So we will debate this over a know fact that Andoid devices are collecting user private information?
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Apple Stopped Supporting Carrier IQ in iOS 5, Complete Removal Coming in Future
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So we will debate this over a know fact that Andoid devices are collecting user private information?
You are incorrect. If carriers required it then it would be on Nokia phones as well, but according to Nokia, it is not.
Carrier IQ masquerades itself as a diagnostic tool. Apple used it as such. Other OEM's, who are responsible for putting it on there abused its abilities and also made it very hard to remove.
Slippery slope my foot. That catch-all argument assumes way too much. Much that has been proven to be vastly difficult, unrealistic and or impossible given the last century's political *and* cultural climate. Remember when SSNs weren't supposed to be shared with *anyone*? Now everyone and their mother needs it to "verify your identification".
Fine. I'm now waiting for Google/Android Handset makers to announce that it won't allow the carriers to put this spyware on their smartphones.
Please let us know when this happens.
It sort of is though. Apple has a very strict approach to their products, they decide what goes in and what doesnt. They take full responsibility for their products. They obviously dont have the OEM relationship to negotiate, but even at the carrier level, Apple sets a certain level of expectation (e.g. no carrier installed apps, no carrier logos, etc )
Android by its very nature will never have the level of quality control and focus on end user experience iOS or WPS7 does. Bear in mind Im not discounting the possibility of a balkan Android to come along, ala the Fire or even a Nexus device that will match Apple, but as a whole Android can never achieve parity in experience.
You don't have to have multiple business degrees to know of the multitude of reasons such apps are valuable.
Blaming Google, Samsung, HTC or anyone who did not put this into affected phones AND had no control over it is totally unreasonable.
In part this is what you get for having an open ecosystem: you give the freedom to do stuff like this.
What I think you CAN do, however, is praise Apple for taking a stand against carriers and winning a fight for not letting them touch their OS and phones.
You can point at this evidence for reasons for trying to convince manufacturers and Google to try to stop carriers from messing with the phones, but you can hardly blame them for what the carriers did.
I think it's a bit like someone blaming macrumors for controversial (but legal) messages posted on the site, just because the users had the freedom to talk about stuff.
On another note, I don't think you can blame Apple for having put CarrierIQ into iOS themselves: unlike the Android version, this was opt-out, you got warned that information could be recorded, it was much less intrusive (more reasonable stuff is being collected), and I think it was even disabled by default. They would obviously remove it now even if they didn't plan to just for avoiding possible controversy.
You make a good point, then again this could be a case where everyone (I even lump Apple here) is scrambling. Everyone is now pointing fingers at each other. Case in point:
http://allthingsd.com/20111201/rim-htc-on-carrier-iq-blame-the-carriers/
Perhaps the real take away here is that all of them are to blame.
w00master
what in android case, it was on the iphone did anyone know about this till now? this is the second time with iphone wasnt there a situation like this before with apple not to long ago.
look at the android source code and tell me were you see carrier IQ
in the source code you dont, google does not install this on there phone the carries do, htc has it samsung has it verizon said none of there phone has it, sprint has it and some of apple phone has it.
And I think that, right there, is the central point.
As I said in my original comment:
So maybe everyone is just scrambling, as you said, to cover their behinds now that Carrier IQ's potential negative uses are out in the open.
Either way, I stand by when I said that this kind of thing is everyone's burden and responsibility. Not only do the carriers and manufacturers need to be aware of and respect our privacy, but we as users need to take an active approach to ensure it.
Edit: Is it odd that I feel funny quoting myself?
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I wouldnt like to own any part of CarrierIQ right now. It's been a total trainwreck since TrevE first exposed them.
First came his findings
Then the cease and desist.
Then the apology & the announcement saying they were not monitoring SMS, location or keystrokes.
Then TrevE hits with another video showing plain text of SMS's, URL's and dialpad keylogging...
And now they're doing an independant review according to The Verge? They had the audacity to issue the C&D and then they lied about what the software is capable of?
