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Apple Set to Shift From Samsung to TSMC for 'A6' Chip Production Next Year?

chrmjenkins said:
Tegra 2 was, but he was referring to Samsung's next generation SoC, Exynos, which didn't launch until The Galaxy S II launched in May. Samsung also didn't use the Tegra 2 until May. (A tegra 2 SII version exists).

As for Kal-el, we need to wait for design wins first. Tegra 2 was lucky to be a google reference chip for Android 3.0, but if power consumption is high on Tegra 3, people may shy away from it.
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I believe I read that the Tegra line is supposed to operate on a tick-tock schedule. The tick meets a certain power usage, and the tock provides enhancements to get more power out of the same usage. I believe the Kal-el is supposed to have the same exact power usage and specs as the tegra II but with significantly faster quad cores and way better graphics.

That said, staying at the same current level of power usage is...well its not good in my opinion.

This is where Apple and the rest need to step it up. 10 hours is GREAT, but when we reach literally all day usage, well thats a whole new ball game.
 
chrmjenkins said:
Tegra 2 was, but he was referring to Samsung's next generation SoC, Exynos, which didn't launch until The Galaxy S II launched in May. Samsung also didn't use the Tegra 2 until May. (A tegra 2 SII version exists).
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You might be right about launches, I was sure Samsung had a dual core product out in february, but it does seem they didn't after all.

However, the post was still wrong that "Samsung copies Apple stuff" when Apple's A5 is just a Cortex A9, which players have been demoing (including Samsung's Orion) since late last year.

As for IPS, it's still old technology and still has the problems of LCD, ie, washed out colors and bad blacks because of the backlight. The industry has moved forward, and especially Samsung, with their iron grip on AMOLED production which they use almost exclusively in their own devices.

Samsung doesn't need Apple as a customer in order to "copy", if they even copy in the first place (let's not go there, I don't want to have to repost all my stuff on the "blatant" copying thing... let the judge sort it out before anyone makes any claims as fact here).
 
NT1440 said:
I believe I read that the Tegra line is supposed to operate on a tick-tock schedule. The tick meets a certain power usage, and the tock provides enhancements to get more power out of the same usage. I believe the Kal-el is supposed to have the same exact power usage and specs as the tegra II but with significantly faster quad cores and way better graphics.
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They are roughly doubling the silicon in both the cpu and gpu. They are still on the same 40nm process, and they are adding SIMD/NEON support to their CPU. I would bet my life that their peak power consumption is higher than the Tegra 2.

They may have lower static power consumption, but the 40nm process is pretty mature and tapped out because they haven't been able to advance to 32nm on schedule because TSMC basically scrapped it for 28nm.

As for it being quad core, I'd skeptical that there is any real world mobile device usage scenario where that would matter currently. I can definitely see its appeal in a net top like conversion device much like the atrix, but beyond that, I'm not so sure.

That said, staying at the same current level of power usage is...well its not good in my opinion.

This is where Apple and the rest need to step it up. 10 hours is GREAT, but when we reach literally all day usage, well thats a whole new ball game.
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Apple is on the top of the group as far as smartphones go (blackberries excluded).

KnightWRX said:
You might be right about launches, I was sure Samsung had a dual core product out in february, but it does seem they didn't after all.

However, the post was still wrong that "Samsung copies Apple stuff" when Apple's A5 is just a Cortex A9, which players have been demoing (including Samsung's Orion) since late last year.
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I'm not approaching it from the copying angle. I was addressing the idea that Apple is lacking technologically.

As for IPS, it's still old technology and still has the problems of LCD, ie, washed out colors and bad blacks because of the backlight. The industry has moved forward, and especially Samsung, with their iron grip on AMOLED production which they use almost exclusively in their own devices.
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And they don't have production capacity for Apple's needs. It's not realistic to expect Apple to release a product that doesn't have production capacity to meet their volume. Samsung is getting there with new plants opening, but they hadn't been there previously, and things like the HTC Droid Incredible even switched to SLCD when shortages threatened its production.
 
KnightWRX said:
However, the post was still wrong that "Samsung copies Apple stuff" when Apple's A5 is just a Cortex A9, which players have been demoing (including Samsung's Orion) since late last year.
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Well, sorta. It's pretty clear to me that they just started with A9 RTL, but I don't think it looks anything like any other A9 out there (the size, alone, should make this apparent).
 
cmaier said:
Well, sorta. It's pretty clear to me that they just started with A9 RTL, but I don't think it looks anything like any other A9 out there (the size, alone, should make this apparent).
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I haven't compared. How big is it compared to the reference design? I'll admit I don't even know if it has a SIMD unit.
 
chrmjenkins said:
I haven't compared. How big is it compared to the reference design? I'll admit I don't even know if it has a SIMD unit.
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I've read that it's about 2x the die area. I suspect they are using n-of-m encoding, but that's just a guess - my buddies won't tell me.
 
cmaier said:
I've read that it's about 2x the die area. I suspect they are using n-of-m encoding, but that's just a guess - my buddies won't tell me.
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The value of n-of-m being what? I see it has applicability in frequency hopping, but that's tower-side, not handset side I thought?
 
chrmjenkins said:
The value of n-of-m being what? I see it has applicability in frequency hopping, but that's tower-side, not handset side I thought?
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Speed/efficiency. The Intrinsity guys (formerly EVSX formerly members of the Austin design team of Exponential Technology) did that stuff, and Apple acquired them.
 
Not quite

shigzeo said:
Again, Samsung are still the largest corporate entity on the planet. Their electronics business is just ONE of their businesses. They own: groceries (where they started out), refineries, shipperies, construction companies, skyscrapers, investment firms, insurance, hotels, shopping malls, amusement parks, household electronics, apartments, and a LOT more.
...
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Samsung is indeed a big company, with about the revenue of Warren Buffet's company. But it is hardly the biggest. Major oil companies have higher revenue, as do VW and Toyota. GE is bigger. Walmart is three times as big.
 
cmaier said:
I can shed a tiny bit of light on that. My understanding is that the PA Semi guys were not involved in A5.
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That's interesting, because I thought there was custom power saving logic in their A-branded chips. Who else would this come from if not PA Semi's expertise?
 
chrmjenkins said:
That's interesting, because I thought there was custom power saving logic in their A-branded chips. Who else would this come from if not PA Semi's expertise?
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There may or may not be such logic, but this isn't the kind of thing that requires "expertise."
 
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