Not only theoretically, but practically
DMA Browser Choice Screen
Find out how Android users pick their default browser during setup and learn how to be included in the choices for browsers.
www.android.com
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Apple to Let EU Users Set New Defaults for Multiple Apps, Delete App Store, Photos, Messages and More
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Why is a browser choice so special that you don't think your mother-in-law can make a good decision? Do you question all her buying/life decisions? I hope not 😝.
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This is completely dependent on what the goal EU have and what you think the goal should be. EU has no intention of preventing chrome from winning the browser race. The fact safari left windows is apple’s failure, the fact safari doesn’t exist in android is apples failure. The fact chromium is dominant over WebKit is apples failure to deal with, and they aren’t allowed to use their system to force it to exist.
Picking what I have heard bias is better than not doing anything bias.
Its mandate is to make sure the market is competitive. It has zero interest if it’s a monopoly or not as it’s not illegal to be a monopoly.
What issue do you think EU is addressing? Because it’s not the consumer this is targeting.
The fact iOS have a market share of 30% is completely irrelevant, but the question if you are an entrenched player who act as the gatekeeper between customers and developers.
Thera nothing confusing with pick the default you want to have.
What’s harmful for everyone is having WebKit being the default for every browser on iOS, except for Apple.
Funny how people stir up about scandal when Microsoft doesn't allow one of their app to be uninstalled, or to switch to another default one, but when it's Apple: good God there will be security flaws, battery problems, user experiences damage, … people crying about having choices and alternatives? You don't want to change anything: just don't! And when you want to you'll be happy to know that you will be able to. And just for you guys to know, everything is already possible on Android and I don't see them loosing any market shares. You can sleep soundly. Duh.
My favorite part is when some people who usually are not even citizens of the EU, complain about the EU citizens getting more options/rights with the products they buy, because it is either going to hurt them or hurt something else like "development" or even Apple. It's hilarious.
I never had an iphone and the only smartphone I have is an android phone because I have to have a smart phone. Else I wouldn't have one at all. I can't stand them.
Funny, funny, funny.
I never had an iphone and the only smartphone I have is an android phone because I have to have a smart phone. Else I wouldn't have one at all. I can't stand them.
Funny, funny, funny.
No offence, but unfortunately, so far it seems, that EU commission has similar approach, there is big uproar what Apple should allow or not, and when somebody says, that Android manufacturers are doing the same, there is "I don't know, maybe they should, maybe we will check" and so on.
In my (EU!) country iOS has ~14% market share while Samsung alone has ~35% followed by Xiaomi with ~24% market share. And who's dominant here?
13% of iPhone new sales were to Android switchers...
Report: Fewer US Android users jumped to iPhone in 2023, but there were still plenty
In 2023, fewer US iPhone buyers had just left Android. However, it's not all good news, as the number that did switch is still very high.
www.androidauthority.com
even with all the limits Evil Apple put in place
As much as I like the ability for all these defaults. I still think the EU Commission shouldn't be dictating the UX of apps and technology
Apparently, you didn’t get my point at all. Up until last year, there wasn’t any possibility to get apps outside the official App Store.
Now we have more options in the EU, but thanks to Apple’s restrictions such as the ridiculous fees and review process for apps from alternative app stores, just a handful of apps are available from them and I would consider none of them relevant.
Therefore, the option to delete the App Store is sheer mockery. Anyone who wants to continue using their iPhone effectively is dependent on the App Store for now.
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But somehow, I don't need to go through this screen after each Android update. Actually, what I only don't like is asking me constantly about the same. If I once chosen Safari as default, I should never be asked gain about that, until I will decide to change it.Not only theoretically, but practically
DMA Browser Choice Screen
Find out how Android users pick their default browser during setup and learn how to be included in the choices for browsers.
so the bit you are missing here is the EU changes have affected the code base of ALL iPhones who upgraded software.
the EU bits aren't enabled, but they sit there nonetheless.
and the worry by those who say they wont change to an alt app store or sideload apps or choose non-standard apps is that to enable EU users to do those things exposes their phone to more avenues that could be exploited.
if youve ever had a family member or friend "accidentally" install a dodgy bit of malware on an Android phone you know how easy it is.
i got exactly what you were saying. i just disagree with it.
the ability to delete the AppStore is not a mockery.
EU wants people to have choice. there you go... choice.
Now you complain about having choice...
Geez, hard to please some people...
I honestly have no earthly idea what the EU is trying to address with “are you sure you want safari” splash screen but I’m excited a DMA defender finally agrees with me that the law isn’t about making things better for consumers - and that if things are made worse for them by this regulation that’s just too bad.
