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[doublepost=1535059774][/doublepost]Jobs would not have allowed this to happen. Mini last update 2016. MacAir 2015. The prices are high. The chips are slow. Apple under Cook is not concerned about its beginnings or the customers who bought Macs yrs ago. If Jobs could return for 1 day he would fire Tim Cook. Cook is interested in money, not in excellent products. We loyal Mac fans can no longer be proud. Our machines are slow, costly and we are ignored by establishment Cook & coterie.

Tim Cook hit his shareholder return goals that were set for him and is now worth $700 Million. There's a very good chance that he lives in an elite bubble and doesn't actually get down in the trenches to get a reality check. From his perspective things are moving in the right direction ($1T baby!)

That being said don't expect things to change. Our only voice to someone like that is our wallet and by the looks of Apple's valuation we're not sending the right message.
 
I am hoping that they aren't holding out for the 9th generation for the iMac although it does make sense. Losing hyperthreading in the i7 seems like a bad move by Intel. Unfortunately that ripples through to Apple. I wonder how a 6 core i7 9700K will compare against the i7 7700K currently in the iMac. Maybe Apple will use the i7 8700K. They may be able to order enough volume to make it worthwhile.

If they offered the iMac with the 8700K, I wouldn't be waiting for the Mac Mini.
More cores will always trumps hyperthreading...each core in the Core i7-9700K (8 cores BTW) will have 1.5MB of L3 Cache all to itself, no sharing. We have been conditioned over the years to accept that hyper-threading was almost as good when it fact, it really is not that good at all. The higher clock speeds mitigated some of that over the years, but clock speeds are still stuck essentially at levels reached in 2005, which is to say, we haven't really broke 5.0GHz on any Intel CPU for day in/day out single-core clock speed yet. But, hey, the laws of physics, so natch.

The 6700K runs at 4.0GHz, 7700K runs at 4.2Ghz, the 8086K, runs at 4.0GHz and can hit 5.0GHz Single Core Turbo, but it is a limited edition CPU, so it counts, but it doesn't. Overclockers are hitting 6.0 GHz on all 32 cores with AMD's Threadripper, but that's with LN2 and no one is running that setup on their desk at the office or at home, so we're in a bit of a pickle. We have more (consistently higher sustained) clock, more cores, more cache, smaller transistors...yet, we really haven't made any gains that make us go WOW! I need that! GPUs are still doing that but, eventually, the uncanny valley is crossed at 240fps and then where do they go? 8K? 16K?

With all that being said, 8 cores is really the limit of usefulness to the consumer 27" iMac buyer, because unless they are transcoding, encoding, decoding, or have 4 arms and two brains et al. more cores and more thread have diminishing returns versus the clock speed penalties they can inflict to stay within a relatively energy efficient TDP. The Core X-Series runs the gamut from 4c/4t to 18c/36t and some very nice clock speeds, but with a 140wTDP.

The one CAVEAT here would be if you are a heavy VM user, Docker, et al. as being able to have 8 cores and parsing 2 or more to the VM without seeing much of a performance penalty or resource juggling (w/enough RAM) may help out those using Windows VMs or who have lots of Docker instances they need to debug and develop for while still keeping a reasonable amount for Xcode, Visual Studio, Eclipse, et al. Having an 8c/16t iMac on their desk without having to shell out for an iMac Pro leaves money for more DRAM, more monitors and more Mountain Dew (one dev I worked with was never without a Dew in hand).

If I were in the market for a new iMac, I would almost certainly go for the 8c/16t Core i9-9900K CPU, but that is just me...almost every Mac I own or have owned has the highest spec CPU Apple offered. That being said, I still love my 2.2GHz Base Model 2015 15" MacBook Pro. It may only have an iGPU, but it's an Iris Pro 5200, I get hella battery life and it never seems to run as hot as my work issued 15" w/AMD M370X. It seemed like Intel would be stuck on 4 cores or 4c/8t forever, not just the past 8 years and all it took was a little RYZEN to inspire them to pry open their wallets and spend a bit of R&D to give us non-enthusiasts 6, and now 8 cores. Thanks AMD...now please get to work on getting Vega Instinct into our hands and into Apple's.
 
