Apple to Eliminate Several Business and Event-Related Retail Positions

[Deuce on the Clock]

Well sounds like you didn't read my post or only read the parts you wanted to read. Why do I say this? Because my concluding sentence said, and I quote: "This could be a smart money move or end up being TC knowing the cost of everything and the value of nothing." No where in that post do I make a declaration on the effect of this move. Yes, it could be a good business decision - my point is we can't fairly judge it based on the information we have at hand.

Now to the second part of your post --

First in my scenario I said 50 phones. Yours is 200. Big difference there and you are changing the facts. Someone that wants 200 phones would likely not be coming into the store. They would dial up Cupertino as a medium or large business would. Remember small business is usually defined as 50 or fewer employees. That's is who would be going to an Apple Store, and likely someone who wanted a lot fewer than 50. I just went to the extreme.

Now those 50 phones. They are still being bought by the small business person. They are just not being sold by a dedicated business manager. They are being sold by the store manager or floor salesperson.

The business teams main revenue was selling to re-sellers so the 200 number is realistic, plus they would throw in "extras". These sales should have gone through corporate but retail and corp. fought over revenue. So business teams would fake sales to get around the max. allowed sale.
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Store leadership from all stores got together and came up with a plan to boot the only manager in the store who worked Mon-Friday 8-5!

LMFAO!! Truth.
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Last I heard Apple Stores were the most profitable retail spaces in the world on a sales per square foot bases. I don't think Apple has any plans to close them.

They wont be closing stores any time soon but the shift will be online sales and repairs being sent to depot for repair. They will not be needing the ton of employees they have any longer in retails stores. Repairs will be doled out to 3rd party repair sites or sent off for repair for in store pick up or shipped to home. Retail brick and mortor stores are hurting and online is the future. It will be a showcase only space soon.
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It is amazing that this comment has been largely ignored thus far. It is the only one that provides insight from someone with actual experience in the affected area and potentially explains some of the logic behind the changes.

It is fairly apparent that many commenting do not have direct leadership or business operations experience. Every time Apple makes a decision people fly off of the handle and immediately proclaim it the worst decision ever. The problem is that none of the commenters have access to any of the intel, facts, or data that lead to such decisions. If you think they're just swinging axes because they felt like it, you're extremely mistaken. Feel free to disagree with decisions, but lets not pretend that these aren't carefully considered and fact-driven.

This is actually a smart move I agree with that Angela has made. Smart move looking to the future of retail experience.

 

[dysamoria]

Considering Apple is the most profitable company in history, I don't think eliminating 4 positions will have a major impact on their bottom line.

This is the usual rationale given as companies destroy what made them great in the first place. Eventually it catches up.

Apple can do what ever it wants and how it wants! Always was the case! Just remember how Tough Steve was! You don't build an Empire being nice!!

Worshipping the bad behavior of executives and excusing their behavior because of short-term success is not a wise business practice. https://www.wired.com/2012/07/ff_stevejobs/

 

[Deuce on the Clock]

So the one person who has experience with this specific position at apple retails says the position wasn't needed, and can be fulfilled in other capacities, but everyone else wants to doom and gloom Apple?

I worked for Apple for 14 years and these positions and importance were always overly exaggerated as needed. They will still sell to small businesses and utilize specialist to complete the sales. Everyone is trained on handling these transactions. Large purchases can be done as well through corp. channels. It will be fine. Except for the people who had these unnecessary roles.

 

[icsedge1]

I spent over 5 years as a Business Specialist and here was my experience in a couple of stores:

Article is correct - former GAP, Target, Whole Foods, "insert similar company here" managers don't understand business at all. Why would they?

They were more concerned with store traffic and an "immediate win" than longer term, "strategic" relationship building with clients that spend more and more often. Business team members get pulled at the drop of a hat when the Red Zone was busy, even if it meant losing time to call/follow up with businesses that have expressed interest. Since Apple is so flush with cash a Store Leader has little incentive to run their store as if it was their own business (higher ups would rather care about AppleCare or OnetoOne sales).

The Retail business teams CAN have opportunity to drive a good portion of the store's business (15-20% while being 2-5% of staff) but it varies based on store and you guessed it, existing store leadership. Those in the thread saying it was just "business already walking into the store and thus NOT B2B" are both right and wrong. Over time I saw higher-ups push to re-define foot traffic as "business customers" in order to hit goals. This doesn't take away from legit relationships.

