Apple Stops PhotoFast's MacBook Air SSD Replacement?

[marksman]

Examples of one retailer if you doubt me. I've no doubt other companies act in the same manner:

http://www.businessandleadership.com/leadership/item/19980-tesco-demands-six-figure-p

http://www.heenamodi.com/2008/08/18/should-we-shop-at-tesco-do-they-treat-their-suppliers-ethically/

Just browsed the first example. Nothing wrong with what Tesco is doing. They control a limited resource that a lot of suppliers want access to... It makes sense to get the most you can out of that limited resource. Suppliers don't have to pay the money if they want to... but in that case it is the cost of getting access to their customers. This is how the world works.

How do you think items get into a retail store? As a retail buyer many years ago, I can tell you there are many different aspects to the negotiation and it depends on a lot of factors. Some stores may charge money for slots, other stores may require advertising coop spends, others may depend other concessions.

The problem is there are laws in many places that limit selling things at a discount outside of volume that makes the whole retail supply chain dicey. So there are other ways to make those decisions besides just demanding the lowest cost of goods. Not to mention that is accounted for entirely differently.

If you had a store with a slot for 20 items and 50 people wanted those 20 slots, how would you decide who gets the slots? What if the 5 in contention for the last spot were all fairly similar in cost and product?

 

[KPOM]

What company makes the OEM drive for Apple?

Apple doesn't make it, they just get it from a third party supplier and integrate it into the system.

Toshiba.

 

[apolloa]

Most of you didn't read the article correctly, because most of you lack reading comprehension skills. Or if thats not the case, you'll skim the article and rush to write a generic response.

But this isn't about you not being allowed to upgrade or apple trying to hog all the money. Toshiba sells the same exact part separate from the MBA, so why hasn't Apple tried to stop them.

I know it's fun for a lot of you to go into attack Apple mode, because it fulfills your life in some way, however, when doing so, know the facts and think rationally.

The Toshiba drive is slower and it is also the one installed in the Air at the factory so it;s the exact same drive. Also Toshiba are only selling the drives to OEM partners and NOT the public. Yet.

 

[Zc456]

typical apple. nothing new. they are able to continue to do this because there is no opposition from apples user base.

on a different note, check this : (Apple Bans Android Magazine App From App Store)

http://apple.slashdot.org/story/10/11/29/1633249/Apple-Bans-Android-Magazine-App-From-App-Store

!!!!!

That's insane. What if someone has an Android phone, but uses an iPad? That would be perfect for those people.

 

[gnasher729]

Occam's Razor. The simplest explanation is more often than not the correct one. So what reasonable people would assume is that the explanation given, being very simple - "Apple asked them to stop" - is the correct one until evidence presents itself to the contrary. Reasonable people also keep their mind open to other possibilities as well.

I don't think you understand Occam's Razor. You would have to find the simplest explanation that is logically consistent and explains everything. Some people here seem to assume that 1. Photofast creates a great product that many MacBook Air users would love to buy. 2. Apple doesn't like it and stops it. That is not a simple explanation because Apple would have no reason to do that, except to those looking for conspiracies everywhere, and Apple would be on very dubious ground legally.

Another explanation is that 1. Photofast creates a product that causes some kind of trouble. 2. Apple doesn't like it and stops it. That is an explanation that actually makes sense.

In other threads, you can find that there are two makes of SSD drives using the Sandforce controller, and apparantly one runs inside a MBP 13" without any problem, and the other one causes lots of problems (for some reason only inside the 13" model, it seems). Would be logical if Apple tried to stop the latter one from selling drives for the 13" model, only there is nothing much they can do. So it is quite possible that such a drive could cause problems.

well, actually they DON'T work in some cases. remember the strange graphicscard problems in the MBA?

however, if someone wants to change the harddisk, he shall do so. if it goes wrong, it is HIS own problem afterwards. it's like with a car: if you buy the wrong tires, it's not your car manufacturers problem.

the real problem is, that apple is FORCING you. and who - as a client - wants to be forced? apple is turning into dictatorship, and that is very sad to see as a client.