Regarding the Mac Mini update, these are the Intel Coffee Lake processors Apple can choose from:

(Coffee Lake-U 8th generation) w/ Intel Iris Plus Graphics 655 (28W TDP)
2.3 GHz Core i5 (I5-8259U) (Quad core) same as base 13ʺ MacBookPro w/ TouchBar
2.6 GHz Core i5 (I5-8269U) (Quad core)
2.7 GHz Core i7 (I7-8559U) (Quad core) 13ʺ MacBookPro w/ TouchBar option

(Coffee Lake 8th generation) w/ Intel UHD 630 (45W TDP)
2.3 GHz Core i5 (I5-8300H) (Quad core)
2.5 GHz Core i5 (I5-8400H) (Quad core)
2.2 GHz Core i7 (I7-8750H) (Hex core) same as the base 15ʺ MacBookPro w/ TouchBar
2.6 GHz Core i7 (I7-8850H) (Hex core) 15ʺ MacBookPro w/ TouchBar option
2.9 GHz Core i9 (I9-8950HK) (Hex core) 15ʺ MacBookPro w/ TouchBar option

The current case design can easily handle (45W TDP) (i.e Late 2012/Server – 2.6 GHz Core i7 or Mid-2011/Server – 2.0 GHz Core i7)

What I would like to see them (realistically) update to

Good 2.3 GHz Core i5 (I5-8259U) $499
Iris Plus Graphics 655
8GB (up from 4GB)
1TB HDD (up from 500GB)

Better 2.5 GHz Core i5 (I5-8400H) (Quad core) $699
w/ Intel UHD 630
8GB (same as before)
1TB Fusion Drive or 256 SSD (up from 1TB HDD)

Best 2.2 GHz Core i7 (I7-8750H) (Hex core) $999
w/ Intel UHD 630
16GB (up from 8BG)
512 SSD (up from 1TB Fusion)

what I think they are more likely to do:

Good Keep old $499 Late 2014 model as low cost intro model for people who only surf internet or check email

Better 2.3 GHz Core i5 (I5-8259U)(Quad core) $699
Iris Plus Graphics 655
8GB (same as 2014)
1TB HDD (same as 2014)

Best 2.5 GHz Core i5 (I5-8400H) (Quad core) $999
w/ Intel UHD 630
8GB (same as 2014)
1TB Fusion Drive (same as 2014)

16GB / 32GB RAM options for all new models (memory will be soldered like current generation Minis)

Storage options will be Fusion Drive or SSDs similar to what's available 13ʺ MacBook Pro.

No discrete video card like the Mac mini "Core i5" 2.5 (Mid-2011) model. Will need to buy an external box available for MacBookPros to get Nvidia or Radeon graphics card for AR/VR development or games.

Ports on back will be updated to four Thunderbolt 3, may keep two legacy USB 3 port for keyboard/mouse, Gigabit ethernet, HDMI

Comparison tp previous models:
current Model
Good Mac Mini ”Core i5" 1.4 (Late 2014)1.4 GHz Core i5 $499
Better Mac mini "Core i5" 2.6 (Late 2014)2.6 GHz Core i5 (I5-4278U) (28W TDP) $699
Best Mac mini "Core i5" 2.8 (Late 2014)2.8 GHz Core i5 (I5-4308U) (28W TDP) $999
Option Mac mini "Core i7" 3.0 (Late 2014)3.0 GHz Core i7 (I7-4578U) (28W TDP)


previous models
Mac mini "Core i5" 2.5 (Late 2012)2.5 GHz Core i5 (I5-3210M) (35W TDP)
Mac mini "Core i7" 2.3 (Late 2012/Server)2.3 GHz Core i7 (I7-3615QM) (45W TDP)
Mac mini "Core i7" 2.6 (Late 2012/Server)2.6 GHz Core i7 (I7-3720QM) (45W TDP)

Mac mini "Core i5" 2.3 (Mid-2011)2.3 GHz Core i5 (I5-2415M) (35W TDP)
Mac mini "Core i5" 2.5 (Mid-2011)2.5 GHz Core i5 (I5-2520M) (35W TDP)
Mac mini "Core i7" 2.7 (Mid-2011)2.7 GHz Core i7 (I7-2620M) (35W TDP)
Mac mini "Core i7" 2.0 (Mid-2011/Server)2.0 GHz Core i7 (I7-2635QM) (45W TDP)
 
And that is part of the problem. I wouldn't fire people over the port situation, but the keyboards? Yes. Everyone from the first engineer who thought of the new design to the highest level person who signed off on it. No matter who that includes.

