Apple to Let EU Users Set New Defaults for Multiple Apps, Delete App Store, Photos, Messages and More

[I7guy]

Got links for that?
And how many were affected?

I've seen many firsthand Android phones affected or bricked from installing apps from text or email.
Not known a single iPhone user who had that issue.

So I look forward to seeing what you have read on this topic...

The way it op phrased it was pure hyperbole. There were some zero click vulnerabilities over the years that has been patched. I’m sure a search of zero click vulnerabilities on major platforms would be interesting, and not limited to apple.

Also ignore the logical fallacies presented as cogent arguments. The dma imo is going to fragment iOS and ultimately go in an undesirable direction with consumers not seeing any benefit. But competition.

 

[AppliedMicro]

I'm afraid though that one day the EU will force us to use only "EU approved" apps that they can monitor.

Extremely dumb and counterproductive to mandate that apps must be installable from third-party sources. It doesn’t make sense at all. The easiest way to control the app ecosystem: have a single gatekeeper that must approve all apps.

 

[NOATAK]

Hahaha. Well if you dont need to get apps outside the store, then how do you know what motivates others to want this?

This isnt about empathy for them.
I'm extremely happy to hear from people who cant get what they want in the AppStore and WHY they need it.

The biggest reason to sideload was game emulators. And Apple now allow it.
What else? and why?

And Epic games is not about allowing games. Epic still pay store commissions and InAppPurchase fees on things bought on console stores. They knew the Apple rules and chose to disobey those rules. They are freeloaders. Simple. Who aren't consistent. Their app store is going to be just like Apple's but with slightly lower fees. A few percent? that's not going to set the world on fire. It will be absorbed as profit with consumers paying the same price. It's just Epic getting into making money off other devs.

And the game peak for Fortnite has probably been reached anyway.
I hear significantly less chatter and use of it among the kids. They've moved along.

Most of us here dont love everything Apple does.
Apple developed the iOS environment to be secure. A consumer device not a tech playground.
If you dislike Apple as a company, you have alternatives. Go explore them.
But you PREFER the iPhone? Geez.
Life (and purchasing decisions) are full of compromises.

I dont like to break it to you but life isnt all about what you want.
There's a generation of Influencers who are finding that out.

The point is that I don't want to be dependent on one company. Is that so hard to understand? Why should it be up to Apple alone to decide what I can and can't install on my smartphone? Why should I be subject to Apple's whims if they decide to delay or reject an app (update), as they often do? What about apps that have limited functionality because Apple doesn't allow them? What if Apple bans your account for no reason? What about users who live in a country where an app is suddenly banned? There are so many examples of why sideloading is important.

The EU has already decided that Apple must open up its ecosystem. Unlike many other places, the EU is still capable of making decisions that genuinely benefit consumers. It's a shame that Apple always has to be forced by law to make consumer-friendly decisions - just like with USB-C and other browser engines on iOS. They don't do this on their own accord.

If you don't care about any of that, that's fine. But assuming that everyone else thinks the same way is pretty foolish. I really don’t understand why people like you get so upset about policies like the DMA. If you prefer to keep getting your apps from the App Store, go ahead! Nobody is forcing you to use alternative app stores. And if you don't even live in the EU, getting upset about this makes even less sense, since you won't be able to use apps from outside the app store anyway...

 

[I7guy]

The point is that I don't want to be dependent on one company. Is that so hard to understand? Why should it be up to Apple alone to decide what I can and can't install on my smartphone?

If you’re in the EU you may get lucky. If you’re not in the eu buy the competition bad you don’t have to worry.

Why should I be subject to Apple's whims if they decide to delay or reject an app (update), as they often do?

You don’t have to with another cell phone.

What about apps that have limited functionality because Apple doesn't allow them?

Buy android. I feel as if these gets needlessly repeated.

What if Apple bans your account for no reason?

Buy android.

What about users who live in a country where an app is suddenly banned? There are so many examples of why sideloading is important.

Buy android.