I went through 6 Business Managers during that time - most had no experience and would move on or move to a regular store role. Those that came in with related experience left quickly as the job wasn't what they were sold - mainly, trying to teach college kids how to develop leads from food traffic (easily 50%+ of the job).

The CRM system was horrible. The discounts offered to clients was poor (making those who were successful very impressive indeed - they had the deck stacked against them). And overall it seemed the business team existed as a unit fighting Apple itself for resources to succeed.

I left about 2 years ago. Good riddance.

I was on the Business Team at Fifth Avenue from July 2013 through September 2015. True about being pulled to the red zone during busy times, and vastly wavering levels of business acumen from the regular store leaders. Yes, we were a resource for some small, some rather larger companies that liked working with non commissioned b2b sales reps. But this sign just points to the continual move of all Business to the online teams in Austin and Cupertino. Who are paid commissions on b2b sales.
Sedge.

 

[Nameloc]

Does anyone have a first hand experience as an Apple store Business Manager? I'd love to hear the take on this from someone with experience in this position

I did. I am not surprised by this decision as they were doing the Business Leader's job. The way snr management and directors have been, they really don't get it and at the moment, it's a ship without a captain. They seem to think that the inexperienced business specialists (lowest level B2B) are the answer.
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Lots of people here pulling out their hair, but I have seen no mention of anyone talking about how they actually used this service for the places they work. Can anyone shed light on if it was effective, and if it was even being utilized? I personally don't know anyone who has ever bought volume shipments of computers from a retail store instead of having them delivered directly and then went to a store for group classes, and I've never seen a group IN an Apple store taking one of those classes.

In fact, I think it would be hard to assume that VARs wouldn't have a huge advantage in B2B sales as they would be more familiar with competing product lines and would therefore be better equipped to point out the right solutions, as well as solutions that go far beyond Apple's core lines of business.

Yes they did. Many times, and I am talking 6 & 7 figures. What would happen is customer would come in store, retail guy would check to see if it is for business purposes but would take their card either way. The business specialists would call them in to run a briefing with them on Apple for business. That's what the BS's are targeted on.

 

[MacBH928]

Can you just let someone go for no reason? isn't that illegal?

 

[Mr Retina]

Ahh I remember those days..Blocking the Business Team newsletters we got daily was worth saving my sanity. They always played on their phones, until a redzone member brought them some work to do aka (bringing them business intros). I think I was just bitter because they always pestered BOH members about stock, and would F'up our inventory daily -_- lol.

 

[saintstryfe]

Indeed, businesses are operated to turn a profit, however, a sensible business with a long term strategy does not peeve off its staff, its business user base and desk top user base at the same time, whilst I add making incredible mark-ups on the underpowered toys it now sells.

For the record I started with Apple Computer in 92 with a LCII, gravitated to DTP requiring decent hardware and software by the late 90s and embraced the concept of the iMac with great pleasure. I type this on a Mac Mini - not updated since 2014, and use a Thunderbolt Display, now abandoned by Apple.

Never owned a iPhone, have owned a iPad, have owned a iTouch and need both a portable and desktop upgrade shortly, usually investing in the highest spec Apple offers. Guess what, all they offer now are coloured toys, laptops unable to run 32G RAM and desktops not upgraded for years, unless incremental upgrades of iMacs constitutes real updates?

Still, MS and Dell are now making some decent kit, whilst Chinese Telcos are ripping Apple apart on the mobile side in the markets that count, namely China and India.

So you're working on a 2014 Mac Mini but suddenly need 32gb of RAM?

 

[drewsof07]

Maybe selling 4 year old Macs as new wasn't lowering the sales enough?

 

[chrfr]

Can you just let someone go for no reason? isn't that illegal?

It's not illegal in most states.

 

[gj64mad]

I think parts of this thread by current and former Apple Retail employee's and other commentators exemplify why Business and Consumer worlds are often misunderstood.

I am an 8 year veteran of Apple Retail, most of that time spent as a Genius. I now manage mobile devices for a large corporate in the MENA region, exclusively Apple devices. Our current run rate and spend is currently about 1.4 million USD per year on mobile devices before we start looking at the cost of infrastructure, procured outside of Apple that keeps an enterprise system running.

