Interesting that Intel also has a presence in Israel.
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Apple to Develop Future Mac Chips in Israel
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Well yes there’s always some sort of exploit but I think people are worried about a government back door being installed.
Here’s the thing most of y’all are not important enough for any high-m level exploit to be used on. If you are and you’ll know if you are then you need to be taking extreme precautions. Always assume that your data can be compromised and act like it has been.
There are a few cultures that insist on education as a way to improve each generation. This would make sense. I can think of a couple of other reasons but don't wish to distract from your point.
Interesting. So you are in a sense secular. Most Israelis I know or have met in acquaintance tend to be simply not overly religious. This doesn't make them agnostic, atheist, or by true definition, secular. What we might agree upon there is a cultural facet involved that is the result of a few things (topic for a non-Mac site discussion). Israel early on knew it had two things to consider - how to be a tiny nation in a big world and what could they compete with and, technology would be ultimately required to stay alive in a sea of those that would end them.
I know this is an old thread but given the narrative from Johny Soruji, I don't think Israel leads the M1, but to expand it into M1 Pro and Max.
It might be 50/50 between America/Israel when it comes to the leading design team. Who knows.
It might be 50/50 between America/Israel when it comes to the leading design team. Who knows.
Since we're opening the rabbit hole, the question is "how much".
Does Silicon Valley (or Texas, Oregon...) have less talent than Haifa? How much work is done by the Israeli team?
Yes, chipmaking is a long train of technology innovations, but we can still know which country does the most part.
I suppose one can speculate. Israel does a lot of innovation but often, at least from past quotes of Americans in the biz, think (to paraphrase) "give it to Israel and they will make it work" as in start something and they'll iron out the bugs. Candidly, I admire Israel's abilities but also can say - how could they have ever helped with Microsoft which is such a big bloated piece of nasty.
I wonder though. I know Intel pretty much gave up and let Haifa handle most of their designs.
For Apple, it might be different when they say "System-on-a-Chip" or "CPU/GPU". While integrated together, these are still separate areas.
I'm concerned that Srouji will eventually let Apple repeat Intel's mistake and give everything essential to Israel.
What is your concern with that? Is it that it's a foreign nation? Israel is pretty hard core on honouring NDAs and such.
I don't know about Apple, but as for Intel, they used to have an American design team. The American team will work on the "performance tier" while Haifa does the "Value tier"
That is until Haifa make their "value tier" performed even better than what we have here, and after that, Haifa pretty much does everything, and we pretty much don't have a design team anymore.
I believe those were Pentium 4s and Pentium M.
So allow me to have some concerns... But I'm not saying Srouji is doing that, tho.
Intel's "Core' series of CPUs came out of Israel. There is a popular story that it was Intel's Israel team that saved Intel in the early 2000s after their Itanium series of CPUs failed to gain traction and their Pentium series was losing performance and just getting hotter and hotter.
Yes. NetBurst (Pentium 4) is a radical departure from their typical design.
Meanwhile, Pentium M is based on their old P6 architecture. Turns out the latter is right.
Bingo! My thoughts exactly. We shall see...Trust them as much as I would trust the CCP on this issue.
I'm not Antisemitic. Let me be clear on that. But after a lot of research, it does feel like we're just giving our core technology away. That's not just Intel, and hopefully not Apple.
Actually, when digging on Linkedin, I found the chief architect for Apple's CPU, where he likes one of the post from Elad:
Seems my assumption is correct. The Israeli team didn't work on the M1's CPU, but the rest of the SoC. They do now, however.
Seems my assumption is correct. The Israeli team didn't work on the M1's CPU, but the rest of the SoC. They do now, however.
Fully respect what you are saying. There is an irony as I recall not long ago some article where someone in the Israeli government said similar about Israel tech given to the US. Both nations need to be careful and particularly now.
So I've done more digging. AFAICT, most of the Apple's CPU and GPU team members are still in the US.
- The CPU lead architect is in California & you just saw my screenshot above. They have their Linkedin page, nothing secretive here.
- If you go to the current career site and search for silicon team and CPU, most opportunities are still in the US, and openings are far more diverse. Most notably, the CPU architect page states that the "Team has offices in CA, OR, TX, MA".
- Judging by the Linkedin post above, Israel didn't have any CPU engineers until half a year ago. Notice that he said "working directly on the CPU", which doesn't always mean the design work.
It's safe to say the Israel team still doesn't have many working/designing the CPU as we do.
On the other hand, I couldn't find any GPU opportunities in Israel.
🤔
You can say the article in The Times of Israel is somewhat misleading, making Apple sound like Intel in return.
- The CPU lead architect is in California & you just saw my screenshot above. They have their Linkedin page, nothing secretive here.
- If you go to the current career site and search for silicon team and CPU, most opportunities are still in the US, and openings are far more diverse. Most notably, the CPU architect page states that the "Team has offices in CA, OR, TX, MA".
- Judging by the Linkedin post above, Israel didn't have any CPU engineers until half a year ago. Notice that he said "working directly on the CPU", which doesn't always mean the design work.
It's safe to say the Israel team still doesn't have many working/designing the CPU as we do.
On the other hand, I couldn't find any GPU opportunities in Israel.
🤔
You can say the article in The Times of Israel is somewhat misleading, making Apple sound like Intel in return.
Apple only makes SoC, which includes the CPU and the GPU, the two most complex units. It's fair to say Israel did all the work to put it all together or enlarge the M1.
I don't mind if we have Jewish engineers working on the CPU, but as a nation, it needs to be cautious. Mutually beneficial is good, but also one shouldn't giving too much.
I don't mind if we have Jewish engineers working on the CPU, but as a nation, it needs to be cautious. Mutually beneficial is good, but also one shouldn't giving too much.
Do you mean Jewish engineers in the US or do you mean in Israel as in Israelis?
A company's first responsibility is to its shareholders and shareholders invest to earn money and money goes to the one with the best product. A company won’t stop itself from having the best product to keep jobs in America. You want the job? Be better (or at least equally as good).
Israeli engineers earn about as much as American engineers do so all else being equal apple will have no reason to outsource anything.
Personally I wouldn’t worry about it to much if you’re looking at the American economy as a whole. Israel’s ties and levels of cooperation with America are so strong you might as well consider it the 51st state.
Israeli engineers earn about as much as American engineers do so all else being equal apple will have no reason to outsource anything.
Personally I wouldn’t worry about it to much if you’re looking at the American economy as a whole. Israel’s ties and levels of cooperation with America are so strong you might as well consider it the 51st state.