Personally, I use a 2015 15" MacBook Pro day in and day out...we are up for a new lease, but that will not happen until there are new iMacs released. I also use a Magic Keyboard with Numeric Keypad that I purchased on launch day last year (WWDC 2017), which was the most exciting thing announced, for me at least. I bang away on it all day long when I am docked. I also own a 2016 MacBook Pro that I pound away on after hours and it is working just fine.

That being said, I have learned that a softer touch nets me better results on the 2016, that the 15" keyboard is simply too wobbly and mushy for my tastes anymore and that the Magic Keyboard feels just right. I also have one of Apple iPad Smart Keyboards on my 2015 12.9-inch iPad Pro and I love that thing. I have no idea why the hate. I mean, I understand the hate for the 2015 MacBook keyboard, it's a POS, but the iPad keyboard and the Magic Keyboard are awesome, at least for me. I had hoped, even though I knew it couldn't really happen due to thickness constraints, that Apple would get the Magic Keyboard mechanism into the 2018 MacBook Pro. I hope they use that mechanism for the rumored 13" MacBook as opposed to the butterfly mechanism used in the 2015-2018 MacBook and MacBook Pros.

Unemployment is probably not a realistic option, despite your fervor for payback.
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Thanks for breaking that down. I'm in the market for a new desktop. With no rumors of upgraded iMacs, I'm definitely considering this new Mini. One question, aren't those some majorly big jumps for the CPU? Especially that i5-59U to 59U. How are you getting a $300 jump there?

For me to do a Mini, I'd have to do 512GB SSD and 16GB RAM. Assuming the RAM is $200 upgrade and the SSD is $300 upgrade, I'd be looking at $1,499 for an upgrade i5. So a pretty big savings over a 27" iMac at $2,299. And the CPU would be current generation instead of the one year old iMacs.
Well, I used Apple's current pricing to arrive at these prices. I did make a mistake in that my $699 model should be a 1TB HDD, NOT a 1TB Fusion Drive, which Apple charges +$200 to upgrade from the 1TB HDD to the 1TB Fusion! Apple charges +$300 to move from the Core i5 2.6GHz ($699 model) to the Core i7 3.0GHz and +$200 to go from the Core i5 2.8GHz ($999 model) to the Core i7 3.0GHz. I had another poster take severe umbrage with my pricing - don't shoot the messenger. The top line 2014 Mac mini (Core i7 3.0GHz/16GB/1TB SSD) costs $1999!!! $2000 for a four year old dual core Core i7 laptop CPU. Ugh, even that is a bit much for me to take.

Glad it was helpful. I'm hoping that we get at least those 4-core 28w CPUs at the prices listed. There have been some unrealistic numbers bandied around and people are setting themselves up for heartbreak. Intel sells their Bean Canyon core i7-8559U NUC for $499 sans DRAM, SSD and OS, so $1299 for the same Mac mini is pretty pricey, but it is what I have come to expect from this iteration of Apple, Inc. They could indeed surprise us with more reasonable pricing or same pricing with better specs, but the 2016 MacBook Pro pricing sobered me up quickly.
 
Which of these processors have hyperthreading? I am currently still running a 2011 i7 quad with dual SSD, but it is certainly starting to get slow (since I upgraded to Sierra). Most of my work is single-threaded, but I do use R, and have scripts that make use of all 8 threads.

Regarding the Mac Mini update, these are the Intel Coffee Lake processors Apple can choose from:

(Coffee Lake-U 8th generation) w/ Intel Iris Plus Graphics 655 (28W TDP)
2.3 GHz Core i5 (I5-8259U) (Quad core) same as base 13ʺ MacBookPro w/ TouchBar
2.6 GHz Core i5 (I5-8269U) (Quad core)
2.7 GHz Core i7 (I7-8559U) (Quad core) 13ʺ MacBookPro w/ TouchBar option

(Coffee Lake 8th generation) w/ Intel UHD 630 (45W TDP)
2.3 GHz Core i5 (I5-8300H) (Quad core)
2.5 GHz Core i5 (I5-8400H) (Quad core)
2.2 GHz Core i7 (I7-8750H) (Hex core) same as the base 15ʺ MacBookPro w/ TouchBar
2.6 GHz Core i7 (I7-8850H) (Hex core) 15ʺ MacBookPro w/ TouchBar option
2.9 GHz Core i9 (I9-8950HK) (Hex core) 15ʺ MacBookPro w/ TouchBar option