The value that Business managers added in our situation was being a link to the back end teams at Apple in a region where there is little to no presence for B2B outside of retail. They understand more about product life cycles, about forecasting for procurement runs, about the supply chain to make sure that product gets to us when it is needed. To whomever thinks that a specialist can acquire this knowledge in an afternoon, I'd point out that to some specialists I worked with, AppleCare was the equivalent of the 'would you like fries with that' idiom that fast food retailers are known for. Apple used to have the ability to hire the most exceptional talent for retail, but they long ago hit the saturation point where the available talent pool had diminished and now they can hire what is good enough.

The challenges with BM's are they are constrained by policy. When I deal with a BM, I am not dealing with a decision maker, I'm dealing almost with a middle man. It is difficult to negotiate outside of the boundaries that they must adhere to due to Apple policy, and talking of that policy, when it comes to retail, it can be a negative factor when approaching Apple directly for procuring purposes. It has taken months to get their legal team to agree to changes in terms and conditions and provisions required by law where I am.

So if the answer to this is to centralise the business function outside of retail, that could be a positive. It would streamline the process of dealing with Businesses and allow quicker conversations within the relevant functions that are required to underpin a transaction.

However, the cost is the opportunity to provide a transformative experience to small businesses. Some small businesses stay small, and loyalty can keep them using Apple products for years to come. Products like Joint Venture and having a point of contact at a local store can help create an exceptional IT experience for the small business man or woman. Very few businesses think about IT or IT infrastructure when they start, but if that business grows, and systems are entrenched within the Apple eco-system, it can be cheaper for them to stay within one vendors products.

Business is a different world to consumer. It should be treated as such. Never forgot that the people who look after Retail are Business leaders themselves at one point in their career looking after vendor transactions, procurement, lifecycles and the like. Any good MBA teaches that.

The most important thing is this change is to make sure there is a clearly signposted method for those who would rely on Business to still get help.

 

[DaveOP]

Can you just let someone go for no reason? isn't that illegal?

No? Companies downsize all the time, and they believe this position is no longer needed. They'll offer to let them stay as some other role, and if they leave, will be considered voluntary I am sure.

 

[I7guy]

While I completely agree, companies need to make a profit, nothing wrong with making a heck of a profit, but at some point... maybe when you have more money than most countries... it is time to give back.

Hire a few extra positions, make training MORE enjoyable and memorable. Create a 'love' for the company, even if it doesn't let you get the 1 or 2 extra points this year. Happy, well trained employees create a synergy that pays out in dividends.

PS. I never understood the reason to continually IMPROVE profits, year after year. Guess that is why my company isn't in the top 500, I'm happy paying the electric bills at the office and putting some food on a couple of other families' tables.

A rewarding work environment and culture along with a bottom line oriented mindset are not mutually exclusive. Giving back by wasting money with unnecessary hires is not a viable long term strategy.

 

[occluded]

HA!

I worked at Apple Retail for 2 years, including on the business team, and every business manager I met was deluding themselves. People shopping at Apple Retail stores for their business ARE NOT B2B customers, and every business manager I saw get promoted to corporate crashed and burned in no time at all.

There's A LITTLE extra expertise about taxes and such, but they were all vastly overpaid for what they actually did. They weren't doing cold calls, the business just walked in. You could train a specialist to do the majority of their work in an afternoon.

I worked at retail for 7 and Business for 5 of that. You couldn't have been on the team long enough to know the scope of what you don't know. If I had made a 2% commission, I'd have doubled my pay. I had multiple fortune 500 companies as clients. I coordinated large scale multi-year rollouts. This is in NYC at a flag, so maybe my experience is different. But your absolute and snarky denigration of the work I personally did makes me want to slap you. I quit because when I joined the Business Team I was told with my experience I'd be an Solutions Engineer in 2 years. Then came the waiting. Then when corporate mandated moving everything to custom stores (which seemed to me to miss the whole point) I realized they wanted to kill the role. My entire team including myself quit within a year. Maybe my job was terrible because I was respected like someone doing the work you obviously did?

 

[AZ63]

Apple will be going more depot repairs and next to nothing in store so this is coming soon. Minor fixes in store only and no need for repair techs. There's no money in it.