Why are browsers special? Why shouldn’t calendar, messages, photos, contacts, maps, camera, weather, clock, stocks, etc. also get splash screens highlighting other options? Aren’t competitors there also in needing of protection too?
It is completely relevant! The aim of this regulation is, if you believe the EU, increase competition in digital markets. To do so, in this specific instance, they are making the minority player in said market ADVERTISE the majority player’s browser. Which will result in the majority player’s browser being further entrenched, and will reduce users’ privacy and battery life in the process.
And if you don’t think the browser screen is confusing, you are succumbing to the typical “every user is as competent with tech as me, a user who posts opinions on a tech forum” logic. The screen is ABSOLUTELY confusing to a large number of users. And like the GDPR led to 99.9% of people hitting “accept” on the cookie banner as fast possible, making the web crappier for everyone while not actually changing anything (another example of the EU’s incapability of thinking through the actual results of their idiotic tech regulations), people are going to click on the name of the browser they’ve heard of as fast as they can. Like I said, reducing user privacy and further entrenching Google’s market position in the name of “competition.”
I'm not sure how that would be a problem.
Back in the flip phone days, I'd LOVE to have been able to delete the text capability from my phone, preventing me from receiving ANY text messages and keeping the telco from charging me for them. Back then I'd respond to anybody texting me by calling them.
It's less relevant today since no telco I'm aware of charges for texts any more, but I could definitely see deleting Messages and Mail being a good thing to do while on vacation if it would block everything from getting to you. Can't be worried about somebody's work 'emergency' if you don't know about it.
I want iPhoto back. Photos has been a disaster on the phone and the Mac since day 1.
Next week EU will force Apple to lower the insane upgrade charges. For EU only, of course! 🤣
People in MR swear that the general population is inept. The mother-in-law especially. So either they are inept or they aren’t. We would like to know for future reference so we have an agreed stance when nuances issues such as default selection are discussed.
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It's easy to answer that. Browsers nowadays are like virtual machines. It's an app system on top of your operating system. I'm sure you know that. Therefore, it's important for consumers to know that, at least theoretically, they do have a choice. Yes, native apps are more convenient to use. But that does not have to be the case if alternative browser engines get a real chance.
My take. I don't care about the choices of other peoples in-laws. But I do care about my choices 😛.
This is especially true on a forum dedicated to Apple; it naturally means there’s a significant pro-Apple bias to overcome.11 pages into this topic and the quickest way to skim these messages I've found is just look at the user name and decide if it's worth reading the comment on the right...
it's easy after a while when you see someone you know well who provide good feedback and counter the emotive and often wrong opinions passed off as information. you can see what theyve answered and get the feel for the thread with a lot less effort...
You see so many irrational arguments to defend Apple here sometimes, and so much parroted misinformation. They’d be considered trolls on a less inherently biased forum.
Not that I think you were saying this, but for the record, my mother-in-law is not inept. She's not technically savvy, but not inept. Case in point, she managed to set Chrome as her default browser without an EU-mandated splash screen explaining to her that she had that option 🤣
It’s not a choice if you don’t have any alternatives. People who still want to use popular apps like WhatsApp or Google apps are dependent on the App store…
On Android, this is not the case. You can get almost any app outside the Play Store as well.
Well you should read the preamble for the DMA where they provide about 100 points describing what they want to do and why.
As much in EU law it’s a broad interest to maintain the healthy competition for the market and this will be in the customers interest long term. And customers can be both citizens and corporate users.
Well have you checked what in the DMA is covered? As something you mentioned, it covers core services that work as gateway between a user and other services.
Example a calendar isn’t a gateway to anything, while a browser is a gateway to other services
The majority players browser being entrenched isn’t an issue when this players browser alongside 10 other ones are randomly presented. Chrome can’t be treated differently towards the other browsers
And chrome isn’t entrenched, WebKit is by being the only possible browser engine in iOS, chrome( chromium ) is also entrenched on android and is required to provide the ability to chose something else.
Tell me what is confusing about picking a browser choice of 10 displayed in a list as your default.
And this is you demonstrating your incompetence on what the GDPR actually says and requires, contrary to what you think it does.
GDPR tells websites that they need to ask for clear and transparent consent from the user to collect private information about you.
And the act of accepting and declining must be equally easy for the user. So if accepting all data being tracked requires 1 click, this means denying all the data required max 1 click.
Now how this is designed outside of EU for us users is out of our control, while in EU it’s strictly defined.
If people click on the name of the browser they have heard of is completely irrelevant as it provided a fair and balanced chance to grow your market share.
Perhaps Apple should advertise safari more.
No user privacy is reduced, Google doesn’t have the legal rights to track and collect your information just because it’s their browser. That would break DMA, DSA and GDPR rules.