It seems that on the MacBook Air, RAM and SSD are not user upgradable. That means if the user does upgrade them, their warranty will be void. Now it is very logical that Apple wants people to know this before they upgrade an SSD (so Apple doesn't have to deal with angry customers who lost their warranty), but PhotoFast wouldn't really want people to know (because many would not upgrade the SSD if they know it voids the warranty). With this conflict in mind, Apple could have said "Please don't advertise these drives without stating very clearly that installing them voids the warranty". Photofast says "no". Apple says "in that case, we don't want you as a partner selling products for iPad, iPod and iPhone with an Apple logo on your products". Photofast says to Engadget "we had to stop selling these drives, because Apple threatened us".

 

[lilo777]

I don't think you understand Occam's Razor. You would have to find the simplest explanation that is logically consistent and explains everything. Some people here seem to assume that 1. Photofast creates a great product that many MacBook Air users would love to buy. 2. Apple doesn't like it and stops it. That is not a simple explanation because Apple would have no reason to do that, except to those looking for conspiracies everywhere, and Apple would be on very dubious ground legally.

Another explanation is that 1. Photofast creates a product that causes some kind of trouble. 2. Apple doesn't like it and stops it. That is an explanation that actually makes sense.

In other threads, you can find that there are two makes of SSD drives using the Sandforce controller, and apparantly one runs inside a MBP 13" without any problem, and the other one causes lots of problems (for some reason only inside the 13" model, it seems). Would be logical if Apple tried to stop the latter one from selling drives for the 13" model, only there is nothing much they can do. So it is quite possible that such a drive could cause problems.




It seems that on the MacBook Air, RAM and SSD are not user upgradable. That means if the user does upgrade them, their warranty will be void. Now it is very logical that Apple wants people to know this before they upgrade an SSD (so Apple doesn't have to deal with angry customers who lost their warranty), but PhotoFast wouldn't really want people to know (because many would not upgrade the SSD if they know it voids the warranty). With this conflict in mind, Apple could have said "Please don't advertise these drives without stating very clearly that installing them voids the warranty". Photofast says "no". Apple says "in that case, we don't want you as a partner selling products for iPad, iPod and iPhone with an Apple logo on your products". Photofast says to Engadget "we had to stop selling these drives, because Apple threatened us".

To summarize your logic: Apple thinks that it is always better for people to buy and use Apple products than anything else and therefore they are justified to do whatever they want. You came up with a lot of excuses for Apple. Even Apple did not bother to do this.

 

[samwight]

battery life?

1. Companies exist to make money, unless they are charitable companies. So, accusing them of doing something because of greed is a compliment.

2. One way to make money is to keep customers happy, so they become repeat customers. This is Apple's speciality, if surveys are to be believed. So, it is not believable that Apple shut down Photofast to screw their customers.

3. It is not obvious how shutting down Photofast helps Apple's bottom line, but it seems unlikely that they are trying to suppress competition, since Apple doesn't now, and is unlikely in the future, to sell upgrade kits themselves.

4. It is much more likely that Apple chose the particular memory chips for a reason, and limited the 11" capacity for a reason. That reason may have to do with battery life or heat dissipation or reliability or something else. But it is not a big stretch to conclude that Apple believes the best user experience, and therefore the best chance of repeat customers is with the factory configuration. Maybe they don't want to sacrifice all the potential profit that such customer satisfaction brings to them for a brief profit surge for someone else.

5. Photofast is presumably free to sell their upgrade, but if Apple feels this will damage customer satisfaction, they should be free to withhold their rubber stamp in the form of MFI membership. It is almost certainly legal, and in my opinion, perfectly ethical to do so.

 

[lilo777]

1. Companies exist to make money, unless they are charitable companies. So, accusing them of doing something because of greed is a compliment.

2. One way to make money is to keep customers happy, so they become repeat customers. This is Apple's speciality, if surveys are to be believed. So, it is not believable that Apple shut down Photofast to screw their customers.

3. It is not obvious how shutting down Photofast helps Apple's bottom line, but it seems unlikely that they are trying to suppress competition, since Apple doesn't now, and is unlikely in the future, to sell upgrade kits themselves.

4. It is much more likely that Apple chose the particular memory chips for a reason, and limited the 11" capacity for a reason. That reason may have to do with battery life or heat dissipation or reliability or something else. But it is not a big stretch to conclude that Apple believes the best user experience, and therefore the best chance of repeat customers is with the factory configuration. Maybe they don't want to sacrifice all the potential profit that such customer satisfaction brings to them for a brief profit surge for someone else.

5. Photofast is presumably free to sell their upgrade, but if Apple feels this will damage customer satisfaction, they should be free to withhold their rubber stamp in the form of MFI membership. It is almost certainly legal, and in my opinion, perfectly ethical to do so.