The EU has already decided that Apple must open up its ecosystem. Unlike many other places, the EU is still capable of making decisions that genuinely benefit consumers.

This isn’t one of them.

It's a shame that Apple always has to be forced by law to make consumer-friendly decisions - just like with USB-C and other browser engines on iOS. They don't do this on their own accord.

You’re making up hypothetical situation upon hypothetical situation and then trying to form a conclusion.

If you don't care about any of that, that's fine. But assuming that everyone else thinks the same way is pretty foolish. I really don’t understand why people like you get so upset about policies like the DMA.

Because it’s crap legislation that has caused bloat in iOS.

If you prefer to keep getting your apps from the App Store, go ahead! Nobody is forcing you to use alternative app stores.

Balogna. If my favorite apps move to alt stores….i am forced.

And if you don't even live in the EU, getting upset about this makes even less sense,

No the incense is legit, seee above.

since you won't be able to use apps from outside the app store anyway...

That’s not the point.

 

[NOATAK]

You don’t have to with another cell phone.

Buy android. I feel as if these gets needlessly repeated.

Buy android.

Buy android.

That is what people say when they've run out of ideas. Android is not the solution to everything Apple does wrong.

Because it’s crap legislation that has caused bloat in iOS.

If you say so. I have a different opinion.

Balogna. If my favorite apps move to alt stores….i am forced.

You're making up a hypothetical situation here yourself.

 

[mrat93]

No. Because I'm not an oracle. There are even reasons to change the size or shape of the port that have nothing to do with power delivery or data speeds.

First of all, the answer is: No, iPhones will never accept anywhere near 240W. We’re talking 2023 Mac Pro-levels of energy here.

Why on earth would they change the connector again? What are these benefits? How can Apple spin a new connector change into a good thing — will it spin around?

I have no idea what Apple's plan was, and neither to you. All I said was that Apple took initial steps toward USB-C adoption before the requirements were announced.

I mean there are news and rumors that corroborate my claim but go off I guess.

That's the point. It was a commitment based on the pain of having to switch connectors. Adopting USB-C when it was released a couple years after lightning would have broken that commitment.

Lol, a commitment to overcharge their customers for flimsy, proprietary cables that are now virtually worthless. It would have been less “painful” for iPhone owners’ wallets if Apple switched as early as possible, even if it was 3 years after iPhone 5. Each year would have saved consumers hundreds of millions of dollars, and would have prevented the manufacturing of well over a billion now-basically-worthless Lightning cables.

 

[RealE]

I'm afraid though that one day the EU will force us to use only "EU approved" apps that they can monitor.

The UK is the only European nation (though no longer an EU member state) which is looking to do that. The EU seems much more privacy inclined.

 

[Abazigal]

That is what people say when they've run out of ideas. Android is not the solution to everything Apple does wrong.

It is an alternative though. If you are worried that your government may start requesting that certain critical apps be removed from the iOS App Store, then maybe it’s not a bad idea to hold on to a second Android phone where you at least have the option of sideloading those apps if they are that important.

That‘s the delicious irony as well. Everyone is all “let the market decide!” until consumers start voting with their wallets in a fashion that they don’t like, and now it’s all “Apple needs to be regulated because they are not innovating in a manner that I like or want”, as if no other options exist.

 

[AppliedMicro]

Buy android

Can‘t. My favourite app is on iOS, so I‘m forced to buy iPhones.

Buy android

Can‘t. My favourite app is on iOS, so I‘m forced to buy iPhones.

Buy android.

Can‘t. My favourite app is on iOS, so I‘m forced to buy iPhones.

If my favorite apps move to alt stores….i am forced.

Just as I‘m forced to buy an iPhone.

And here‘s the kicker: you have a much higher chance of finding an alternative favourite app - than I do of finding an alternative favourite operating system. You have lots of choice of apps. And the people you‘re referring to (buy) Android do not.

 

[arobert3434]

> Note that the option to set a default browser will only show up again for users who have Safari as the
> default, so if an EU user has already selected Chrome, the choice window will not pop up again.

