Apple Threatens to Terminate Epic Games' Developer Accounts on August 28

[4nNtt]

No real news here. I'm sure this was expected. They are still in the opening moves of the game.

 

[cflem]

Like it or not, Apple isn’t wrong in this case. Epic signed the agreement knowing what the criteria was... they signed the contract to be offered and sold on Apples platform. That was their choice.

this is a bs case that is about to cause Epic to lose - a lot...

 

[cflem]

Apple is as bad as MS of their era.

The amount of pro-Apple bias, even on a fan site like MR is unbelievable.

The same people would have rooted against the MS monopoly of past, now rooting for the Apple monopoly (cause Apple is somehow their friend).

That Apple can even cut out a company that displeases them shows how artificially locked-down their devices are. No consumer wins from that.

There’s no monopoly here.... this is just like Xbox... PS4... android... etc... just another closed platform... they agreed to be on.

 

[AZREOSpecialist]

This is a classic setup by Epic. They knew very well Apple would take these steps and have had a response and/or lawsuit already prepared, just waiting. To a jury, all of these actions by Apple casts Epic as the victim and they don't even have to do anything. Epic's crime that caused all of this? Wanting to bring lower, more competitive prices to its customers.

If this gets to a jury Apple will lose. Bigly.

 

[Arbuthnott]

Epic are sitting on so much money its unbelievable!

If this is the way that ByteDance and EPIC choose to spend their money, so be it.

 

[TheAustrianGuy]

I‘m afraid the world will run out of popcorn because of this...

 

[0128672]

Interesting legal chess match to watch ...

 

[Rogifan]

When you're already being hauled in front of congress and charged with being monopolistic, engaging in blatantly anti-competitive actions tends to not be a good look. So the "unless they are forced" to part of your statement is getting ever more likely.

I am not siding with Apple. Apple could allow all apps to be “reader” apps or allow developers to use their own IAP if they so choose. But by taking a hard line they make it more likely something more than that will be forced on them like allowing alternate app stores or being able to download apps from the web on iOS devices.

 

[easy4lif]

Wow, Apple went the nuclear route! They actually pushed the button.

if epic, changes course and submits to apples demands, their case in court diminishes, if epic decides to stay the course, they lose out on millions, if not at least 1 billion in future earning.

 

[borgein]

I'm not making a judgment call here about whether Apple is right or wrong, but this is the sort of thing that can easily blow up in Apple's face. Epic likely doesn't need the money for licensing those games on Apple platforms, but Apple needs headline-grabbing games to make the case that they care about gaming. Cutting off one of the key players in that toolchain is not the way to keep those sorts of games coming to your platform.

So losing a few lower-end games on a platform that has always been unfriendly for games will blow up in Apple's face?
Most iOS and Mac developers that develop games prefer to use Unity instead of Unreal for the Apple ecosystem anyway.
Unity is far better on mobile platforms, and works far better for developing games on Mac's and iOS devices.
Unreal is mostly used for big AAA PC and console games, not mobile or tablet games.

If anything Unity might be the winner here.

 

[Scipster]

It’s not even a response to a strike, it’s just the rules that all developers adhere to. This would be happening even without the lawsuit.

Honestly, good for Apple for applying their rules uniformly to all developers. This will provide good PR for Apple, even if it is a red herring. The Courts will probably grant the injunction until they have time to review the full lawsuit.

 

[0128672]

This is a classic setup by Epic. They knew very well Apple would take these steps and have had a response and/or lawsuit already prepared, just waiting. To a jury, all of these actions by Apple casts Epic as the victim and they don't even have to do anything. Epic's crime that caused all of this? Wanting to bring lower, more competitive prices to its customers.

If this gets to a jury Apple will lose. Bigly.

You believe it will get to a jury trial?

 

[Naaaaak]

Apple can do whatever the frick they want. It’s their company

Just make your own mobile and desktop OS!

 

[atomic.flip]

Right, and Epic’s argument is that the contract is illegal or not enforceable. We will have to wait and see what happens, but if

I’m not mistaken, if a contract is found to be illegal in the eyes of the law, it is not enforceable. (Not specific to this situation, just contracts in general)

Actually a contract does not require compliance with the law to be valid. And enforcement is subjective to circumstance so a judge is always the one to rule on that.

For example i could write a contract that says you agree to be my slave and work without pay perpetually.

If you signed and agreed to that contract then I could demand you fulfill services or threaten legal action (civil legal action) to obtain remedy. A court order could also be issued requiring compliance with the terms.

When it’s a matter of illegality (as in a prosecutable activity) then an entirely separate branch of government gets involved and also a different court system.

It would only require reporting that the individual who asked you to sign said contract is engaging in slavery (which is illegal). And then they would be indicted, tried and likely convicted.

Once the conviction occurs then you can go to court and sue to have the contract invalidated. LOL

Or if there is any precedent (established case law from prior actions /rulings in the civil system) then the judge could throw the matter out entirely. Deeming the contract null and void.