Another Apple apologist. Wrong flash chips? MBA would not even know which chips those are for it would not work with them directly. It would only see SSD controller. Bogus excuses.

 

[moderately]

Another Apple apologist. Wrong flash chips? MBA would not even know which chips those are for it would not work with them directly. It would only see SSD controller. Bogus excuses.

Sorry, missed the part where you addressed "That reason may have to do with battery life or heat dissipation or reliability or something else." I don't even know if heat is an issue with flash chips but the controller certainly wouldn't hide heat from the rest of the machine.

Those that think that are * think this is an extention of their *ery. Those that think the opposite, an extension of that.

 

[yamabushi]

I hope they decide to release the SSD as an OEM product instead with no mention of an Apple product or tools or instructions for use as an upgrade. That should be sufficient to address the main concerns of Apple.

 

[lilo777]

Sorry, missed the part where you addressed "That reason may have to do with battery life or heat dissipation or reliability or something else." I don't even know if heat is an issue with flash chips but the controller certainly wouldn't hide heat from the rest of the machine.

Those that think that are * think this is an extention of their *ery. Those that think the opposite, an extension of that.

The heat issue is resolved very easy - product warranty is automatically cancelled when MBA owner opens up the laptop. So, what's there for Apple to worry? And this is a futile attempt on Apple part anyways because in a week someone else will start selling the same SSD. After all it only contains standard parts.

 

[moderately]

The heat issue is resolved very easy - product warranty is automatically cancelled when MBA owner opens up the laptop. So, what's there for Apple to worry? And this is a futile attempt on Apple part anyways because in a week someone else will start selling the same SSD. After all it only contains standard parts.

"Not my problem" is not really resolving the problem.

 

[samwight]

The heat issue is resolved very easy - product warranty is automatically cancelled when MBA owner opens up the laptop. So, what's there for Apple to worry?

Unhappy customers are less valuable to Apple. This is true even if it is obvious that Apple is not to blame for their unhappiness, and certainly if the customer is not sure who is to blame.

And this is a futile attempt on Apple part anyways because in a week someone else will start selling the same SSD. After all it only contains standard parts.

If the someone else is not Apple-legitimized with MFI membership, then it will not have been entirely futile.

 

[lilo777]

And the end result as always is...

that PC users will enjoy better performance than Apple customers. They can use the fastest SSDs, Apple customers can not.

 

[KPOM]

That's insane. What if someone has an Android phone, but uses an iPad? That would be perfect for those people.

Obviously Apple would rather people use the iPad or iPhone than an Android device. I don't blame Apple or any other company for this. Would we expect Dell to put an ad for the Mac on their computers?

I don't think you understand Occam's Razor. You would have to find the simplest explanation that is logically consistent and explains everything.

I think Occam's Razor would lead one to conclude that this is a contractual issue of some sort. That's the simplest explanation.

Going beyond Occam's Razor, perhaps it's a non-compete agreement that's part of the MFi program, or perhaps it's part of some other agreement.

If we look more closely, we'll see that Apple did not object to Toshiba announcing that it was making the blade SSD available to other OEMs. If they don't have an issue with Toshiba making the very drive available to others, we need to consider why would they have an issue with PhotoFast making a similar drive available. If they were concerned simply about the attempted tie to the MacBook Air, the cease and desist letter likely would just be to stop them from marketing it as a "replacement drive for the MacBook Air." But it seems here they are asking PhotoFast to stop making the drive altogether.

The simplest logical explanation is that Apple has concluded that PhotoFast has violated some sort of contractual agreement that Apple is a party to.

 

[Zc456]

Obviously Apple would rather people use the iPad or iPhone than an Android device. I don't blame Apple or any other company for this. Would we expect Dell to put an ad for the Mac on their computers?

And yet iTunes has more then a dozen Android podcasts.

 

[barmann]

I'm all for 3rd party upgrades for the MBA, but I have to admit you are making a lot of sense .

In a perfect world, Apple would embrace the efforts of this company and offer the upgrade through their repair centers; however, there'd be a lot of work involved and possible issues, just to make a small minority of MBA users a little happier.

And once the pricing is announced, there might be noone left to actually want those harddrives.

With luck, Apple includes these better SSDs in the next MBA revision, though I'm not holding my breath.