The current case design can easily handle (45W TDP) (i.e Late 2012/Server – 2.6 GHz Core i7 or Mid-2011/Server – 2.0 GHz Core i7)

What I would like to see them (realistically) update to

Good 2.3 GHz Core i5 (I5-8259U) $499
Iris Plus Graphics 655
8GB (up from 4GB)
1TB HDD (up from 500GB)

Better 2.5 GHz Core i5 (I5-8400H) (Quad core) $699
w/ Intel UHD 630
8GB (same as before)
1TB Fusion Drive or 256 SSD (up from 1TB HDD)

Best 2.2 GHz Core i7 (I7-8750H) (Hex core) $999
w/ Intel UHD 630
16GB (up from 8BG)
512 SSD (up from 1TB Fusion)

what I think they are more likely to do:

Good Keep old $499 Late 2014 model as low cost intro model for people who only surf internet or check email

Better 2.3 GHz Core i5 (I5-8259U)(Quad core) $699
Iris Plus Graphics 655
8GB (same as 2014)
1TB HDD (same as 2014)

Best 2.5 GHz Core i5 (I5-8400H) (Quad core) $999
w/ Intel UHD 630
8GB (same as 2014)
1TB Fusion Drive (same as 2014)

16GB / 32GB RAM options for all new models (memory will be soldered like current generation Minis)

Storage options will be Fusion Drive or SSDs similar to what's available 13ʺ MacBook Pro.

No discrete video card like the Mac mini "Core i5" 2.5 (Mid-2011) model. Will need to buy an external box available for MacBookPros to get Nvidia or Radeon graphics card for AR/VR development or games.

Ports on back will be updated to four Thunderbolt 3, may keep two legacy USB 3 port for keyboard/mouse, Gigabit ethernet, HDMI

Comparison tp previous models:
current Model
Good Mac Mini ”Core i5" 1.4 (Late 2014)1.4 GHz Core i5 $499
Better Mac mini "Core i5" 2.6 (Late 2014)2.6 GHz Core i5 (I5-4278U) (28W TDP) $699
Best Mac mini "Core i5" 2.8 (Late 2014)2.8 GHz Core i5 (I5-4308U) (28W TDP) $999
Option Mac mini "Core i7" 3.0 (Late 2014)3.0 GHz Core i7 (I7-4578U) (28W TDP)


previous models
Mac mini "Core i5" 2.5 (Late 2012)2.5 GHz Core i5 (I5-3210M) (35W TDP)
Mac mini "Core i7" 2.3 (Late 2012/Server)2.3 GHz Core i7 (I7-3615QM) (45W TDP)
Mac mini "Core i7" 2.6 (Late 2012/Server)2.6 GHz Core i7 (I7-3720QM) (45W TDP)

Mac mini "Core i5" 2.3 (Mid-2011)2.3 GHz Core i5 (I5-2415M) (35W TDP)
Mac mini "Core i5" 2.5 (Mid-2011)2.5 GHz Core i5 (I5-2520M) (35W TDP)
Mac mini "Core i7" 2.7 (Mid-2011)2.7 GHz Core i7 (I7-2620M) (35W TDP)
Mac mini "Core i7" 2.0 (Mid-2011/Server)2.0 GHz Core i7 (I7-2635QM) (45W TDP)
 
Personally, I use a 2015 15" MacBook Pro day in and day out...we are up for a new lease, but that will not happen until there are new iMacs released. I also use a Magic Keyboard with Numeric Keypad that I purchased on launch day last year (WWDC 2017), which was the most exciting thing announced, for me at least. I bang away on it all day long when I am docked. I also own a 2016 MacBook Pro that I pound away on after hours and it is working just fine.

That being said, I have learned that a softer touch nets me better results on the 2016, that the 15" keyboard is simply too wobbly and mushy for my tastes anymore and that the Magic Keyboard feels just right. I also have one of Apple iPad Smart Keyboards on my 2015 12.9-inch iPad Pro and I love that thing. I have no idea why the hate. I mean, I understand the hate for the 2015 MacBook keyboard, it's a POS, but the iPad keyboard and the Magic Keyboard are awesome, at least for me. I had hoped, even though I knew it couldn't really happen due to thickness constraints, that Apple would get the Magic Keyboard mechanism into the 2018 MacBook Pro. I hope they use that mechanism for the rumored 13" MacBook as opposed to the butterfly mechanism used in the 2015-2018 MacBook and MacBook Pros.