—-

FYI: the most annoying thing about the civil system is that while the person is being indicted or even after, if there were any confidentially clauses that were violated then they could sue for remedy lol

But only once the contract is determined invalid can you avoid such a matter.

A similar matter of complication has come up time and again with the US President’s liberal use of NDAs for all employees.

 

[kuwxman]

Yeah, having the help of the Chinese (Tencent) filling your bank accounts is an advantage.
But it's still a drop in the ocean compared to Apple's cash reserves.

I hope you take a step back and realize how silly that comment is. China has helped Apple become who they are as well with the low labor costs building their products. Apple can put all the cute 'Designed by Apple in California' tags on their products they want, but most are still made in China. Apple is not some innocent victim here. This battle between Epic and Apple is literally a Goliath vs Goliath and WILL likely cause shockwaves across the industry when it is all said and done. This isn't anywhere near being done.

 

[Realityck]

Apple is planning to terminate Epic Games' entire access to its App Store and app development tools, Epic Games said today. Apple told Epic that by August 28, all access will be ended.

On Twitter they had this

Dylan Byers
New from Epic Games: "Apple has removed Fortnite from the App Store and informed Epic that on Friday, August 28 Apple will terminate all our developer accounts and cut Epic off from iOS and Mac development tools."

 

[Naaaaak]

You believe it will get to a jury trial?

Did you believe the Samsung copying case would?

 

[ArPe]

Apple Silicon MacBooks are going to absolutely revolutionise mobile laptop gaming, especially for students. Discreet GPU performance levels with little heat and long battery life. Sales are going to be wild when reviewers and students rave about it.

Epic and their master Tencent need to stop this game and appreciate the revolution that is coming. They will make a lot of money by being a respectful developer.

 

[mariusignorello]

Epic is not quite the saint you think they are. This is about money, case closed. (Same can be said for Apple — but I’ve never pretended Apple isn’t a for-profit company)

Epic’s battle for “open platforms” ignores consoles’ massive closed market

Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo demand the same platform control—and the same 30% fee.

arstechnica.com

 

[Rogifan]

Nope. Apple charges the same 30% everyone else does. I don't see PS or Xbox letting people sell products without taking 30%.

I don’t consider an iOS device to be the same thing as a console. I consider an iOS device to be a general purpose computing device just like the Mac. Also if Apple deserves the 30% why do most apps not have to pay it?

 

[Appleman3546]

Apple is required to preserve the evidence when there is an on-going lawsuit, so this is factually different than simply terminating a developer account that violated the terms and conditions. Regardless, emergency injunctive relief until trial is a motion that is routinely granted, so Epic will likely win this motion.

 

[phobos512]

This won’t hold any water. They clearly violated the guidelines they previously agreed to. Maybe this would swing if they tried this lawsuit before signing, but as of now they’re breaching their own contract. These were the consequences they agreed to.

They would've been laughed out of court if they'd filed a suit ahead of signing the agreement as you suggest as they'd have had no standing.

 

[Arbuthnott]

Apple is as bad as MS of their era.

The amount of pro-Apple bias, even on a fan site like MR is unbelievable.

The same people would have rooted against the MS monopoly of past, now rooting for the Apple monopoly (cause Apple is somehow their friend).

That Apple can even cut out a company that displeases them shows how artificially locked-down their devices are. No consumer wins from that.

What monopoly? Go sell stuff on Android - there are more of them in any case. And the rules Apple imposes are there to protect us the users. Why should companies with significant Chinese ownership in particular (TenCent in the case of EPIC) be allowed to dilute the safeguards that protect us?

 

[jvlfilms]

If you're putting it into blatantly simple terms, yes, Epic violated Apple's App Store TOS. However, it's still not a good look for Apple amidst a time where they're under scrutiny for being monopolistic.

That being said, I believe Fortnite will be back in the store soon enough with IAP removed completely and the only way to purchase would be through a website.

 

[Altivec88]

Apple is as bad as MS of their era.

The amount of pro-Apple bias, even on a fan site like MR is unbelievable.

The same people would have rooted against the MS monopoly of past, now rooting for the Apple monopoly (cause Apple is somehow their friend).

That Apple can even cut out a company that displeases them shows how artificially locked-down their devices are. No consumer wins from that.

Apple is not a monopoly and has nothing to do with Apple bias. They hold 14% share of the smart phone market. I chose iOS because it is a safe controlled platform. Apple is my only option for that. You want to side load apps and have multiple stores, you can do what the other 86% of the market has done.

Epic knew the rules, signed an agreement and even uses some of Apple's code for their unreal engine. Apple is not kicking them out. Even now. They are saying abide by the rules you agreed to. If Epic wanted to protest, there were other ways of doing so. Epic chose to disregard the consequences that their own company would face. Even if they are successful in the end, this will take years to resolve and cost them dearly. Its their dumb fault for doing it this way.