It seems that on the MacBook Air, RAM and SSD are not user upgradable. That means if the user does upgrade them, their warranty will be void. Now it is very logical that Apple wants people to know this before they upgrade an SSD (so Apple doesn't have to deal with angry customers who lost their warranty), but PhotoFast wouldn't really want people to know (because many would not upgrade the SSD if they know it voids the warranty). With this conflict in mind, Apple could have said "Please don't advertise these drives without stating very clearly that installing them voids the warranty". Photofast says "no". Apple says "in that case, we don't want you as a partner selling products for iPad, iPod and iPhone with an Apple logo on your products". Photofast says to Engadget "we had to stop selling these drives, because Apple threatened us".

 

[exigentsky]

I have a feeling that the same people who voted positive would also prefer Hitler was still in power.

 

[newuser2310]

Hi, my name is Oveeno C. Welcome to Apple!
Hi! How may I help you today?

Me: I'm looking to buy a macbook air
i want to know if i can replace the ssd hard drive myself?

Apple: Unfortunately not, it is not user upgradeable.

Me: will it void the warranty?

Apple: Yes it would.

 

[charlituna]

Interesting, I can't see why Apple would want to stop this.

Probably just Apple not wanting PhotoFast advertising them as upgrades for the Macbook Air specifically as they were doing, especially as PhotoFasts could be seen as "official" and "apple supported" due to PF being in the MFi program

hey Saint. there is your reason.

 

[tigress666]

My .02 cents?

I honestly don't see why Apple would allow one manufacturer to sell aftermarket parts and ask another to stop if they were trying to eliminate competition (wouldn't they be trying to stifle both manufacturers?).

So, I don't understand the people who think this is Apple just trying to make it so you can only buy their part. I think there has to be something else to it. Unless those people can make a better arguement than, "Apple is just trying to only let people buy their stuff." Because if they were, they would also be asking the other company to stop too. So, for all you who think Apple is just being monopolistic, do you have anything more to your arguement (and I'm honestly curious cause I honestly will say I have no clue why the asked the people to stop and if there is a good arguement for the Apple = monopolistic I'm open. It's just so far the logic of the arguements I've seen doesn't really add up).

 

[KnightWRX]

My .02 cents?

I honestly don't see why Apple would allow one manufacturer to sell aftermarket parts and ask another to stop if they were trying to eliminate competition (wouldn't they be trying to stifle both manufacturers?).

Because they have leverage with one (through the MFi program) and they don't with the other (who could just cut off their entire supply of RAM chips and leave them stranded with no Macs to ship). That is why Apple "allows" one manufacturer and asks another to stop. Note that Toshiba is not wanting to sell their blade type SSDs to the general public either, they've opened up the product to other OEMs for now, another glaring difference.

 

[Dbrown]

It seems that on the MacBook Air, RAM and SSD are not user upgradable. That means if the user does upgrade them, their warranty will be void. Now it is very logical that Apple wants people to know this before they upgrade an SSD (so Apple doesn't have to deal with angry customers who lost their warranty), but PhotoFast wouldn't really want people to know (because many would not upgrade the SSD if they know it voids the warranty). With this conflict in mind, Apple could have said "Please don't advertise these drives without stating very clearly that installing them voids the warranty". Photofast says "no". Apple says "in that case, we don't want you as a partner selling products for iPad, iPod and iPhone with an Apple logo on your products". Photofast says to Engadget "we had to stop selling these drives, because Apple threatened us".

Why should photofast agree to label its product as voiding the warranty when in fact its the act of removing the OEM SSD that voids the warranty?

Bottom line is Apple wants the products you paid for to be used in the way it approves of, and thats why Photofast is being bullied into not selling this SSD.

 

[TinHead88]

Why should photofast agree to label its product as voiding the warranty when in fact its the act of removing the OEM SSD that voids the warranty?

Bottom line is Apple wants the products you paid for to be used in the way it approves of, and thats why Photofast is being bullied into not selling this SSD.

Bottom line is there are lots of people on this thread willing to berate Apple based on guessing what the reason of this recent action is.

No one knows the real reason because Apple have not given it.

But many are only too happy to judge despite having no facts.

Get your pitchforks...

 

[Dbrown]

Who cares what the reason is? If I want to void my warranty by installing a 3rd party upgrade into a device I paid for, thats my choice to make, not apples. The only difference between what's going on with photofast and all those 3rd parties selling replacement batteries and parts for iphones is that apple has leverage on PF and can harm them financially.