Disgusting.
I wouldnt like to own any part of CarrierIQ right now. It's been a total trainwreck since TrevE first exposed them.
First came his findings
Then the cease and desist.
Then the apology & the announcement saying they were not monitoring SMS, location or keystrokes.
Then TrevE hits with another video showing plain text of SMS's, URL's and dialpad keylogging...
And now they're doing an independant review according to The Verge? They had the audacity to issue the C&D and then they lied about what the software is capable of?
Disgusting.
I love to see all the ways the Apple Fanboys continually defend Apple. To say in a post that Google is evil for allowing it and Apple is looking out for us because they (only) partially removed it in the CURRENT, just RELEASED version of the OS makes me laugh. Apple IMO is one of the most "evil" companies doing business. Yes I love their products. Yes I'm on a MBP now while my iPhone 4S is sitting next to me and my iPod Touch is in my car... and my Mac Mini is also on my desk and my Extreme Base station is across the room... but I'm not in denial thinking Apple is some knight in shining armor sitting on the hill protecting and defending mankind from everyone else.
The problem I see is that on the phones where keystrokes were logged (like the HTC ones -- since iPhone did not log the keystrokes) is that things like credit card numbers and bank pins could be logged. Then if you lost the phone, somebody might have unencrypted access to that information.
Before this going public few folks knew about that. Now that it is known, the #1 thing an identity thief will do when finding a lost phone is try to pull the Carrier IQ logs from the device.
Thankfully iOS devices don't log the keystrokes. Also, supposedly WP7 devices and the Android Nexus devices don't even have this software installed.
I agree with you though that likely nobody has yet been hurt by this -- but the potential is there. Kinda like finding and exposing a security hole in an operating system. Once its out in the open, it needs to be fixed.
Carrier IQ won't have to be worried about being sued. They aren't the one's that put the software on the phones. They sold the software to carriers.. They are in the clear.. The carriers have to answer for this..
And I can bet if it was never found it wouldn't even make the news..
I don't know if you call it crapware but I do recall apple getting private information and then sending out a software update to address what they had going on...
Like nokia would tell us the truth and risk a lawsuit.. They are probably looking into right now and wondering if it is there how to get it off their devices..
James
This is stupid.
I can't show you one person who has been "been truly hurt, punished, injured or in any other way disenfranchised" by a store who put video cameras in bathrooms and changing rooms and allowed employees to see them naked. But most people feel violated by it and don't like it.
I probably wouldn't be "truly" harmed if "Find my Friends" broadcast my location on a public website that anyone could look at. But I would still feel like my privacy was invaded and would not like it.
And if you are okay with corporations abusing your privacy, that's your prerogative. But I'm glad that most people actually care about their privacy and object when corporations spy on them.
More importantly might be that Google also hasn't (yet) done anything to stop it either.
It is OFF by default on iOS.
Apple: off by default. Can be changed in settings. Cannot collect keystrokes or secure data.
Android: ON even before activation. Can NOT be changed. Can collect keystrokes and HTTPs info.
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It's not even INSTALLED by default on some devices.
so aggressive
Consultant said:
It's not even INSTALLED by default on some devices.
so aggressive
What a mess. While I can see the value of a software like this to the carriers and handset manufacturers, this seems to have been handled poorly from the get go. Fact is that a lot of companies were using it, including Apple. Ok, so Apple stopped supporting it in iOS 5, but what the heck does that mean? Why did they stop supporting it? Did Apple develop something themselves so they can stop paying Carrier IQ for their services? Or did they get a conscious and decided it was wrong? Who knows, but now they're seem to be spinning it to come across as the good guys. No one seems to know the extent of data collection and what is being done with it on ANY platform. I applaud the people who found this and decided it was a big deal. Just the thought of so much information about me being transferred to a 3rd party is very upsetting. How legal is all of this? Ugh, excuse me while I adjust my Tin foil hat... I just need transparency, that's all I ask so I can make the decision on the devices I use.