Let the world domination of Chrome grow and increase!

 

[Trusteft]

so the bit you are missing here is the EU changes have affected the code base of ALL iPhones who upgraded software.
the EU bits aren't enabled, but they sit there nonetheless.

and the worry by those who say they wont change to an alt app store or sideload apps or choose non-standard apps is that to enable EU users to do those things exposes their phone to more avenues that could be exploited.

if youve ever had a family member or friend "accidentally" install a dodgy bit of malware on an Android phone you know how easy it is.

Nothing you said changes what I said.

 

[Nuno Lopes]

1. I think this will not change anything to the people vested in the Apple only software and digital services.

2. The main difference might be for new device owners. It will be easier for them to use on their device the services they are used to or want.

3. I believe that Apple has been ill advised all the way. I believe that Apple could have maintained the App Store has the sole software distribution and install mechanism on iOS if it followed a non invasive approach to user properties (businesses and people), their safety, privacy and security. Paving the way for a different approach to app distribution on specific kinds of devices.

Make no mistake, an App is not just an app, it's a surrogate of a business. An App is not just an App, its tool used by a person to achieve a particular task. An smartphone is not just a smartphone, is a component of a wider digital network, the Internet that is also a component of a region communication platform and infrastructure.

The EU and its members have total democratic political and legal legitimacy to regulate the components of the Internet infrastructure in their regions and its suppliers. Wall gardens specific in nature within it are acceptable, but not fiefdoms controlling the border between people/businesses, the Internet, and other people/businesses on the other side of the line.

A border that is composed by internet connected devices and internet connections, as you guys know. The iPhone/iOS is one of those devices, so is your internet connection of choice. The border components are in principle suppose to be Net Neutral in they way they work and how OEM and service providers operate them.

Has someone might have said, who controls the borders runs the region, case in case the digital market on top of the Internet within the EU. For that matter, border control is not an asset to be exploited by private businesses of any kind. In others words, businesses may try, yet such objective is not legit in a Democracy, no matter the percentage of the border they might already control. The mechanisms used to achieve such control end up being dismantled one way or the other.

Well, unless they aren't. But then we would enter into a new global order of things. Who knows if that will happen. Yet I wonder how many people are willing to fight for such an order. Because history has shown that such changes require a lot more than a wallets.

EDIT: I personally think that Messaging and Call consoles are an intrinsic part of what makes a phone a phone. Much like the ability to install Apps is what makes a modern computing device. In that mater I believe requiring these consoles to be swappable may be a step to far from the regulation ... In other words regulators should instead think on what are the primal components that make such a device let it be an OEM thing. Yet the reality is that not the issue they seam to be addressing, is mostly a side effect of internet connected devices OEMs push back on regulation in the last decade.

Cheers.

 

[ButtMcManus]

This hurts Apple and only helps Google. A new user won't know to install the official Apple App Store and might use another one not knowing there are prolly more apps in the official store. This happened with Google Play until Google put their foot down and required it be installed alongside 3rd party stores on 3rd party devices so that Users KNEW there were options.

If McDonald's is banned from being on the roadside to help Burger King, how does anyone know McDonald's is just around the corner? This is Market Burial, where 3rd Parties get special treatment to FORCE competition.

And as any economist worth their degree will tell you, competition cannot be forced. Lada sells well when the Soviet government forces it to have market share. Doesn't mean BMW isn't better in the market. BMW is better. But Lada is just a tank on wheels, it's a nice car. It ain't a BMW.

 

[AppliedMicro]

If McDonald's is banned from being on the roadside to help Burger King, how does anyone know McDonald's is just around the corner?

Operating systems and their application stores aren‘t fast food restaurants.
In the case of McDonald‘s, it’s an established brand - and consumers know how to find it, if they desire so (such as through inter search or a Maps application).

A new user won't know to install the official Apple App Store

They don‘t need to - it comes bundled on iOS devices.

