grabbed some of that new code. Unfortunately, FreeBSD 5.x is not even at "STABLE" yet. So, yes there may be issues.

This tidbit is off the top of my head, but it stuck with me as I have major WiFI problems with a PB 800 (Snow Base) where the Airport driver will periodically freeze the machine solid. This has been acknowledged by Apple as a known problem.

Regards

 

[JayBee]

... my god why cant they put a simple ftp client into safari or something like IE...

What, and give the Konfuzzled Konfabulator weenies another "pariah" in Panic Software?

"OMFG! I CANT' BELEIV TAHT APPL WOULD RIP OFFF TRANSMIT!!! THAT'S SO M$ STYEL! I'MN EVER BYEING A MAC AGAIN!!!!!!!"

😀

And as someone very astutely pointed out, if you could mount an FTP login as a writeable drive, who needs an iDisk for web publishing?

😉

 

[caveman_uk]

I want to download this ASAP! Hopefully with some new network stability issues fixed.

Wait until it comes out for real - then wait a little while more. Remember the cutting edge can be a little sharp and pointy sometimes
😀

 

[robbieduncan]

It wouldn't kill Apple to at least standardize all versions of certain programs, oh, like SAFARI for example. The irony for me is that I can't run Panther at home b/c I have an upgraded Beige G3 (OK, well, I could, but there's still a lot of interfacing work left to be done), but I run Panther at work on an old G3/350 iMac. It's a real pain in the butt to still be working on Safari 1.0.2 on a better system. 🙄

The newer versions of Safari rely on improvements to the underlying system to work. For example 1.1 (or was it 1.2) supports text shadows via css. This is done via the NSShadow class. As this is only available on 10.3 or above there is no easy way to get the newer Safari running on 10.2. The same holds true for a number of apps and technologies (Cocoa Bindings for example).

 

[aussie_geek]

Was just thinking the other day that it was about time for an update. It's funny that I have been running software update manually for the last week or so expecting some new goodies... 😉

aussie_geek

 

[johnnyjibbs]

The newer versions of Safari rely on improvements to the underlying system to work. For example 1.1 (or was it 1.2) supports text shadows via css. This is done via the NSShadow class. As this is only available on 10.3 or above there is no easy way to get the newer Safari running on 10.2. The same holds true for a number of apps and technologies (Cocoa Bindings for example).

Of course they could solve that problem by making Panther free 😉

Only kidding, Apple has to make money somehow...

Addressing some of the earlier comments about Jaguar updates after the release of Panther - the answer is no (and Panther updates will cease after Tiger's launch). The last update each major revision of the OS tends to be a stable one that allows people to stick with that version. I'm sure if some major bug was found at a later date, they may release a patch though.

Security updates, for example, have also recently been issued to Jaguar users as well as Panther users.

 

[wordmunger]

And as someone very astutely pointed out, if you could mount an FTP login as a writeable drive, who needs an iDisk for web publishing?

Good point, but I don't use iDisk for Web publishing; I use it for automatic background syncing. Still, as I have said many times, if Apple doesn't significantly bump up iDisk space, I won't be renewing my subscription to .mac.

 

[Sabbath]

Could this be related to the afore-mentioned Safari 1.3 seed?

Yup lets hope we see it soon, I always like safari updates especially speedups, safari is great but still a few things to be ironed out. Networking can always do with tweaking it seems, I still often have trouble connecting to windows computers.

It looks like we might be seeing this a bit sooner than AI suggested however which is great news as long as it works!

 

[MikeTheC]

I'm not quite sure what he means by that either. I've got Panther running on a PowerMac 7300 upgraded to a G3/300 using XPostFacto with no problems.

How are you guys getting these old systems to run Panther? I (amongst other things) have a Beige G3 at home, and Panther hangs on boot off the original CD (even though this CD boots up anything else I've got flawlessly).

 

[age234]

I hope they've fixed the "local string not found" bug in Safari.

 

[MacNeXT]

How are you guys getting these old systems to run Panther? I (amongst other things) have a Beige G3 at home, and Panther hangs on boot off the original CD (even though this CD boots up anything else I've got flawlessly).

http://eshop.macsales.com/OSXCenter/XPostFacto/

It's a great piece of software!

 

[The Red Wolf]

It wouldn't kill Apple to at least standardize all versions of certain programs, oh, like SAFARI for example. The irony for me is that I can't run Panther at home b/c I have an upgraded Beige G3 (OK, well, I could, but there's still a lot of interfacing work left to be done), but I run Panther at work on an old G3/350 iMac. It's a real pain in the butt to still be working on Safari 1.0.2 on a better system.

Apple discontinued support for any machines that were "beige". Doesn't mean you can't get Panther to run on them with upgrade cards, its just not supported.

 

[The Red Wolf]

Rendezvous update in 10.3.5?

As its stated that "Networking" will be updated, I wonder if this includes the new version of Rendezvous. It's no longer limited to one sub-net. It broadcasts and receives across DNS. So essentially global. Would be nice to see it this forthcoming update or a before Tiger one. The newer Rendezvous will be in Tiger native.

 

[invaLPsion]

OpenGL performance

i hope this update provides an OpenGL speedup to make our games look better and run faster!!!!!! OH BOY OH BOY!

 

[virividox]

woo hoo cant wait bring on the updates

 

[MikeTheC]

As far as waiting for a newer OS is concerned, what is that all about? I have noticed definite improvements with some of the double-dot releases, and no losses with the others. Besides, why wait upwards of 12 months for a dot release when you could benefit from the improvements between now and then that Apple makes available for free?

I'm always excited when Apple puts out an update. I'm not saying that Apple is infallible, but their updates are a heck of a lot better an alternative to Microsoft's incessant "fixes".