Unemployment is probably not a realistic option, despite your fervor for payback.
[doublepost=1535067914][/doublepost]
Well, I used Apple's current pricing to arrive at these prices. I did make a mistake in that my $699 model should be a 1TB HDD, NOT a 1TB Fusion Drive, which Apple charges +$200 to upgrade from the 1TB HDD to the 1TB Fusion! Apple charges +$300 to move from the Core i5 2.6GHz ($699 model) to the Core i7 3.0GHz and +$200 to go from the Core i5 2.8GHz ($999 model) to the Core i7 3.0GHz. I had another poster take severe umbrage with my pricing - don't shoot the messenger. The top line 2014 Mac mini (Core i7 3.0GHz/16GB/1TB SSD) costs $1999!!! $2000 for a four year old dual core Core i7 laptop CPU. Ugh, even that is a bit much for me to take.

Glad it was helpful. I'm hoping that we get at least those 4-core 28w CPUs at the prices listed. There have been some unrealistic numbers bandied around and people are setting themselves up for heartbreak. Intel sells their Bean Canyon core i7-8559U NUC for $499 sans DRAM, SSD and OS, so $1299 for the same Mac mini is pretty pricey, but it is what I have come to expect from this iteration of Apple, Inc. They could indeed surprise us with more reasonable pricing or same pricing with better specs, but the 2016 MacBook Pro pricing sobered me up quickly.

Thanks. So I’ve got to factor in another $200 to get myself from the base models to the 512GB SSD which I would probably target. This is where one ends up looking at the iMac because the cost isn’t that much more. And you get a gorgeous screen. But if I forgo the iMac screen and just use the existing keyboards and screens that I have, I can save some money. And then save some more money and have an easier upgrade path if Apple makes a new Mini five years from now. I’m probably going to forgo the GPU this generation and if I change my mind later, do an eGPU.
 
You are expressing the same ignorance that many others express suggesting that "pros" need many cores to get their jobs done. That is of course non sense as professionals come in all sorts of specialties. Even if you limit the discussion to that group of professionals called college professors you will find a large array of performance needs.

On the flip side I never understood why Apple gave up on some of its networking technology. Sometimes a rack of computers is the right choice or at least a small cluster. TB offers an interesting approach to make small clusters for example that are nearly cost free outside of the computer.
If we're not talking about multiple cores, then we might as well be talking about every single computer user. "Pro-focused" is a specific set of users in this context. While writers, executives, programmers and professors are all pros, they do not require hardware that is "pro-focused" the same way that artists, engineers and scientists do.
 
I had hoped, even though I knew it couldn't really happen due to thickness constraints...

Which are 100% artificial and created by Apple.

I am truly glad you like the new keyboard designs. As for me? I am planning on switching to basically anything else unless they change. It actually hurts my hands to type on them.
 
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Which are 100% artificial and created by Apple.

I am truly glad you like the new keyboard designs. As for me? I am planning on switching to basically anything else unless they change. It actually hurts my hands to type on them.
If your hands hurt when typing on a keyboard, it’s very likely you are pressing way too hard. Maybe try lightening your touch; very little force is actually required.
 
[doublepost=1535059774][/doublepost]Jobs would not have allowed this to happen. Mini last update 2016. MacAir 2015. The prices are high. The chips are slow. Apple under Cook is not concerned about its beginnings or the customers who bought Macs yrs ago. If Jobs could return for 1 day he would fire Tim Cook. Cook is interested in money, not in excellent products. We loyal Mac fans can no longer be proud. Our machines are slow, costly and we are ignored by establishment Cook & coterie.

Exactly, agree 100%.
That a company makes money, does not mean they make excellent products.
Long time Loyal Mac fans are so fed up with Apple poor products quality, poor design and overprice that for the first time in many years we are looking at other options (hackintoshes).
Really Sad...
 
Great, a "you're using it wrong" defense of Apple.