And as any economist worth their degree will tell you, competition cannot be forced

But it can be enabled - or restricted/stifled by dominant actors on the market.

The law is about enabling competition. It is, to keep with the analogy, not prohibiting McDonald‘s from being on the roadside.

 

[NOATAK]

Let the world domination of Chrome grow and increase!

If users switch straight to Chrome (or any other browser) as soon as they get the chance, maybe it's because Safari isn't such a great browser after all.

I only use Safari on iOS because there is currently no other alternative with which I can use an adblocker and other add-ons (and no, Orion is not (yet) a good alternative).

Also, with the introduction of Manifest V3, Google has restricted the functionality of adblockers, leading some users to switch to other browsers. Perhaps their browser dominance issue will eventually resolve itself.

Forcing every user to use Safari is definitely NOT the solution.

 

[webkit]

This hurts Apple and only helps Google. A new user won't know to install the official Apple App Store and might use another one not knowing there are prolly more apps in the official store. This happened with Google Play until Google put their foot down and required it be installed alongside 3rd party stores on 3rd party devices so that Users KNEW there were options.

The App Store will still come pre-installed. Only if the user decides to delete the App Store would they have to re-install it. If they know enough to delete it, they can probably figure out how to re-install it.

The Google Play store can also be disabled on Android.

If McDonald's is banned from being on the roadside to help Burger King, how does anyone know McDonald's is just around the corner? This is Market Burial, where 3rd Parties get special treatment to FORCE competition.

And as any economist worth their degree will tell you, competition cannot be forced. Lada sells well when the Soviet government forces it to have market share. Doesn't mean BMW isn't better in the market. BMW is better. But Lada is just a tank on wheels, it's a nice car. It ain't a BMW.

Apple was the only one "banning" things here by not allowing alternative app stores and other things. Allowing users to set new defaults, delete things, etc. gives them more flexibility and options not less/fewer.

 

[wbeasley]

Can‘t. My favourite app is on iOS, so I‘m forced to buy iPhones.

Can‘t. My favourite app is on iOS, so I‘m forced to buy iPhones.

Can‘t. My favourite app is on iOS, so I‘m forced to buy iPhones.

Just as I‘m forced to buy an iPhone.

And here‘s the kicker: you have a much higher chance of finding an alternative favourite app - than I do of finding an alternative favourite operating system. You have lots of choice of apps. And the people you‘re referring to (buy) Android do not.

what's the fav app that cant be found elsewhere?

 

[I7guy]

Can‘t. My favourite app is on iOS, so I‘m forced to buy iPhones.

Can‘t. My favourite app is on iOS, so I‘m forced to buy iPhones.

Can‘t. My favourite app is on iOS, so I‘m forced to buy iPhones.

Malarkey. You choose to buy a certain brand of a consumer discretionary device for your own reasons. You voted with your $$$. When you buy a product you go in and accept the pluses and minuses of a product.

Just as I‘m forced to buy an iPhone.

False equivalency. On one hand I was already in the ecosystem had an iphone and now my app moved. On the other hand you elected to go into the ecosystem by voting with your $$$.

And here‘s the kicker: you have a much higher chance of finding an alternative favourite app - than I do of finding an alternative favourite operating system. You have lots of choice of apps. And the people you‘re referring to (buy) Android do not.

Lol, you know that already. 👎 So if that's the case you should have not walked rightly into an apple store with blinders on, done a right search and then gone android originally. You could have had the digital world at your feet. A ridiculous post like this shows what lengths one will go to defend this lousy legislation. Instead of what people normally do when they don't like a product. The go to the competition of which there are hundreds.

 

[I7guy]

That is what people say when they've run out of ideas. Android is not the solution to everything Apple does wrong.

It absolutely is. Buying the competition and directing sales dollars sends the best message available.

If you say so. I have a different opinion.

Sure. It's no surprise two people "discussing" something on the internet have different opinions.

You're making up a hypothetical situation here yourself.

