“Yes, the throttling occurs only at peak cpu power calls because we and, more importantly, you don’t want your phone to shutdown.”
2018 when people don’t know how to read articles and skip details to make sensational claims and believe lies.
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Apple Sued Over Meltdown and Spectre in U.S. as iPhone Slowdown Lawsuits Now Total 45
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2018 when people don’t know how to read articles and skip details to make sensational claims and believe lies.
OMG really, I understand people suing them over the slowing down because of the battery thing, but really this is in no way apples fault Lol.
Never one to coddle the must-billion dollar company, in this case I think the issue is vastly overstated and ultimately the plaintiffs will prevail, but with minimal damage to Apple. The settlement will be minimal and similar to ones by other companies when they realize they are partially to blame, but so minimal that they get by with offering a $25 discount on future iPhone products. Difference is, you'll have to "trade in" your old iPhone to prove you're a party to the suit. The trade in value will be negated to offset the "discount." It's very common these days (think Equifax).
Apple is guilty of only one thing, throttling the phone speed BUT they can show they did it to keep your 2 year old phone from crashing and that will negate the "malice" claim. Even if someone tries to offer up the "planned obsolescence" claim, it would be negated by the "good will" claim of Apple showing that they have - A) done this to prevent you from having to buy a new battery, B) Done this so your phone still works and contrary to most other manufacturers that don't even upgrade older phones, and C) it was done with YOUR usage of the phone in mind.
When people are angry about throttling, you only have to look at almost EVERY laptop in existence over the past 5 years that uses throttling to save battery life. While they can ramp up to higher speeds, they are throttled to ensure you are able to get the best battery life out of the machine. In Apple's case, your phone was being throttled to avoid having to replace the battery. That will be their only liability in this case as they should have given the consumer a choice to upgrade the battery (and prevent the nasty crashes) rather than buy a new phone. I'm thinking this settlement will cost them no more than $300M which in their economy of sales is a variance on their P&L statement.
Meltdown and Spectre affect nearly every modern processor, including PowerPC, SPARC, ARM, and Apple. AMD is hit by both variants of Spectre. It's difficult to have predicted this given the designs were based in the 1990s and the associated security requirements of that time.
No chip maker can claim their processors are free of errata. But given Apple's secrecy, I don't think they ever disclose errata publicly the way Intel and AMD do. Consumers are basically buying a black box.
No chip maker can claim their processors are free of errata. But given Apple's secrecy, I don't think they ever disclose errata publicly the way Intel and AMD do. Consumers are basically buying a black box.
In all those cases with known consumables like a phone battery, everything still works correctly. Cars have a maintenance schedule saying when to replace things that wear down. Your car doesn't refuse to accelerate because its oil is dirty or the tires worn.
It's simply a reality of capitalism that hungry lawyers will sue the living c**p out of a large and successful company like Apple at every opportunity.
But this battery-gate business and the hype surrounding it is stupid, and I've seen a lot of MacRumors members jump on the bandwagon, which is disappointing.
Apple throttled CPUs when not doing so would result in an immediate shutdown of the phone. A SHUTDOWN. How do people react? By claiming "See, this is proof they throttle your phone's performance to force you to buy a new phone!!!!!"
But this battery-gate business and the hype surrounding it is stupid, and I've seen a lot of MacRumors members jump on the bandwagon, which is disappointing.
Apple throttled CPUs when not doing so would result in an immediate shutdown of the phone. A SHUTDOWN. How do people react? By claiming "See, this is proof they throttle your phone's performance to force you to buy a new phone!!!!!"
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Try 100% acceleration on worn out tires vs new tires.
How about if my tires are worn out and I accelerate quickly and then tire spins and then traction control kicks in to reduce power to the vehicle because of the tire slip, because of the tires having reduced traction.
It would be like saying my vehicle operates at the exact same condition as it did when brand new even though these multiple things have been worn down over time.
Same with anything that deteriorates over time. Or why even change it to new then.
Because performance in some way is being effected by this thing (whatever it is) deteriorating.