Unless you count customers who buy there specifically because they can come back for repairs and because of that perk they pay a premium price for a product.
With that service gone, why pay a premium price?

 

[Deuce on the Clock]

Unless you count customers who buy there specifically because they can come back for repairs and because of that perk they pay a premium price for a product.
With that service gone, why pay a premium price?

You can still go and get "support" help but repairs are being phased out in store. They cant pay the wages for "techs" because of the volume. Its easier to troubleshoot a device then ship out if it needs repairs that require time. No doubt they will expand a loaner program so being without a device wont be an inconvenience. But I will bet it will be tied to Applecare customers only.

 

[ocifersven]

Apple will be going more depot repairs and next to nothing in store so this is coming soon. Minor fixes in store only and no need for repair techs. There's no money in it.

That's what I remember hearing before I left. iMacs were being piloted for depot as well as others. It's just a matter of time before even the Genius role itself is replaced by "Technical Expert," which is sad considering the title Genius is one of the first job titles a person thinks of with Apple.

 

[Rocketman]

The business teams now have the ability to setup online stores specific to a particular business - streamlining purchasing and offering (slightly) discounted prices depending on annual spend of said client. So makes sense.

Didn't know that. That's news.

 

[Zandery]

Are you a member of the management team referenced in the article? The team that doesn't understand B2B sales.

I don't think you understand B2B, it isn't done in retail stores, it's done through dedicated business centres or area reps. Retail stores don't enter into the equation unless it's a small business without access to either the rep or business centre.

I can't recall the last time I went into a store for a B2B purchase, it was done via the business centre through phone and email.
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Can you just let someone go for no reason? isn't that illegal?

For no reason, yes I believe it is however these positions are being eliminated thus this is a redundancy for which those employees are being offered 2 months salary (pathetic IMO) or the ability to switch roles (again pathetic as it's to lower paid roles).

 

[Osxguy]

Does anyone get the weird feeling that the old MOTTO "At our heart and at our soul is our people" I feel bad for Apple Retail it used to be the proving ground for corporate. Now its a misshaped technical guess jeans...microsoft stores take notice

 

[IShouldn'tReply]

Everyone calm down. Apple is eliminating the business manager role, but there is still a manager in charge of business and the business team. And the business team is actually expanding. The difference is they had the option to become a regular manager in charge of business, so they lost their cushy 8-5 Monday through Friday life. Boohoo. Business customers come in the store at all hours and all days of the week, so they need to be available like anyone else. The business managers were given the option to become a full member of the leadership team or step down, and they were not forced into a pay cut. Business managers are the same payscale as the other managers.

This article was clearly slanted by a disgruntled business manager who doesn't want to work the regular manager hours.

 

[69650]

A lot of misconceptions in this thread from people who have obviously never worked with their local business team.

I find this very disappointing, my local Business Manager is great and is my primary contact with Apple.

Buying from the business team at an Apple Store doesn't mean you have to go there in person. I use the ecommerce portal and devices ship right to us. I only visit the store to drop/off pickup repairs.

But having the relationship with the business manager is great. No need to worry about an appointment, he'll get me right in. If I go in the morning right when the store opens he'll pull me out of line and up to the front so I can get out of there and back to the office.

As others have said he can help get me things in short supply or simply have something waiting for me to grab and go with only a PO# in an emergency.

I personally see this as a bad move since it'll effect my ability to do business with Apple.

My local Business Manager is great. He would call me when a product I wanted like the Apple Pencil was in stock so I could just pop in and buy it. Such a shame all these dedicated people will be out of a job soon.

 

[AAPL33]

Does anyone have a first hand experience as an Apple store Business Manager? I'd love to hear the take on this from someone with experience in this position

Yes. It's a great position and much needed.

 

[IShouldn'tReply]

Two months of severance?!?? Wow......

When my job was eliminated, I received 6 months Plus benefits.

Very stingy there Apple....

It varies depending on your length of service.
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My local Business Manager is great. He would call me when a product I wanted like the Apple Pencil was in stock so I could just pop in and buy it. Such a shame all these dedicated people will be out of a job soon.

You will still have a manager who runs business, and an expanded business team. Your pencils will be fine.

 

[AsherN]

Can you just let someone go for no reason? isn't that illegal?

There is a reason. he position is being eliminated. They don't even have to offer a position somwhere else.