Have you ever had the misfortune of using a 2005 Apple Keyboard (White Crumb Catcher Tray Deluxe)? If not, consider yourself lucky. I still have two laying around at work (one is Bluetooth) and those by far had the mushiest, spongiest, most awful key travel and response I have even encountered in an Apple Keyboard and I have used almost every model Apple produced since 1989. The key shape was not bad, but the mechanism needs a bit of extra force to be sure you contacted and a key press was registered. My overall speed suffered greatly with this keyboard. The two in the backroom are only ever used under extreme duress.

My point? The butterfly mechanism does not need as much force as the old scissors mechanism in the prior Magic Keyboard (what I am using right now), which didn't require as much force as the 2005 Apple Keyboard. It does require an adjustment in one's typing style. I have to consciously remember to type softer when I move over to my 2016 MacBook Pro or my Magic Keyboard w/Num Pad.

It's really no different than those before us who went through the transition from a manual typewriter to an IBM Selectric. There's no doing it wrong defense, it's just something one has to get accustomed to when they use it. I did, I cannot be the only one. I think pickurpoison's suggestion is a valid one.
 
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Great, a "you're using it wrong" defense of Apple.

Harsh, I mean it is possible you're using the 'product' in a way that causes issues you have not experienced before and an adjustment could help instead of it being a defence of Apple. Only speculation of course.

Personally, I am ok with the current keyboard, but I do need to adjust how I use it even when coming from the magic keyboard and especially after the G413 when coming from my Windows machine. It took a while but I got there with it.
 
Great, a "you're using it wrong" defense of Apple.
I’ve seen posts here from people saying they learned to stop pounding on their keyboard since it’s not necessary. Why would anyone’s hands hurt from typing on a keyboard? A shorter travel should be less fatiguing.

btw, Jobs never said what you quote above; he said “Just avoid holding it in that way”.
 
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Why would anyone’s hands hurt from typing on a keyboard?

Well if I type on the G413 for a while my hands do hurt, but it's the height, not a great position so it causes discomfort after a while, a rest would fix it but I don't intentionally type a lot on it. On a MBP keyboard or Magic keyboard? Don't understand how that would cause discomfort, far more natural position.
 
Well if I type on the G413 for a while my hands do hurt, but it's the height, not a great position so it causes discomfort after a while, a rest would fix it but I don't intentionally type a lot on it. On a MBP keyboard or Magic keyboard? Don't understand how that would cause discomfort, far more natural position.
And the same position whether old or new MBP.

I’m old enough that I learned on a manual typewriter, where it was necessary to press hard and it was fatiguing. My hands did hurt! That’s my experience, and partly why I had conjectured that OP might be pressing too hard. I should have said “it’s possible” instead of “very likely” though.
 
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I’ve seen posts here from people saying they learned to stop pounding on their keyboard since it’s not necessary. Why would anyone’s hands hurt from typing on a keyboard? A shorter travel should be less fatiguing.

Sure, we need to adapt our typing style to the new reduced travel, but we're only human and there is an average limit to our reaction time when typing.

The problem is that with the reduced travel of these new keyboards, compared to the previous generation of keyboards, we have an even shorter time to react between feeling the keys being pressed and the keys hitting the bottom of their travel. It means we're hitting the bottom a lot more often, which makes the experience similar to typing directly on a table using a laser-style virtual keyboard.


That's why a lot of people don't like the reduced travel of these new butterfly keyboards. That, and the lack of reliability against dust. Let's hope the 3rd revision/patch finally fixes the problem or that Apple went "the cheap road" and kept the same old scissor keyboard in the upcoming refreshed MacBook Air.
 
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The problem is the reduced travel means we have an even shorter time to react between feeling the keys being pressed and the keys hitting the bottom of their travel. It means we're hitting the bottom a lot more often, which makes the experience similar to trying to type directly on a table using a laser-style virtual keyboard.

That's why a lot of people don't like the reduced travel of these new butterfly keyboards. That, and the lack of reliability against dust. Let's hope the 3rd revision/patch finally fixes the problem or that Apple went "the cheap road" and kept the same old scissor keyboard in the upcoming refreshed MacBook Air.
Gotcha. I have heard users say the latest generation feels more dampened at the bottom, which iirc they were attributing to the silicone. And if it is “too hard”, then the harder you hit the keys, the more problematic it will be. There are plenty of legitimate criticisms of the reduced-travel keyboard, including the inability to deal with foreign particles.