Yes it does. Haven't you ever heard the term 'limp mode' in the context of cars? Most turbo charged cars will modify ECU profiles and reduce boost under those conditions. My old RSX would impose s 3k rev limiter if it detected low oil. Also VTEC would be disabled under similar conditions. VTEC was also disabled under certain temperatures. Actually, most cars these days offer a lower performance map prior to the coolant temps reaching a certain level.
Honestly, I'd rather my phone still operate as a phone longer into the day, then die at full speed in an hour. The only problem I have is that they should have been transparent about the battery slowdown. "Hey, your battery is past its prime. Toggle this switch if you want it to conserve battery life over speed." End of issue.
Meltdown is a decades old design decision that turned out to have a security consequence. Not lawsuit worthy regardless of company.
None of these will go anywhere.
Apple and every other manufacturer make no guarantees about security issues and protect themselves from these lawsuits with their EULA.
Additionally, Apple is in no way forcing people to install updates which slow their machines. That's the choice of the user.
Apple and every other manufacturer make no guarantees about security issues and protect themselves from these lawsuits with their EULA.
Additionally, Apple is in no way forcing people to install updates which slow their machines. That's the choice of the user.
They would have had the opportunity to feel really scared, had they known before the patch was released. It's impossible to put a price on the value of fear. Consider the aerobic benefits, for one.
I mean there basically aren't any processors that don't suffer from the flaw, and you can go back many years. What were they supposed to sell?
So in your opinion Apple and everyone else should have disclosed the flaw publicly way ahead of any fixes? How is that responsible?
Geekbench developer has responded saying that dude was in low power mode when doing the 11.2.2 test. In other words, a case of user error. (Credit to Rene Ritchie for story.)
For designing the A series SoCs with performance hacks that compromise security and the performance penalty when patched. These lawsuits are fair to get companies to balance security with performance and not outright performance while compromising security.
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The issue is that the purchaser didn't know about the defect and the supplier (Apple) did. The work around fixes reduce the performance significantly for some uses of the product from what the purchaser thought they were getting. They want to be compensated for the loss of value. It is not the purchasers fault this happened. The pragmatics of how to handle security flaws is outside the issue of the purchaser suffering a loss.
For you maybe, but I would rather have a phone that is slow and works than crashes.
I have supported Apple for a long time, by buying its products and recommending those products to others. I also vehemently defend Apple versus Google and Amazon as Apple is comprised of good people who provide products while the others - Google especially - simply make the consumer the service and sell to advertisers. I would commonly say Apple protects!
This battery slowdown was so noticeable on my iPhone 6s. I had purchased the iPhone 7 on launch date but returned it as it was no different than the 6s. When the iPhone X came out I wanted to justify buying a new one and the simplest way to do so was my iPhone 6s with 128GB and camera setup I use all the time had simply slowed down too much. I thought I just will not update beyond one or two updates from now on as even simple typing lags sometimes as much as a full second.
Then, it’s released that Apple intentionally did this and concealed it from consumers. This isn’t the Apple I know, defend and buy its products. I wholeheartedly agree with any and all lawsuits against Apple and I hope consumers win big. Not for me necessarily, but to show Apple it cannot screw over its customers.
At the very least, Apple should have informed users before they upgrade what the consequences of every upgrade are to their device and how those consequences will affect their useage.
Now, I want Apple to give EVERYONE the right to go back to ANY version of iOS they want. And, I want a few switches in the settings to determine what happens when given options concerning battery vs performance just like computers have in energy settings.
That still wouldn’t solve the BAD FAITH Apple has created.
As an AAPL shareholder, I am frustrated with Tim Cook, Eddy Cue, and the company’s handling of customers. As a company, Apple can look out for equality, DACA, and environmental concerns. However, I feel like Tim Cook’s Apple is more focused on those “right things” than doing right by customers.
Frustrated with my keyboard issues on two TB MBPs. Frustrated that Apple cannot get its products out on time. Frustrated that it has supply chain issues. Frustrated by how much energy is spent on things that don’t add to shareholder value. For example, the money spent on stock buybacks could be creating innovation. Maybe even allow for one ethical expert who tells the story about how Apple slows down devices without transparency. Perhaps explaining the software flaws that allow user login without a password.