It takes a good hypothetical situation to counter another one.

 

[AppliedMicro]

You choose to buy a certain brand of a consumer discretionary device for your own reasons

Yes. Just as you chose to buy and use your favourite app.

On one hand I was already in the ecosystem had an iphone and now my app moved

Your app can move or be discontinued any day.
Such is business and life.

On the other hand you elected to go into the ecosystem by voting with your $$$.

I didn‘t „vote“ for every (non-) feature of that ecosystem when there’s only one viable alternative otherwise.

So if that's the case you should have not walked rightly into an apple store with blinders on, done a right search and then gone android originally.

I did - and liked Android less. For reasons unrelated to soo installation and digital transaction processing.
So I made the correct decision of buying an iPhone - despite my misgivings about Apple‘s monopoly.

A ridiculous post like this shows what lengths one will go to defend this lousy legislation.

Why are you even getting so worked up about it and feel to attack it so vigorously?

👉 You don’t even live in Europe - so you aren’t even impacted by it. (And no, disabled, inactive code doesn’t count any more than iCloud being hosted by a Chinese corporation - the code is certainly in there).

Rather than complain about Europe, maybe you should write to your own legislators and lobby them for less choice, more technical restrictions put on hardware purchases and more market concentration.

 

[MilaM]

Malarkey. You choose to buy a certain brand of a consumer discretionary device for your own reasons. You voted with your $$$. When you buy a product you go in and accept the pluses and minuses of a product.

You can vote with your money, or you can vote for a parliament/government, that has your interest in mind.

 

[I7guy]

You can vote with your money, or you can vote for a parliament/government, that has your interest in mind.

If in fact they have YOUR interest in mind. It remains to be seen if this in in the best interest of the consumer.

 

[I7guy]

Yes. Just as you chose to buy and use your favourite app.

And when you make that choice you take all of the good and bad of the product.

Your app can move or be discontinued any day.
Such is business and life.

And at some point your purchase will no longer be supported. Of course electronics and automobiles, and things that are meant to be used up vs things that are used. Things that are used are jewelery, watches etc. But none of this has anything to do with the main point.

I didn‘t „vote“ for every (non-) feature of that ecosystem when there’s only one viable alternative otherwise.

Yes you did.

I did - and liked Android less. For reasons unrelated to soo installation and digital transaction processing.

Choice is good. Right?

So I made the correct decision of buying an iPhone - despite my misgivings about Apple‘s monopoly.

There is no monopoly. That word has turned into a joke at MacRumors.

Why are you even getting so worked up about it and feel to attack it so vigorously?

Why are you defending it so vigorously?

👉 You don’t even live in Europe - so you aren’t even impacted by it. (And no, disabled, inactive code doesn’t count any more than iCloud being hosted by a Chinese corporation - the code is certainly in there).

It impacts the ios code base. Now are you suggesting that any non-EU person should bow out of the conversation?

Rather than complain about Europe, maybe you should write to your own legislators and lobby them for less choice, more technical restrictions put on hardware purchases and more market concentration.

No, I want government to stay out of micro-managing charging ports and the like. And like you say, vote your conscious and most importantly vote with your $$$. That's what sends the real message.

 

[MilaM]

If in fact they have YOUR interest in mind. It remains to be seen if this in in the best interest of the consumer.

It's an experiment with some very tangible good outcomes already. Think about the new ways in which NFC will finally be available to app developers.

I also haven't noticed any opposition to the new rules on this side of the pond in the media. So it seems people are OK with it or at least indifferent 🤷‍♂️.

 

[I7guy]

It's an experiment with some very tangible good outcomes already. Think about the new ways in which NFC will finally be available to app developers.

That's another minefield which remains to be seen if it actually is in the best interest of the consumer.

I also haven't noticed any opposition to the new rules on this side of the pond in the media. So it seems people are OK with it or at least indifferent 🤷‍♂️.

Hard to tell. I think the biggest cheerleaders and critics are on enthusiast sites, such as MR.