I totally get not wanting to feel like you’re “typing on a rock” as one user put it. That’s one of the reasons I always push back when someone says the keyboard will be replaced by a haptics-enabled touchscreen. Talk about a horrible typing experience (and not just for touch typists).
 
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"Zdigital2015 said:
I had hoped, even though I knew it couldn't really happen due to thickness constraints..."

Which are 100% artificial and created by Apple.

Dead right. Laptop buyers demand a lot of things of their machines: more ports, longer battery life, better screens, better keyboards ... all perfectly understandable and legitimate. And yes, they may want it lighter, too. But I've never heard many say that they really, really wish it was thinner.

This is entirely driven by so-called "designers", who work only in terms of "concepts", whose interest is limited to "elegance" and "aesthetic qualities" of the outside of the machine, but who do not concern themselves with grubby details of functionality. One can imagine the discussions. Limited key travel? A mere detail, dear boy: they'll get used to it. When we take a fearless leap into the future, they must leap with us - bringing their money, of course. Overheating, you say? Oh, how tiresome. They don't really expect to keep it more than two years, do they? By that time, we'll have something prettier to replace it. Or perhaps not: but we can always count on them to buy another one. After all, it's our unique brand that we sell them.
 
Just curious. What do you guys using the Mac mini for?
I use my 2012 quad core i7 mini as a media computer/dvr/plex server/everything computer. I have been using a mini connected to my tv since the early 2009 model. I was using it for games up until about 1-1/2 years ago when i just couldn't play any new games I wanted, so I built a pc just for that and vr. I've been waiting for a new mini that can display 4k. Hopefully it will come soon. I just bought an lg oled tv and would love to use it for 4k movies instead of the windows machine. So basically I use it for everything but games right now.
 
Just what we wanted: A more expensive Mac Mini.

Tim's greed never ends.

A bigger and powerful Mac Mini would basically be a modern Power Mac G4 Cube, which would be very welcome for those of us who want a desktop Mac that isn't a Mac Pro and that doesn't have the integrated display of the iMac Pro.
 
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A bigger and powerful Mac Mini would basically be a modern Power Mac G4 Cube, which would be very welcome for those of us who want a desktop Mac that isn't a Mac Pro and that doesn't have the integrated display of the iMac Pro.
I’m thinking more along the lines of the 2018 13” MacBook Pro without the integrated display. Maybe the 15”, too, if Apple thinks there will be sufficient demand for hexacore processors in a headless desktop.

Some people (not necessarily you ScholarsInk) have gotten the wrong idea about the relatively low end desktop Apple will release. I can’t imagine the Mac mini will actually be a Mac mini Pro—i.e. Xeon CPUs, ECC memory and workstation graphics—by any stretch of the imagination.

The source says likely to be more expensive, due to new processor and storage options. It’s been forum posters that have turned the Mac mini into a Mac mini Pro. It’s going to be much like the current mini. Relatively small and correspondingly less powerful, compared to Apple’s other desktops. Thermals and performance (and components) of MBP.
 
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I can’t imagine the Mac mini will actually be a Mac mini Pro—i.e. Xeon CPUs, ECC memory and workstation graphics—by any stretch of the imagination.

God no :)

I expect that the current Mini will still exist in the future, a cheap entry-level device with a minor upgrade. Cheap relative to the price of the new Mini Pro which will have (opinion only) a new form factor and far better specs, again, far better, relative to the existing mini.

The Pro will have at least a 4/8 processor, maybe the option of a dGPU, that is discrete not a full form card of course.
 
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I’m thinking more along the lines of the 2018 13” MacBook Pro without the integrated display. Maybe the 15”, too, if Apple thinks there will be sufficient demand for hexacore processors in a headless desktop.

Some people (not necessarily you ScholarsInk) have gotten the wrong idea about the relatively low end desktop Apple will release. I can’t imagine the Mac mini will actually be a Mac mini Pro—i.e. Xeon CPUs, ECC memory and workstation graphics—by any stretch of the imagination.

The source says likely to be more expensive, due to new processor and storage options. It’s been forum posters that have turned the Mac mini into a Mac mini Pro. It’s going to be much like the current mini. Relatively small and correspondingly less powerful, compared to Apple’s other desktops. Thermals and performance (and components) of MBP.

If there is a 32GB BTO and this sounds great.
 
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