In general, I am frustrated about the direction Apple has taken. The transformation hasn’t been in the best interests of the customers or shareholders. I believe that Tim Cook does what’s best to get his stock options vested and what he personally believes in in social issues rather than what would help his company thrive and take leaps forward into the future instead of lagging behind.
TouchID is missed by me and everyone I speak with who owns an iPhone X. Nearly everyone agrees that FaceID is nic but given the choice they would prefer TouchID.
Battery life is missed by those who have 2016 and 2017 MacBook Pros. The concept to go so slim without thoughts of battery performance is concerning.
The failure of the TouchBar seemed obvious within months, and the keyboard issues are even worse. It’s time to fix the keyboard and own up to mistakes. To ensure the keys don’t hit the screen when it’s closed, the keys should auto depress when the screen is closing and pop up when opens to give key travel.
We love the Bionic chip, and I disagree with suing over flaws that impact all current chips. Apple has that and the screen technology down. Everywhere else, it’s behind.
MacOS is a disaster. I actually believe Windows 10 currently is less problematic and crashes at a far lower rate than High Sierra but I have no proof just my own observations. Maybe focus on stability rather than endless features which most people don’t even know about.
I like green energy and doing good by the environment, but as a public corporation, Apple is required to do right by its shareholders and doing right by its customers will further improve the stock prices.
Apple has one product that is producing a large part of its revenue and even greater portion of its net income. iPhone. It has to fix the mess - now. Pay the customers and give them options to go back to software that doesn’t degrade phones. Give tools that show when battery health affects performance.
I think the Apple has had duds for awhile now with its Mac updates. iPhone stayed the same since version 6. The ecosystem is losing out by not incorporating new WiFi and screen technologies. If DropBox was a service not a product like SJ said, Apple should have bought it and fixed the iCloud problems with it.
Time for research and development. Hire new designers. Look for improvement and hire younger executives who understand Millennials. Build a company that isn’t so dependent on one product. For now, improve the iPhone so as to create stability with its one product that foretells the stock pricing.
End of RANT. Wanting a new CEO. Wanting a new designer who understands user interface. Wanting programmers who focus on quality. I want back the old Apple!!!
This battery slowdown was so noticeable on my iPhone 6s. I had purchased the iPhone 7 on launch date but returned it as it was no different than the 6s. When the iPhone X came out I wanted to justify buying a new one and the simplest way to do so was my iPhone 6s with 128GB and camera setup I use all the time had simply slowed down too much. I thought I just will not update beyond one or two updates from now on as even simple typing lags sometimes as much as a full second.
Then, it’s released that Apple intentionally did this and concealed it from consumers. This isn’t the Apple I know, defend and buy its products. I wholeheartedly agree with any and all lawsuits against Apple and I hope consumers win big. Not for me necessarily, but to show Apple it cannot screw over its customers.
At the very least, Apple should have informed users before they upgrade what the consequences of every upgrade are to their device and how those consequences will affect their useage.
Now, I want Apple to give EVERYONE the right to go back to ANY version of iOS they want. And, I want a few switches in the settings to determine what happens when given options concerning battery vs performance just like computers have in energy settings.
That still wouldn’t solve the BAD FAITH Apple has created.
As an AAPL shareholder, I am frustrated with Tim Cook, Eddy Cue, and the company’s handling of customers. As a company, Apple can look out for equality, DACA, and environmental concerns. However, I feel like Tim Cook’s Apple is more focused on those “right things” than doing right by customers.
Frustrated with my keyboard issues on two TB MBPs. Frustrated that Apple cannot get its products out on time. Frustrated that it has supply chain issues. Frustrated by how much energy is spent on things that don’t add to shareholder value. For example, the money spent on stock buybacks could be creating innovation. Maybe even allow for one ethical expert who tells the story about how Apple slows down devices without transparency. Perhaps explaining the software flaws that allow user login without a password.
In general, I am frustrated about the direction Apple has taken. The transformation hasn’t been in the best interests of the customers or shareholders. I believe that Tim Cook does what’s best to get his stock options vested and what he personally believes in in social issues rather than what would help his company thrive and take leaps forward into the future instead of lagging behind.
TouchID is missed by me and everyone I speak with who owns an iPhone X. Nearly everyone agrees that FaceID is nic but given the choice they would prefer TouchID.
Battery life is missed by those who have 2016 and 2017 MacBook Pros. The concept to go so slim without thoughts of battery performance is concerning.
The failure of the TouchBar seemed obvious within months, and the keyboard issues are even worse. It’s time to fix the keyboard and own up to mistakes. To ensure the keys don’t hit the screen when it’s closed, the keys should auto depress when the screen is closing and pop up when opens to give key travel.
We love the Bionic chip, and I disagree with suing over flaws that impact all current chips. Apple has that and the screen technology down. Everywhere else, it’s behind.
MacOS is a disaster. I actually believe Windows 10 currently is less problematic and crashes at a far lower rate than High Sierra but I have no proof just my own observations. Maybe focus on stability rather than endless features which most people don’t even know about.
I like green energy and doing good by the environment, but as a public corporation, Apple is required to do right by its shareholders and doing right by its customers will further improve the stock prices.
Apple has one product that is producing a large part of its revenue and even greater portion of its net income. iPhone. It has to fix the mess - now. Pay the customers and give them options to go back to software that doesn’t degrade phones. Give tools that show when battery health affects performance.
I think the Apple has had duds for awhile now with its Mac updates. iPhone stayed the same since version 6. The ecosystem is losing out by not incorporating new WiFi and screen technologies. If DropBox was a service not a product like SJ said, Apple should have bought it and fixed the iCloud problems with it.
Time for research and development. Hire new designers. Look for improvement and hire younger executives who understand Millennials. Build a company that isn’t so dependent on one product. For now, improve the iPhone so as to create stability with its one product that foretells the stock pricing.
End of RANT. Wanting a new CEO. Wanting a new designer who understands user interface. Wanting programmers who focus on quality. I want back the old Apple!!!
Well if they knew about the problem in June and then released the iPhone X and the 8/8+ anyway, that is a problem. Not just for Apple but any other company that did same thing.
Raspberry Pi isn't vulnerable but it uses ARM.
They cared more about minimizing power consumption than raw speed, so decided to go with a processor that didn't offer speculative branching (because that means the processor spends energy computing values that it may or may not end up needing, before it knows whether it needs them.)
I understand caring more about the raw performance in something like the iMac Pro, but it seems weird that Apple didn't make a similar choice for their battery powered devices, and their iOS devices in particular.
What bugs me the most about all of this is that Google’s Project Zero notified affected parties about these vulnerabilities during Summer 2017, but this was all kept hush-hush from the public until after the Holiday shopping season.
That’s a new low as far as I’m concerned, as it suggests possibility of more than 1 of those licensees talking to each other to agree on a strategy. In my best 1930’s Chicago gangster voice: “Ok, nobody says anything until after New Years, see!? Or you’ll be getting a pair of concrete galoshes for Christmas!”
I expect it from individual companies, to have every single one of them all keep their mouths shut until after shopping season? Stinks pretty bad, IMO.
Then, suddenly, it’s public news week after New Years, but: “don’t worry! We have patches, see?! We’re awesome! Look at the pretty patches over here! Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain! Patches!”
That’s a new low as far as I’m concerned, as it suggests possibility of more than 1 of those licensees talking to each other to agree on a strategy. In my best 1930’s Chicago gangster voice: “Ok, nobody says anything until after New Years, see!? Or you’ll be getting a pair of concrete galoshes for Christmas!”
I expect it from individual companies, to have every single one of them all keep their mouths shut until after shopping season? Stinks pretty bad, IMO.
Then, suddenly, it’s public news week after New Years, but: “don’t worry! We have patches, see?! We’re awesome! Look at the pretty patches over here! Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain! Patches!”